FE4 Gen 2 list

[Eltoshen]

Five turns is a long time.

What you do with that time is what matters.

Using the berserk staff in hopes of the boss killing all of his troops isn't logical unless you're going to charge in while the boss is berserk. This, I can see people arguing as efficient.

[Rodykitty]

What you do with that time is what matters.

Using the berserk staff in hopes of the boss killing all of his troops isn't logical unless you're going to charge in while the boss is berserk. This, I can see people arguing as efficient.

This supports my statement.

[Paperblade]

I'd say Julia is slightly better. They both get 2HKOd, but she has Resire to heal herself. Due to her high MAG, as long as she doesn't get doubled, she'll probably do more damage than she takes. She's also invaluable against Dark Mages, because even if she doesn't ORKO them, she brings them to low health, so that someone else can finish them off. And unlike everyone else, she survives more than one hit due to Resire. She promotes into Sage, one of the best classes in the game. She might never get a horse, but she does still have 6 movement after promo. Plus, she can heal up to B Staves. Not sure if it really counts, but she gets a point for having the best chance to kill Julius.

Meh. I guess he can stay where he is, but Julia goes up.

She also doesn't exist for two chapters, although Resire is sexy. >_>

Edited October 11, 2009 by Paperblade

[Dat Nick]

I dunno, it's kind of iffy. Staves+Resire vs Horse and existing lategame.

[is happy to get off the subject of friggin Corple]

[Mekkah]

What an amazing use of numbers, enemy stats vs PC stats here. Where's the evidence that "everyone on the team is ORKOing"? Or that Corple faces negligible hit rates (or not)?

[Blademaster!]

I'd say Julia is slightly better. They both get 2HKOd, but she has Resire to heal herself. Due to her high MAG, as long as she doesn't get doubled, she'll probably do more damage than she takes. She's also invaluable against Dark Mages, because even if she doesn't ORKO them, she brings them to low health, so that someone else can finish them off. And unlike everyone else, she survives more than one hit due to Resire. She promotes into Sage, one of the best classes in the game. She might never get a horse, but she does still have 6 movement after promo. Plus, she can heal up to B Staves. Not sure if it really counts, but she gets a point for having the best chance to kill Julius.

Meh. I guess he can stay where he is, but Julia goes up.

She also doesn't exist for two chapters, although Resire is sexy. >_>

Personnally, I don't think resire is all that greeat. It has 70 hit and when combined with Julia's low accuracy, she could very easily miss and die, and a skill ring will only barely help increase her chances. I think she is better of with the lightning tome.

[Dr. Tarrasque]

Personnally, I don't think resire is all that greeat. It has 70 hit and when combined with Julia's low accuracy, she could very easily miss and die, and a skill ring will only barely help increase her chances. I think she is better of with the lightning tome.

A perfect example of stupid. Julia with Lightning would die easier than Julia with Resire -__-

[grandjackal]

Point me to these magical stats, Mekkah.

Anyways, a thought just occured. Exactly when is Corple/Levin promoting anyways? Without Reserve, 75 EXP is the best he can muster, full use of Libro is 750 EXP, 7 and a half levels. This is only getting him to level 8, and basically has 1 and a half chapters before endgame. You could burn through the Libro staff twice, and he would only be level 16. This is all the time that Corple/Claude could have been a more effective healer with Reserve. One full use of Reserve, Corple/Claude is at level 11. Basically prepromotion, Corple/Claude is gonna be the far superior healer, due to having access to a better staff. Not only that, but with it he gets to promotion faster regardless. So for a while, Corple/Claude has better offense than Corple/Levin because Corple/Levin isn't even promoted yet, meaning he can't use magic while Corple/Claude can. Granted he blows offensively, but he gets there first. 33 Magic Mt with basic tomes is not exactly bad, just he lacks Pursuit.

