ApocaLips

The DLC battalions are largely very good. I don’t know wtf the above poster is talking about. The three Nuvelle servants come early, are all C rank, and have stat totals that crush the other C rank battalions other than the battalions the lords come with in part 2. In particular, one has +8 str with +10 hit and crit, while the other has +8 mag and +10 crit and avoid. Both have +1 def and +7 res. That’s comparable to the best of the endgame battalions. What this means is characters with authority boons get an even bigger stat boost early game, and characters with authority banes (e.g., Felix, Hapi) have perfectly acceptable endgame options that aren’t too difficult to qualify for, which does a lot to offset what would otherwise be a notable weakness. They pull a ton of weight, and the two with focused stats should both see heavy use. As to the battalions obtained through the dlc paralogues, they’re also generally good. Hapi’s has stats competitive with the other endgame magic-based battalions (+8 mag, +10 hit and crit), and will likely make the cut on someone. Constance’s also has good stats and is the only flying battalion with a magic focus, meaning it’s an automatic pick if you make anyone a dark flier, and a solid pick at any rate. Both have AoE gambits as well which is nice. Balthus’s has the highest boost to both str and mag in the game, so it’s another auto-pick if you have a mixed unit. Even if you don’t, it still gives a solid +7 to whichever stat you’re using, plus a really well rounded boost to both defenses (+5), making it an attractive option for tanks or units that need a little help defensively that still want offense. Yuri’s is the only one I don’t regularly use, as +5 to str and mag is pretty mediocre, but the gambit can be good. Anna’s is also pretty niche but an upgrade to the E rank stride battalion on purely support units if you get their authority high enough. For non-dlc battalions, there are a few key gambits (the AoE dance, stride, retribution, a few others) to look out for, then you want the best stats you can get for your authority rank. Battalions to look out for include Fraldarius Soldiers (great stats), all 3 of the battalions that come with your lord unit in part 2, Gautier Knights (good stats plus stride), Blue Lion Dancers/Opera Co Volunteers (AoE dance gambit), and Indech Sword Fighters/Black Eagle Pegasus Co (good stats plus retribution).

There’s nothing to address here other than to note how amusing it is that you consider the statement “Your ratings are very off” to be “attacking,” and that you continue to demand a level of explanation to your arbitrary satisfaction when you’ve yet to provide any reasoning or analysis yourself. If you don’t want to address content within the same page as your posts, even when they are laid out for you again on a silver platter, that’s your prerogative. Just don’t be surprised when others give your assessments essentially no weight.

1) no it’s not. A characterization of data isn’t evidence. 2) I’ve already given plenty of points on this. For example, one of my posts from a page ago is copied below. You responded to only like a third of it with a bad point about Yuri’s boons and banes and haven’t addressed the rest. There’s plenty more from me and others if you actually care to look and discuss, but it seems you’d rather spout out random letters without giving a basis and then attack people when they disagree. ———————— Hapi for example is an excellent alternative to Lindhardt - she’s got mostly the same great faith list (physic, warp) but with a much, much better reason list (particularly banshee and death) and access to multiple good endgame classes (gremory, dark flier) that Lindhardt would kill for. You also don’t need to expend any resources recruiting her. All of this in exchange for an authority bane and not having a Faith boon - that slows down her access to physic and warp a bit, but I still usually get warp by chapter 8 or 9. She may displace him in a lot of runs. Similarly, I’m starting to greatly prefer Constance to all other combat mages. About 4.5 shots of bolting on average plus the best rescue user in the game (thanks to an excellent magic growth, as well as generally not being a shit unit) gives her a combination of power and utility that’s unmatched by anyone else. It’s almost as if she gets to just remove any 4-5 units from the map - not even lysithea as dark knight with Thyrsus has that kind of flexibility with her combat. She starts off fine with decent bases, gets to A rank reason pretty quickly if you invest a bit, and can make due with Thyrsus during the gap. She also doesn’t have the lull during the advanced class stage that other mages have because bolting and rescue offset the low move, and she generally gets a ton out of being a warlock (extra boltings, tomefaire). Yuri also seems great, with a growth spread comparable to Petra and Leonie, but again without the need to meet recruitment requirements. He then gets a hero relic, which pairs with his major crest for solid damage reduction as Felix’s does with his aegis shield. I usually give it to Yuri for that reason, and the relic also basically makes him a mounted unit in non-mounted classes, giving him the flexibility to use low-requirement classes like Sniper while gunning for authority rank, which tends to effectively put him way ahead on stats for a huge chunk of the game.

