leesangstar10

Byleth- Not sure if you planned on class path, but I recommend during Advance class stage make her a wyvern. Other options you could do is stay as pegasus or assassin. Marianne- couple tips: once she has most of her basic skills/spells(physics, thoron, etc), start investing into riding to get +1 mov. Make sure you recruited a healer before you certify her/use her as dancer. Once she becomes a dancer, she won't be healing as often(not to mention the limited heal spells she'll have). Petra/Ferdinand- I personally recommend you to choose one of them and replace the other with Hilda. It is better to have more in house units in preparation for ch 13. Shamir- Use Ignatz. Same reason for Hilda. Need more units to use for ch 13. Rn you only have 3 available units you could use by turn 3 for ch 13(Byleth, Claude, and Leonie). Mercedes- keep her as bishop. You lack healing. She isn't really meant to be an offensive mage anyways and her reason spell list sucks. Yuri-Personally never found Trickster a good class. Imo sniper is the best class for him(will require more invest thou). Recommend to recruit early. Eh not sure where you got that, but imo physical tanks are better in maddening than in hard mode. Dedue makes early game AM more manageable. Even in endgame I'd argue they are okay. I recommend Alois instead of Caspar since he provides mt bonus to Leonie. Other options you could use instead of Caspar: Balthus(Hilda), Sylvain&Ingrid(Felix), or Catherine(Shamir).

sorry but what's the point of telling me this. This does not support ur argument EO > MS. I never said you should train in reason if you do EO Byleth. As I said it is only 4.5 more. That doesn't make or break a unit's performance unless there is some benchmark. I don't think these extra stats make much of a difference. Personally, I think +4 dmg makes more of a difference. Yes Ragnorock with tome faire killing while levin+ not is situational, but I find these +4.5 extra stats mattering to be more situational. Wrong. You are forgetting the fact that most enemies have much less res than def. Idk exact numbers, but most units have at least 7 more def than res. Either way, it is kind of pointless to talk about which shit is better when both are shit. Wyvern/Falcon best class for Byleth because 1. They are just straight up a better class than most end game class. Ex. Pali, SM, assassin 2. Best build for dodge tanking. 30(alert stance+) + 10(class skill) + 30(Spd) + 15/10(lance/axe prowess) 3. This isn't about endgame but only mentioning it because the natural class path, but Byleth being flier is extremely useful for ch 13. Especially for Azura Moon since it is the only route where you aren't given a flier.

I mean if you plan on using EO Byleth, what are you going to invest in? Unless you are aiming for faire skills, what are you going to do with the activity points that could've gone to reason. Myb I meant SM is less investment. Still, I stand by wyvern/falcon being more rewarding. Also note that the best way to cheese ch 13 is to use wyvern. Watch Mekkah's recent video.

We are discussing end game class so I assume EO's availability isn't considered. Also I'm not saying don't use EO if you plan on using MS Byleth. You could use EO until MS is available. Yeah forgot to mention this is like the only strong argument against MS that nobody else seems to mention. I mean by late game getting a skill to level B in order for min req for certification isn't that hard. I don't do aux battles/quest so I basically do monetary/seminar every week so personally I didn't have a problem with this. But I do see that activities like cooking to be much more valuable. Haven't rlly thought about wasting activity points thou. I also just realized that for CF it actually could be a huge problem(make me think MS is worse for CF, but other routes not sure now). I mean MS is kind of low investment compared to other end game classes. You really only need to tutor 3 skills sword, reason, and authority. Faith u really only need C(unless you are going for white dodge tank). Also, by end game if you moderately invest in authority, you should get A or close to without the boost. I'm not equipping either skill so Sacred power being better than warding blow doesn't really help the argument. As I said -10% is just 1 Spd less per 10 lvls. So it really doesn't affect much unless there are crucial benchmarks. Byleth gets doubled anyways so it doesn't affect negatively that much. No Swordmaster is not considerable for end game class when Assassin easily outclasses it. +1 move > crit+10 any day. Also I find stealth to be kind of annoying lol cause sometimes I want them to target Byleth but they don't. Also I personally find curve shot to have about the same effect as windswept(not get counter attacked). Most enemies don't have 3 range options so using curve shot u are normally safe. If there are enemies with 3 range, they are usually archers/snipers which you can just attack 1 range(thank god they don't have close counter). The only con is awkward positioning, but if Byleth has canto this really isn't an issue(another reason why flying byleth is best end game class). I mean sure it is less investment compared to sword master, but Byleth as a flier is much more rewarding. Found my calc. At level 40 EO Byleth has +1 str, +1 mag, +1 Spd, +0.5 def, +1 ch over MS. This includes stat boost, stats from growths. As I said stat wise they are very similar. Main reason why I'd find MS to be better(very slightly) is just overall dmg output to be better. Idk maybe because I just attack with spells a lot if I make Byleth a hybrid class(pitfall? cause I am not required to use them)

