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Red Fox of Fire's character review topic (Complete)


Florete
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Even if Sothe blocks Burton, Micaiah can't move into the Arrive. In order for her to do that she needs to be in Burtons range Prior to your turn start, meaning Burton could've came out and ROFLSTOMPED Micaiah. It's pretty hard to complete the chapter with a dead Micaiah. Micaiah has to move in the Arrive Range on the same turn sothe is blocking Burton. It's takes the same amount of turns to have anyone lure out Burton, have Micaiah kill Burton, while at the same time have Micaiah more in arrive range, and next turn Arrive.

You still have to kill a fighter, a soldier, an armor, and Burton. Good luck doing that.

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It's because instead of getting the boss kill and Arriving next turn, she can just Arrive. Micaiah kills the Armour, Sothe kills the Archer. That puts Micaiah in range to arrive straight away. Obviously, we are slowing ourselves down so that Micaiah can take the kill.

His entire point was that, due to Burton's movement range, you can kill him with Micaiah and then Arrive without losing any time.

You still have to kill a fighter, a soldier, an armor, and Burton. Good luck doing that.

So...that'll make things even slower?

Anyway, I might move Micaiah down half a point, though that would cause other changes as well. I don't really know about Elincia and Tibarn being > her or some of the 7.5's being ~equal.

Edited by Red Fox of Fire
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Was something lost in translation here?

Even if Sothe blocks Burton, Micaiah can't move into the Arrive. In order for her to do that she needs to be in Burtons range Prior to your turn start, meaning Burton could've came out and ROFLSTOMPED Micaiah. It's pretty hard to complete the chapter with a dead Micaiah. Micaiah has to move in the Arrive Range on the same turn sothe is blocking Burton. It's takes the same amount of turns to have anyone lure out Burton, have Micaiah kill Burton, while at the same time have Micaiah more in arrive range, and next turn Arrive.

Do I need to spell this out for you?

Micaiah and Sothe start the turn out of Burton's range. Micaiah moves and kills the Armour. This puts her in range to Arrive, but Burton can kill her and there is an Archer on the Arrive square that can also kill her. So we move Sothe next to the Archer and kill it. This prevents Burton from killing Micaiah. It also prevents other units from moving into the right hand side. You can see this in dondon's playthrough.

So you see, we can move Micaiah into the range of the arrive square without Burton attacking her, because Sothe can block his movement.

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Do I need to spell this out for you?

Micaiah and Sothe start the turn out of Burton's range. Micaiah moves and kills the Armour. This puts her in range to Arrive, but Burton can kill her and there is an Archer on the Arrive square that can also kill her. So we move Sothe next to the Archer and kill it. This prevents Burton from killing Micaiah. It also prevents other units from moving into the right hand side. You can see this in dondon's playthrough.

So you see, we can move Micaiah into the range of the arrive square without Burton attacking her, because Sothe can block his movement.

But is it absolutely necessary to do it this way? That's his point. Sure, you could do it that way. But the question is can you have someone draw the boss when both Sothe and Micaiah are outside of Burton's range, have Micaiah kill the boss, someone else kill the armor, and Sothe kill the archer.

Just because you can avoid the boss does not necessarily mean that you should. Particularly since if you can pull it off that just means more exp for everyone with the same turncount. Though I have to admit to having doubts about being able to kill the armor in this scenario.

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But is it absolutely necessary to do it this way?

No. That's why I only brought it up in response to people saying it's 'very fast' to kill Burton with Micaiah.

That's his point. Sure, you could do it that way. But the question is can you have someone draw the boss when both Sothe and Micaiah are outside of Burton's range, have Micaiah kill the boss, someone else kill the armor, and Sothe kill the archer.

I don't think anyone really has the movement/durability to not only keep up with Sothe, but actually stay ahead of him and be able to kill the armour in a single round of combat. You would probably need multiple shoves to set this up.

Just because you can avoid the boss does not necessarily mean that you should. Particularly since if you can pull it off that just means more exp for everyone with the same turncount. Though I have to admit to having doubts about being able to kill the armor in this scenario.

Well, I'd rather stretch turncount by one in order that I can avoid giving all my kills to Sothe. It's really up to the individual where they draw the line.

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But is it absolutely necessary to do it this way?

No. That's why I only brought it up in response to people saying it's 'very fast' to kill Burton with Micaiah.

The tone of your post implied you were suggesting it's the only way. Start a post with "do I need to spell this out for you" and then talk about a strategy other than what the guy was suggesting, it tends to imply you are saying "your way doesn't work, you must go like this".

