Oceanbourne

that bus wasn't intentional but it sure worked out for us (almost)! I was right with Quote/Refa sorta, too bad I succumbed to the tendency of "oh it's close to deadline what is my best townie play supposed to be" and then messing up there. I would've pushed onto Quote more at end of d1 but I didn't want to be mean lmao cause I felt like I basically made him sub out so I was like "yeah I guess I'll vote junko". I'm glad ITP won over town though! casing people was legitimately hard, I never had a problem before. so most of my content came from not knowing what to talk about and it looked very superficial because anything else would be blatant bs

I guess the only thing we could try to turn it to is Elieson if people are literally reading right now or Shin but I don't want to lynch Shin

I targeted him because he was the most null (bad wording? the person I had the hardest time reading was one I wanted to use the power on to see if I could determine anything regarding his alignment because it seemed like a good idea to do that to help bring him out of the grey zone of my reads rather than go on via who I already thought was scum) rip tho I think

the timing of Freyja's vote change is suspicious cause iirc you had a fairly scummy read on Zerosabers as well who also isn't here yet you still chose to go after Elie conveniently after Boron decides to vote for them I don't think I'll be around for deadline either. I'm a Pushy, which is kind of like a follower/tracker from my experience, but instead of knowing who my target visited I get to know what kind of action my target performs. it didn't help at all n1 because I targeted Paper and got that he performed an 'investigative' action but he already went out and claimed Watcher so I don't have anything new to tell you guys @Junko the lack of conviction isn't as bad as the feeling that you were grasping at straws with the Shin case and then even though you expressed a lot of uncertainty with it you tacked on another case (with Shin's stance on the end of d1 wagon and how he should've pushed harder for via even though he couldn't)

I actually have no idea how to take the SB scenario and to be honest I was reading his role from the mafiascum wiki and as someone had said earlier it was similar but apparently it's not the role the wiki says? because then there's no reason that I was supposed to be the intended target. can someone actually explain what his role is supposed to do / link me to the explanation at least I can say with a pretty good degree of confidence I'm townreading Shin so I'm not gonna join the 6 other "idk about Shin" reads ##vote Junko yeah basically I didn't like #363 and I don't need to talk about his next case on Shin that Shin himself already took care of @junko, ok, so Shin puts you as the victim and makes via/paper/elie look worse. since he was voting via at the time, wasn't that congruent with his intentions? I guess victimizing might be some extreme wording but... (yeah I can see where people are coming from when they call me passive I guess I typically am this way rip)

I never mentioned 'solely,' just that you included meta as a part of the read. you say that Shin has reason to be scum and that's why he's null, but in the reads post you say "shin pushed people and I'm sure that was good" (unless you're talking about SB talking about the way Shin is pushing people, in that case that just means more reading for me ugh) and "I like his conviction" which are both indicating you think Shin is acting toownie when I said they were lackluster I meant like... less concrete reasoning than the things you were talking about with Shin. with his read you referenced his convictions and stuff that SB said but with Elie you said "oh yeah he's just behaving like he was last game" and "if he was scum he'd be trying harder not to get lynched." obviously you can't elaborate more on Elie with his lack of content but when I first addressed you about this, there seems to be no reason for Shin to be ranked below Elie my last point was supposed to be the fact that he was hardly getting any attention day 1, and people sympathized with some of his posts cause he talked about bad weather in the area where he lived giving him an excuse for almost no content. that behavior is pretty non-alignment indicative, so how can you get that Elie would be trying harder to not get lynched if he was scum if he doesn't have to try at all? I can understand if he was under some fire and him just shrugging it off means he looks town to you and him taking things more personal means he might read scum but there was no fire to speak of for Boron iirc you just said "Boron is Boron" and left it at that, and said something about "she might've been the n1 kill!" but I'm pretty sure that was it. again, you talked about Shin in more concrete terms

see the last time I posted I had just posted after Paper's Watcher claim incriminating SB and then I went to go do new year's eve stuff. at that point I was probably going to go junko > refa, wanted to see the SB response first though. I've just got back with time to make another post but I don't make a vote if I feel I haven't a) gotten out all my arguments or b) got up-to-date with my info sooo i haven't quoted the whole thing but the reads post as a whole was more like a longer version of Zero's catchup post which was not that great (Freyjadour's is better but there's still some things here that don't quite make sense) you think junko switching votes around a lot is townie? nothing about their day 1 play troubled you even in the slightest? I guess I can't ask you for an opinion on every little thing, but I am wondering how you viewed his interactions early day 1 with via and his voteswitch on day 2 to your slot Refa slot is scummy because of via's behavior. okay, but what about Refa himself? I'm not sure what you mean by 'not too many tells' are you saying that you have no idea how to read them or what the only people I've voted are cam / via / junko. the first two were far from bandwagoning and the last one was 1 1/2 hours from deadline. if my post voting for via wasn't justification then I guess none of mine are. reasons for not voting are detailed in the beginning of this post you seem to have different criteria for townreading other people in the game, for example GP is autotown because mayor, yet you don't say anything about Paper's claim or what you think about SB's explanation for Paper's results. you must have read up to date since you're aware of Paper's vote on Shin, yet it feels like you missed out on quite a bit in doing so

