Mavi251

I second this. I would legit pay money for cosmetic DLC to have that ponytail + glasses in combat classes rather than the pay to win stuff we have now . The hat on the horse for MK is also cool. Also Lapis has the best drip in the game

Enemies that aren't defeated in one round are returned to full HP after combat.

I wouldn't stress it too much. If she didn't turn out too well I'd replace her with someone else. Personally I play on fixed mode and usually hand her one of the energy drops; she always has as least decent strength. She also holds on to the Erika Emblem since her speed allows her to double and quad non swordmasters/sword griffins consistently and capitalize on the true damage from Lunar/Eclipse Brace. Other units like Kagetsu, Roy!Alear and friends usually can collect KOs without Erika and trained bow units will generally be able to knock down fliers without her as well. Personally I hate chapter 20 and warp skip it turn one every time. If you're not doing that then use AOE Illume on Engaged Micaiah turn one and it'll make the map way less frustrating. You can even use a strong physical unit with Engaged Sigurd to run up remove Griss' first health bar (he's slow and defensively weak) and force him to retreat to the top of the map and stay there. To my knowledge Griss will always spawn near the starting area so AOE illume will always reveal him turn one. The only things really worth getting are the Rescue staff in the chest directly west of the boss terrain tile at the top of the map and the entrap staff (worst case you can just Silence the entrap staff guy or just warp a unit there, drop the entrap staff guy, then rescue unit you used back to safety). I wouldn't stress about the treasure and just play the map conventionally and/or safely if you need to. Its uses aren't immediately obvious. You can do some pretty creative stuff like using it to force an enemy/enemies to attack at two range (potentially creating situations where enemies body block each other and cannot make multiple attacks), using it to create artificial funnels or choke points so that one or two strong units backed up by Bonded Shield/Chain Guard can 2HKO multiple enemies 100% safely on enemy phase for multiple turns while pushing forward (this alone effectively negates the need for dedicated defense tanks like Louis). You can break up enemy formations, allowing you to stagger/delay the approach of specific enemies when luring out groups of foes. When paired with the other options in this game, like the fire dragon vain, other emblem effects, etc. you can easily turn a lot of situations that were otherwise dangerous into easily manageable ones without useful resources like Freeze/Silence (which can miss) or spending Engage turns that you may otherwise want to hold onto. I think it's OP because it is 1) super useful in every non warp skipped map, 2) cheaply replaceable and widely distributable, 3) it has 1-10 range so units that may have otherwise been sitting back can meaningfully contribute (or just use canter for more movement) and 4) anyone with any staff rank can use it. It's not flashy but it gets the job done map after map and is pretty underrated imho.

Hmm. Am I the only one that finds Levin Sword Griffins underwhelming? I don't think they've got the raw magic to keep up. I will say that I enjoy using characters with natural staff proficiency as B rank staff fliers, though. Yeah I agree here. Chloe is the only one I use as a combat Griffin but I might give Wyvern a try on her. Perhaps a midgame reclass would be good once she's capitalized on the speed growth. I used Clanne as a Mageknight on my first blind playthrough on hard mode. It was pretty fun but nothing too amazing. I haven't bothered trying Dire-Thunder Sage Citrinne yet, I'll do that one next.

I am kind of torn on whether I prefer MageKnight or Sage. I think I am leaning towards MageKnight but I'd like to hear what some people think. MageKnight - Better movement (6 vs. 5 on Sage) - Better Speed (better base speed and slightly better growth) - Access to the Levin Sword which can be obtained & forged early. It allows magic units to break axe enemies and avoid breaks from fist users which can be situationally useful - Better build - Chaos Style (+3 speed when initiating on player phase) is one of, if not the best class skill in the game Sage - Access to staves like Obstruct (it's broken, inexpensive, and becomes unlimited in the shop), Warp, Re-wrap, Rescue, Pandero has A-Rank staves on Sage for Fortify which can be used to quickly recharge engage meter - Obstruct staff + Canter can be used to add 2 movement if you're not attacking, that gives Sage a 7 move option to MageKnight's 6. Though MK doesn't need to commit to a staff action for 6 move - Mystical bonus for access to Flame Dragon Vain on Emblem Corrin and the ability to bypass terrain evade bonuses (I find this to be minimally useful in practice. Most bosses move/aren't on terrain. You don't fight a lot of enemies that make use of terrain. The late game bosses that are on terrain can be gimped/warp skipped with Engage attacks) - S-rank tomes for Nova. I think this is a small point at best since you get it so late and weapon rank bonuses don't exist in this game - Sages gain access to Thrysus on Byleth. Personally I don't stick Byleth on my magic combat units but I know there are people who get good use out of it - Citrinne and Pandreo won't need to gain sword proficiency and can promote/reclass directly into Sage, saving bond points/resources - Spell Harmony is there but honestly it is pretty bad/not worth deliberately stacking - Slight base magic/magic growth lead. Overall I feel that it is better to go all in on magic offense with MageKnight since it has better speed/build and Chaos Style. I think it's easier just to bring dedicated staff users but perhaps I'm missing something. My opinion on this will probably change as time goes on. Let me know what y'all think.

Yup. Engage attacks also bypass those effects. A good tip for chapter 20 is to use Micaiah to AOE Illume turn one. Griss is usually there as he likes to spawn in the starting area. Have someone with Sigurd (my choice is brave sword/forged weapon Kagetsu) pull up and bonk him turn 1. Griss is pretty weak defensively. If you remove his first HP bar then he'll retreat to the top of the map and stay there. That'll simplify the map greatly (if you're not choosing to just warp skip it in one turn). Edit for grammar

Agreed on this one. I think they're mostly fine, less Skill Emblem we have to deal with the better. The only thing I'd change with how some of them work is perhaps to standardize their effect range to 3 squares, along with support bonuses.

I get that. I honestly don't find myself bothering but DP+ can be good failsafe for Hortensia entrap/freeze strats late game. Adding 50% with another 20-30 percent from her good luck pairs well with Staff Mastery for near guaranteed status staff hits late game. I don't find that combat units have hit rate issues if you give them good engraves/forges, though (except maybe late-game Ivy depending on the forge/weapon).

RD early game can be hard. I identified that in my post. An experienced player not streaming (managing a stream while playing makes everything harder, not to mention the nerves) won't have major trouble with it if they come in with a plan. Saying "some people have trouble with x map/section" is true for every fire emblem game and isn't too helpful without more context to be honest. I stand by this. Rutger is arguably the most over-rated unit in the entire franchise. He's amazing but far from the only viable boss slayer. Supported Lance/Alan (mostly Lance for the higher base speed) also dunk on every single chapter post Chapter 8 when promoted as he/they are the only reliable 1-2 range users you get (except a trained Milady). People just overly rely on Rutger as a crutch and haven't bothered to look into other options. They overfeed him and then get mad when their 6 move sword locked unit can't no diff the latter half of the game. FE6 enemies are bulky and hit hard but by no means are they on the level of FE12/Awakening/Three Houses or even Fates (except Rev's bulky as heck promoted enemies). It's easy enough to get at least double B rank supports with Lance/Alan/Roy before chapter 10 whilst also completing every map in around 15 turns or less (except chapter 8 because that map is huge). All it takes is some good positioning and rescue dropping which you'll require regardless if you want to make it through the game's huge maps in an orderly fashion. Other units like Shin, Echidna, Milady, Percival, trained Lugh, and even a trained Fir can dispose of bosses without too much trouble, especially if you go Illa. The only bosses who posses anything like a serious challenge are Henning, the boss of chapter 8x, and Gel on Sacae chapter 19. Literally every other boss in this game is a pushover and are the easiest parts of their respective maps. Edit: I will also include the boss of Sacae chapter 18 in this list.* I'm not gonna argue on Engage's fliers anymore to be honest. They're dangerous but no so much so that you effectively require a dedicated bow user like you do with armours and mage. Are bows strong? Of course. Is bringing a natural bow user required to not pull your hair out dealing with fliers in this game? Of course not. You say you don't want to send 3 guys for one enemy flier but their stats aren't much different than the enemy infantry users until again, like I've been saying, the very late game. You're making it sound like we're fighting Wyverns in early game FE12 H4 or late game Falcons in Silver Snow but we're not. Let's take Chapter 16 as an example. The reinforcement Griffins have 42 HP and 17 Def. The Heroes have 45 HP and 20 def. The non promoted units and non promoted fliers are even weaker. They're annoying but not *that* dangerous. Let's try Chapter 18. The Griffins have 48 HP, 24 speed, 17 def, 27 Res. The Wyverns have 56 HP, 20 speed, 23 def, 8 Res. The Heroes have 51 HP, 25 speed, 21 def, 14 Res. The Berserkers have 64 HP, 21 speed, 17 def, 11 Res. If you have units to take out the grounded infantry then those same units can slay the fliers, especially using effective weapons like the wind sword on Erika, Falchion from Lucina, Wyrmslayer, Lyn emblem engage attack and her bows, wind magic, etc. It's not that bad, man.