Now here's the thing, at promotion, Corple/Levin is packing 54 Mt with Holsety. I...do not think even endgame units have 54 HP outside of bosses, and I think only those with ridiculously high resistance wouldn't be afraid. However, it raises a qquestion. Major Blood only raises rank by 2, not auto stars you, right? If so, Corple/Levin shouldn't even be able to use Holsety, only Tornado. That's if that's the case though, I'm pretty sure I'm wrong. So yeah, Corple/Levin shitstomps Corple/Claude offensively. Here's the problem though. I'm not getting this till damn near the end of the game, and I'm talking like midway through it. All this time I could have had a far superior healer with Reserve.

Say "he keeps us from having Reserve earlier", and I'll say it's impossible. Unless you can tell me how in god's name Rana promotes in that time when I'd be lucky to have mounted guys promoted by Thracia, Corple's joining chapter? The soonest I can get it is with Sety, who joins like a step in front of Corple, so 1 battle is not a major loss, especially when I could have a more durable Sety in the form of Sety/Noish, along with freeing the clearly superior combatant of the responsibility of spamhealing. I can also reflect the point back at you, saying Arthur/Levin doesn't get it for the start of generation 2, or Sety doesn't get it who is using it all the way until Corple/Levin would normally promote, and continue to use it in a far superior fashion.

Also, don't tell me Sety/Noish sucks. http://fea.fewiki.net/fea.php?character=setynoish&game=4x 43 HP and 13 Def is probably what an average Delmud is packing at this time, and he's got 31 Mt with Light with Pursuit from momma, Charge and Critical from Pappa, Continue from his class. On top of this, we get Fee McMurderface http://fea.fewiki.net/fea.php?character=feenoish&game=4x Seriously, look at those bases and remember she has no excuse not to have the Brave Lance, Pursuit, Charge and Berserk. The only father better for her would probably be Arden for the SLIGHTLY better growths, but she loses Berserk and Charge for Ambush, and obviously comes with the problem of having to have ho-dink Ardan fall in love with huge flight move Fury.

[Just call me AL]

However, it raises a question. Major Blood only raises rank by 2, not auto stars you, right?

According to the site: wrong.

(If a character cannot use the weapon type of their crusader, they will not receive a boost to their weapon rank and will not be able to use their holy weapon. The only exception is Corple with Holsety blood, since he gains a weapon rank in Wind as a High Priest.)

Not that it would matter with Corple's offense anyway.

[Dat Nick]

Forrest Knight lv 21 (silver sword): 61 hp, 28 atk, 122 hit, 30 avo, 14 def, 5 res

30 avo equates to 15 AS. Meaning physical units need 45 atk and 19 AS. But this is a less demanding requirement than it seems considering mages one round easily and that we now have a lot of Hero/Silvers floating around. Fin's in trouble yes, but remember that this is just high AS Sword users and Snipers he's falling short on. Stuff like the 6 AS Bow Knight is easy pickings. But anyway, the bare minimum Radney needs to ORKO with Hero is lvl 20, it's even possible she can do it without promotion bonuses. So I don't know what your excuse for not ORKOing one of the better enemies endgame is if a lower-mid tier unit [Very bottom of lower mid too] is doing it just fine.

Plus, the Power Ring should be all you need to eliminate a non ORKOer, and you can toss a Silver Blade to anybody with 25 or more str [Oh hi Swordkids also Leaf] to not even use a hero.

Edited October 11, 2009 by Athena's Chest

[grandjackal]

However, it raises a question. Major Blood only raises rank by 2, not auto stars you, right?

According to the site: wrong.

(If a character cannot use the weapon type of their crusader, they will not receive a boost to their weapon rank and will not be able to use their holy weapon. The only exception is Corple with Holsety blood, since he gains a weapon rank in Wind as a High Priest.)

Not that it would matter with Corple's offense anyway.

Looking at the example, yeesh. Yeah, nevermind the holy blood part.

Still, Corple/Claude is only capable of holding C rank tomes, and he'd have 33 mt at promotin. From the looks of it, that doesn't quite 2RKO that example. So yeah, Corple/Levin has better offense, though 2RKOing with a holy weapon is still god awful.

EDIT: Wait, 19 Speed? I thought you only needed to tie their speed, and you would double if the enemy didn't have pursuit? Because Fin with a speed ring still doubles that.

