Hard Mode: 3-6 problems

[Geist]

Well, I've been playing on hard mode some days ago and I got through the game quite well. But I failed really hard at chapter 3-6. I only finished it because I sacrificed some units, which I didn't want to do. So I used human shields...

Anyway, can you give me a hint or something with which i can go through this chapter without losing units?

[Seph]

It's an easy chapter, Nolan and Zihark make the chapter pathetic together, with an A support. They will dodge everything.

Send Nolan and Zihark north and Micaiah, Sothe, Volug and maybe a promoted Jill (my Jill was like level 16 with transfer bonuses and I promoted her just for that chapter and 3-13) east. Then, when the BK comes, send him east too.

Edited December 29, 2008 by Julius

[Wisper]

My strategy for this level was to move everyone in the bottom right corner of the level, and keep using vulnelries if they were hit even once. Try to form a box formation around Micaiah and Laura, who will heal any weakened units. Defense is the best way of staying alive in this chapter. Just wait five turns for BK to appear, then have him solo.

EDIT: Also, IIRC Zihark has about a 33-40% chance of getting hit. Nolan's chance is probably higher. Don't overely on an Earth Support if you have it.

Edited December 29, 2008 by Wisper

[Seph]

That's a good strategy, but it just doesn't give enough exp.

The enemies are easy enough that you can charge anyway.

Edited December 29, 2008 by Julius

[Wisper]

That's a good strategy, but it just doesn't give enough exp.

The enemies are easy enough that you can charge anyway.

The next two chapters they're in are almost completely defense based anyways. As long as you have two or so units that can take a hit, then you're pretty much set.

And laguz are not easy enemies...not in this chapter at least. Everyone on my team except Aran was 1-2 shotted by Tigers.

Edited December 29, 2008 by Wisper

[Seph]

Um, so?

You want more exp for the other chapters..

And laguz are not easy enemies...not in this chapter at least. Everyone on my team except Aran was 1-2 shotted by Tigers.

Nolan and Zihark take tigers like nothing, and the Black Knight helps a lot with the tigers to the east. Sothe can one round a tiger and you can Physic heal him with Micaiah, which you want for a higher stave level.

Edited December 29, 2008 by Julius

[Wisper]

Um, so?

You want more exp for the other chapters..

Meh, you already have all the GM's and Haar. I didn't use any of my Daein units after that. They aren't that neccesary.

[Seph]

Micaiah and Sothe are mandatory, so they want exp.

Nolan and Zihark are just amazing together, and they should be trained.

People like using Jill too, and she needs exp a lot since she has poor availability.

[Wisper]

Micaiah and Sothe are mandatory, so they want exp.

Nolan and Zihark are just amazing together, and they should be trained.

People like using Jill too, and she needs exp a lot since she has poor availability.

I didn't train Micaiah at all, lol. I decided to pity Sothe and I paragoned him in 4-P. He got up to level 15 I believe. Nolan and Zihark are good, but training them BOTH is very difficult with the lack of EXP on HM. Jill...I don't know how you're supposed to use her in HM. She has a 60% hit on everything in part one, and is really hard to train there for other reasons as well.

But I guess all of that is all personal preference.

EDIT: Plus, this is getting a bit Off Topic.

Edited December 29, 2008 by Wisper

[Mekkah]

It's an easy chapter

Apparently it's not for him. Why do you always call every chapter/game/mode considered hard "easy"? Seems like you're bragging.

Anyway, a foolproof method of this chapter is to only field Micaiah and Sothe, and give Sothe Savior and some vulneraries. Make him Savior Micaiah while on a thicket. Stall a few turns until the Burger King comes in, then start to schwoop everything.

Alternatively, make use of choke points, and only attack if you're on full health and not going to take a counter.

[Seph]

FE lacks challenge.

Anyway, a foolproof method of this chapter is to only field Micaiah and Sothe, and give Sothe Savior and some vulneraries. Make him Savior Micaiah while on a thicket. Stall a few turns until the Burger King comes in, then start to schwoop everything.

No exp, needed on HM, and if Sothe is ganged up on then he'll die easily.

A tiger will 2hko Sothe, and cats are very accurate. That strategy is impractical. Tigers have like 50% hit on him, even with Micaiah support.

Edited December 29, 2008 by Julius

[Geist]

Thank you guys for the answers. I think I'm going to try different methods and see which works best :). I just need to get to the chapter again...

[Florete]

I had Jill and Aran wall it up at the north with Volug hanging back waiting for his gauge and Laura healing. I had Sothe, Zihark, and Nolan fighting at the right with Micaiah backing them up with Thani and healing. It was actually very easy.