If you can get past the Dawn Brigade section of FE10 then I honestly think the game becomes yours to lose. You get sooo many powerful units that don't need a lot, or any investment that run roughshod over enemies. The Laguz Royals, Ragnell Ike, Early game Sothe, etc. I don't think FE6 is *that* hard. The first 13 chapters can be a pain but like most FE games the difficultly is front loaded. If you clear the first half then you're mostly good to go, especially if you go to Ilia route which is the easiest section of the game. The only hard (annoying) map post chapter 14 in FE6 I'd say is Sacae chapter 20BX. Chapter 21's reinforcements can be avoided by not triggering them and using fliers. Chapter 21X is basically free whether you choose to warp skip it or not. Chapter 22 is also free provided you have a semi-decent team. The last maps after that are basically a race the finish and pose no real challenge. Outside of chapters 4, 7, 10B/11A (both routes) 14 (if you're not familiar with the enemy positions), Sacae 20BX and perhaps Sacae 19 (if you're not prepared for Gel) pose any real challenge. The game really shows its* age despite being my favourite and the title I've played the most. Perhaps I'm projecting my experience onto my assessment and this conversation. Also it's not like the fliers in Engage are immune or heavily resist non-bow damage. You can just fight them normally. While the enemies certainly aren't trivial in Engage Maddening, during the latter half of the run I'd say the only map where enemy fliers significantly threaten you AND cannot otherwise be easily avoided is the boat map, Chapter 18. Dealing with fliers in the game is not like dealing with enemy armoured units who basically require magic/effective damage to dispose of them quickly. This isn't the case with bows and fliers. I think you're overestimating their threat level. While most units can't tank more than two hits you still have so many options to deal with them that simply don't exist in most other games. Chain guards, Bonded Shield, Obstruct staff to block off routes and/or create artificial funnels/chokepoints, freeze/silence staves, Corrin's dreadful aura and dragon vain, Ike to tank, Goddess Dance to go all in, etc. It's just a matter of bringing the right tools for the job if you ask me. I get what you're saying though. I wouldn't class FE10 or FE6 as being free but there're not *that* bad either. Edit: Spelling*

The only game I think is unfriendly to Ironman is Three Houses, especially on Silver Snow. Also, I wouldn't describe 15 turns as fast in this game as most maps can be completed relatively safely in 10-12 turns or less in my experience and what I've seen people post. But I concede the point, the list may aim to do too much. I'll keep that in mind for future reference Most of those options require Engaging but the fliers you fight in this game are not numerous (except chapter 13) or frequent. Many also come as non-ambush reinforcements on some maps. It's not hard to deal with them as any of your physical combat wyverns will likely be able to just fight them straight up. Again, it's not until the very late game that enemy fliers are super powerful (and have crazy high avoid). The Mozu/early game Conquest stuff could be it's own topic and I stand by my opinion on bow users in Engage so I'll just concede and move past it here since it's not the point of the thread.

Yeah I originally wanted to place Vander lower but he's a fairly bulky guy that can stand in if you need him during the early game, bench him if you don't. Gotta give him some credit for that. Though he's no FE6 Marcus, that's for sure. I also think that between Micaiah's AOE Healing and Marth's Mercurius, EXP is not so tight that you need to worry about the odd KO here or there are going to someone you aren't using long term.* Edit: Formatting

I respectfully disagree. I don't think there is a clash at all. We will try to keep everyone alive but people can die. We want to play through the game but also want to avoid just sitting in a corner and safely stalling out every map 'cause it's boring, hence the 15 turn recommendation. It's more of a rule of thumb rather than a hard rule that I also think is kind of generous since this game's maps are mostly pretty small and tightly constructed. I think the natural bow users in this game are either bad or mediocre. There are no Mozus or FE10 Shinons in this game. I specifically made the comparison to FE6 and 3H to* highlight that the fliers aren't as comparatively lethal as they can be in those two games. The Griffin/Wyvern knights aren't so strong that bows are required, you have the tools to fight them (staff users, Lyn emblem, Parthia from Lucina, etc) or just ignore/skip them like any other enemy type on shorter/warp-skippable maps. The Griffins have more mid level defense and can be dealt with fairly easily, it's not until the last 3 or so chapters where the enemy fliers start getting really strong that forged bows become the best option. By then it probably won't matter since the tools you have at the point to fight anything are numerous if you're not just Micaiah/Covert Astra Storm skipping the maps. Edit: Added a word/line for clarity*.

It's exactly that. Doing many of the paralogues early is kind of dangerous since the enemies are numerous and the bosses are strong (most of them). Most of the maps feature nasty reinforcements, as well. By the time you're able to clear/skip them easily, usually after Chapter 19 when you get Micaiah back, you probably won't need their bonuses/unlocks. It'd be fine in a reset/Draconic Time Crystal playthrough, but in an Ironman I wouldn't chance it if it doesn't add a lot to the late game and is relatively easy/safe to get like Lunar/Eclipse Brace+ with Seiglinde or high level Staff Mastery.

Nah. I don't find it to be worth doing. Nothing his expanded skill lists gives is worth it in my opinion and Ragnell is kinda bad despite being a 1-2 physical sword you can get in the mid-game. Resolve+ (Bond Lv. 18) is pretty good but I don't find myself needing more defense to clear the mid-end game. You can of course use Ike offensively to dive but I rarely find myself needing it.