Edited October 11, 2009 by France

[dondon151]

30 avo equates to 15 AS. Meaning physical units need 45 atk and 19 AS.

You mean 16 AS.

[Just call me AL]

Faval[Lex>Jamka>Midir>Holyn]

Here's what I'm wondering, wouldn't Midir!Faval be a little redundant, seeing as Bowfighters have Pursuit in the first place? And IIRC, Noce!Faval was considered as one of the top five versions of the guy. Just saying...

[grandjackal]

Anyone notice that Arden is basically Lex as a father without Elite, but greater weapon inheritence due to generals having literally any physical weapon to pass down, and gives the pursuit ring for free to his inheritor?

Just thought it was an interesting tidbit.

[Dat Nick]

You mean 16 AS.

16x2=30?

Here's what I'm wondering, wouldn't Midir!Faval be a little redundant, seeing as Bowfighters have Pursuit in the first place?

Midir is for Patty, not for Faval.

And IIRC, Noce!Faval was considered as one of the top five versions of the guy. Just saying...

NoishxFaval doesn't really change anything. Faval goes from having epic offense to having epic offense. In fact Faval is pretty much the same regardless of what you do with him so he's just grouped as one unit, with the only pairings being listed being pairings beneficial for Patty.

[Eltoshen]

You mean 16 AS.

16x2=30?

No, he meant the 19 should be 16.

[Just call me AL]

Here's what I'm wondering, wouldn't Midir!Faval be a little redundant, seeing as Bowfighters have Pursuit in the first place?

Midir is for Patty, not for Faval.

And IIRC, Noce!Faval was considered as one of the top five versions of the guy. Just saying...

NoishxFaval doesn't really change anything. Faval goes from having epic offense to having epic offense. In fact Faval is pretty much the same regardless of what you do with him so he's just grouped as one unit, with the only pairings being listed being pairings beneficial for Patty.

I see. Thanks.

[Dat Nick]

You mean 16 AS.

16x2=30?

No, he meant the 19 should be 16.

Jackal already pointed out the AS error[i thought dondon was correcting me on enemy AS] so whatever. AS is redundant half the time because swords are so damned light which breaks the system so I didn't even bother to check the formula, before I get any more of this "omg bb doesnt know everything about FE4 by heart he must not have played it!!!1oneoneone" shit.

Anyway, Just needing AS >Enemy's AS, and not by 4 is only helping my argument since now Fin is rape too.

Edited October 11, 2009 by Athena's Chest

[Blademaster!]

Personnally, I don't think resire is all that greeat. It has 70 hit and when combined with Julia's low accuracy, she could very easily miss and die, and a skill ring will only barely help increase her chances. I think she is better of with the lightning tome.

A perfect example of stupid. Julia with Lightning would die easier than Julia with Resire -__-

Lightning is better to use if you are in the arena or are attacking with no other enemies around. She would die easier, but with resire's low hit and Julia's low skill, I wouldn't want to put her on the front lines or near danger anyway.

[Dr. Tarrasque]

Personnally, I don't think resire is all that greeat. It has 70 hit and when combined with Julia's low accuracy, she could very easily miss and die, and a skill ring will only barely help increase her chances. I think she is better of with the lightning tome.

A perfect example of stupid. Julia with Lightning would die easier than Julia with Resire -__-

Lightning is better to use if you are in the arena or are attacking with no other enemies around. She would die easier, but with resire's low hit and Julia's low skill, I wouldn't want to put her on the front lines or near danger anyway.

Then you're slow and you're overestimating the evade of the enemies. You have Charisma, SKL ring and Celice's leadership to help the hit rate.

Dark Mages in Chapter 7 have negative avoid and so do Axe users and then there's also Road terrain to further drop their avoid. Against magic enemies, she has WTA against Wind, Fire and Thunder and in this game, WTA grants +20 hit.

[Blademaster!]

Personnally, I don't think resire is all that greeat. It has 70 hit and when combined with Julia's low accuracy, she could very easily miss and die, and a skill ring will only barely help increase her chances. I think she is better of with the lightning tome.