Unpopular opinion(?): Mortal Sevant Byleth is (slightly)better than Enlightened One. I did calc and EO has on average 4.5 total stat more than MS. +1 Spd and I forgot the rest(ik they are spread out thou). But MS imo is better because it has black tome faire. Letting Byleth do 5 more dmg with spells. Sure Byleth isn't always going to use spells, but I'd rather take that then 4.5 more stats. Also it's not like the white tome dodge tank build can't be done as MS. I honestly don't know why this is an unpopular opinion. I got shit on so much for this and I have not seen any proof that really supports EO > MS. The best argument is MS -10% Spd growth, which is just 1 Spd less every 10 lvls(in an efficient/semi efficient play through you aren't going past lvl 40 realistically). Anyways, MS Byleth is bad too so I personally don't recommend either. Imo Wyvern/Falcon is the best class for Byleth and very useful for ch 13 especially. Byleth can fly to and help ur frailer students. also there are other battalions that have better avoid so I'd change this.

Things I like: Each character has a unique spell list. Makes unit more unique from a gameplay perspective, but I wished that they balanced each character's spell list better(ex. annette's list is terrible). Use based per map rather than hp based. Never played Echos, but I'd imagine constantly having to heal ur mages would get annoying. Things I don't like: Why are they so fricking heavy? Most mages are so slow and get easily doubled and OHKO by basically every enemy(except armor knights). As you mentioned in the video, they have to rely on one shot, but on maddening most of they can't. How many uses a spell has. Especially early game, why do spell usage gets halved? It makes mages so bad early game. After 4 rounds of combat, mages basically become useless. And why so little use for high level spells. They aren't that op considering how fricking heavy they are. Move. Why are they so slow compared to other infantry units? I get that they have good 1-2 range, but they get so behind once most of your units especially once you reach advance classes. The 1-2 range doesn't make up for all the disadvantages they get. Like why use mages when archers/snipers are better range attacking units? 1. they don't get so easily weighed down, 2. not made out of paper, 3. can attack longer ranges and 4. can trade I personally didn't find Black/Dark split that bad because I really like it for the lore (notice how only Lysithea, Hubert, Edelgard can use it, ppl that have been involved with TWSITD). But there should not have been black/dark tome faire, dark mage, dark bishop when very few units actually take advantage of this. However, these issues aren't apparent much in hard. Overall, the magic system is terribly balanced for maddening, but okay for hard/easy.

For FE in general: I'd say the most important thing is to plan ahead. Before you start your game, pick which units to use, class path, etc. Of course you could make adjustment as you play, but I'd recommend at least have a general plan for your roster and stick to it. (for example, make sure you have enough strong in house units for ch 13.) You are killing more on enemy phase than player phase. If you want to play "efficiently", you would want your units to be killing more on enemy phase because a unit can kill much more enemies rather on player phase(you can only kill max the number of units you have on that map). This is why most FE games, bows are a terrible weapon since it is very player phase focused.

I second this especially the dancer idea. However, if you really don't want to use these units, I would recommend making Byleth a flier. It allows Byleth to fly to them and protect them(assuming you are going for a deathless run). Another advice is if you don't plan on using the left side female units, class change them into a flier as well if possible. It makes it much easier for them to escape danger. (I say female cause it will be hard for Ashe to certify as a Wyvern due to lvl. Annette and Mercedes is easier due to pegasus at lvl 10)

I highly doubt that SS would look different if they did do that. SS was the first route created and they based the others routes on it. So if SS changed, that would mean the other routes would also have to be re worked. They might make minor changes to make it overall better(ex. the part with Judith), but nothing drastic. CF probably just be extended. I dont think there would be any drastic changes, but hard to tell thou. But yes it would def would be much different. Revelations wasn't a copy of either Conquest or Birthright.(even though most ppl consider it to be the worst FE game, you can't deny that they made effort)

the route as dlc. they could have Claude join SS/AM post time skip some time later(bringing back late game recruits. I really wanted this)