I HAVE REVIVED. Hello everyone. I'm here to give some thoughts on how I feel Engage's cast fair in an Ironman setting. The game is still fairly fresh so I'm so in a year or two I'm sure my thoughts will have evolved. That said, feel free to agree or disagree on anything here. It's always good to get some additional view points. It should go without saying but DO NOT READ FURTHER if you haven't completed the game and want to remain unspoiled. Tier List Assumptions: 1) You are playing on Maddening Classic. 2) No DLC. 3) No Heroes bonus. 4) Try to complete maps in 15 turns or less. (Many can be completed in less than 10, some even in 1-3 turns. Others may take longer, like Chapter 17). 5) Recruit everyone. 6) Try to keep everyone alive. 7) You've completed Engage Maddening at least 2-3 times and are familiar with the maps, reinforcements, strategies, etc. 8) Characters are ranked top to bottom, left to right. 9) Obtaining all of the chests/items/villages is nice but not required. 10) These are my thoughts prior to the addition of the Ancient Well. Everyone can benefit heavily from more SP so I just consider it a wash for all units. 11) Edit: The game is played on Fixed Growths without the Draconic Time Crystal.* Rankings S: You should always use them A: They're strong with some attention/investment. B: Good but not mind-blowing. C: Kind of mid but serviceable. D: Not worth training up beyond their initial usefulness. F: Using them long term actively hurts you. S-Tier Seadall: He is a dancer, that alone places him in the S tier by default. His passive healing skill is cool too but not critical. It can be good to support martial masters. Chloe: The obligatory early game flier. She has strong offense in the early game with forged weapons (Sigurd!Steel Lance + 3 / Représailles +1/2). She's easily the most important early promote in the game. She's one of the few units that can gain enough speed to double even the faster enemies like Wolf Knights, Griffins, and Sword Users under the right circumstances. The overkill speed also indirectly improves her otherwise mediocre durability as she'll be fast enough to avoid getting doubled by anything. Her personal skill is also one of the best in the game, +2 true damage is useful, especially when paired with Alear's divinely inspiring. She also wrecks shop mid-late game with Sieglinde. Kagetsu: I think the community fawns over Kagetsu enough as is so I'll keep it brief. He starts with amazing stats; likely the highest on your entire roster when he joins. His good growth rates in Speed/Str/Build/Hp will ensure he keeps on performing throughout the whole game. Class change to Wyvern after you get Ike, through down +3 speed on him and he'll tare it up. Ivy: I feel as though this placement may be controversial but I stand by her placement in this tier. I acknowledge that her combat falls off in the very late game but this isn't a real issue for her. In the mid-game she has both the offense power (19 magic when insta-promoted) and durability to survive multiple hits in the Solm arc. She's one of the few units that joins with an emblem for whom there is no immediately better user. With Lyn's Speedtaker she gains the ability to ORKO most non-magic enemies in the mid-game. Here are some quick calcs: 17 / 1 Speedtaker Lindwyrm Ivy using the following: Elfire+2 + Magic Tonic = 34 magic attack Leif!Elwind+1 = 48 Eff Mag vs. Fliers 19 speed (14 Base + 3 from Lyn skills + 2 from meal/tonic) On Chapter 13 vs: Axe fighters with 6 Res / 43 HP / 9 Speed. deals 28 x 2 = 56 Damage Sword fliers with 15 Res / 34 HP / around 13 speed. Ivy deals 33 x 2 = 66 Damage (Elwind) Wyvern Knights with 15 Res, 47 HP / 16 Speed Deals 33 x 2 = 66 Damage (Elwind) When backed up by Alear using Bonded Shield for the 100% chance to block damage they can easily eliminate every single flier on the map with no real difficulty. I like to send the rest of the squad down the far west lane to secure the village after routing the 3 enemies near Timera's squad. Doing this effectively removes the challenge from the entire chapter. I could do these kinds of calcs for every map Pre chapter 17, with similar results. But I won't bore you all with the turbo-nerd damage calcs or these explanations will take forever. Once she starts needing much more speed to double faster enemy types, usually around chapter 19, she can fall back into a flying-staff support role with Staff Mastery and Divine Pulse for accurate status staff use and utility. Hortensia: S-rank flying staves, B-rank tomes. Enough said. Her personal gives her +1 range on her staves, including warp, re-wrap, and rescue. I often find myself pairing her with Byleth and Micaiah. Her personal flying class allows her to maneuver effortlessly, unlike most staff users. She can also use Fortify (A rank staff) to quickly, or with the right setup, completely replenish her Engage Meter. She starts with enough SP to get Divine Pulse, Canter (when available), and Staff Mastery (when available). Using her to do things like AOE Entrap to snag bosses to gank them early (Chapter 24/many paralogues), AOE Obstruct to block off or funnel enemies, AOE fracture to prevent counterattacks and AOE Rescue/Warp/Re-Wrap to quickly beat the late game maps. While other units can replicate these strategies she is without question the best unit to employ them. Her utility is unique and its usefulness is undeniable (in my opinion, anyway). Pandreo: Magic Kagetsu. Reclass him immediately into MageKnight, hand him a forged tome and/or Levin Sword, and set him loose. Again, like Kagetsu, there isn't much to discuss here. His personal can also add some hit rate reliability which is a nice bonus. For context, here are his Chapter 13 bases when immediately reclassed: 35 HP, 15 Magic, 18 Dex, 20 Speed, 8 Def, 20 Res, 11 Luck, 10 Bld. See Ivy's section to understand just how good these stats are at this point in the game. He should always have a slot on your team. Some people may advocate for Sage but you're better off, in my opinion, fully committing to the damage and speed route with Mage Knight than are you with Sage. It also has more build and one of the best abilities in the game in Chaos Style. Some people also may argue that Corrin!Kagetsu on Sage for the Flame Dragon Vain is extremely strong but honestly, you're better off engaging enemies quickly and directly in this game, similar to Fates Conquest Lunatic and FE12 H4. The crowd control utility can be replicated with the Obstruct staff and proper positioning. He's better off gaining the extra magic with Corrin and going all out on the offense side. Female Alear: I imagine this will be another controversial placement. But again, I stand by this. Both Alears have an easy time gaining enough SP for Canter in the early game. Their combat, while it won't initially blow your socks off, can become very powerful if you promote them to Wyvern, which you should. Some people will be quick to point out that Alear may be better off as a support unit due to their dragon affinity. She has access to every Dragon Vain on Corrin and the ability to provide +3 stats when engaged with Byleth but I'll be honest: these traits are grossly overrated. First, like my previous notes on Pandreo, a player experienced with the game's maps and enemy types will have more success simply attacking/luring and defeating enemies outright rather than slowing them down. On the other hand, the +3 stat bonus from Byleth can only be provided when Alear is engaged. Otherwise, they'll be a comparatively useless 5-movement, sword/fist-locked, foot-locked unit. Other units, like Hortensia/Ivy, will have a far easier time refreshing their Engage Meter AND they'll be able to keep up with your combat fliers and mounted units. This allows them to abuse Goddess Dance more frequently; this supersedes the usefulness of +3 to all stats for what might only be 1-2 turns in a chapter if you're playing relatively quickly. Foot-locked Alear, likely untrained/poorly trained if you're going the support route, will be far harder to advance with and keep safe. While the +3 stats are nice, they are not critical. So why is Female Alear in S and not Male Alear? Are they not identical stat-wise? In my view it comes down to this: 1) Female Alear, in my view, has an easier time activating Chloe's personal skill when warp/re-wrap diving mid to late-game bosses (e.g. using Wyvern Kagtesu [Male] and Wyvern Female Alear). Other units can of course kill bosses but these two have an easy time getting to the point where they can do it compared to other units. 2) Female Alear does not have to deal with Goldmary and Rosado's annoying personal skills when you fight them as enemies. While they are not difficult to defeat, in an Ironman context I would rather have more reliable options against potentially annoying enemies rather than leaving them on the table. 3) She also interacts with Louis' personal skill, which can improve his durability in the mid-game if you're using him. 4) Female Alear can gain +5 hit from Merrin's Knightly Escort. A Tier Male Alear: See Female Alear's section. He has everything she does minus the useful gender bonuses/interactions. Anna: This one will probably generate some disdain but I, again, will stand by this. In Engage you absolutely need strong magic combat. The only games where magic is more powerful than in Engage are perhaps Tharcia and Awakening. Enemy armoured units have so much defense that even your physical combat carries will deal little to no damage to them without effective weapons. I don't mean that in an abstract sense, either. They will literally deal zero damage unless you have an effective, or powerful forged & engraved weapon. Armour Knights in Chapter 5, for example, have 19 defense. In chapter 18, the Generals have 38 defense which is immense. Chapter 19 Great Knights have 39 Defense. The very late-game armours even have 45-50+. They are also fought frequently and often in groups of at least 2-3 at a time. You get the idea. Magic combat units are effectively required in this game unless you want to sacrifice multiple turns chipping these jerks down. Anna is perhaps the 3rd best long-term combat mage in this game. Citrinne does not have the speed (10 base, 30% personal) to keep up in the latter half of the game. Céline does not have the magic (40% on Vidame, for reference). Clanne has a 10% personal magic growth (lol). So why her? While it takes investment, the payoff, in my view, is worth it. But before I get into a stat comparison let's talk about Engage's Meta, especially in the early game. 1) You get access to Micaiah, which is essentially a free EXP printer. You can use AOE mend and Great Sacrifice to power level any unit you choose. 2) Other units, like Alear, Chloe, and perhaps Louis, Lapis, Diamant, or Alycrst are the only ones you'll reasonably be using after Chapter 10. All of these units are better served in their hunt for EXP by fighting enemies directly. Having them use staves rather than fight will directly harm your ability to complete these chapters quickly and safely. 3) Engage is unique in the Fire Emblem series as it's difficultly starts out manageable and gradually increases throughout the game. Compare this to Fates Conquest Lunatic, FE12 H4, or even less difficult but still challenging games like FE6 Hard Mode or FE5 wherein the difficulty is largely front-loaded. In these games, it is not worth it to train up an initially mediocre trainee unit (except archer Mozu in Fates) since the danger posed by the enemies and map challenges are acute and omnipresent. This is not the case in Engage. By contrast, the first 11 chapters of Engage Maddening compose what is by far the easiest section of the game. 4) The majority of the early game cast simply do not have the bases, growths, or a combination of either needed to be useful long term. This is before considering the fact that they'll have low SP in addition to requiring you to further divide your combat EXP. All of this before we consider the fact that many of them (e.g. Lapis, Alfred, Etie, Boucheron, Yunaka) are directly outclassed by units that join later with better bases, equal or better growths, and more SP such as Zelkov, Fogado, Panette, and Merrin. (I could make another thread about this topic alone). 5) Master and Second Seals are not hotly contested items since the units you'll want to be promoted in the early game and prepped for the long term are few. So let's take stock: We will generally only bring 2-3 trained physical combat units from the Pre-chapter 11 roster (Wyvern F!Alear/Griffion Chloe/Wyvern Lapis or Wyvern Diamant/Great Knight Louis). Staff utility is needed so that you can consistently and quickly defeat enemies and push them back turn after turn. Here's what I mean by this: First, adding another physical combat unit has diminishing returns during the first 10 chapters. Second, adding a strong long-term magic combat unit helps on literally every map in this game as they can easily and safely cut down enemy lance/axe infantry along with enemy armoured units which are otherwise a pain in the behind to deal with. They also have strong 1-2 range options along with anti-flier utility which is always useful. I consider Anna to be one of the major contenders to be on your team post-chapter 11. I stick Micaiah on her and, using AOE mend and Great Sacrifice, power level her to level 15 by the end of chapter 10. I do this so she'll get the +1 build on fixed growth mode at level 15. She'll of course have Canter, the same as the other units we'll be using from the initial cast. Knowing this, Let's compare her to Pandreo using the stats we highlighted earlier. Chapter 13 Insta-reclass Mage Knight Pandreo has the following notable stats: 35 HP, 15 Magic, 18 Dex, 20 Speed, 8 Def, 20 Res, 11 Luck, 10 Bld He's got the build to take no/little speed penalty from the Levin Sword and Bolganone (which you don't get until much later). Let's say Anna promotes and reclasses into Mageknight in Chapter 11 and gets one level between then and the start of Chapter 13. 