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Progenitus

ITT I rank the characters

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Lyre

So we get Ranulf, a pretty cool dude who has some nice stats. He's a cat though, so he can't go crazy.

And then we this unit named Lyre. Who's also a cat. Except, other than speed, Lyre has about the same str and def transformed that Ranulf has... untransformed.

**** YES, THIS SOUNDS LIKE THE PERFECT UNIT TO USE, MIRITE GUYS?

Lyre has 22 base att. 22 att is what ****ing Mist had in 3-P. And with 22 base spd, she doesn't double either. 47 HP/14 def is pretty underwhelming. That's about what Boyd had in 3-P, who started out pretty mediocre. 60 avoid before authority stars doesn't help either. So she does like 2 damage against enemies and doesn't double, and gets 3HKO'd in return, and she has the same transformation issues as Ranulf.

And Lyre barely gets any better beyond this. She's only level 17 so she doesn't level too slowly, but her growths are crap other than speed. 35 str/20 def? Her problems aren't going to get any better. Well, her speed growth is 70, so after a few levels she'll actually double, like what a cat's supposed to ****ing do. So she'd do 4 damage instead of 2, and still gets 3HKO'd in return.

STOP FAILING LYRE KTHNX

I'm not sure what IS was thinking about when they made Lyre. What redeeming feature does she have? Level 40 Lyre has only 1 more str than base level Ranulf, and 1-2 less def. That's really sad.

Like Astrid, I'm going to have some moar random lulz.

- Untransformed base level Muarim would beat transformed base level Lyre in a fight regardless of who went first. 58 HP/15 def/28 att vs 47 HP/14 def/22 att. Muarim does 14 damage (4HKO) and Lyre does double 7s (9HKO).

- Untransformed base Mordy could beat transformed base Lyre in a fight regardless of who went first. 57 HP/24 att/16 def. Mordy 5HKOs and Lyre 10HKOs and doubles. Mordy would always get his 5th attack before Lyre gets her 10th.

- Halfshifted base level Volug would beat transformed base level Lyre in a fight regardless of who went first. 49 HP/25 att/13 def vs 47 HP/22 att/14 def. Volug 5HKOs and Lyre 6HKOs, and Lyre can't double him (19 AS vs 22 AS).

- If Lyre had wildheart and joined in 1-5 with Volug, she would still be one of the worst units on the team.

- Base level Nolan with a steel axe has more att than base level Lyre.

- Transformed, base level Lyre only has 2 more def than Reyson. And the same speed.

- Base Lyre can't 2HKO base Soren, who has 28 HP/9 def.

- The only DB units at 20/1 that Lyre could beat in a fight are Micaiah and Laura.

I compiled a list of tier 2 units at their base level, who could beat transformed Lyre in a fight, if their weapon had 0 mt.

Lyre wins

Sothe

Zihark

Tormod

Marcia

Neph

Heather

Lucia

Danved

Makalov

Calill

Soren

Mist

Boyd

Rolf

Rhys

Mia

Pelleas

Lyre loses

Tauroneo

Brom

Haar

Kieran

Geoffrey

Ike

Titania

Gatrie

Shinon

Sigrun

Tanith

depends on who goes first

Oscar

GUYS, WE COULD MAKE A TIER LIST BASED ON HOW WELL YOU DO AGAINST TRANSFORMED LYRE IF YOU WERE USING A 0 MT WEAPON.

tldr; WHAT IF MY BEORCS WERE USING 0 MT WEAPONS AND HAD HALF AS MUCH DEF?

I'D GET LYRE.

NO WAIT, MY BEORCS WOULD STILL BE BETTER, BECAUSE THEY STILL DON'T HAVE A TRANSFORMATION GAUGE.

1/10

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Kyza

Kyza should've taken a leaf out of Mordy and Muarim's books. Apparently he didn't get the memo of how tigers should really be; godmoding with uber att and def.

Kyza's durability is actually not too bad. 55 HP/20 def is higher than most beorcs, and with an 85 HP and 40 def growths, they remain decent.

Unfortunately, that's where his positives end. His offense is bad. 30 base att is crap if you joined in 3-4, and 22 base spd is not enough to double consistently. 3-4HKOing and not doubling? Give me a break. And his growths are not enough to make it better. You'll need to give him a speedwing so he can double, but then he has a 30 spd cap which gives him serious issues doubling anyway. And his att never gets out of the hole. With 5 levels and S-strike, he has 39 att, which is only 3 more than what Ranulf joined with, and because of his issues doubling, he may not even get S-strike in a timely manner.

So his stats are already pretty bad (above average durability but terrible offense), but then he's hampered by being a laguz and having to worry about a transformation gauge. A good laguz is one that has such good stats that their transformation gauge is a minor issue, but when you're bad at fighting, the gauge is just another annoyance to tack on. ****, Ranulf HALFSHIFTED has comparable stats to Kyza with full bonuses. Kyza leveled to 26 is still worse than Ranulf at his base level. What's the point of using Kyza?

It doesn't help that he has a terrible affinity, so he's not even going to be helping with supports.

You can think of Kyza as basically being Lethe, but without having an average part 2 performance. Instead Kyza is just bad the whole game. Not Lyre level bad, but not worth your time.