Something I did think of but forgot to mention and needs to be brought up more on why SS over VW. We need that choice. Not everybody is just going to side with Edelgard automatically especially if this is you first playthrough. You don't even know what really her reason for doing and you are essentially siding with the "bad guys"(TWSITD people who killed your father Jeralt and done evil experiments on ppl). My opinion has changed slightly due to ppl bringing up how it is essentially cutting a third of Fodland. I am not considering the point devs could've made VW more unique because they had a budget and time constraints. There was no way they would've had enough time before the release date(not to mention they delayed it several times) So I think VW should've been cut from base game and make it dlc to give IS more time to develop a more unique story. Imo if the dev did this, 3H would have been much better(considering how much ppl did not like CS. I regret preordering dlc).

When I mean confused I was talking about whether if I should be sad or not. This cut scene was obviously meant to be a sad moment where you have to kill your student, but because I didn't feel anything cause I didn't know her at all. VW just ruins this scene for people like me who played it first and plans on playing SS some time after. Yes this kind of what I was talking about when looking at the routes individually. Off topic, but Imo I think the developers intended that SS to be played first with the constant push of Edelgard for ads(CF would confusing as a first route and it is the "secret route". I doubt they would recommend players to play a "secret route" first) and VW last to fill in the missing lore ppl might be wondering. Thats the problem. The lack of a connection with the antagonist in VW makes it worse. You barely know anything about Edelgard in VW and fighting her just makes it feel like you are just fighting a generic FE villain(i'd argue worse due to the lack of cut scene). I think this is the point @Ottservia was trying to get across.

opps forgot about that.

Sure Claude sharing the spotlight makes it better so players aren't stuck with the blank slate character as the primary focus. And yes some moments VW made more sense like anything to do with Judith. However, during the important and peak moments of the game(Edelgard's betrayal, Byleth killing Edelgard), for VW, it was confusing and just bad. What SS adds is the emotional impact through the Edelgard vs Byleth drama. What SS is different from other routes is no prior relationship with Edelgard. SS is the only route you get to know Edelgard before going war against her. If you played CF before VW, then this wouldn't be a problem. However, if you play VW first time around, this scene has very little impact and ruins it. That is true didn't think much about that.

First I'd like to address. I do not mean get rid of Golden Deer, the Alliance, or even Claude. I said instead of VW being a route on its own, it would've been better without it to add more to other routes and make them more unique. They could just make Claude an important secondary character. Heck maybe having Claude's route be dlc would have given it more time for the developers to make the route more fleshed out. Pull a revelation and have it the "golden" route.(but make the actual plot good thou) Second, there really isn't much that VW has over SS as a narrative. Nobody has talked about what makes VW better than SS other than Claude. One character doesn't make the narrative of VW automatically better. Claude isn't even the main focus of his own route too. He shares a spotlight with Byleth. Sure he does help carry the story, but he doesn't add anything more than what SS does plot wise. Also there is so much more in the Edelgard vs Byleth than just 2 cutscene. There is still the choice where Byleth have to choose Edelgard or the Church before TS and the fact you going war against someone you knew personally. Third, my argument isn't why SS is better than VW. It is why VW should've been taken out so that they can use the time and resources to strengthen the other routes and how it would have made 3H overall a better game. I explain why VW is the weakest to show why I choose to get rid of VW out of all the routes and compared it to SS to show how little it offered. Anything extra VW like lore could've been went into other routes. In a perfect world, I would've wished for all 4 routes to be in the game and all of them were more fleshed out, but that is very unrealistic considering how long they have delayed this game.