15 Axefighter/2 Mageknight Anna has the following notable stats: 33HP, 15 Magic, 18 Dex, 18 Speed, 7 Def, 16 Res, 9 Luck, 7 Build, and the Canter Skill. As we saw in the Ivy section, these stats are more than enough, with tonics/meals and proper weapon, to double and 2HKO a wide variety of enemy types at 1-2 range with magic, 6 movement, and Canter. The Canter skill has been talked to death by the community but its implications are huge. It allows you to attack and move away from enemies that would otherwise be unsafe to engage due to overexposure. This is a very significant issue Pandreo (and the units that join post-chapter 10) must deal with. Thus, in practice, this Anna has more opportunities to engage/KO enemies and gain exp in places where Pandreo must be used more safely. This allows her to snowball much easier and capitalize on her strong growth rates. The Solm Arc is the last place where you don't have to sweat much before the enemies' stats start scaling hard so being able to level and complete your builds in this time window is incredibly valuable. Finally, her personal skill is irrelevant. Don't bring it up. The proc chance won't be high enough to matter until late in the game if you take her into High Priest. This is before we even consider that you are given enough funds to donate for extra materials and have more than enough leftover to do basically whatever you want in this game, especially compared to Fates Conquest/FE12. If it procs, sweet. If not, then whatever. Also, Pandreo is S-Tier because he has similar performance with no investment apart from a Second Seal and weapon. Merrin: She's got strong stats, a good pool of initial SP, and decent growths. Her personal skill also benefits many of the strongest units in the game. Reclass her to Wyvern and set her loose. She can do well on Wolf Knight if you pass her a forged dagger but personally, I like when my combat units can all use and pass around forged engraved weapons as needed (swords, lances, and tomes being the best IMO) rather than having the resources for them earmarked for at most one unit using a niche weapon type. B-Tier Framme: Early game staff user. The ability to block an incoming attack has big applications on enemy phase as it can allow you to fight multiple enemies in situations where an enemy may otherwise inflict break status you (attacks that would break will move first). She generates her own exp for the most part and has early game access to the broken Obstruct staff. Also having the ability to Rescue, Warp, Rewrap for mobility, Physic, and Restore are all useful options if/when you need them. This package of utility is useful enough that I'd bring her to late-game maps even if she were level one. It'd be preferable to taking a comparatively undertrained/skill less combat unit that will likely stand around doing little to nothing. You'll have to protect your staff users/dancer regardless so the trade-off is worth it. Céline: Good early game mage. Her personal class gives her access to B-rank staves which is nice. I also find she has a relatively easy time getting to Canter since she'll be your primary combat mage in the early game until Citrinne joins. She can get a lot of use out of Celica before she joins. Her personal skill adds to the amount healing items restore (Vulns heal 22 instead of 15) which is a nice bonus. Hot take: if you're gonna use her she's probably better off reclassing in Martial Master and just going all in on staff/blocking utility with healing light and canter post-chapter 10. Jean: Put the pitchforks downs. He's good for the same reason Martial Master Framme and Martial Master Céline can be, just to a lesser extent. In exchange, you have the option to train him to be a decent combat unit as his personal skill doubles the individual class growth rate modifiers. If you want to mess around with that then I recommend using Paladin (I prefer sword but lances also work), Wyvern (sword/lance), or Warrior. Lindon: Funny crits, old man. But nah. Just reclass him to Griffin, toss him Staff Mastery 3 and Canter (he comes with enough SP for both), Emblem Lucina to block for your combat fliers, and send him in. He's a strong support unit. His stats on Griffin are also decent so he's not a defensive liability. Mauvier: Do the same as Lindon skill and class-wise. His stats are also decent, the same as Lindon. I don't think he's that good of a combat unit so just focus on support. Panette: She's decent but overrated in my view. I don't think she's a strong enough grounded combat unit to justify the absence of flight+canter flexibility. Her crit builds are fun but I prefer to steer clear of low hp Wrath/Vantage crit strategies as they leave no room to improvise if you get rocked from outside your attack range or you don't crit or miss on enemy phase. She's more than usable as a combat specialist in this role, though. You will need to protect her as her defenses won't allow her to take multiple hits on enemy phase. While this is true for a lot of units on a given roster (support units, mages, etc) those units don't need to walk the RNG tightrope on enemy phase to be strong. If you want to take a more conventional approach then she'll be at least decent regardless of what you do. Also, the Warrior's Merciless skill paired with the Fracture staff can net you some KOs you'd be otherwise unable to secure on player phase. Try it out. Veyle: She's a dragon. Lots of people will use her for that alone on her personal class with Corrin/Byleth. Personally, I don't. If I choose to use her then I'll just reclass her. She's very strong offensively when reclassed into Mage Knight: Chapter 23 Reclass (Recommended Level is Advanced Class Lv 14) 35 Fell Dragon / 1 Mageknight Veyle: 36 HP, 22 Str, 26 Mag, 28 Dex (capped), 27 Speed, 18 Defense, 30 Res, 17 Luck, 9 Build. For comparison: 15 Axefighter/13 Mage Knight Anna: 39 HP, 12 Str, 23 Magic, 24 Dex, 24 Speed, 10 Def, 23 Res, 14 Luck, 7 Build Chapter 13 Insta reclass Mageknight Lv 14 Pandreo: 42 HP, 7 Str, 23 Magic, 24 Dex, 23 Speed, 10 Def, 33 Res, 22 Luck, 10 build Goldmary: She's a serviceable unit. You can simply train her to level 5 as a Hero and let her use Brave Dual Assist to support your team. She's also got high defense when reclassed to Great Knight. With Ike's +3 Defense and a tonic, she can block access to the boat on Chapter 19, allowing your fliers and mages to safely engage both bosses and the enemies on the dock. The Wolfknights won't have enough attack to damage her and they'll opt to sit there and do nothing. Either use Obstruct to keep away the Wyrm on the south side, or just slay it outright, then you'll be good. Fogado: He's good decent stats and growths when he joins. I don't find myself needing another physical combat unit at this point but he makes a great Warrior since he'll have access to B-rank bows. He can also do well with a forged Radiant Bow with his 9-base magic. Zelkov: Another unit with good stats and fairly decent growths. His being level 17 when he joins can be kind of annoying since you'll need to level him to 21 before he can reclass to Wyvern but he's more than decent should you choose to use him. Rosado: His bases are borderline serviceable for the point he joins at (Chapter 16) but his growths on fixed mode are solid enough that you can use him should you choose to do so. I recommend reclassing him to Sword/Axe or Sword/Lance Wyvern so he can make better use of his speed. Saphir: She's a decent warrior with a good starting SP pool. She won't blow you away but again, she's passable in a combat support role. Lapis: Probably another hot-take placement-wise. She's basically discount Chloe, which is pretty good. Reclass her to Wyvern and she'll have what it takes to put in work. Her personal skill is also super underrated. Reducing your own crit rate and increasing your hit rate can add reliability on both phases. Crit builds are mostly garbage/unnecessary in this game so don't think of it as a potential damage nerf, think of it as a concrete reliability buff. Diamant: Same as Lapis. Both of them struggle with the fact that you're better off just throwing Alear into Wyvern early game. Fair-fight is also a good skill as it can patch up his hit rates. Alcryst: Don't get too angry over this one. I debated placing him into the top of the C-tier but I went with the bottom of the B-tier. Alcryst, in my assessment, is being overrated by the community. Perhaps it's the allure of the Luna skill which is honestly garbage. He provides some immediate anti-flier utility in the chapter he joins, which is good. Fliers are also perhaps the most dangerous enemy type in the game, similar to FE6/Three Houses. So why do I think he's overrated? It boils down to this: 1) He has low strength in his personal class. He only reaches 19.9 strength as a 10/20 Tireur d'élite. He won't even be reaching this until the end of the game. This is laughably bad. For context, most physical combat enemies in the mid-late game have 15-25 defense. If we assume he's around level 10/4 he'll have 13-16-ish strength during the Solm arc. That's awful for a bow-locked unit. Factoring in a forged silver or steel he'll maybe have 30 or so attack, less with lighter weapons. He won't be 2HKOing. Not to mention he'll be bow-locked and foot-looked. If you want to justify your existence as a bow-locked, foot-locked unit you need to be able to point, click, and delete almost all non-armoured enemies no questions asked. His inability to do even this much combined with his mediocre stats makes him a major defensive liability and restricts opportunities to gain exp, setting him further back. 2) Luna is hot garbage. The skill halves enemy defense so in most cases it'll be adding 8-14 ish attack. If you're gaining more damage than this then Alcryst would've been dealing little to no damage to begin with. The late-game Brave Bow build is unreliable as it requires you to hit proc chances. This is another major issue unto itself as the proc rate will, for the vast majority of the game, be low enough that you can never factor it into your gameplan but you'll also need to be careful on enemy phase with it as it may end up killing an enemy you did not mean to, potentially opening him up to a fatal attack from another enemy. You'll need to assume the latter scenario will happen regardless of Luna's proc chance if you want to avoid a death chance. He would straight up be better and more reliable if he did not have Luna. This is true of all the +damage proc skills. 3) You simply do not need bow users in this game. If there were a flying class that had bow access, like Kinshi Knight from Fates, then perhaps we could have a conversation about it but you can just fight the enemy fliers normally or just slay with them with 1-2 range wind magic. If you want to use him he's probably better off just reclassing to Warrior/Wyvern. C-Tier Vander: Use him till you no longer want to. He can chip and soak damage for the first 10 chapters. Perfectly serviceable in his role as a Jeagan. Louis: Seriously, put those pitchforks down. You simply do not need an armoured unit in this game. Personally, I view him the same way I do Oswin in FE7. Many less experienced players will be able to use him as a crutch to make their way through maps but as the community gets more comfortable with Engage I predict that his stock will drop. Defensive formations and situations can be navigated with the use of the Obstruct staff, Status staves, Flame Dragon Vain, and just good positioning. While enemies in this game are strong they are not so monstrous that you need a dedicated defense tank. His growths are ill-suited for any other role, as well. Deploy him in the early game where he is most useful then drop him post-chapter 10. Timerra: Sandstorm is garbage for every reason Luna is garbage. Do not @ me. Her stats are decent enough when she joins that you can just reclass her to Wyvern if you need a stand-in. She also has one of the best personal skills in the game as it reduces enemy crit chances which are a constant threat throughout the whole game. Bunet: Where's my Chef's Hat for this guy? Nah, I jest (somewhat). He's okay when he joins but his stats and growths aren't good enough to keep up long-term. Use him if you need to but otherwise send him to the bench. Citrinne: Without Dire-Thunder she's kind of mid. She can be decent when insta-promoted to Mage Knight or Sage but she falls off hard. People think Anna is frail but she'll at least have to speed to avoid getting doubled by fast sword users until the very late game. Citrinne has around the same durability but she gets doubled in the mid-late game, heavily restricting her usability. I'd rather use the grace period we get in the early game to train up a better long-term mage. Amber: This guy's strength is pretty good. His other stats are kinda mid. Make him a Wyvern if you want to use him but otherwise, I wouldn't bother. D-Tier Clanne: Early game mage. Use him until you get Céline then bench him. He can be decent when reclassed into a physical unit but it's generally not worth it. Yunaka: Seriously, guys, put the weapons away. She's down here because she requires too many levels to get to a point where she can reclass, on top of being strictly outclassed on fixed growths when Zelkov joins. Other physical combat units are also just better stat-wise and considering the weapon forging situation I highlighted early. Fog-avoid tanking strategies do not work well on Maddening on top of being generally unneeded. You have the tools to stall enemies if you want to as previously discussed. Use her until she's no longer good then bench her. B̶e̶n̶c̶h̶e̶r̶o̶n̶ Boucheron: Early game backup attacks are useful. He has low strength and it's generally not worth it to train him. Use him until you no longer need him then send him back home. F-Tier: Etie: She makes a good first impression but her stats and growths simply do not keep up on Maddening. This is before we even consider that Alcryst, who himself is kind of mid, completely outclasses her. Feeding her is actively a waste of exp. Alfred: Too slow. Low build for an early game lancer user. Decent-ish growths but again, training him as a physical combat unit over Alear or even Louis will just actively hurt you in the long run. Use him for chip/combat utility in the early game then bench him. Jade: You don't need an armoured unit. Her growths don't support any other role. She's Louis without the early-game utility. Don't bother using her. Bonus Weapons I recommend forging: 1) Celica engraved Elfire+2/3 for Anna/Pandreo/Ivy to avoid crits (all game) 2) Marth engraved Steel Sword+3 for Alear and Kagetsu (Early-Mid game) 3) Sigurd engraved Steel Lance +3 for Chloe and Alear. 4) Byleth engraved Bolganone +1-3 for Speedtaker mages/Pandreo 5) Lucina engraved Brave Sword +2/3 for Mid-late game bossing killing on Alear/Kagetsu. 6) Alear engraved Brave Lance +2 for very late game boss killing/skips. 7) Erika engraved Thoron for accurate ranged damage. 8) Ike engraved Silver Blade to use with Lodestar Rush boss kills late in the game. 9) Leif engraved Elwind for accurate and strong early game anti-flier utility. 10) Corrin engraving works for anyone who needs extra crit avoid 'cause enemy crit rates in this game are too high and frequent in general. Paralogues Worth Doing 1) Erika's Paralogue for Lunar Brace+ and Sieglinde, one of the few weapons effective vs. corrupted. It can be completed easily in 2 turns with AOE warp provided you activate Erika turn one with a Covert's Astra Storm. 2) Micaiah's Paralogue for high level Staff Mastery. It can be completed in 3 turns with 100% reliability. Again, use Covert AS to force her to move, use Engaged Corrin to freeze the armour knights in place. Once she steps forward in the centre just gank her and win. 3) Lucina's Paralogue for Dual Assist+ and access to the Parthia for quick EXP gain and a strong anti-flier weapon (matters much less now that Ancient Well is in the game).