2/10

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Reyson

So there I was being Reyson

When some guys told me that I was really good in Path of Radiance and I should be nerfed

So I said "**** YOU I'M REYSON"

And then I started smoking grasses and gained canto

And made lots and lots of vigors

I love my life

All jokes aside, Reyson has a small issue. His availability is limited. Unlike Haar/Ike, units who got 10s, he only has 7 chapters before 4-E. It doesn't really help that many of his chapters are fairly easy, even without his help, which means existing for that chapter isn't worth much (of course this applies to everyone in that chapter, but it hits Reyson harder than most people because it's a greater percentage of his pre-4-E chapters). 3-E, for example, is a complete joke.

There's no doubt that Reyson's abilities are rigged beyond belief, and I could really go on about how ridiculous he is, except that'd be pointless. But his limited availability prevents me from giving him a perfect score. He's not as essential as Haar and Ike, where Haar is the *only* flier for several GM chapters, and Ike is pretty much a monster.

9.5/10

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Janaff

I'll just jump straight to the point. Everyone knows the hawks are godly, but the question is, which one is godlier?

I think the most accurate way to do it is to break it down by chapters, at least how they fare offensively.

3-7. Janaff one-rounds halbs and warriors and snipers while Ulki has issues.

3-8. Janaff has issues one-rounding halbs now. Ulki has issues 2-rounding generals

3-10. The enemies are about the same as 3-8 enemies, except now there are paladins (Janaff one rounds and Ulki doesn't) and dragonmasters (neither one-round).

3-11. There are a lot of paladins in this chapter. Janaff one rounds a bunch and Ulki can't one round anything. Janaff starts running into issues one-rounding snipers and warriors (though they're rare in this chapter). Ulki has an even harder time 4HKOing generals, and now he's borderline on 2HKOing SMs.

3-E. Similar to 3-11.

I'm assuming we're sending the hawks with Micaiah because of the desert (as awesome as the 4-5 base convo is).

4-P. Ulki has issues 3HKOing most anything, which means simply giving him adept may not even be enough. Janaff isn't one rounding, though he 3HKOs non-generals with ease. The hawks are probably getting S-strike sometime late during this chapter.

4-3. Even with S-Strike, Janaff has issues 2HKOing halbs and warriors, while Ulki upgrades to 3HKO.

4-E-1. General heaven. They're so tanky Janaff has issues 3HKOing, but on the other side Ulki has issues 4HKOing. Note that if Janaff can't 3HKO, his offense is not that much better (adept won't let him one round), since after 2 rounds of attack you're bound to have a mastery go off once.

4-E-2. Janaff isn't 2HKOing, but Ulki might have issues 3HKOing. It's a fairly small chapter though (~30 enemies), and you don't even need to kill them all.

4-E-3. wtf dragons. Something like 76 HP/36 def for red dragons and 71-72 HP/22 or 24 def. The red dragons are so tanky that while Janaff requires fewer hits to kill them (like, Janaff ~6HKOs, 5 if he has SS-strike, while Ulki ~10HKOs, 6HKos with SS-strike), they'll probably activate their mastery before the dragon even gets to half HP at which point they both kill. Janaff 3HKOs white dragons while Ulki might not (unless they have SS-strike, at which point they both 3HKO).

4-E-4. Neither have issues 2HKOing the spirits, although because they lack 2-range they're not very good here anyway.

4-E-5. This is like the only time Janaff can't double, since the auras are too fast for him. However, because the hawks have canto, they can easily use the dragons' tide skills and then move off to let someone else use it, which means Janaff can go to Nasir while Ulki goes to a red dragon and they'll be doing similar damage. And then Ashera, but neither are that stellar against her. It's pretty short anyway.

Now would be a good time to address masteries. In all of part 3 they are both getting 1 exp for doing anything. In 4-P, because the enemies are about level 6, that means Ulki gets ~5 exp a kill while Janaff gets ~2, which means that Ulki might gain a level and hit level 29 while Janaff will be stuck at about 70 exp or something. And then in 4-3 they get about 10 exp a kill, which means that Janaff doesn't really get his mastery much earlier than Ulki. Although with BEXP factored in Janaff does get it a bit faster, but not by a lot.

However, the rest of the offense does matter. Janaff doesn't really one-round very often without a crit or adept or something similar, but he's generally requiring one less hit to kill than Ulki, which makes a pretty big difference, be it Janaff being able to kill with an adept and Ulki not, or just weakening foes enough so that other units have an easier time killing. It's also worth noting that Janaff can usually turn his 3HKO into a 2HKO if we give him an energy drop while giving one to Ulki just puts his att at the same level as Janaff's without one, and Ulki doesn't do much better with adept than Janaff does.

I'm at my maximum message size, so I have to cut it short.

9/10

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Ulki

Base Ulki untransformed with no supports has similar avoid to several beorcs do with an earth support.

Yes. I am not kidding. 18 spd/25 lck gives him 81 avoid before stars. Boyd with A Earth does not match this until roughly 20/15.

But that's enough of fun facts. Time to get to business.

We all know Janaff is pretty durable himself. The guy transformed has 57 HP, 24 def, 16 res, and 98 avoid before any stars, PLUS has a purely defensive affinity. He could go into 4-E at base level with no supports and have comparable durability to Titania. Still, there are situations where Ulki can apply his durability lead (for comparison, Ulki has 59 HP, 22 def, 20 res, 117 avoid).