Hoo boy this is probably a controversial opinion and it pains me to say this(since this was my first route), but hear me out. First I'd like to say that this doesn't mean get rid of the Golden Deer and its students, the Alliance, and Alymyra(arguably without it doesn't affect the plot of the game much). It is more how getting rid of VW could've made the game better and how. Why Verdant Wind specifically? Why not other routes? 1. VW is the weakest route as a narrative. It is a clone of Silver Snow but better, but I'd disagree. If we look at each route individually, SS holds more emotional impact than VW. For a first playthrough, VW you never got to know Edelgard. You really only have the few cut scenes she is in and the monastery to interact with her. So when Byleth was about to deal the final blow, Edelgard's saying "I wanted to walk with you" didn't make any sense since they shouldn't be close, more like aquatints. Personally, I was confused whether if I should feel sad or not. However, in SS, you personally got to know Edelgard through the plot and supports, so killing her hold much more weight. When I finally played SS, I realized why they included that cutscene and the speech actually made sense! Additionally, when Edelgard revealed that she is the flame emperor was a moment where players felt betrayed. Then having the choice to side with her, a mist the betrayal or go against really adds a lot to the narrative. For VW, the reveal was very weak and rushed. Yes Claude was a charming character, but these moment really hit home for me and made me appreciate 3H's writing. How charming a character is doesn't determine how good the a narrative will be. If I had to choose one of the two, I'd choose VW. 2. VW offers very little to the game If we exclude everything that was in SS, all VW has to offer is Golden Deer characters and some extra lore. However, it didn't go as deep into a character as AM or CF did with Dimitri and Edelgard. The extra lore we learn about is Almyra and Nemesis. The lore about Nemesis can be covered and SS and Almyra can be taken out of the plot and it wouldn't affect much. 3. Claude is an unimportant character Out of the main cast, Byleth, Edelgard, Dimitri, Claude, Claude is easily the least important. Heck, I'd argue Rhea was more important. Other than VW, he makes brief appearances in other routes and doesn't offer much. For the most part, Claude was just there. Dimitri has a connection with Edelgard, which made him kind of relevant in CF. Even in his own route, he is not the sole focus. He shares a spotlight with Byleth. To me, he just seems like an important secondary character. 4. SS is more needed than VW plot wise. The choice where you can choose to side Edelgard or not is needed. Not everybody would want to side with Edelgard on the first playthrough. You are essentially siding with the "bad guys"(TWSITD) that killed Byleth's father, Jeralt. How will it make it better? 1. Will make the game less repetitive. The biggest criticism people have on 3H is how repetitive the game is. If you want to get the full experience on the game, you would have to play all 4 route. Getting rid of VW means you only have to play part 1 a minimum 2 times. Not to mention, making each route unique. 2. The resources spent on making the VW could have been spent on making the overall game/routes better. Saying 3H is a flawless game is wrong. I still love the game, but I can't ignore these flaws. There are so many reused maps, lack luster map design, CF's length, etc. With more time, they can fix a lot of these issues. 3. Not make the game unnecessarily long. Like mentioned before, to get the full experience of the game, you have to play all 4 routes. It took me at least 200 hours finishing them all and to be honest, it being so long made the game kind of boring. A lot of what VW offers can be covered in other routes or just taken out. Yes I know you can just choose not to play either VW or SS, but for someone just getting into fire emblem, they wouldn't know that SS and VW is similar unless a friend played the game. 4. Give more time for devs to make VW unique! Sure it may seem scummy blocking Claude with a pay wall, but there was no way IS would have been able to do this without the extra time. They have already delayed the game and doing it again will only frustrate fans even more. Not to mention, this will help devs develop Claude more as a character, go deeper into the lore, and make a "golden route" that some fans wanted(heh the pun). Personally I don't like the idea of a golden route(look at revelations), but still I do think giving it more time through dlc would have made VW more unique(not to mention appease the fan of that are dissatisfied with CS) I might edit this if there are some things I didn't clarify enough/wrong. Let me know what your thoughts are! I hope IS never does these multiple route splits again.

Dark Flier > Valkyrie >>> War Monk > Trickster Dark Flier: Basically a less offensive dark knight but can fly. Flying is super op but there isn't any flying battalions that boost mag. Still I'd say it is better than dark knight. The extra boost doesn't help mages one shot enemies so I'd rather just put all of my mages on a pegasus.(except for Lysithea) Valkyrie: Basically easier transition to dark knight. War Monk: Imo i think it is better than Trickster mainly due to the additionally move and better dmg output. Still not much better than trickster and grappler is just straight up better thou. Very niche class. Trickster: Also a niche class. Doesn't come with a flare skill and 5 mov. Foul play is very niche combat art that I usually never use.

