First enjoyable day in my neighborhood

[TheEnd]

Everyone has options

Not really and not always, in a qualitative sense.

[lolDeath]

I'd consider that more a personal problem.

But, hey, I don't blame people for my own being poor, I must just be weird.

[GKSB]

It's always your responsibility first, not the governments or anybody else's, to get you out of your shit. My parents would be in sorry shape - hell, my moms from a dingy farm in Iowa and my dad from basically an eskimo ghetto in Alaska- if they hadn't worked their asses off to get a college education and work their way up to high paying jobs so that we can live as we do now.

Don't give me that Social Darwinist bullshit.

It'd be Social Darwinism if he said that people are poor because their race keeps them down intellectually or whatever other inherited trait. Death's saying that people put themselves where they are, there's always a way out except in the most extreme circumstances.

Edited March 9, 2009 by Crepe Knight

[lolDeath]

As usual, better at saying what I mean than I am.

I can't think of a single example where someone has no choice but to live in poverty, outside of some in very poor countries. I'm sure there must be a couple though.

[Manna]

I can't think of a single example where someone has no choice but to live in poverty, outside of some in very poor countries. I'm sure there must be a couple though.

I must say that it all depends on where you live. Remember, the southern side of a US state might be completely different than the northern side, not to mention stepping into another state entirely. If you live in rural Virginia, there aren't hardly any jobs there. It took a friend of mine's husband over three years to find a job with his networking degree there. (And I'm not entirely sure he hasn't recently gotten laid off. We don't stay in contact much.)

Layoffs aside, all our factories are closing down or moving to Mexico. My dad's worked in a factory for over 25 years and pretty soon he'll be jobless. He's almost old enough to legally retire, but he can't retire-- the house isn't paid off, et cetera.

I'm not saying it's okay to go and blame everything on someone else. We're only human, and as such we make stupid mistakes. No one is exempt from that. Eventually we'll all look back and say, "What the hell did I do that for?"

Personally, I like where I live. Rural Ohio for the win. We've got a lot of cornfields, a lot of nice scenery... But it's hard to find a job way out here. That's why I work in a factory, haha. And believe me when I say I'm grateful that I even have a job. I make almost as much as most teachers, and I only work through two-year contracts as a temporary worker (though I get 40 hours a week).

However, the Honda factory I work has cut production, and the other Honda factory just down the road laid off all its temporary workers. In the meantime, my contract was up in April, and that would leave me jobless. It was an answer to prayer that with the economy like it is, and with them planning to only keep 30 or so temporaries a shift (we probably have 300 total) that they asked me to stay on another full year.

Others are not so lucky. But that isn't the point. The point, I guess, is that with things like they are right now, looking for a job is about next to impossible. Looking for a better job? Is impossible, especially without a college degree. And getting a college degree right now? Impossible for those that are struggling. Most people are not legally allowed to collect unemployment and go to college at the same time.

Either way, I don't think the original poster meant to be blaming everything on everyone else so much as he was trying to give reasons that, to him, make sense. After all, unless you live where he/she does, you cannot say whether or not what he is saying is true or false.

And racism? Is still everywhere, I'm afraid. It's just not as in the open as it once was.

[lolDeath]

Impossible? IMPOSSIBLE?

You can lay down all the examples you want, but it doesn't change the fact that it is possible to find a job and a better one depending on the amount of effort you put into it. If you have no degree and can't get a decent job, that is your own fault for being lazy. If you are about to get laid off, find another job. Saying "there are none" is completely untrue, this just goes back a a lack of effort.

Americans are pretty lazy and seem to love blaming everyone else for their own problems.

And yes, I can say that his claim is false, being as one of the reasons he gave was that white people don't like him, or his family, or whatever.

Edited March 9, 2009 by Death

[Manna]

If you have no degree and can't get a decent job, that is your own fault for being lazy. If you are about to get laid off, find another job. Saying "there are none" is completely untrue, this just goes back a a lack of effort.

Where?

If I get laid off, I'll make more on unemployment than I will working at any job that makes less than $10/hour. Not only is it hard to find a job, most adults need jobs that will give them at least 32 hours a week, if not 40.

Though I do pose a question: what is your definition of a decent job?

Again, it depends on where you live as to the availability of jobs in your particular area. Cities naturally have more jobs than rural towns/villages.