The big one is when a crossbow is nearby. They get pretty ridiculous. Already in 3-7 the crossbow warriors have 155 hit, which means even after stars Janaff is facing 42 displayed hit while Ulki faces 23 displayed. Of course at the moment they both get OHKO'd, so I don't really plan on leveraging Ulki's avoid advantage here, but down the line when the hawks can avoid the OHKO (supports, plus they eventually level up) will it become apparent.

However, later on even snipers using regular weapons have high hit, especially if the boss in the chapter has stars, as well as 4-P and 4-3 where Micaiah has none. A sniper in 3-11 has 160 hit/33 att with a steel bow, which means it has 47 displayed hit on Janaff at 29 damage and 28 hit on Ulki at 31 damage (before supports, where Janaff will improve slightly since his affinity boosts avoid, but still a lot worse than Ulki). Usually bow enemies don't come in groups, but even just 1 only needs to be around for Janaff to watch his step. If one sniper hits him, all the enemies with high hit suddenly look kinda threatening.

Even wind sages are annoying. 3-11 elwind sages have 153 hit with 30 att (so 42 after the bonus), which is 40 hit vs Janaff and 26 damage while 21 hit vs Ulki and 22 damage. Granted these enemies are rare, but when you run into one they'll hurt the hawks almost as much as a bow.

Of course Janaff isn't that worried about dying even after some steel bow hits him (you'll still need a bunch of enemies around to kill him off), but you'll waste more time healing him than Ulki, which matters because the laguz have to also worry about keeping their gauge up. Even if they don't get attacked by bows, Janaff will get hit several times, so you'll eventually want to heal him, which is an advantage for Ulki.

I see the durability being a noticeable advantage in chapters where the boss has multiple authority stars or when you have none. This would make 3-11, 4-P, 4-3, and 4-E-3 (maybe 3-10, since the boss has 1 star). This hurts Janaff's avoid, and his lategame HP/def is not THAT awesome when you consider that laguz don't want to be wasting their time healing.

Another small advantage the durability poses is that, for part 3, Ulki is less worried about prematurely untransforming. He's less likely to get doubled than Janaff when they're untransformed, plus their durability is no longer overkill. Of course when untransformed their offense goes down the ****ter so you'd want to avoid them untransforming anyway, but it is a bit of a failsafe for Ulki.

Overall, Janaff is probably better, since his offense advantage applies against more enemies (pretty much everything except sages/swordmasters) than Ulki's durability advantage (pretty much just when a bow enemy is nearby or in chapters where the enemy has authority stars). However, they are both very good, and since scores are rounded to the nearest 0.5, they both end up getting the same score anyway.

And, my personal favorite is Janaff anyway. Rarely will you get a subordinate shut down his king.

9/10

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Sigrun

Sigrun: Hai guyz, I have a 25% speed growth and 10% defense growth, with craptastic bases in both stats. At least my strength growth doesn't blow at 45%, but my base sucks even more. I hope I'll be of service.

Rafiel: Interesting. I have a 20% speed growth and 10% defense growth. Perhaps we're long lost siblings?

Leanne: asdhasdhfsdhsfduasga (I do too, Rafiel!)

Reyson: nub, I have double your defense growth.

Rolf: My strength growth alone is almost as high as your str + spd + def growths combined.

Sothe: Maybe I should arm wrestle Sigrun instead of Skrimir. I have the same base str as her 18 levels lower.

Naesala: I think you need some training. Here, I'll fight you while I'm untransformed. Oh wait, sorry, I'd still win.

Sigrun: You're all making fun of me! Just watch! I will protect the empress! *flies off to some enemy*

Enemy: Haha, fool. I have better stats than you, and I'm not even carrying a weapon.

Sigrun: Oh no! Empress Sanaki, please protect me!

SanakI: What am I supposed to do? I get OHKO'd by every enemy on the map.

Sigrun: Help! *gets pwned*

Moral of the story: Be aware of the unit with the amazing str base, and 25% spd and 10% def growths.

3/10

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Tanith

Believe it or not, Taniths' bases are arguably worse than Sigrun's (20 str/23 spd/19 def, vs 18 str/24 spd/20 def), and promotes later. And Sigrun's were bad. However, Tanith has a few things that make her better than Sigrun, and usable (though not great) in general.

First off is Earth affinity. This means Tanith will be dodging after her supports are built up. Granted, it's a bit late to start them, but at least she'll be dodging sometime in the future. Pairing her up with someone like Naesala or one of the hawks is a possible idea, since they all join fairly late, and are likely going with the same team in part 4 (Micaiah for the desert). Sigrun was water, which is nice, but not good enough to save her.

Next are growths. Tanith has significantly better growth rates. 55 str, 40 spd, 40 def >>> 45 str, 25 spd, 10 def. This lets Tanith catch up to Sigrun's bases quickly and then pass them.

For example, a 20/20/1 Tanith versus a 20/20/4 Sigrun. Tanith has ~4 str while having similar spd/def. Sigrun has... 7 more lck? Supports close the avo gap and then some (although Sigrun will get some str/def). Her bigger spd and def growths makes Tanith pull ahead very quickly.

However, Tanith is still unimpressive. She still has issues doubling and doesn't hit very hard, and until she builds her supports her durability is not very good. A 20/20/1 Boyd versus a 20/20/1 Tanith has 6-7 more str and 16-17 more HP while having similar spd/def and higher growths in most everything and an established support. Tanith has... mag/lck/res? lolwut. She'll be losing to most any DB unit the moment they hit third tier as well, especially if we have crowns in play and can promote people like Nolan and Jill early so they're not sitting at their 2nd tier speed caps.

