On a Tangent

I agree that would feel more organic than how the curse was described in game. I'd be up for that. He's not the kind of guy to wait around, for sure. It's one of the reasons I dislike the pacts to begin with - it nerfs Ashnard's and Naesala's characters. This is one of the issues that my retcon tries to address. Naesala's interactions with Begnion just don't make sense if Lekain and/or the Senate is really behind the pacts. It makes more sense if it's Sephiran. But as I said, I do think it's primarily Lekain behind Pelleas's pact. He's definitely a nefarious guy, just not as all-powerful as he tries to make himself out to be, in my opinion.

Judging by what we see of his skills in Heroes, yes, they would nerf him. Unless someone wishes to correct me regarding his actual performance?

Haha! In some moods, I imagine that Eirika always yells "SHISHKABOB!" when she attacks with her rapier - also because of her sprite. By the same measure, we should consider it canon that Joshua replicates into at least four different beings all at once during criticals.

Not entirely, no, but it's a pretty weak explanation. Given that he's devoted all his life since the Serenes Massacre to this purpose, he seems to give up on it pretty quickly. With that amount of investment involved, I was surprised. Sure, he seems to like Micaiah, but Sanaki wasn't enough to stop him. I don't see how the world having two people he loves instead of one would stop him. Micaiah had no skill as a peace-maker. And it's not like anyone in the battle spoke to him any new moral or philosophical ideas that he hadn't already considered himself in his long life. I think Sephiran is an interesting character, and I agree he's not totally lost. I liked the confusion of him still caring for Sanaki even while he was betraying her. But his change of heart came a little too easily for me to swallow.

This might be one of the few points that most of the FE community can agree on. Well, he's got long, dark hair and he repented of his hell-bent life's ambition about as inexplicably!

That makes a lot of sense. In the game's intro, it says that Magvel has been at peace for 800 hundred years, so I'm not sure how anyone has any fighting experience at all. Could be that everyone was just assigned a rank and they went with it.

Devnad, Kyle's special gift is being able to constantly scold Forde and still be considered his best friend.

No possibility that you were influenced by someone else in your household joining up, huh, Devnad?

So, what headcanon do you have the characters of Magvel? Apart from shipping, I mean. Anything out of the ordinary that's just fixed in your head? For me, I guess I've always considered Forde to have some measure of latent psychic abilities. The game made it pretty clear that despite Forde’s quirks, he’s a fully competent knight… somehow. More than a few characters express disbelief in his claim of “always being alert”, which is kind of an important trait when you’re involved in guerilla warfare, especially. So something must be going on. Forde is like a cat. He can appear to the be the laziest, slothiest lump around, basking in the sun, but he can go from deeply asleep to hissing, widely alert and twenty body-lengths away in the twitch of a whisker. At least, that’s how I imagine him. He can sleep on the battlefield because some part of him somewhere, is always watching. Clearly he doesn’t wake up for just anyone who approaches him (eg. Vanessa – though he does sense her energy…aura? He was also able to read her pretty quickly upon first formal meeting, what with calling her on her crush on Innes), but he’d have to wake up in time to fight off an enemy combatant. And you don’t just keep getting lucky on the battlefield. If you rely on luck, you end up dead. I heard once that (supposedly) the American military has a history of identifying people to train as psychics (for surveillance and spying purposes, of course) and the way they’d choose people is they’d see who keeps surviving situations that should have killed them. Who keeps getting lucky? Frankly, Forde’s been through enough that his luck should have run out a while ago. He’s able to be “lazy” and laid-back because he’s well-enough sure that everything is ok at the moment. Where other people are uncertain, and so need to check, Forde can “sense” when things are about to go wrong, or when the enemy is approaching. It’s not that he’s being negligent, so much as he doesn’t need to put forth the same effort because he’s got a little help. He doesn’t really recognize that he has this ability – he probably thinks everyone does, too, and is just uptight. It’s not like he actually visualizes what’s going on or reads signs and omens. I doubt he has visions, though I wouldn’t be surprised if he has frequent déjà vu’s and possibly lets the dreams he has at night influence his decisions and what he does during the day. As much as he can sleep during a battle, I suspect that he’d have trouble sleeping while, say, Franz was in mortal danger, or a legion of fiends is approaching them unawares, despite being cognitively unaware of either situation. Maybe “psychic” is a bit too strong of a word – more that he’s got a really honed intuition – though I suspect that in a world as magical as Magvel, if he were to train his abilities, they’d get stronger. I don’t see him as a prophet or an oracle, but his abilities would be strong enough to be a real asset to military escapades – in fact, I wonder if he hasn’t already been. Ephraim's tactical genius or not, I think he and his two companions must have just gotten lucky a few times while they were stuck behind enemy lines. And I don’t think they would have been so lucky without Forde. By all this, I don’t mean to imply that he’s unskilled or careless as a knight – if he were either, he’d be a dead knight, with or without a strong intuition. But I think that this latent psychic ability gives him the boost he needs to be able to have his quirks in relative safety. He doesn’t give the impression that he’s survived by sheer cleverness. He certainly IS clever, but as multiple people point out, he doesn’t exactly do a lot of planning. He kinda just “goes with the flow”. The laziness and tomfoolery is part act, but acting or not, can you paint and sleep on the battlefield without getting speared? Forde can.