Of course, it upsets me when people are hired for a physical labor job and then refuse it. That's just laziness. And that happens more often than I'd like to admit. (Of course, some people turn down fast-food jobs, even when they don't have a job at all. At least it's work, right? That kind of stuff drives me absolutely insane and is definitely nothing short of lazy.)

But like I said, getting laid off and making money while you're looking for another job is better than finding an $8/hour job before you get laid off.

I'm letting everyone know that it all depends on where you live. Just because jobs (might) be easy to come by where you live doesn't mean they are anywhere else. All we have within a 20 minute drive of here is a couple of gas stations, a post office (with two routes), and one or two pizza places. Obviously, nobody is hiring. Ever. That's why I and almost everyone I actually work with drives between 40 minutes and an 70 minutes to work there. I knew one guy who drove 90 minutes to work there. It was the only place he could find a job that paid decent.

But no, it is not always easier to find a better job in your area, even if you look hard. Especially if you're making $25/hour or so. (I don't make that much, but that's what most factories are paying after several years of being hired on.)

[lolDeath]

I don't need to reply to that because my point only relates to a small part.

But no, it is not always easier to find a better job in your area, even if you look hard.

You live in poverty or go to another area where it's easier for you to find a job. If you end up with no job and stay in the same place, broke, that is -your choice-.

I don't understand how you can sit there and say that in my area it might just be easier, when it sounds to me like it's just more difficult in yours because you live in the middle of nowhere (or at least, that's how you make it sound).

Edited March 9, 2009 by Death

[Manna]

You live in poverty or go to another area where it's easier for you to find a job. If you end up with no job and stay in the same place, broke, that is -your choice-.

Of course!

But moving into another area sometimes isn't the best choice, either. For example, just because you move doesn't mean you'll find a job. And lots of times, if you're broke, you can't afford to move. (You have to pay first and last month's rent most places nowadays, at least the last time I checked.)

Alas, the world is not a kind place.

Edit: Oops, didn't see this (well, before I posted)--

I don't understand how you can sit there and say that in my area it might just be easier, when it sounds to me like it's just more difficult in yours because you live in the middle of nowhere (or at least, that's how you make it sound).

Well, I mean easier than where I live. Honestly, I've never lived in a city so I don't know how much easier it is to find a job, and sometimes race does impact whether or not you'll get a job. (Just like being a man or a woman has the potential to impact that, even if it's not supposed to.)

So I guess I meant (from what you said) that it might be easier in your area than it is in my area. Or maybe in the original poster's area.

And yes, I do live in the middle of nowhere, haha. ^^

Edited March 9, 2009 by Manna

[lolDeath]

The main reason I started this is because the original poster lives in an area with an insane cost of living, haha.

Of course!

But moving into another area sometimes isn't the best choice, either. For example, just because you move doesn't mean you'll find a job. And lots of times, if you're broke, you can't afford to move. (You have to pay first and last month's rent most places nowadays, at least the last time I checked.)

Alas, the world is not a kind place.

Not being able to find a job in a new area would be caused by a lack of planning, and the person would choose not to plan that far into it, making it still their fault. As for the rent payments, sell shit, get a really horrible, low paying extra job for a little while and save the money. At the same time, the person in that situation would have known that they have to do that, so them not having the money available to them would also be their own fault.

[Phoenix Wright]

The main reason I started this is because the original poster lives in an area with an insane cost of living, haha.

Not being able to find a job in a new area would be caused by a lack of planning, and the person would choose not to plan that far into it, making it still their fault. As for the rent payments, sell shit, get a really horrible, low paying extra job for a little while and save the money. At the same time, the person in that situation would have known that they have to do that, so them not having the money available to them would also be their own fault.

Why are you saying it is so easy to get a job when it is not?

To me, you are speaking of a fantasy land where EVERYONE gets jobs if they are not lazy. Bull shit. Say two men/woman work as hard as they can, spending as much time as possible to get that certain position; but only one gets the job. Now the other person is jobless, and will have to move to a bad neighborhood. Say the person CAN get a descent job, but it only pays enough to get by. OK, so s/he can get a second job, what about children? Daycare costs too much, and you cannot find one descent babysitter for your kids.

This is a common problem just so you know, it is not rare. Not every family has lazy ass parents unwilling to get a job, it is only the fact that their best was not good enough.

Then there are other factors, like Section 8 for example. Section 8 members are focused on before other people are looked at.