Tanith flies, but that only goes so far, especially if you're mediocre at fighting.

4/10

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Sanaki

HEY GUYS I'M MISS LOLI, MY BASE HP AND DEF ARE COMPARABLE TO BASE LEVEL DB UNITS, AND MY SPEED IS CRAP, AND MY STRENGTH IS SO TERRIBLE I'M ACTUALLY WORRIED ABOUT IT.

Seriously. 28 HP, 10 def? wtf IS. This would've been fine for part 1, not part 4. Basically, she hits one enemy hard but doesn't double, and then needs complete protection because even one hole in your wall will kill her off. It's so bad she's not even safe from the loladin swarm in 4-P because it only takes 2 to kill her off (some paladins OHKO, lawl). Swordmasters double her, warriors/halbs/snipers can usually double her and warriors OHKO anyway, generals mostly OHKO... She doesn't even have good avoid (78, but she loses AS from like everything so it's really lower, and enemies can easily break 130). she makes the herons look like they have passable durability.

She's not even safe in 4-3. True, enemies have 2 move, but for Sanaki to attack, she has to be within 2-range, which means unless you wall her in they'll reach her anyway. All she can really do in the desert is run the **** away from enemies, especially since a bunch of enemies in 4-3 have 2-range weapons, and there are a few draognmasters running around with their 9 move versus Sanaki's 6, who can also OHKO her.

Her durability never gets any better. In 4-E-2 enemies can reach up to 29 spd (warriors might even reach 30), which means Sanaki with Cymbaline needs to be about level 8 to not get doubled, and since she only has like 33 HP/12 def, she's still getting OHKO'd by a bunch of enemies. 4-E-3 red dragons have ~58 att, which means Sanaki ON COVER doesn't stop getting OHKO'd until about level 12. Even white dragons 2HKO her unless she's on wardwood despite her 30ish res, since Sanaki's base HP is just so bad. Attacking with a siege tome doesn't solve her problems either; can't even double dragons with purge, the LIGHTEST siege tome, until level ~11, and if the dragons have 14 spd instead of 12, she needs to be ~13. This is laughable. In fact, the 30 AS spirits double her until she's about level 12, which is pretty sad because the fire spirits have 36 att so they would 6-round her, and the wind spirits who have 39 att would 3-round. A MAGIC USER WHO MIGHT ACTUALLY DIE IN 4-E-4, ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

And as said earlier, her offense is nothing special. 46 base att and hitting res is cool, but she can't double (rofl @ 20 base AS with cymbaline). Flare isn't even guaranteed to be an OHKO, and while that applies to all magic users, at least those guys have other forms of utility (staves, being useful in other parts of the game, might actually double, etc). Sanaki has literally nothing else. And just to pour salt on the wound, her affinity is garbage.

I think IS has something against little children. Look at the other young kids in the game. Mist? Horrible stats, only useful because she can heal. Rolf? Horrible bases. Tormod? Horrible availability. Sanaki? Horrible unit.

Sanaki has heron-like durability with like 10% of their player phase output. She's a strong contender for one of the worst five units in the game. She has some semblance of use over the unholy trinity (Fiona, Astrid, Lyre) since she can actually do something on player phase, but not much.

1.5/10

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Skrimir

Skrimir is like Mordy, if Mordy joined in part 4 rather than part 2. Which means he's not very impressive.

Skrimir has pretty good bases. 66 HP/54 att/32 def is really nice. He hits like a truck and has awesome durability. Even his transformation issues aren't so severe, since lions untransform pretty slowly, though he still has no 2-range.

unfortunately, Skrimir has issues doubling. 26 stops doubling by 4-3 (Hell it won't even double some enemies in 4-P), and his spd growth is ehhhh. Although, a speedwing will do the trick. However, what's the point? If I wanted a laguz with gigantic attack and defense and good speed, but no formshift, I have Giffca joining by 4-E, who didn't need a speedwing. There's nothing wrong with using Skrimir, but you don't want to bring too many laguz into 4-E or else you'll have big problems in the last three parts of 4-E, which are dominated by 2-range enemies. And with a ton of royals, plus guys like the hawks who are very good, the competition is really tight. And these laguz didn't need anything to rape, while Skrimir needs a speedwing. It's not really worth it.

Skrimir is good in 4-P, but it's such a stupid chapter anyway because it's dominated by paladins, who get pwned by anything that can move. And he stops doubling by 4-3 without the speedwing, so he's not really *that* useful, although since one rounding is rare, I suppose I can't really fault him for that. There's nothing wrong with using him or giving him the speedwing. It's just there are better choices. When your availability is largely limited to 4-E, you really need to stand out, and Skrimir doesn't.

5.5/10

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Naesala

Naesala is actually pretty bad... for a royal. By normal standards he's still ridiculously good for part 4. 47 att is good, and it can increase later because he's only at S-strike. And being level 27 means he kinda gets some exp for kills, so his decent growth spread for a laguz (45 str/45 spd) can help out. And has canto. And dark affinity isn't bad, although he probably won't be able to find a viable supporter unless you break up an existing support and that unit also goes with Micaiah's team.

Also, he hacked the game and managed to get his mastery when he isn't level 30, which gives him a ridiculous 66.36% chance to get a Tear on a double attack.