Seriously. Major spoilers. Hi all! In my obviously-too-much free time, I wrote what ended up being an essay to fix the grievance that is the blood pacts of RD. Please have a read and tell me if I overlooked anything, or if this isn't coherent. I'd love to hear your thoughts. Maybe someone has done something like this before, but I'm new, so please forgive me if that's the case. So... There are three known blood pacts in the Tellius series: Pelleas’s pact, Naesala’s pact, and Ashnard’s pact. They’re a ridiculous addition to the story that serves the function of making people who don’t want to fight each other to fight each other. They seem to fall from the sky and float around willy-nilly. We can do better than that. I’d like to posit a theory: It’s all Sephiran. The first blood pact, it would seem, ensnared the raven king before Naesala. This is the pact that Naesala inherited. It’s the story that scared Pelleas into not breaking his own contract. We don’t know much of the history of Kilvas, but it seems that the blood pact was activated and slowly grew in power until the hundredth day. Let’s suppose that the pact, instead of being the source of the curse, is simply a vessel that extends and targets the power of the Serenes Altar to the kith and kin of the signatory (blood relatives, those under his command, or those within a certain physical distance are all possibly affected). After all, the theme of blood covers both the pact and the Altar, as historically, altars are places where bloody sacrifices are made to appease the gods and maintain order. Let’s further suppose that Sephiran gave the blood pact to the raven king, and that the king’s disobedience was not punished by an automatic triggering of the blood pact’s curse (which doesn’t technically exist), but by Sephiran himself, who invoked a seid curse at the Serenes Altar. We know that the Altar can be used for curses. We saw during one scene in Serenes that Reyson believed he had the power (presumably sourced in Ashera, who seems to like severely punishing people) to destroy everyone in the forest by using it. Though talked out of bringing about this calamity, we later see him and Leanne at the altar, proving its power. Reyson is an out-of-practice and rather warlike heron. Leanne’s been in a coma for decades. Presumably, Sephiran, who is at least a thousand years old and one of the elites who combatted Yune, is much more powerful. Possibly, his shifting into a non-laguz after his union with Altina could have altered this, but all we know for certain about the effects of this transition is that he smells different and can no longer take heron form. As pure speculation, perhaps his pacts are so powerful because they’re made with the remnants of his very own feathers – heron wing vellum or something like that. And if Sephiran is the one ultimately casting the curse, then that would account for the curse’s intelligence – how it strikes royals in particular, knows the borders of the land, and chooses who inherits the mark. The pact doesn’t actually decide any of those things – Sephiran does. The inheritance issue remains a bit tricky – why would the curse continue to be channelled appropriately through the pact after the blood of the “sacrificed” one (i.e. the person who signed) has no more value (read: dead)? I have two theories for this point: a) There is no evidence that the pact actually does transfer to someone else. Only the mark does, which Sephiran could possibly whip up as quite a separate party trick in order to scare the new guy into believing that the pact has transferred, or b) the pact automatically extends to whomever it is that takes the life of the original signatory. One blood is replaced with another, if you will. The mark transfers to Micaiah because she kills Pelleas, and presumably to Naesala because he killed the previous king (as Tibarn obliquely suggested he did). If Tauroneo kills Pelleas, however, then this wouldn’t work, so we’d have to assume that this story option isn’t actually canon. It also leaves open the possibility that the blood pact would end up being directed against the original holder’s enemies, if the original signatory was killed in battle. This would be quite an annoyance for Sephiran. But, if Sephiran is