This portion of the chain goes back to a comment I previously made, not your list. If you’re going to make a bad technical argument, at least make sure it applies. Okay? The logic is still faulty. A lot of the female mages don’t want the class for one reason or another, and still more would just prefer Bishop. I already explained a chunk of my reasoning in this thread. You’ve yet to provide any response - you instead just slapped letter grades onto them. The ball’s in your court. I can’t respond to your rationale when I don’t have it other than to comment that the result seems very off. If this is a recurring issue, maybe it’s the rules that are a problem.

Trickster is ass. You should take a closer look, the tl;dr is sniper or dancer. I’ve tried both, they’re amazing. Yuri as a Sniper basically makes him a bowknight without the terrain problems and with hunter’s volley, and as a dancer with his authority boon he’s basically knight ring reyson but way, way tankier. And since he doesn’t need to grind toward master class requirements, he can pump authority early, giving him his choice of amazing stats or utility. All of this with a growth spread comparable to Leonie/Petra, who are supposed to be balanced around not having crests. Oh, and by the way, he also gets deadeye and has the highest strength growth among those who do. If your answer to all of this is “well, he can’t be one of the 3-5 wyverns on the team,” smh. FYI, in practice Dark Flier is being overrated. The best combat mages don’t really want it (lysithea for example doesn’t get a tomefaire out of it, Constance doesn’t need it thanks to bolting, Hubert can’t get it), which basically means you’re trading uses and possibly healing from bishop/gremory on warp/physic users, or a shot of meteor for Dorothea, just for flight - which only lets you get subpar combat units into combat more often. Not great. Also its stats are ass. As for your ratings of the dlc units - I thought you said you haven’t used them? Your ratings are very off. Hapi has the best spell list in the game hands down, Constance comes online way earlier than most mages and is a ridiculous bolting machine through endgame, and Balthus is pretty close to dedue early game, but with way better availability and a better endgame. Also, there’s zero chance they should be the same across all four routes. For example, BE and Church have access to Lindhardt by default, who steps on Hapi’s toes quite a bit since he has almost the same faith list with a faith boon, and Hubert already has Banshee for the early game, so her stock goes down there. On the two routes that otherwise would have to recruit Lindhardt to access that faith list (and can’t get Hubert at all, let alone have both by default), she’s much better.

If you’d look at the builds that people are discussing for him in this thread and the thread about best classes for the DLC units, you’d see that his proficiencies are far from a hinderance for him.

That’s a non-answer and again entirely unproductive. I happen to agree with you that War Cleric is a shit class, you shouldn’t put anyone in it, and putting Constance in that class is a phenomenal waste of her capabilities. But the topic at hand is who makes the best one, not should you use it. I’m sure you can understand that there are some people who want to try new content, even if it isn’t necessarily optimal, and thus want to discuss who would be a good fit for that new content. Picking at pieces of posts to make a point unrelated to the discussion isn’t a good use of anyone’s time, including yours.

Sounds fun, but you eventually got there so no need. Huh? The new classes are only available at level 20+.

Okay, then who do you think is the best War Cleric, and why? It’s not productive to respond as you did without making any effort to engage with the topic at hand.