Yeah I meant faire opps. I dont think it is impractical but since it is your first run maybe it is better not to. Still my point stands on Paladin Sylvain. Yeah GK is tankier, but personally I found the +1 more mov from the class better and it is less investment heavy. Additionally, it will allow Sylvain to invest in authority more, allowing him to equip higher att and def battalion(ex. gautier knight). I mean steel lance+ with SS is essentially the same as Brave Axe+(does the exact same dmg and steel lance having +5% hit). Yeah if you use lance breaker Brave Axe is better, but you could use Silver lance to do more dmg with only having 10% less hit. You could use iron lance+ if you want the accuracy(sure it doesn't do as much dmg thou).

thief aint going to help him, hes still gonna get doubled. I would say stick to Paladin. Imo it is better than high/great lord since you get more mov and canto. To make ch 13 easier I recommend making your byleth a flier to help the frail units Annette and Mercedes. Personally I'd prioritize authority or flair skills(hard to do since availability) rather than investing in armor. Hes too slow so hes getting doubled anyways. If you are, stop at smite. Personally I think bow knight felix is his best class. Swords are bad. It is only good early game(not the best) and gets worse and worse as the game progresses due to low dmg and bad classes. You also get failnaught and he has a crest so he can make good use out of it. Personally stick with priest. +10 heal really helps especially with fortify. if you are going for offensive Marianne, do dark flier or dark knight. Better than holy knight. Paladin is better imo. Has more mov, less investment heavy, easier to get flair skills or +1mov. You can swift strike spam your way through. Remember to get DB thou so train axes a bit. Once mastered switch to cav and Paladin once lvl 20.

Well EP only makes his performance worse and i do note that the war master kills on EP. I did my best and put trickster Sylvain in a more favorable position, but clearly he aint that great. My point is that he doesn't kill.

Personally I think it makes more sense than past supports bonuses. I feel like if an enemy is surrounded by army they should be at a disadvantage, even if they don't support each other. And giving extra dmg if close ally is near was good. However, I don't like how they got rid of affinity. Ik that it doesn't make too much of a gameplay difference, but I liked it because it made each character more unique.

Uh no. Class bases and stat modifiers are immediate(you get them once you certified into that class and 100% guaranteed) and growth rates are residual(as you level up after certification and chance based). This is last ch of Azura Moon Maddening. I will assume Sylvain is lvl 45 at this point *also certified for warlock Noble(1-5)->Monk(5-10)->Mage(10-20)->Swordmaster(*20-30)->Trickster(30-45) Sylvain lvl45 Stats Hp: 57.45 Str: 29.3 Mag: 24.2 Dex: 24.15 Spd: 39 Lck: 25.9 Def: 23.1 Res: 22 Cha: 26.05 Mov: 5 with glouster knight *used this cause best mixed battalion Ragnorok: Att 45 AS 34 Prt 28 Rsl 27 Cha 33 Bolganone: Att 38 AS 38 Prt 28 Rsl 27 Cha 33 Silver Sword+: Att 48 AS 34 Prt 28 Rsl 27 Cha 33 Brave Sword+: Att 45 AS 30 Prt 28 Rsl 27 Cha 33 Iron Sword+: Att 41 AS 39 Prt 28 Rsl 27 Cha 33 Enemies Mortal Sevant: Wo Dao&Ragnorok Hp: 58 Str: 35 Mag: 30 Dex: 24 Spd: 28 Lck: 23 Def: 32 Res: 32 Cha: 27 Wo Dao: Att: 48 AS 28 Rag: Att 50 AS 26 Gremory: Ragnorok Hp: 52 Str: 24 Mag: 45 Dex: 35 Spd: 33 Lck: 13 Def: 22 Res: 36 Cha: 40*with battalion Rag+battalion: Att 66 Ptr 26 Rsl 43 AS 28 War Master: Killer Knuckle Hp: 70 Str: 45 Mag: 23 Dex: 23 Spd: 44 Lck: 14 Def: 35 Res: 13 Cha: 27 Killer Knuckle: Att 53 *fist flair AS 44 Sniper: Brave Bow Hp: 52 Str: 33 Mag: 23 Dex: 43 Spd: 32 Lck: 16 Def: 30 Res: 13 Cha: 27 Brave Bow: Att 48 AS 25 Assassin: Silver Sword Hp: 59 Str: 38 Mag: 26 Dex: 40 Spd: 57 Lck: 20 Def: 35 Res: 20 Cha: 31 Wo Dao: Att 51 AS 57 Sylvain wins only against the sniper out of these all these enemies. Against MS Ragnorok: 13x2 vs 23 silver sword+: 16x2 vs 23 Against Gremory Ragnorok: 2x2 vs 39 silver sword+: 22x2 vs 39 Against War Master Ragnorok: 32 vs 25x2 Against Sniper Ragnorok: 32x2 vs 20 Against Asassain Ragnorok: 25 vs 23x2 Also to note that Sylvain has a some what chance of being killed due to crit and the war master will kill him on enemy phase. Even with +3 in every stat, it still wouldn't make a diff. *Edit: sure i didn't take in account of fiendish blow, but results would still be the same Now someone please show me something that could make trickster sylvain can be good? There hasn't been anything objective that proved trickster sylvain being good. If not, I lay my case rest assured. Magic Sylvain is such a meme build. I'm fine ppl using it and talking about it, but tryna convince it is good for him is objectively wrong, sorry. If you want Sylvain to use magic, go to dark knight. Give you flair and 7 mov(and could possibly get +1 mov). If you want Sylvain to use swords, go to Assassin. Gives you swordflair and 1 more mov. If you want Sylvain to become a dodge tank/good, be wyvern lord. 8 mov, axe flair, flying. Can dodge with alert stance+ and avo +10(easily reaches +40avo) Found enemy stats here:

no where in your original post mentions class bases or modifiers. You only mentioned how your sylvain didn't get 17 magic in your playthroughs. Yes i did forget about class bases, but it wasn't you that pointed that out. So don't claim something you didn't do. No i did not ignore class growths. Not sure if you actually read my post but I clearly do mention it. I even calculated it. I said that class growths don't have a huge impact. Magic stat wise you are only getting 1 more mag per 10 lvls on average. So by level 40, leveling up in a magic class you are only getting 3 additional mag(no beginner class boost mag growths). Again you are talking about your personal experience, even including stat boosters. Again you got lucky so you mentioning your Sylvain doesn't prove anything objectively, using that path gives Sylvain 31.8 spd total(8 base + 17 from base growth + 4 from class modifier + 2 from 10 lvls of sword master growths + .8 from 4 lvls of trickster). Yes I said 36 spd is good, but I said it isn't enough to double everything which you said here: Yes it will allow you to double warriors and enemies that are a bit slow, but you sure ain't doubling everything. I assume you are playing semi efficiently. To give you better context on what I mean by "semi efficiently", units are around lvl 40~45 by the final map for non CF routes. (and this is being pretty generous. My runs units ended between lvl 38~42 by final map)

Sorry but personal experience doesn't tell much how good a unit is OBJECTIVELY. Class growths doesn't help much. Its only a 10% boost meaning you are only getting 1 mag per 10 lvls on average. 1 more mag doesn't make or break a unit's performance. Also I mainly didn't include class growths because idk the exact class path. His speed is not that good where it doubles everything. He averages 28 spd by lvl 40(no class growths). Even if you certify as trickster at lvl 20, by 40 you get 36 spd with class boost and growths. Pretty good, but not enough to double everything. Assasins, falcon knights, swordmaster have like 40+ spd by like ch13. Also tomes/spells are heavy in this game. I forgot about the class bases and modifiers so my calculations were very wrong, but my point still stands on how bad his magic would be. You are basically get base warlock by level 20 when other mages are well over base 17 mag.

Damn idk how, but you either must have gotten extremely lucky with your lvl ups. I've never seen the orange bar in any of my maddening playthroughs. Also try using Dimitri's battalion vantage+wrath combo. Makes him an enemy phase monster lol dw everybody hates that chapter. I hate this chapter the most because I can't find a way where I don't turtle(moving my units very slowly like one tile per turn). lol me too. GBA swordmasters and heros were my favorite class when I was a newbie, but then i got better and realized how broken mounts are. Idk why but they made mounts so broken in this game with dismount. (not geneology lvl thou) Imo it is the best written route, but has the least amount of lore. It has the best character development in Dimitri and overall really compelling story. However, a lot of the lore and plot gets shafted. Ex finding rhea, anything TWSITD related. Still imo best route. Bows are super useful all throughout the game. I have at least half of my units that uses bows either as their main or secondary weapon(to provide 2 range option since javalin and hand axe sucks). gauntlets for me are only decent in early and late game and it is unit dependent. Most units in maddening don't have enough strength to do significant dmg with gauntlets. I found using combat arts spamming with other weapons to do more damage than gauntlets. I do fine it useful late game on tanky units like dedue to kill swordmaster/assassin through combat arts, since late game there are swarms of them.