I've been messing around with FEBuilderGBA and have a few questions that I hope I can get answered: 1) Is it possible to change the GBA games to operate on 1RN instead of 2RN? If so, how? 2) Is it possible to implement features like Canto+, negation of enemy terrain bonuses? If so, how? 3) Instead of modifying weapons, is it possible to implement classes with special characteristics such as a class with 1-3 range, 2-3 range, etc? I believe Blazer had some kind of 2-3 range Sniper patch but I've been unable to locate it. I've been perusing the Ultimate Repository (FE) and have found it super helpful thus far. That said, directions to any other sources of advice/information would be greatly appreciated.

Fog of War: I wish FE handled FoW in a fair manner, kind of like how Berwick Saga does. If the player cannot move into darkness and attack then the enemy should not either. This is not even mentioning how you can lose your turn entirely if you bump into an enemy. FoW as implemented in FE games does not enhance the gameplay or story in any meaningful way, it's primarily a restriction on the player. This is more of a FE critique than a Thracia critique in general, to be fair. Staves: I kind of like how FE5 Staves/Staff Users are balanced. Fatigue and Weapon Rank management are interesting when paired together. Early game staff misses are irritating though, especially in an Ironman setting. Deployment Restrictions: I love and hate how Thracia handles deployments. On one end it makes sense from a story perspective—like in the—Manster Arc—that you wouldn't get to deploy units in the formations you would want. By contrast, it makes no sense that you couldn't deploy units in battle formation, that is to say, select where you want your units to start off in chapters like Chapters 8/9/13/18, etc. Fatigue: A good mechanic, though it's basically a non-issue with proper deployment management/Stamina Drinks. It would be awful for a blind run/casual runner since you can't just stomp every map with 2-4 combat units. Indoor maps/Dismounting: Handled mostly well in my opinion. The lack of good indoor lance users kind of stings (excluding Xavier who you get in Chapter 18 and may never see combat if you're playing fast). It's nice having a game where Fliers/Riders don't stomp the entire game. Skills: Having a completely reliable Wrath (Earth Sword/Nosferatu shenanigans), or Vantage+ is nice. Most of the other skills are either useless (Nihil), dangerous to use (Charge), or redundant (Adept) by virtue of the units you want to have the skill (like Asvel/Homer/Lief) already having/getting them. Paragon on a unit like Orsin is amazing, though. Minimum and Maximum Hit Values: In my opinion, It doesn't have a large impact on gameplay, for the most-part. Though it can be annoying to fail to kill/capture/dodge when you need to and/or other factors make it necessary. Capturing: I wish it would make a return. Movement Stars: Pretty annoying when bosses/strong enemies have them and is seldom useful in the player's hands because their activation rate (5% per star) is not high enough to warrant factoring them into a coherent strategy. Cool in theory, annoying in practice. Leadership Stars: They should make a permanent return; movement stars add a lot of depth to the story and gameplay, even if they can be pretty annoying in... certain instances. Magic and Resistance as one stat: It works in the context of Thracia but would be awful in every other FE title. It should not make a return. Rescuing limitations: Units will have reduced movement if they carry a unit that has 50% or more of the their own constitution. It makes sense to have a system like this and can even give value to a skill like Saviour (which doesn't exist in Thracia) but units getting an excess of constitution can make rescue/ferry strats a little cumbersome. I'm indifferent on this aspect of Thracia. Single RN: All FE games should be single RN. Players should be able to accurately and quickly calculate then act on risk/information without being mislead and/or coddled. Don't @ me. Weapon/Item Diversity: Tharcia has a surprising amount of weapon diversity. It's not diversity for its own sake, either; most of the weapons/items are actually useful. Fire Swords to boost magic (Amalda + Staves, anyone?), Elite Sword to boost defense and xp gain, King Sword for its Charisma skill and Brave effect, accessible Master and Brave weapons, loads of useful personal weapons and items like the Grafcalibur, Light Brand, Pugi, Forseti, Earth Sword, Theif Staff, Repair Staff, etc. And of course mainstays like the Warp staff makes many appearances in Thracia. FE games should take a page out of Thracia's book on how to handle weapons/items, for the most part. Feel free to agree/disagree.