He's definitely a step up from Skrimir though. His offense is better (he loses att by 8, but has a much easier time doubling, plus has his mastery right at the start. Though if Skrimir could double he wouldn't need his mastery....) and has comparable durability (loses def and HP by 6 each with significantly lower growths in both, but wins avoid by 28 and res by 10 and wins those growths significantly. Just watch for crossbows), and formshift, and flying/canto.

He's probably the worst of all the royals in 4-E, since they also have equally ridiculous chances to activate their masteries but with more att, and generally superior durability. This doesn't make him a bad choice at all though.

His biggest problem is just availability. Being limited to part 4 really hurts your ability to help out with the game. Still, when he's around, he's a good unit.

8/10

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Tibarn

LOLTIBARN.

LOL56ATT.

LOL40AS.

LOL32DEF.

LOL109AVOID.

LOL40TEAR.

LOL10MOVE.

LOLCANTO.

LOLFLYING.

LOLFORMSHIFT.

LOL100CAPACITY.

Tibarn is one of the many royals you get in part 4 that just roflstomps everything in sight. And we have like 5 royals to choose from. It's ridiculous. The stats alone pretty much warrant at least an 8.

Unfortunately IS forgot to give him something called availability. Being only in part 4, he's only making the game "LOLEASYMODE" for a short time period, while many other units like Ike and Volug are doing the same, only for a longer period of time, and when you also have fewer resources to h4x up your units.

Also, being a laguz, he has no 2-range. He does hilariously rape everything that attacks him, but lack of 2-range gets in the way, especially in the last parts of 4-E where everything has it. So even with his ridiculous stats, he's not quite as useful as someone like Shinon or Ike who have good enough stats to get the job done, but have an advantage in range.

Plus, he got shut down by his own underling.

8.5/10

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Pelleas

So we get WTFTIBARN in one chapter called 4-2. He one rounds the entire map and takes no damage. And then Pelleas decides to get off his ass and start fighting too, so he joins a few turns later in the same chapter, with bases worse than Tibarn has untransformed.

LOL, what a joke. This is like Ranulf vs Lyre.

Pelleas has a decent growth spread, but there's just no point in using him at all. He joins ridiculously underleveled, and even if you do manage to train him, his caps are so bad he's terrible in 4-E anyway.

The only reason why I didn't feel like giving Pelleas a 1 is because you can master crown him immediately and have him use staves, which is *slightly* useful, but a crown is useful especially in HM, and they're in pretty limited supply. It's still better than what the unholy trinity can ever accomplish, but he's pretty bad. Another contender for one of the worst 5 units in the game.

1.5/10

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Stefan

Stefan's kinda like Skrimir; his only real flaw is that the royals exist.

His stats are really not that bad. For example, if compared to a 20/20/8 Mia, he has +4 HP, -2 str, -0-1 spd, and -3 def, and their growths are very similar so these gaps don't go anywhere (although Mia's 1-2 points away from her HP/str/def caps). Of course, Mia has supports. But Mia is worthy of an 8/10 or something, and she's one of the best people in 4-E, so losing by a few points is still okay.

However, the royals give him fierce competition in 4-E, as well as a couple of beorcs who do have the upper hand on him, such as the aforementioned Mia, as well as a few other people (probably Nolan/Zihark and a few others), although they probably don't beat him as much as the royals do. Still, he's not bad. Unlike people such as Leo or Danved who fail the entire game, or Rolf who fails for a long time before he gets good, or people like Vika/Tormod who are decent for a few chapters and then complete garbage after that, he's more than capable of holding his own. He's just... not special.

5.5/10

Edited by smash fanatic

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Oliver

Oliver is so good, he gets his own tier above top tier, the FABULOUS tier. No one even comes close to matching his beauty.

On a more serious note, Oliver continues the trend that magic users must have awful stats, especially healers. I mean, 20 spd at this point in the game? Are you kidding me? My guys had that 20 levels lower. His other stats aren't that good. 31 mag means he doesn't hit particularly hard especially since lollight magic, and 48 HP/18 def is pretty bad too.

Still, as a staff user, he has his uses, obviously in healing. Especially since 4-E has physics buyable, so his durability isn't much of a concern if he's sitting in the back spamming physics. He can also use fortify, which is pretty cool, since the only other real fortify user is Micaiah, people who have less mag than him (Elincia/Mist) or people who need more resources than Oliver just to be a 4-E healbot too (Laura/Rhys/Pelleas).

And if for some reason you're crazy enough to let him try frontline, Nosferatu can kinda help his durability. It's mostly for just the dragons though, as enemies in 4-E-1 and 4-E-2 still double him for massive damage and he won't last long.

4/10

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Bastian

I would make a joke in Shakespearean language, but English and flowery language was never my strong point.

Bastian is like Oliver who is a little better at combat but no fortify. Considering his combat isn't that much better (3HKO'd, sometimes 2HKO'd, less likely to get doubled by generals but still might get doubled by 4-E-2 enemies, although he has thunder for 4-E-3 dragons but durability is still a concern, probably better off spamming siege tomes/physics anyway), I'd say lack of fortify cancels it out.

Although he does have 4-5, but it's such a stupid chapter and I don't really care about performance there anyway. SLIGHTLY STRONGER THAN 3-13 ENEMIES, EXCEPT OUR GUYS ARE 15-20 LEVELS HIGHER AND WE HAVE A 6 AUTHORITY STAR JUMP.