[dondon151]

A tiger will 2hko Sothe, and cats are very accurate. That strategy is impractical. Tigers have like 50% hit on him, even with Micaiah support.

Your strategy is impractical as well, for a couple of reasons. If Sothe is getting 2HKO'd, then how are Nolan and Zihark taking tigers like nothing? Zihark has worse concrete durability than Sothe and slightly better base avoid. In addition, what if TC didn't build up ZiharkxNolan support earlier? ZiharkxNolan C grants the same avoid as SothexMicaiah A, so in this case, you're strategy is hardly better than Mekkah's.

Also, I have hardly any trouble with any FE chapter/game/mode, but I can recognize when a chapter's difficult and when it's easy.

[Seph]

Did you seriously forget that A Zihark x Nolan gives 45 avoid?

A tiger has like 25% hit or less on Zihark? A tiger has like 30% hit on Nolan (I remember this from my playthrough..)? They WILL be taking tigers like nothing. In fact, my strategy worked far better than I anticipated, I was charging with Zihark and Nolan because they were just dodging and killing everything, and I wanted them to get as much exp as possible.

And even then, if you don't have A or B Zihark and Nolan, you should be able to take those tigers as long as you don't charge/kill them in a single round, but you can stay at the north.

Also, on my hard mode playthrough, I didn't even have beastfoe, which would make the strategy even more effective with it. I'd probably hand it to Volug or Jill since Nolan and Zihark didn't need it, they were just killing everything.

Edited December 30, 2008 by Julius

[Mekkah]

No exp, needed on HM

You don't "need EXP on HM" (or any mode). You use the Savior strategy for this chapter, then let the NPCs and Tauroneo do some work in 3-12 and 3-13, as well as the people you raised in Prt 1 (who should be overleveled by now), and from there you just put some GMs on the Silver Army.

and if Sothe is ganged up on then he'll die easily. That strategy is impractical. Tigers have like 50% hit on him, even with Micaiah support.

Only like 2 dudes can attack him at a time iirc. And he's on a thicket. Several people, along with vykan on another thread, have said it works. It's far more practical than "my Zihark and Nolan just rushed in and never got hit", which was obviously you getting lucky.

[Seph]

You don't "need EXP on HM" (or any mode). You use the Savior strategy for this chapter, then let the NPCs and Tauroneo do some work in 3-12 and 3-13, as well as the people you raised in Prt 1 (who should be overleveled by now), and from there you just put some GMs on the Silver Army.

Which makes the game harder later on, because they didn't train well. You want to beat the game as efficiently and as fast as possible, right? You said this yourself before.

Only like 2 dudes can attack him at a time iirc. And he's on a thicket. Several people, along with vykan on another thread, have said it works. It's far more practical than "my Zihark and Nolan just rushed in and never got hit", which was obviously you getting lucky.

Again, I never said it was impossible.

First off, I called it impractical because of the little exp you get.

Yes, obviously me getting lucky, when Micaiah can get a Physic (which she should use since her staff rank should go up) and Zihark and Nolan can use Vulneraries/Concoctions! I had to restart the chapter a couple of times too, because of the east side but Zihark and Nolan were always working well. When I said 'never got hit', it means barely, and I was trying to encourage the use of it. Getting hit twice in a row by tigers is just pure bad luck, since they have like 20-30 hit, sometimes even less than 20, and cats don't do much damage anyway, and even they have 30-40 hit. Nolan and Zihark both on average have more than 100 avoid (ignoring biorhythm, terrain, map bonus etc.), I just calculated this. Even if they did get hit, I can simply heal them. You didn't even play the game anyway, I don't see how you get the liberty to comment on it.

Heck, you don't even need to test this to see how effective it is, with logic you can easily figure it out.

Edited December 30, 2008 by Julius

[Geist]

Well, I found out a strategy which worked very well in NM. But I do not know about HM:

I just put Micaiah, Sothe and another Unit with a 2-range-weapon(I took Jill because she can also attack a unit which Sothe cannot because of her movement) in the corner at southwest. In addition, I command the yellow units to go there, too. They work as human shields and I heal them. I tried that yesterday and had Edward with Beastfoe in one of the bushes. He dodged quite well, but as I said, I do not know about hard mode. Maybe you can place Nolan and Zihark there with an A support. Now I just wait, attack the opponents I am able to attack and heal the weakened ones.

However, when the BK appeared, there were still three of the yellow units alive. Maybe I am going to test this on HM.

Edit: I forgot to mention that Edward had Vantage, which helped a lot because he instantly killed every enemy within one hit.

Edited December 30, 2008 by Geist

[dondon151]

Did you seriously forget that A Zihark x Nolan gives 45 avoid?

Did you not read that I was assuming ZiharkxNolan C?