A perfect example of stupid. Julia with Lightning would die easier than Julia with Resire -__-

Lightning is better to use if you are in the arena or are attacking with no other enemies around. She would die easier, but with resire's low hit and Julia's low skill, I wouldn't want to put her on the front lines or near danger anyway.

Then you're slow and you're overestimating the evade of the enemies. You have Charisma, SKL ring and Celice's leadership to help the hit rate.

Dark Mages in Chapter 7 have negative avoid and so do Axe users and then there's also Road terrain to further drop their avoid. Against magic enemies, she has WTA against Wind, Fire and Thunder and in this game, WTA grants +20 hit.

It's situational. Plus, she doesn't have access to lightning until chapter 8, so she's stuck with Resire or Aura at those points. And the skill rings helps, but she is still better of using Lightning if you want to increase her hit. It's better for the arena in my opinion. Lightning is also much lighter, and increases her avoid by 14%.

[Eltoshen]

You mean 16 AS.

16x2=30?

No, he meant the 19 should be 16.

Jackal already pointed out the AS error[i thought dondon was correcting me on enemy AS] so whatever. AS is redundant half the time because swords are so damned light which breaks the system so I didn't even bother to check the formula, before I get any more of this "omg bb doesnt know everything about FE4 by heart he must not have played it!!!1oneoneone" shit.

Anyway, Just needing AS >Enemy's AS, and not by 4 is only helping my argument since now Fin is rape too.

Uh, don't fret over that, since people barely pay attention to AS when it comes to the good characters in FE4, because 95% of the time, it doesn't even matter.

[BBM]

My main problem with Arthur (and Tinny too), is that he can only use Anima magic. He has swords, but his strength is crap, and every chapter in the second gen except 6 and 8 have Dark Mages. 6 doesn't matter, because Arthur barely does anything in that chapter. Chapters 7 and 10, for example, are brutal for him. Chapter 7 has Dark Mages that 2HKO him at hit rates of 98%, while he does 12 damage after doubling. Then, the rest of it is a crapload of troops outside Melgen he can't survive against, and a couple Thunder Mages and the troops with Blume. Chapter 10 has a whole bunch of Dark Mages at the beginning in formation. They have Hel and Fenrir. That's a 2HKO as well. The middle part is a bunch of mounted units, which he can fight against, and then another bunch of dark mages with Hel and Fenrir. These ones have Ishtar and Julius with them as well. The end part is a squadron where the generics have Hero weapons. He definitely doesn't want to fight those either.

[Mekkah]

Sum-up: he has bad durability, however anyone does against some of these, particularly Dark Mages. What makes Arthur sub-par is 5 mov before promo and fairly bad durability. However, his offense is good, and post promo he has like +4 move and horse.

[Renall]

The entire point of me BRINGING UP the devaluation of roles is to illustrate that Holsety on Corple does virtually nothing at this point in the game because his offense compared to everybody else sucks even with it. Goddess, pay attention.

Jesus Christ, you can keep saying that buzzword and it will keep not meaning anything.

Corple [Levin] is the best Corple can be offensively and defensively, and is not substantially different enough as a healer to be weaker. He is the best Corple that exists. Therefore, he should be tiered higher than any other Corple. The end. Do it. Change the list. I'm demanding it. All arguments I have seen or made about it have convinced me of something that should have been patently obvious.

There is no such thing as devaluation of roles in this game. As you may be aware (but probably aren't), you can deploy everyone. Corple's existence does not stop any other character from existing. Corple's deployment does not stop any other character from deploying. Corple fighting does not stop other characters from fighting, nor does his healing stop other characters from healing if you decide to have them do it instead.

In the world where Corple [Levin] exists, Arthur and Sety have different fathers. Corple is still probably a worse fighter than them. But in a world where Corple [someone Else] exists and Levin was unpaired (to get rid of your BUT SOMEONE ELSE SHOULD GET HOLSETY irrelevant bullshit), Corple is now a vastly worse fighter and roughly the same as a healer. So, uh, how is he better relative to the team by picking a worse father? Your argument fails on every possible level.

Change the damn list and then we can put the stupid Corple argument behind us.