Yeah, my ratings are getting very short now, since these part 4 guys have very little availability and stuff to talk about.

4/10

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Volke

Volke is like Stefan, who is like Skrimir. He wouldn't been ranked higher, if the royals didn't exist.

Since Stefan and Volke have basically the same availability (Volke has lol4-5, Stefan has a part of 4-3), it seems fine to make a comparison between them.

In raw stats, Volke beats Stefan pretty handily (Volke has +3 str, +5 def, +6 res, +5 crit due to class. Stefan has +1 HP. w/e about skl/spd, they both overkill it. Though Stefan gains levels faster and Volke cap rams earlier. Growths are too similar to care), but Stefan has far superior weapons to choose from. Vague Katti and Alondite are both decent, and he can brave sword or killing edge or wyrmslayer too. Volke, on the other hand... LOLBASELARD, LOLPESHKATZ.

...well actually, Baselard isn't too bad in Volke's hands. It has 15 crit, so Volke has 58 base crit with it, so he has at least 30 crit on 4-E beorcs, which coupled with his 19% base Lethality rate, gives him ~67.85% chance for a crit or Lethality, which isn't too bad. And like 45 on dragons, so ~80% chance for crit or Lethality on dragons (granted, red dragons are really tanky, so just a crit alone won't do). So his 1-range offense isn't bad. It's his 2-range that's balls. lol @ 13 mt weapon.

So basically, when compared to Stefan, Volke probably wins 1-range offense, but Stefan wins 2-range offense, and with the SS swords equipped, Stefan and Volke have too similar durability to really care.

Although Stefan's probably the bigger badass. Volke is cool, but one of his greatest moments isn't even in this game (bastian support), so it doesn't quite count. Stefan, on the other hand, lolz in the face of God in 4-E, is so awesome the end of the world isn't even a blip on his radar, and is the Tellius equivalent of a Jew. And I'm talking about Israeli "6-Day War" Jews.. But unfortunately this isn't ranking awesomeoness, so I'm going to have to give them the same score.

5.5/10

Edited by smash fanatic

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Kurthnaga

Frickin Kurth. He should've been a playable unit starting at 1-3. Maybe he would've been top tier. Instead the moron decides to be an NPC that doesn't attack in that chapter, and then never appears again until 4-E where he's a piece of crap.

Kurth is an awful fighter. He doesn't hit very hard, and while 30 def is pretty good, the fact that he only has 20 spd with an effective 70% growth means he gets doubled like forever. Using Kurth as a fighter is like using Sothe as a fighter in part 4; why bother?

However, he's forced into 4-E, so you can do some tricks to work around his horrible stats. Obviously, night tide has its uses. It's pretty good in 4-E-3, due to the fact that the dragons don't attack him (or Ena/heron) and the dragons are so strong +5 def/res kinda helps, plus he can act like a roadblock if nothing else. It's very limited in the other parts though, since chances are if he's anywhere near the frontlines so he can give night tide bonuses, the enemies are probably going to target him.

And he's pretty pointless in 4-E-4 since no one's really worried about dying (not even Gareth), so his night tide is dumb, and his offense sucks since there's like a billion cover tiles and he's not doubling the spirits and his att still sucks. He's pretty pointless in 4-E-5 as well since night tide doesn't help against the damage the auras do or help against Ashera's AoEs, and we have fortify and Ashera Staff anyway.

Kurth is kinda like Danved/Mak/etc. in CRK chapters or Edward/Leo/etc. in early DB chapters. They're forced, so you can kinda do some things to make them useful, but it doesn't amount to much because of how bad they are.

3.5/10

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Ena

Ena's even worse than Kurth at fighting. She has a little more spd, but she's still likely getting doubled, and she has less def on top of that, and has like 10 less att. What is with IS forcing all these awful fighters into 4-E?

However, blood tide is just generally better than night tide. She's just as useful as him in 4-E-3, but she's also useful in 4-E-5 because the extra att and skl (which equates to better hit) is really cool on the auras and Ashera. Her usefulness in 4-E-1 and 2 is about the same as Kurth's (technically, Kurth fights better, but his fighting sucks anyway). Because of that, she deserves a slightly higher score than him.

Oh, she has no formshift unlike Kurth does in 4-E-4 and 5, but she can just use a laguz stone anyway since dragons untransform slowly, and the only other advantage formshift gives is it lets Kurth be able to attack something on the first player phase, but his combat sucks anyway, so no one really cares. I wouldn't field her in 4-E-4 anyway though, since she's like 4HKOing spirits even if they weren't on cover, so she's just going to be a waste of space.

4/10

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Caineghis

Cain is another frickin crazy royal. 66 att. 44 def. 76 HP. wtfux. His worst stat is spd, and it's still at a good 34. Like Tibarn, his stats alone pretty much warrant at least an 8.

And, like Tibarn, he has a big problem called availability, except it's even more severe. Being locked to only 4-E severely limits how much he can help us beat the game.

I really don't have much else to say about him. I mean, what else is there about him other than "HERE'S A GUY THAT GODMODES 4-E, LOOK AT HIS RIDICULOUSLY OVERKILL STATS"?

So to make this rating look longer...