[lolDeath]

Let me list the problems here

1. I didn't say it was easy, ever. I said possible. It's possible to do a lot of things.

2.By choosing to try for the same job as someone else with no backup, they are allowing that risk.

3. Are you saying that no good babysitters exist? And again, they chose to have the child without the ability to financially support it well.

4.

You know what, I wash my hands of this horse shit discussion. You can try to justify the poor planning of your families all you want, I don't care, just don't bitch about it blaming it on those who had nothing to do with it like this guy has.

Get last words, snicker "frikkin owned", whatever you need.

Edited March 9, 2009 by Death

[Phoenix Wright]

Let me list the problems here

1. I didn't say it was easy, ever. I said possible. It's possible to do a lot of things.

2.By choosing to try for the same job as someone else with no backup, they are allowing that risk.

3. Are you saying that no good babysitters exist? And again, they chose to have the child without the ability to financially support it well.

4.

You know what, I wash my hands of this horse shit discussion. You can try to justify the poor planning of your families all you want, I don't care, just don't bitch about it blaming it on those who has nothing to do with it like this guy has.

Get last words, snicker "frikkin owned", whatever you need.

I am sure everyone can agree with that.

[TLSothe]

I grew up in a 'ghetto' area. Not exactly ghetto, just...a bad neighborhood. There were shootouts once or twice a month. I was never really in more than a few myself, but it was a bad environment to grow up in, which is why I moved before having kids. Yeah...

[Dr_Slick]

The city life isn't so bad. Not by a longshot. Sure, some area are bad and they have their bad days, but usually, those days are overlapped by good days. I used to live in a suburan area and I just hated it. Yuppies and preps just pissed me the fuck off and I couldn't take it. Man, I'm just happy that when I turned 17, my parents deicided they had enough of the suburban life and wanted to move to the city. I enjoy it ever since.

[YokaiKnight]

You can try to justify the poor planning of your families all you want, I don't care

The problem isn't that many people are poor by their own fault or family--the problem is that you're acting as if there are almost no exceptions to this, like it's a rule. Not true. Bad luck happens.

[Esau of Isaac]

You don't have to be successful to not be forced into such a shitty area.

And you don't have to want to live in a shitty area to be in a shitty area.

Everyone has options, and not taking them -does- make it their fault short of layoffs and mass conspiracy to not let them get a job.

Bullshit. This isn't some kind of happy world where I can catch a bus out of town and just live in a new world. If I want to move somewhere else, that requires funds. And for some, they don't have the money to just up and leave to another area that doesn't guarantee better living.

Edited March 11, 2009 by Esau of Isaac

[lolDeath]

You're cute when you're defensive.

[FurryYunSeong]

Death, you win for being a fighter. I agree with you on most accounts.

It took me some time to realize that everything that happens to you is mostly influenced by your choice. You choose pratically everything. A friend of mine said that your choices only affect 10% of things. Untrue. If you take the time to think about your situation, and work on it, you can go over that, and dominate your life. Frist step to success. Planning and working. It's never easy. And some people get lucky. Just don't get your hopes up.

I can't speak for myself. My choices arent the best, and as a result, I'm not in the best situation. But I know what to do, and more than anything, I believe I'll get a better life. By working on it.

The only thing I have to add is that sometimes, where you are, where you live, who's around you, it's probably dangerous to take risk. Dangerous as in losing your life dangerous. To fight, you actually have to be alive.

I dunno if I'm making any sense, of I'm just repeating what has been said, but seriously. I agree with the dead person.

[Esau of Isaac]

You're cute when you're defensive.

And you're cute when you're an asshole.

Wait, no you're not.

[Rehab]

I agree with the dead person.

smile'd

[TLSothe]

And you're cute when you're an asshole.

Wait, no you're not.

Luckily for all us, you are though! That was without a doubt the most pathetic post ever made by you. So sadly defensive, and unproductive...

Sorry, but I gotta side with Death on this one. And not just because I worship him either.

Edited March 15, 2009 by Matthew O'Connell

[Esau of Isaac]

Luckily for all us, you are though! That was without a doubt the most pathetic post ever made by you. So sadly defensive, and unproductive...

Sorry, but I gotta side with Death on this one. And not just because I worship him either.

It's hard to create a large and structured amount of information in a rebuttal when responding to a post that already lacks substance, and has no indication of entering in an intelligent conversation. But you're not looking for an explanation as to why I responded to his unfair and incorrect generalization. You are only interested in circle-jerking.

So continue on.