And even then, if you don't have A or B Zihark and Nolan, you should be able to take those tigers as long as you don't charge/kill them in a single round, but you can stay at the north.

How does this strategy not apply to Sothe hiding on a thicket?

[Seph]

Way to go, ignoring most of my post.

Did you not read that I was assuming ZiharkxNolan C?

Your strategy is impractical as well, for a couple of reasons. If Sothe is getting 2HKO'd, then how are Nolan and Zihark taking tigers like nothing? Zihark has worse concrete durability than Sothe and slightly better base avoid.

Because you weren't? Or you were, but you did a very poor job of saying it. You said that Zihark and Nolan weren't going to take tigers like nothing THEN you mentioned that. Also, you said IN ADDITION. You didn't say "I WAS ASSUMING".

How does this strategy not apply to Sothe hiding on a thicket?

Um, what does this have to do with what I said?

[dondon151]

Way to go, ignoring most of my post.

There's no point addressing every single part of a post when most of it doesn't need to be addressed.

Because you weren't? Or you were, but you did a very poor job of saying it. You said that Zihark and Nolan weren't going to take tigers like nothing THEN you mentioned that. Also, you said IN ADDITION. You didn't say "I WAS ASSUMING".

If I were assuming NolanxZihark A, I would be an idiot to say that it doesn't work.

Um, what does this have to do with what I said?

NolanxZihark C grants the same avoid as SothexMicaiah A, but for some reason Sothe is impractical and NolanxZihark isn't?

Why are we even arguing about this anyway? It's fairly obvious that both strategies work well.

[Seph]

There's no point addressing every single part of a post when most of it doesn't need to be addressed.

It does.

If I were assuming NolanxZihark A, I would be an idiot to say that it doesn't work.

Then you did a very poor job of saying you were assuming Zihark/Nolan C, which is not my problem.

NolanxZihark C grants the same avoid as SothexMicaiah A, but for some reason Sothe is impractical and NolanxZihark isn't?

Oh man, you were talking about Nolan/Zihark C? Way to go. Why are you even assuming that? Seriously? No one will have Nolan/Zihark C at 3-6 if they're training them seriously.

I was using Nolan/Zihark A when I said it was impractical.

Why are we even arguing about this anyway? It's fairly obvious that both strategies work well.

Your strategy is impractical as well,

Edited December 31, 2008 by Julius

[dondon151]

It does.

No, it does not. Do I have to offer a retort to everything, even if it's correct or if it doesn't warrant further discussion?

Then you did a very poor job of saying you were assuming Zihark/Nolan C, which is not my problem.

Maybe I overestimated your inferencing abilities.

Oh man, you were talking about Nolan/Zihark C? Way to go. Why are you even assuming that? Seriously? No one will have Nolan/Zihark C at 3-6 if they're training them seriously.

Uh... I didn't? This isn't a fair assumption. Just half of an earth support grants 23 avoid, and most other affinities grant a little avoid as well. Perhaps someone wants to share the earth affinity?

I was using Nolan/Zihark A when I said it was impractical.

You said it yourself, "if you don't have A or B Zihark and Nolan."

A tiger will 2hko Sothe, and cats are very accurate. That strategy is impractical. Tigers have like 50% hit on him, even with Micaiah support.

Hate to sound like a kid, but you started it.

[Seph]

No, it does not. Do I have to offer a retort to everything, even if it's correct or if it doesn't warrant further discussion?

If you want to look good in a debate, you should address them as correct, not ignore nearly all of the post and only address the parts which you are capable of.

Maybe I overestimated your inferencing abilities.

Ha. I explained this already, quite well in fact, which you couldn't deny. Must I do it again?

Uh... I didn't? This isn't a fair assumption. Just half of an earth support grants 23 avoid, and most other affinities grant a little avoid as well. Perhaps someone wants to share the earth affinity?

There are 4 chapters for an A support. Easily a B support.

In a hard mode playthrough people generally pair up Zihark and Nolan for the most efficiency. Micaiah and Sothe are paired up together anyways. Aran is rarely going to dodge anything either way. Leonardo? No need for avoid. Edward is generally used in place of Zihark, not used together. Jill does things by herself so she shouldn't get a support. Volug is the only one, but I don't think he will be used seriously.

You said it yourself, "if you don't have A or B Zihark and Nolan."

I'm saying you should.

Hate to sound like a kid, but you started it.

Are you serious? I made a claim, you replied to it, I replied back.

Edited December 31, 2008 by Julius

[Little Sothe]

Hey, I read somwhere that people give Volug beastfoe and kill many ennemy in the east while untransformed, does that work?Because since I scrapped some of my character I was thinking of using Volug to get me out of this shit.