I’m not missing my own point, lol. If you can take a break from trying to tell everyone how wrong they are, you might see that what I’m saying is that the existence of certain new units may stand to radically shake up the tier list because they bring similar benefits to units you’d otherwise need to spend time and resources recruiting. So they could affect the relative rankings of more than just themselves because they change the calculus as to opportunity cost. For example, the first post in this thread ranks Lindhardt at B+ in BL because of the spells he brings to the table but noting that he’s hard to recruit. With Hapi in the mix bringing the same spells and having no recruitment requirements, it obviously changes the math on whether Lindhardt is still worth the effort and thus should keep his spot. A similar thing to a lesser degree is going on with Leonie and Petra compared to Yuri, and Constance compared to any other combat mage you might consider. The benefits that you’re noting for Balthus let him just slot right in, except maybe in BL where he might push Dedue down. That’s why it’s irrelevant.

You can’t recruit Dedue. Again, he’s not displacing units that people tend to rank highly spend resources recruiting.

He’s not knocking out recruits from other houses that people are ranking highly, as the other three are.

I wonder how the new dlc characters affect these lists. Hapi for example is an excellent alternative to Lindhardt - she’s got mostly the same great faith list (physic, warp) but with a much, much better reason list (particularly banshee and death) and access to multiple good endgame classes (gremory, dark flier) that Lindhardt would kill for. You also don’t need to expend any resources recruiting her. All of this in exchange for an authority bane and not having a Faith boon - that slows down her access to physic and warp a bit, but I still usually get warp by chapter 8 or 9. She may displace him in a lot of runs. Similarly, I’m starting to greatly prefer Constance to all other combat mages. About 4.5 shots of bolting on average plus the best rescue user in the game (thanks to an excellent magic growth, as well as generally not being a shit unit) gives her a combination of power and utility that’s unmatched by anyone else. It’s almost as if she gets to just remove any 4-5 units from the map - not even lysithea as dark knight with Thyrsus has that kind of flexibility with her combat. She starts off fine with decent bases, gets to A rank reason pretty quickly if you invest a bit, and can make due with Thyrsus during the gap. She also doesn’t have the lull during the advanced class stage that other mages have because bolting and rescue offset the low move, and she generally gets a ton out of being a warlock (extra boltings, tomefaire). Yuri also seems great, with a growth spread comparable to Petra and Leonie, but again without the need to meet recruitment requirements. He then gets a hero relic, which pairs with his major crest for solid damage reduction as Felix’s does with his aegis shield. I usually give it to Yuri for that reason, and the relic also basically makes him a mounted unit in non-mounted classes, giving him the flexibility to use low-requirement classes like Sniper while gunning for authority rank, which tends to effectively put him way ahead on stats for a huge chunk of the game.

Warlock has tomefaire but only +3 magic compared to Gremory’s +5. So we’re really talking about 3 damage vs +1 move and an extra use of rescue. YMMV but I’d give the nod to Gremory. Agreed that dark flier is being overrated on her. Access to lots of bolting diminishes the flying utility, and she’ll never be as good of a combat unit as, say, lysithea.

Disclaimer: recommendations for hard, not maddening. Haven’t tried it yet, just getting back into the game after a hiatus. Yuri: sniper or dancer. As mentioned above, you really want to leave fetters on Yuri. As we learned with Felix, the pavise/aegis effect is very useful when paired with a major crest, and free canto means you aren’t forced to go mounted. Altogether, that makes sniper have fewer drawbacks than usual compared to bow knight, and you get better stats and access to hunter’s volley in return. Really nice. Dancer with canto and extra move also seems awesome, especially with the extra tankiness from sword avoid. Balthus: war master/grappler/wyvern rider. I don’t think this unit makes a ton of sense if you aren’t trying to leverage his crest. War master gives high crit, grappler for the 3x attack art, and wyvern rider for mobility. Constance: gremory. Her crest lets her really stretch those extra bolting uses, giving nice synergy and access to a niche as premiere artillery with access to rescue. She doesn’t really have the stats to excel as a pure combat class such as dark knight or dark flier in the way that lysithea does, so I’d leave her to do what she does uniquely and give thyrsus to someone else. Hapi: gremory. She feels like a way better version of lindhardt - physic and warp access, but also with a better reason list. Lindhardt would kill for gremory and she gets it. The class doubles her great faith list and some important spells from her reason list. Again, combat stats aren’t stellar, better to leave that to someone else. Anna: don’t use her much, but trickster seems fine.