12 of the 42 (28.5%) generic units of the initial batch of enemies on SS Final have miracle. All of them except the Miracle Falcon Knights are easily dealt with with Brave Weapons after you chip them to low HP. Miracle cannot activate at 1HP so two attacks that are both fatal gets the job done. The Falcon Knights are an exception as they are mobile (8 Move flying enemies), pretty tanky (69+ HP, 37+ PRT, 40+ RSL), dodgy (68-83 Avoid), and hit back hard. They hit hard enough to ORKO everyone on your team in a fast play-through so without Gambits/Guard-adjutants no one can fight them safely on Enemy Phase; even most level 35-40 units risk getting ORKO'd without a setup meant to survive a round. Miracle is an annoying skill for sure but I think people make too big a deal of it on SS Final. Also, it's not Bernie vs. SS Final, it's Bernie and Friends vs. SS Final. Provided you stop the reinforcements on turn one (Impenetrable Wall + Warp and/or Stride does the trick) the map turns into a bait and switch fest until you're in a position to fight the final boss. It's not terribly difficult, just time consuming. By contrast, Venge Bernie risks dying out-right to Hegemon Edlegard on Azure Moon Final if you keep her on low hp, basically making Venge useless for the whole map whereas Venge Bernie can still dispatch non-Miracle enemies reliably on SS Final. She can immobilize enemies with Encloser as well, though I never bother getting her A-Rank bows. That's my take, anyways. SS Final Boss having Miracle for all of their HP phases after the first is honestly the worst part, imo.

Bernie is definitely amazing as a Rider/Flier with Veng, she can easily OHK most foes when at 1hp with lances, especially considering the levels/stats of your Bernie. Don't bother using her as a Bow Unit when she's one of the few units who can reliably OHK Maddening Mode enemies with Veng. Azure Moon Final is easily her weakest map, though. If anything here is what I recommend: do a trial run of the map, see how enemies move and where your units can reach. Plan out your movement to control your enemy phase exposure and focus on taking down enemies without taking counters, when possible. Use things like Impenetrable Wall (it has 5 uses), which I feel is grossly underrated, to safely bait a group of enemies and clear them out on player phase. Guard adjutants and Blessing also help. End-game azure moon will definitely be a rough ride so perhaps consider using Dimitiri boosted with Retribution while using Battalion Wrath and Battalion vantage, a crit boosting battalion, and a Killer Lance+. He should be able to OHK lots of enemies without taking counters, especially if you use Dedue as a guard adjutant for the possible +3 (+9 on crit) damage. Worry less about clearing it and more about understanding how the map plays; the rest will come naturally. Crimson Flower Final is also a little tedious. I usually advance on the right side and move up towards Rhea, baiting and switching the enemies and Golems. To kill Rhea, consider using the Triangle Attack Combat Art (+8 Attack and +40 Crit) and Killer Weapons+ on Edlegard (after you exhaust the Amyr) and F!Byleth. This also works against Hegemon Edlegard. You can use another unit, preferably a flier, boosted with Impenetrable Wall to bait Rhea's attacks and AOE special away from your main attackers. I mean like literally using gambits then positioning your aggro pull above/to the north of Rhea so her AOE only hits the unit with the Impen. Wall active. Moreover, Combat Arts like Windsweep, Monster Breaker, and Bane of Monsters are excellent if you're going for an Armour Break; just don't go for it if she she's still at full armour and about to use her AOE. I've been able to clear New Game CF Maddening with no DLC in 12h 26mins using the final map strategy above; all of this without a single unit in their Master Class. Combat Unit Bernie as a Peg Knight, assuming you've given her the HP stat boosters and she has the HP +5 skill, easily dispatches enemy Fliers, the Paladins, and Catherine/Cyril with Vengenace and the appropriate lances (Training Lance+ for the generics / Lance of Ruin for the mini-bosses). Edlegard can bonk the Armoured Units with the Axe of Zoltan and use Curved Shot to help kill enemy fliers when without taking counters. Byleth/Jeritiza can initiate with Windsweep to chip enemies into range of high-damage follow up attacks from Bernie/Edlegard/the other Windsweep user, if needed. I'll assume you have much more stuff than I usually do and also add that you're able to use the Thrysus to dispatch some of the armoured, as well. But you don't need to do any paralogues on CF maddening to clear it. Though Shamir and Alois' one-turnable paralogue is useful to get Bernie another Seraph Robe (+5 attack for Venge). As a general rule of thumb, I try to have 2-4 dedicated combat units at most on Maddening, everyone else is utility and support. Item management and Linked Attacks are also to be considered; accuracy rings and each route's charm boosting item can go a long way when combined with other variables. Dorothea as a Dancer with Meteor is also amazing for Linked Attacks/Gambit boosts. I would also considering getting Hit +20 on your dedicated combat units to help them with their general reliability and offensive gambits. Don't feel bad about warp-skipping maps, either. Most of them on Maddening, regardless of route, are boring and tedious to play. Though you'll need to ensure that your combat units are in a position to carry you over the finish line. That said, you're more than able to finish the game with your current team, just keep on keeping on. Take breaks when needed and consider trying new strategies/gambits that accommodate for enemy movement and positioning. I know you can do it!