calling the shots, presumably he could just remove or abandon the curse at that point. I’m more in favour of the first theory, as it’s simpler. In any case, if Sephiran were to be behind the blood pacts, it would account for Naesala’s erratic behaviour. Let’s follow what happens with him: Whether he is actually bound by his inherited pact or not, he thinks he is. Yet he wreaks havoc in PoR, regularly ticking off Begnion. He’s obviously not concerned that his actions will cause the Senate to trigger the blood pact, so either he’s doing everything at their behest, or the Senate doesn’t control the pact. We already know that the Senate is corrupt, but the members seem to be too petty to all agree about how they’d divide the spoils of Naesala’s piracy, if they were the ones ordering him to do that. Plus, they probably wouldn’t bother to pay him, like it’s suggested Oliver does for Reyson. So let’s go with the second option – that the Senate does not at this point control the contract. If Sephiran, who wants chaos and ultimately the end of the world, controls the pact, then he’s probably quite happy to let Naesala do his own chaotic thing, regardless of who it hurts. Sephiran can turn his attention elsewhere, and Naesala can still be an audacious sleazebag in PoR, literally selling out Reyson because he wants the money, not because he can’t afford to stand up to the Senate. The one thing Naesala doesn’t do is actually attack or harm Sanaki. He talks like he will when he’s supposed to help Norris take down her ship, but notably doesn’t. Sanaki is the apple of Sephiran’s eye. Likely he’s been told not to touch her. In Radiant Dawn, Naesala acts more bizarrely. Even though he sold Reyson into slavery, it seems beyond even him to actually want to slaughter Tibarn’s entire nation. Leanne and Micaiah both read his emotions on the issue, and Naesala himself seems to think he deserves to be ripped apart for it. It’s fairly clear that he was acting under duress in this instance. I postulate that when the Senate rebelled against Sanaki and Sephiran, Lekain found the pact in Sephiran’s possession, and took it for himself. Obviously, Lekain can’t do a darn thing with the pact, because he has zero seid magic. But he bluffs, or believes his own explanation of pact mechanics (the possession equals power), and begins exerting pressure on Naesala where before Sephiran hadn’t really bothered with him. Following Sephiran’s release, however, we learn that Naesala has been tasked with watching and protecting Sanaki. There’s no way that Lekain would condone this. It’s the opposite of what Lekain wants, so it really makes no sense that Naesala would be doing so if he still feared Lekain. So, presumably, after Zelgius freed Sephiran, they paid Naesala a little visit and explained that Sephiran is the one who controls the pact, not Lekain. That it’s physically in Lekain’s possession is a moot point. Naesala and Phoenicis were the victims of a catastrophic misunderstanding of contract mechanics (And if the pact can’t be inherited, then Sephiran is simply replacing one lie with another). Since Zelgius was in on the Phoenicis plot, we could suppose that maybe Sephiran was actually the one behind Naesala’s treachery against Tibarn, but then it would make no sense for Lekain to be the one holding the pact during the endgame. Probably Zelgius was just along for the ride. Sephiran and Naesala have a confusing and somewhat cryptic battle conversation when they fight each other. Sephiran is clearly well-aware of the blood pact, and Naesala is not surprised that he knows: Sephiran: King Naesala, it seems as if everything went well with the pact. Naesala: Yes, for which I am thankful. Who knows exactly what they mean by everything “going well”, but Naesala is particularly eager to rip out Sephiran’s lungs. Unfortunately, their conversation doesn’t shed any more light on their relationship. So, in summary, if Sephiran is behind the blood pacts, all of Naesala’s side-swapping makes a lot more sense. Next, we can consider Ashnard’s pact. I believe it’s canon that the “wise man” who ensnared Daein’s king was Sephiran. Pulling Ashnard’s strings was always a part of Sephiran’s plan, and this was his way to get the Mad King onto the throne. Everything