In this film in the continued story of Rocky Balboa, the top Russian boxer Captain Ivan Drago (Dolph Lundgren) arrives in America with the hopes to take The Heavyweight Boxing Title from Rocky Balboa (Sylvester Stallone). Ivan Drago's wife, Ludmilla Vobet Drago (Brigitte Nielson) lays down the challenge to Rocky, who due to retirement refuses, however after a few cross words Apollo Creed instead put himself up as an opponent for the giant Russian.

As Apollo trains for the fight with the help of Rocky and his trainer Duke, Rocky expresses his concerns for Apollo and suggests he backs out of the fight, but Apollo will not and instead persuade Rocky to be his ringside man along with Duke. Rocky accepts and the fight is set to begin with Apollo making his usual over the top entrance, whilst the Russian watches from the ring.

The fight begins and Apollo soon learns that the Russian is not the weak opponent that Apollo thought he was and takes a terrible beating in the first round. Soon Rocky realises the fight cannot continue and drops the towel to end the fight, but sadly he is too late and Apollo is on the floor and sadly dies.

The Death of Apollo its Rocky hard and he soon takes up the challenge of fighting the Russian giant. The World Boxing Federation refuse to accept the fight and Rocky still goes ahead with it, agreeing for the match to take place on Christmas Day in Russia. Adrian argues with Rocky as she is totally against this fight and Rocky heads off to Russia with Paulie and Duke to train, leaving Adrian and Rocky Jnr behind.

Rocky trains intensely with the help of Duke and Paulie and as the fight draws closer a surprise visit is waiting for him on his return from a running session. Adrian has come to support him as she has missed him terribly and the training gets to full intensity. The Fight is on, the arena is set, and as Rocky enters the ring, he gets a very hostile welcome from the Russian crowd. Drago enters trying to show off whilst making his entrance and soon the fight begin. Will Rocky survive against this man of iron, let alone win, and what makes this Russian so strong? That you will have to watch to find out.

8/10

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Giffca

Giffca has no formshift, unlike Cain, and has lower str/def, but really, it's ridiculous anyway. Anything Giffca doubles will die, and with 12436132163212 def, enemies may as well just punch him, because it'd do the same damage as if they used a weapon (i.e. 0).

Hell, even the formshift issue isn't too severe. Because he's a lion, he untransforms veeeeeeerry slooooowly, which means he doesn't even need the laguz gem if you're bringing too many other laguz into 4-E. He can just use a stone.

Still, no formshift is a minor problem when compared to Cain, since using a stone/gem makes you lose your turn, so he loses his first player phase, and since 4-E chapters are typically very short, that's losing like 20% of your player phases. Although, he does have a slightly easier time doubling Sephiran/Ashera, so I'd say it's enough to put Cain and Giffca at about the same level.

Since I don't like how short this rating is, let me pad it with something else...

Lock eyes from across the room

Down my drink while the rhythms boom

Take your hands, skip the names

No need here for the silly games

Make our way through the smoke and crowd

The club is the sky and I'm on your cloud

Move in close as the lasers fly

Our bodies touch and the angels cry

Leave this place go back to yours

Our lips first touch outside your doors

The whole night what we've got in store

Whisper in my ear that you want some more

And I **** in my pants

This really never happens you can take my word

I won't apologize

That's just absurd

Mainly your fault for the way that you dance

And now I **** in my pants

Don't tell your friends or I'll say you're a slut

Plus it's your fault

You were rubbing my butt

I'm very sensitive

Some would say that's a plus

Now I'll go home and change

I need a few things from the grocery

Do things alone now mostly

Left me heartbroken, not lookin' for love

Surprise in my eyes when I looked above

The checkout counter and I saw her face

My heart stood still so did time and space

Never thought that I could feel real again

But the look in her eyes said I need a friend

She turned to me that's when she said it

Looked me dead in the face, asked cash or credit

And I **** in my pants

It's perfectly normal

Nothing wrong with me

But we're going to need a cleanup

On aisle 3

And now I'm posed in an awkward stance

Because I ****ed in my pants

To be fair

You were flirting a lot

Plus the way you bag cans makes me

Bothered and hot

Please stop acting like you're not impressed

One more thing

I'm gonna pay by check

Last week, I saw a film

As I recall it was a horror film

Walked outside into the rain

Checked my phone and saw you rang

And I ****ed in my pants

Speeding in the street, when the red lights flash

Need to get away, need to make a dash

A song comes on that reminds me of you

And I **** in my pants

The next day

My alarm goes off

And I **** in my pants

Open my window and a breeze rolls in

And I **** in my pants

When Bruce Willis was dead at the end of Sixth Sense

I ****ed in my pants

I just ate a grape

And I ****ed in my pants

I went to. . .

Ok seriously you guys, can we. . . . ok?

I **** right in my pants

Every time you're next to me

And when we're holdin hands

Its like havin sex with me

You say I'm premature

I just call it ecstasy

I wear a rubber at all times

Its a necessity

Cuz I **** in my pants

(I **** in my pants, I **** in my pants (x3))

Yes I **** in my pants

(I **** in my pants, I **** in my pants)

8/10

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Renning

This is actually the first time I'm taking a serious look at Renning, and I bet this is the first time anyone's been told about anything Renning can actually do.

Offensively he's lame. 29 spd means he doesn't double, and 31 str means he doesn't hit hard for someone that can't double, and he's 20/20/16 so he can't count on levels to fix his problem. It doesn't help that paladins have a terrible mastery offensively.