"ignatz has the best timeskip glow up, honestly!! i love how he got more confident post timeskip ;; and also changed his hairstyle thank god// rn I'm near the end of a church run and I've got him running crit ring/edmund troops/mini bow+ and an extra hit+20. even with access to deadeye, I'd count myself lucky to get a 3+ range hit from ashe/shamir (or bernie)". Agreed, Ignatz is a gem. Marianne is a close second for me. Also, having a good bow unit(s) for SS final pays dividends, there are so many strong flying enemies on that map. "not being able to survive multiple rounds of combat implies getting hit. with ingrid in particular that's never been a significant concern; by the time she has alert stance+ i'm already seeing 0% pretty often. imonit's also not fair to say bernie gets those kills completely unsupported, since the rest of the party is basically helping her get in range/escorting/etc.. her weakness in swords means i doubt she'll be hitting sword prowess lv 5 and that +hit makes a difference." If the hit rate is more than 10% I just assume they'll always get hit. It's not really feasible to get Alert Stance+ via seminars; it takes too long. Bernie doesn't solo or anything, she just assassinates bosses on Player Phase with consistency and minimal setup/grinding. The Devil Sword is moreso to take the 10 fixed damage to help get her to 1hp on turn one or two, she doesn't even have to kill or hit anything with it. Getting the Devil Sword isn't necessary, either. "honestly my main disagreement is with the assertion that this tier list applies to general CF on "efficient, but not ltc" (hence "regular") play. the alois paralogue is easy to 1tk yeah, but.. most ppl aren't playing the game like that... what you're describing sounds like a playstyle with a specific goal like any other kind of (ltc/in house only/etc) run, in this case being "1hko boss"? +assumes the player has familiarity with spawns, what can do this or can't do that in [specific context] and so on." 100% fair. For the record, most of my playthroughs are casual; they're more enjoyable overall. The run does assume you have familiarity with what units can do certain things with certain weapon/skill ranks at certain levels, etc. It especially requires you to know ambush/reinforcement zones, specifically chapters 5, 12, 14, 16, 17, and especially 18/Final. Special shout-out to chapter 3 for being kind of irritating at the start. "EP not being important i suppose we shall have to disagree on haha. you're right abt maddening enemies being lethal....+. you don't *have* to move fast and play offensively to survive maddening classic.. you certainly can but you can also turtle through every map with smart planning; it just comes down to personal playstyle and at the end of the day the goal is to have fun, yknow?" Perhaps I shouldn't have said EP isn't important. Rather, you can't rely on clearing out a whole squad of enemies on EP like in the GBA/SNES titles; the enemies are just roaming blobs of stats. That said, personal playstyle > all. Fun is the most important thing. I wouldn't recommend that anyone play Nader's paralogue, it's awful to play and has terrible rewards. Bernie is kept out of range on EP, it's pretty easy for her to do this as a Cav/Flier. Everyone except Byleth. Edelgard, Jeritza, Felix (or another combat unit) usually need to be kept safe/out of range on EP, except the occasional time where someone like Ferdie with a guard adjutant baits a single unit. It doesn't change too much about how the route (and maddening in general) is played. In my opinion, at least.

Sure, but it's far riskier to have someone like Petra/Leonie as a boss killer than units like Edelgard/F!Byleth. Almost no one except Byleth/Bernie/Edelgard and maybe Felix/combat unit of your choice are going to get a meaningful amount of combat exp. For a run like this I find that it's easier to use people who can have perform consistently with less resources and are subject to less variance. If these units fail to kill the bosses they're meant to combat then you risk being effectively soft-locked or you'll have actually complete maps the hard way, which is awful and time consuming. I also never said PBV can't defeat fliers, just that it's more risky to use than Heavy Draw due to the possibility of getting counter-attacked. We are not worried about swordmasters or assassins because units like Byleth/Edelgard/Bernie can easily dispose of them and almost every other generic. Byleth and Edelgard handle the majority of the duel phase combat in the run. If we need to tank them then we can use Impenetrable Wall to make enemy phase 100% safe; the thing has 5 uses, use em. Leonie does have some good bases, to be fair. "And why are worrying about Rng Screwage when Leonie has some of the better bases among the recruits?" Because in a run like this, with minimal fighting, tutoring and leveling, units who can be more easily rng screwed are less valuable than those that're less vulnerable to it/can mitigate it easier. Only Bernie/Edel/Byleth actually reach level 30 before my run is over and only then they just barely reach it. Every level matters. Though I understand that this is subjective. Also, amazing link. Thank you. The Veng strat is designed to have a way to kill the endgame bosses with a unit that can reliably reach the numbers needed to defeat them without elaborate setup/planning/grinding. The calcs I did in my OP we're almost entirely based on the Paladin Class' base strength, which is a known variable that can be planned around. She takes the guess-work out of many of the defeat boss chapters in a fast run. She's also able to kill most generic with a Training Lance, look at the chapter 4 enemies in the link LoneRecon attached. A level 7 Bernie with 31 HP, 11 STR, a 50 use training lance (4MT), and a plus 3 attack battalion (Serios Mercenaries) has an attack value of 50. This is more than enough to OHK every enemy on the map except the Death Knight and is far and away from anything I'd consider "expensive", like spamming steels and silvers. She's able to do this at a point in the game where 2-3 units are needed to kill one enemy. The value she overkill generics by only goes up as Veng scales off her Attack and HP. With a Steel lance she has an attack value of 55 and deals 37 of the DK's maximum of 46 HP. Again, she can do this at level 7. Even if we never gave her anymore exp until chapter 6 she'd still be able to OHK almost all of the generics on the map. A trained Bernie will have no trouble OHK'ing every enemy on said map. If she gets good levels she can OHK the DK too, otherwise she may need a few points of chip damage. Sure, she can only kill one enemy per turn but that's far better than units who can't kill anyone unsupported. For the sake of argument let's assume a lot of units can in theory kill bosses like C15 Seteh. How much babying/stat boosters/levels do they need? How long will it take to get them there? Especially when compared to Bernie who can nearly kill him and a load of other bosses with her level 20 Paladin bases and a few select boosts? I'm still looking for ways to use Ignatz, such a cool guy. No part of my current route involves dodge tanking, if people need to absolutely need to survive then Impenetrable Wall it is. It takes the guesswork out of planning. Alois/Shamir's paralogue can be cleared in one turn; it's a defeat boss map. I usually just have Byleth gank the boss and move on. EP phase isn't as valuable as most people, even when trained, are at risk of dying to 2 or 3 rounds of combat on EP during a maddening mode run. Especially if you're not grinding or getting a lot of kills on paralogues; if you're playing fast then you need to have a plan to survive. Crimson Flower is super bait and switch heavy so I've honestly never had trouble with this.

I never denied it to begin with. It can be apart of what may make a unit worth recruiting but it is by no means the only thing they're rated by; paralogue information was listed alongside other unit characteristics/evaluations in the OP and my subsequent posts. I again don't know how you got this impression. The point of a run like this is to use the monastery in particular as little as possible; the opportunity cost is the time you spend in the monastery doing activities. If you like playing like this then be my guest but let's not pretend it's efficient or optimal in any way. It also sounds like you have a different definition for the word "optimized". From what I can tell, you're using it as a proxy for what are known as completionist playthroughs, which are an entirely different category of run. For the record, I actually enjoy doing runs when you recruit as many people as possible. It just takes a lot of time and isn't necessary to complete the game on any route.

I lost the notes for my original response so Ill make this one short. Bosses like C15 Seteh and C17 Dimitri have 34 and 39 AS respectively. Are you going to be doubling them after factoring in the AS penalty from brave weapons? I think not. Take a look a the screenshots I attached. My L32 Edelgard with 50 str and 80 attack on initiation barely 2HKOs (she deal 36 x 2) C15 Seteth with a brave axe. Are you seriously suggesting units like Petra and/or Leonie are going to be one-rounding bosses like this, especially in fast-playthroughs? This 50 str Edelgard is getting weighed down by 4 with a brave axe equipped, as well. Units like Petra/Leonie, assuming they get average level ups, will be weighed down much more by brave weapons onto top of being much less powerful. I think you're severely under-estimating the tankiness/power of some of these bosses. Also, it's wildly unfeasible to have a unit (other than Bernie) with this much attack by C15; you almost certainly will not have anyone this nearly this strong. Heavy Draw + Steel bow+ is enough to KO fliers without risking a counter whereas if you fail to kill or get an unlucky miss with PBV you're liable to taking some serious damage or getting killed (Enemy Fliers in Maddening are a little absurd). Felix can hit C+ rank before Leonie can hit A Rank. He performs better with less resources, is less vulnerable to getting str and speed screwed, and has more accessible options to augment his combat. Their combat potential is similar, Felix is just easier to use. Alert Stance+ is completely unnecessary. You would need to focus on flying to the detriment of her skills in all other areas on top of also needing to visit the monastery again and again to get the motivation needed to do what you outlined. In my opinion, It is a complete waste of time as it doesn't help us beat any map faster/with less difficulty. Sure, get swift strikes if you want but even if we trained him as a combat unit to the detriment of other possible combat units we would just be left with a unit that can maybe deal with generics. He certainly will not be one-rounding the bosses in P2 without failing to KO and/or getting killed by the boss(es). Lysithea is a special case due to her personal skill and the utility warp provides. Also, she never needs to be trained or see combat. I will again state that recruiting her isn't necessary. Paralogue rewards are a part of the possible benefits a unit can provide via recruitment. If they provide good rewards, like Ingrid's, then of course i'll mention them. I'll also add that getting the Luin/Flying battalion isn't even necessary if you have the LOR. Slyvain's paralogue isn't necessary/worth doing if you already have the LOR, either. They just provide things could in theory make a run easier, like the extra stride battalion from Slyvain's paralogue. I don't believe that I wrote anything that would imply a given unit is or is not worth using/recruiting solely or primarily because of their paralogue. If I did then I apologize. I'd love to have this become an actual speedrun, but there is still a lot of planning to do. Also, "I only care about optimized play - even if it adds twenty hours of busy work into the run"? I'm honestly not sure how to respond to this.