happened like Almedha said it did: everyone who stood to inherit the throne before Ashnard died. This happened not because Ashnard go lucky, but because Sephiran was being pointed about who he killed. Ashnard killed the king, the pact either went obsolete or transferred to Ashnard, and he destroyed it. Either way, Sephiran’s goal of putting Ashnard on the throne was accomplished. Pelleas’s pact is more interesting. I don’t think it’s clear that Sephiran is actually behind this one. Pelleas signed it with Senator Lekain, not Sephiran or a mysterious wise man. So what is this all about? Presumably, Lekain had already obtained Naesala’s pact from Sephiran’s possessions. He recognized it as a blood pact and liked it, which sparked an idea for trapping Pelleas. Pelleas has little brain and is easy to manipulate. So, Lekain made a copy of a real pact, cobbled up enough magic to make a mark appear on Pelleas (presumably one that will transfer to whoever kills the wearer), and sold it to him as a genuine blood pact. No one ever tested it to learn that it was fake. Micaiah read Pelleas and Almedha and decided it was genuine, but all she read was their fear and conviction, not the facts themselves. Even with this, it’s still ridiculous that Micaiah chose to obey Lekain. Initially, it might have made sense to attack Ike, since she didn’t know how strong he was. But when Ike showed that he was going to positively slaughter all her soldiers, then at that point, he was clearly going to do damage faster than the pact was threatening to do. Definitely after Pelleas died, and Almedha explained that they had to destroy the pact as well, she should have explained the situation to Ike and asked for his help taking down Lekain before the curse’s strength grew strong. The only reason I can think of that she doesn’t, is that she thought Lekain would win over Ike and then kill everyone in Daein for her betrayal. Granted, the Central Army was huge, so maybe this wasn’t a completely stupid notion. But she should at least have let Ike know what was going on. Lekain wouldn’t have overheard whispered words on a battlefield, and she and Ike could have lightened up and reduced losses in the battles that were just for show, anyway. The lighter losses would have improved the likelihood of Ike’s victory over the Central Army and the eventual destruction of the blood pact. But Micaiah makes decisions based on her special gifts of reading emotions and the future, not based on brains, usually, or on Sothe’s advice. And those magical gifts come from Yune, who likes battle and chaos. So maybe Yune had a hand in enraging Ashera, as well as the people of Tellius. TL;DR – Sephiran controls pretty well every aspect of the magic of the pacts, rather than leaving control to some set-in-stone curse, and Pelleas’s pact is fake. Micaiah still can’t do math.

I agree with this. Well considered! He's definitely gonna connect with someone that can cook. And probably fix his clothes. Domestic support would be his primary need in a marriage. Except, I think that he does, on some level, realize the importance of hugs and letting loose emotionally, as evidenced by when he pushes Soren to cry and then comforts him. And he does listen to advice about how to handle people, so if he decided that his family was important to him, I could see him making an attempt to embrace them from time to time, because eventually he'd be clued in enough to know that doing so would be normal. They'd be suuuuper awkward hugs, but I think he'd try. And the kids or wife would kinda go, uh, thanks hon, and everyone would pretend that it hadn't happened.

Hello! I clicked on your thread because I liked how polished and formal you sounded with the whole "Salutations" thing. I'm new, too. Should be fun. See you around in the discussions!

So, I've been a FE fan for about ten years now, and I've played all the games from FE4-12. But, I have never bothered to join the online community before because I felt I had nothing to add. But I've given in, and now I'm here. Hello. And who are all you people?

Hello, Welcome! I'm new, too, but I've been a fan of the series for about, uh, ten years... Haven't played Echoes yet, but I enjoyed FE7. What's your favourite component of the game?