where is the problem about talking about the person he votes for the most out of the three (elie/via/paper)? is it scummy of Shin to use one of my posts to put that trio in a bad light? the portion of this post where you talk about him quoting my post seems rather detached from the rest of your argument, I don't know what point this is trying to make Refa's slot looks better for the point on junko being eager to switch votes for small stuff and wow I didn't see via's claim in day 1 I swear he was hinting at something instead of outright saying it

@hosts: junko was voting Clarinets at the end of d1 not SB iirc @Refa: it seems your Elie/GP/Boron/Shin reads are based on the players' meta but you talk about Shin pushing good points yet he's still null compared to your rather lackluster Elie read (and Boron). he didn't really have much pressure on him d1 either, so I don't see why he would have to try to not get lynched considering he went under the radar fairly well it's unfortunate that a good amount of this might be due to host error but yeah if you really went through all my posts then you would've seen that my very last posts of the day were talking about how I wasn't on the clarinets wagon and yet your reasoning for your original vote on me today was "someone on the wagon is scum" and you thought it strong enough reasoning to vote me over junko. I like wagon analysis as much as the next guy but even that seems rather strong went through junko's most recent posts and found that a lot were defending himself from stuff, especially cam's posts and the things I did see about him were a vote on the now-claimed SB and some ambiguous read on me. said something about via doing what he did as coming from town/scum, so there's not much of a read there either Shin already talked about the lack of confidence coming from junko in his most recent vote so there's not much I can say that he hasn't already said some saving grace for junko is the black text in between Shin's colors that Shin didn't address, also the fact that Shin didn't really respond to junko saying he had one read (concern for the Clarinets wagon, but saying nothing about the target or the wagoners themselves) it's really a pain to talk about new people like Coby especially considering they just didn't show up d1 but I don't see how you can call it completely "not alignment-indicative" like GP says when he's just using another post's reasoning to throw a vote down. re: sb, I kinda panicked at the end of d1 cause wasn't entirely sure what was going on. you can see the last posts I made as to my stances, but yeah I suppose I could've done better if I wasn't constantly rereading the last 4 or so pages that popped up close to deadline? @Zerosabers: hammering people without giving intent to hammer would be scummy. I don't see anything wrong with an L-1 vote especially on a person that I've had a scum read on (it wasn't as strong then, but I certainly didn't see him as town) especially considering it was 90 mins until deadline. why does Junko flipping town make me scum? it seems that you just have a problem with putting people at L-1 and I'm not aware of why

I never voted Clarinets hold on a sec

just so I can have it spelled out clear: via > junko > clarinets, my vote went off via because I thought people were consolidating on junko, forgot that we had majority lynch, my reasons for via are in my big post with all the links, clarinets looks like he just goofed up again

oh no I'm rather glad I unvoted obviously I have no time to look over junko's posts again but it's weird how you can have a null read on via (well I guess all the appeal to self-meta stuff is hard to digest and some people seem to agree with him) I think everyone is saying "oh yeah Clarinets is bad for claiming because there was like no pressure on him so there was no reason to do so" I went over the postgame of Trinity mafia and eclipse was telling him that he should claim early rather than late so maybe he misinterpreted her advice in saying that he should claim any role if he's in any danger of being lynched close to the deadline. this is why I've been holding up on him for a bit, including the fact that he didn't finish his posts/reading of the game since his laptop apparently died, but it's because he looks rather new (he didn't know what bussing was) quote's like last 20 posts is putting a big warning sign over his head saying DON'T LYNCH OR YOU'LL REGRET IT... I guess it would be normal for him to flail, but then wouldn't you do that as scum too pretty sure my vote wouldn't matter at this point since clarinets is at 6

unvote I'm pretty sure I'm missing something but I'll be here at deadline so I can put my vote down near the end just in case lots of things happen again

? I know deadline is soon and it seemed that people were consolidating on junko and all I remember is 'hey if we don't lynch anyone we all lose'

unvote ##vote Junko THIS IS L-1 I guess I'll be around for deadline but the last few pages were a train wreck