However, he's got decent durability. 56 HP/27 def/23 res/82 avo isn't bad at all. It's *slightly* worse than unsupported 20/20/10 Shinon (55 HP/29.2 def/21.2 res/87.5 avo). And because he gets SS swords, he's probably getting +3 or 5 from his weapon. And of course the mastery helps.

And then he has canto, which means he has an easier time abusing the dragons' skills or the uber tiles that are all around the place in 4-E, which is nice.

Of course, as we all know, Renning's big problem isn't really stats. It's the same as Stefan and Volke; very tight competition. There's no point in bringing Renning along when there are a lot of better choices. Hell, even Stefan/Volke, who also act as beorc fillers, are better, because they have significantly better offense and just a bit less durability. Bastian/Oliver lose combat, but have staves (Oliver especially can Fortify), so Renning doesn't have any utility to fall back on either.

Fun Fact: Renning has a 60% str growth and 70% def (40% spd though). His growths are actually pretty scary. It's a shame he only has 4 more levels to grow though.

3/10

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Gareth

If Gareth were in any other chapter, he would solo it at base level by simply spamming olivi grass.

Unfortunately the constipated dragon is in chapters with only magic attacks.

I mean, what was IS thinking when they made Gareth? HEY LET'S MAKE A DUDE WITH 40+ DEF, AND NOTHING TO USE IT ON! SOUNDS GOOD, YEAH?

However, he's not useless. Far from it. Even in 4-E-4 with the swarms of spirits, Gareth has options to survive. The first is that there's a lot of wardwoods in the chapter, which is a nice +10 res. When he's transformed that's already 28 res. Then when he has time he can use pure waters (they're only 900 gold, and by 4-E you should have 1243614326243264326 gold) for another +7 res (or you can have a staff user ward him), which puts him at 35, so even with spirits doubling him, he takes negligible damage. Although, since this locks him to wardwood tiles, he's pretty useless on player phase, but it should dispel the myths that Gareth dies in this chapter. And with his 62 base att, he's leaving spirits at single digit HP on the counter even if they attack on cover, and if they're not on cover he OHKOs most of them.

He's a lot better in 4-E-5 as well, since he's basically Ena with less res (use pure water/wardwood!). The +5 str/skl helps against the tanky and dodgy auras/Ashera.

This isn't saying that he's any good, since he still is around for only 2 short chapters and is locked to wardwoods, but he's far from being one of the worst characters in the game.

3.5/10

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Nasir

Nasir is one of the reasons why 4-E-4, and particularly 4-E-5 go by so quickly.

In a game where so many units have terrible speed, let alone terrible speed caps, Nasir provides +5 spd, which makes basically anyone double all the spirits, and those with 34-38 spd double auras, and makes it easier to double Sephiran/Ashera. This is nice because there are a ton of spirits in 4-E-4, and the auras are pretty annoying to kill with their uber HP/def/res/spd and being on +10 def or res tiles. He also hits hard because he has 64 att which will 2HKO spirits even if they're on wardwood. He's also lolinvincible because he has 9001 res in chapters where everything hits res, although durability's not really a concern in these chapters in the first place, but it's something funny to point out.

In 4-E-5 you can kinda think of him as a poor man's heron, if he stands next to a unit with 34-38 spd, since he lets them double, which has the same effect as the heron chanting the unit to let it attack twice. Although he can attack himself (doing like 34 damage to an aura is pretty cool, although he only has 51 hit at base level).

Oh, and he also gives +5 mag.

6/10

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Lehran

We're no strangers to love

You know the rules and so do I

A full commitment's what I'm thinking of

You wouldn't get this from any other guy

I just wanna tell you how I'm feeling

Gotta make you understand

Never gonna give you up

Never gonna let you down

Never gonna run around and desert you

Never gonna make you cry

Never gonna say goodbye

Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you

We've known each other for so long

Your heart's been aching, but

You're too shy to say it

Inside we both know what's been going on

We know the game and we're gonna play it

And if you ask me how I'm feeling

Don't tell me you're too blind to see

Never gonna give you up

Never gonna let you down

Never gonna run around and desert you

Never gonna make you cry

Never gonna say goodbye

Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you

Never gonna give you up

Never gonna let you down

Never gonna run around and desert you

Never gonna make you cry

Never gonna say goodbye

Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you

(Oooooooh, Give you up)

(Oooooooh, Give you UP)

Never gonna give, never gonna give

(Give you up)

Never gonna give, never gonna give

(Give you up)

We've known each other for so long

Your heart's been aching, but

You're too shy to say it

Inside we both know what's been going on

We know the game and we're gonna play it

I just wanna tell you how I'm feeling

Gotta make you understand

Never gonna give you up

Never gonna let you down

Never gonna run around and desert you

Never gonna make you cry

Never gonna say goodbye

Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you

Never gonna give you up

Never gonna let you down

Never gonna run around and desert you

Never gonna make you cry

Never gonna say goodbye

Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you

Never gonna give you up

Never gonna let you down

Never gonna run around and desert you

Never gonna make you cry

Never gonna say goodbye

Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you

5.5/10

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The least you could have done while you were making this copy-pasta thread where you farm up 70+ posts is to address some of the more egregious problems with the rankings, such as the massive unexplainable gap between Boyd and Shinon, or the numerous entries where your write-up doesn't match the score you gave (Oscar, Aran, etc).

EDIT: also, your methodology is missing from the OP.

Edited by Interceptor

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