"A lot of units seem to be ranked on how good their paralogues are, for one thing. But good monastery management leads to all units getting recruited in a non NG+ run so the implied opportunity cost isn't there in my eyes. Especially since Ferdinand and Caspar won't have to be recruited in this route and they take more investment than any of the students." I mentioned what, 4 out of a possible 9 paralogues? Three of which I stated/implied might be worth doing. I even said Ashe's is probably not worth doing. I'm honestly not sure how you got this impression. Also, you don't need to and shouldn't spend the time getting the requirements to recruit everyone in the context of a playthrough like this for what I hope are obvious reasons. "There's also making Ignatz bottom tier while only mentioning he has the best personal skill in the game. Soooooo, where does that leave him in relation to Ashe, who almost has no personal skill? They have the same statline (Ignatz' is strictly better with much higher luck and a tiny bit more Defense). If Ashe is non viable as a combat unit, but makes a great guard adjutant due to axe proficiency, then what happened to Raphael and Caspar? They have axe proficiencies - and even armor proficiencies. When I made a tier list, I specifically avoided discussion of units based on their performance as adjutants. Because the best adjutants are just guard adjutants with linked attack supports to better units, like attaching Flayn to Byleth, Raphael to Ignatz, etc". He does have what is arguably the best personal skill but that doesn't make him a good unit on CF. He'll have trouble killing anything without prior chip-damage until he masters the Sniper Class for Hunter's Volley. Spending time to get a foot-locked unit that can maybe kill one generic and will likely die if exposed on enemy phase strikes me as hardly being worth the trouble. Even if he went Wyvern it'd still take some time to get him there, time that doesn't need to be spent doing this when we have other units (Bernie/Byleth/Edelgard/Felix) that're more than capable of doing the job with less complications. Caspar and Raph do not/should not receive training, any exp they could be fed should go to primarily towards units such as Edelgard, Byleth, and Bernie. Raph and Caspar, on the other hand, would be unable to deal with many of the bosses that they'd need to face in efficient/fast run if you're using them as combat units/boss killers. Not without a healthy amount of levels and offensive skills on top of needing to engage the bosses for multiple turns without dying, anyways. There are units who can handle those bosses reliably that are also far less needy and vulnerable to the whims of bad levels. By time you can recruit Ashe/Slyvain you're able to easily promote them to armour knight with no exp or tutoring in Ashe's case, and minimal exp in chapter 5 in Slyvain's case. Also, using Flyan as an adjutant in Crimson Flower? Sure you could for a few chapters but... well you know. "The argument that.... use it to such greater effect on maps that actually have objectives and time limits" I agree that I should've clarified how much/what kind of grinding is okay, my bad there. Here what is what i think: if the purpose of grinding is to trivialize the game's difficultly then i'd say that kind of grinding should be avoided. I don't think I recommended anything that would do that, like grinding 4-7 levels and a host of skill on all of your main squad, for example. I mentioned using an aux battle for Lysthia as she'll able to level faith incredibly fast with her Mastermind skill + a Knowledge Gem. You can easily do a Faith-focused seminar and have her focus solely on Faith as a goal to get her to D-rank Faith; let's not pretend this is a big ask. I agree that you may need to do more than one aux battle, depending in Edelgard's defense stat. You can grab the Pirates in the North quest during the forced exploration at the start of Part 2; the enemies in this quest are usually weaker than those found in the regular aux battles Chapter 15 and onward. An average L27 or more Edelgard in her Armoured-Lord/Emperor class in conjunction with protection boosting shields, +def battalions, and def boosting items like the C8 giant shell, can become tanky enough to take little to no damage from some aux battles provided the enemies don't mainly use axes. Again, none of this is necessary. I wouldn't bother doing this if your Linhart/Manuela level ups are average or better but if you get magic screwed then doing some warp/stride setups might get a little more tricky. I again go out of my way to say that she's not even necessary but instead imply that she can be useful if things aren't going your way. Another thing, the units who auto-level in axes never require any tutoring, never need to be deployed in combat (even as adjutants) and can still easily access the armour-knight class, which is the entire point. Sure, you could use any random unit for it but that doesn't mean they all have an equally easy time reaching the class requirements or justify the effort spent to get them there. "You may have wanted to lead with that comment about play style first. When people here discuss Efficiency, they usually do it from the prescriptive of clearing maps in the least amount of Turns rather than Real Time. It's why even though it'd only takes like five minutes for Lysithea to get to B Faith through Aux battles, some are going to be more leery about that than spending an hour fishing for Bull Heads". I 100% agree that I should've been more clear, my bad. However, I disagree with your point on efficiency; what you're referring to is specifically called a Low Turn Count run. Efficiency doesn't mean you clear every map in the least amount of turns possible, it means that you attempt to clear to maps quickly, both in total time played and turns passed. "Quadrupling with Braves tends to be enough for bulky bosses. Like a Base Wyvern Lord alone can hit 42 Speed just from various Speed boosts, almost enough to double most Maddening bosses with Brave Weapons. While it does rely on having certain skills and growths to an extent, most good units such as the lords and good recruits are capable of doing so with no more investment than most other units need." It isn't. Not for Part two, anyways. A str blessed Level 27 Edelgard with 35 str, and +5 attack battalion, death blow, class fare and a brave axe has an attack value of 63. The value cannot 2 hit KO most of the enemies I listed in Bernie's section. Even if she somehow got enough speed to quad the faster bosses, which on average she won't, even with darting blow, it would still not be enough to ORKO bosses like C15 Seteh, C17 Dmitri or C17 Dedue. Moreover, enemies like C17 Dimitri with his 85 attack and 39 AS would kill even a blessed non-armoured class Edelgard/Byleth with ease. Even if Edelgard was armoured up you'd still be rolling the dice on top of having trouble reaching him quickly with the low movement of this game's armoured classes. Also, good luck hitting 42 speed on anyone in an efficient setting; it is completely up to RNG whether people can get this fast and is thus unreliable for a play-through of this kind, in my opinion. "Leonie gets a +3 Attack Support from Alosis and has boons that are relevant to become one of the best classes in the game. What does Felix provide that makes a 3 tier gap between the two when he doesn't even have a notable statistical advantage over her?" A much better combat art (Heavy Draw at C+ vs. Leonie's PPV at A Rank), his support partners are better and more available than Alois and can be positioned/attached to Felix to grant a +2-6 attack boost, depending on their support levels. Leonie, on the other hand, would require Alois to also become a flying unit if she goes into a flying class, which can be a pain. Felix, if recruited in chapter 9 or 10, can transition quickly into an assassin or swordmaster without tutoring thanks to his sword/bow boons. He can later become a Sniper with some seminars/goal management whereas the Leonie you described would need tutoring in axes, authority, lances, and flying and need a skill like death blow to even gain the opportunity to become decent in a reasonable amount of time. Tl:dr his support partners are decent and are also worth recruiting; Felix performs better than Leonie, in my opinion, with less investment. His 55 + Class Modifier strength and speed growths also make him a little more resilient to getting RNG screwed than Leonie who who has STR growth of 40 + class modifiers. It's possible to train a Leonie and not get much strength, whereas Felix is usually at least somewhat strong on average and has independently useful, more available support partners he can use/worth with to boost his attack. "Speed is quite relevant during the early-game, but I'll admit that it's impact is quite dulled without Cooking. Still, Petra still has the capability of stacking a great amount of avoid with Alert Stance + and utilizing it Battalion Wrath to have a near 100 Crit rate". Alert Stance + is unlocked at A+ Flying, good luck getting that on anyone before the run is over. Petra will also need to have extremely high, if not 100% accuracy and the ability to OHK almost every enemy she faces otherwise she risks dying due to overexposure. Also, if there are enemies with gambits you'll need to be careful as a hit from a gambit will cripple her for the rest of the enemy phase (and into player phase), likely leading to her death. This isn't even counting enemies that could attack her at three range. It just isn't reliable enough to justify using in my opinion. That aside, the only person who makes good use of Battalion Wrath is Dimitri (Bat. Wrath + Bat. Vantage + Retribution on top of strong stats).