That's his point. Sure, you could do it that way. But the question is can you have someone draw the boss when both Sothe and Micaiah are outside of Burton's range, have Micaiah kill the boss, someone else kill the armor, and Sothe kill the archer.

I don't think anyone really has the movement/durability to not only keep up with Sothe, but actually stay ahead of him and be able to kill the armour in a single round of combat. You would probably need multiple shoves to set this up.

Just because you can avoid the boss does not necessarily mean that you should. Particularly since if you can pull it off that just means more exp for everyone with the same turncount. Though I have to admit to having doubts about being able to kill the armor in this scenario.

It wouldn't even have to be a unit other than Sothe that draws the boss. Sothe can draw and then run up to kill the archer. It pretty much has to be Sothe that KOs the archer since he's the most likely to survive the onslaught on enemy phase. Micaiah kills the boss. The worry comes solely from killing the armor. Which is probably what Queen_Elincia had her transfer Ilyana do. And why it actually worked for her. If Micaiah can reach that armor, it stands to reason that Ilyana would be able to do so as well. They have the same move, after all.

Well, I'd rather stretch turncount by one in order that I can avoid giving all my kills to Sothe. It's really up to the individual where they draw the line.

Um, I'm assuming that in the set up to kill boss with Micaiah, Sothe wouldn't actually get any extra kills compared to dondon's way. And if you are stretching your turncount by one then there isn't much reason not to have Micaiah kill the boss. He's still kinda difficult for guys like Edward and Nolan to deal with here. Can you get boss kill exp for Ed and Nolan in 7 turns? Perhaps.

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The tone of your post implied you were suggesting it's the only way. Start a post with "do I need to spell this out for you" and then talk about a strategy other than what the guy was suggesting, it tends to imply you are saying "your way doesn't work, you must go like this".

Joerachi argued that the strategy wouldn't work because Burton would kill Micaiah if she was in range to Arrive. I argued that it could work because Sothe's positioning prevents Burton from attacking Micaiah.

It wouldn't even have to be a unit other than Sothe that draws the boss. Sothe can draw and then run up to kill the archer. It pretty much has to be Sothe that KOs the archer since he's the most likely to survive the onslaught on enemy phase. Micaiah kills the boss. The worry comes solely from killing the armor. Which is probably what Queen_Elincia had her transfer Ilyana do. And why it actually worked for her. If Micaiah can reach that armor, it stands to reason that Ilyana would be able to do so as well. They have the same move, after all.

I remember that Micaiah needs shoves to reach that armour. I suppose you could do it with a transfer Ilyana, though. But assuming transfers on Ilyana, and speed transfers no less, is not really something I would do in a rating topic.

Um, I'm assuming that in the set up to kill boss with Micaiah, Sothe wouldn't actually get any extra kills compared to dondon's way. And if you are stretching your turncount by one then there isn't much reason not to have Micaiah kill the boss. He's still kinda difficult for guys like Edward and Nolan to deal with here. Can you get boss kill exp for Ed and Nolan in 7 turns? Perhaps.

I know that. I mean, in my playthrough, I think I did have Micaiah bosskill.

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well what I did was have Eddie, Nolan, Micaiah, and Sothe go down while and Kurth, Aimee, Ilyana, Laura, and Leo go left in manner of shielding the weaker characters and recruiting Aran in turn 3. Ilyana's group draws the attention from the extra enemies (soldiers, archers, etc that are close to the boss), while the other guys draw the attention of the boss. Micaiah kills the boss, Sothe+Eddie kill the knight and Sothe kills the longbow archer so Micaiah can escape on turn 6 ^_^. Oh I only shove Micaiah once on turn 1.

I made a video and its uploading in youtube so you could see in detail what i did. Sothe and Ilyana are transfered though (and are the more important ones in the chapter too along with Eddie and Kurth).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmP2X93Vf5Q

I gave some kills to Aran ^_^ just to show how its not impossible to raise him, I extended Aimee's meatshield serveness, sorry for the horrid quality.

on the previous chapters i took

1-P 6/7 turns

1-1 5 turns

1-2 7 turns

so it evens out with dondon's first 3 turn counts ^_^. I'm not sure if the same results would occur for unstransfered characters ^^' though.

Edited by Queen_Elincia
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Joerachi argued that the strategy wouldn't work because Burton would kill Micaiah if she was in range to Arrive. I argued that it could work because Sothe's positioning prevents Burton from attacking Micaiah.

Except he didn't. Or depending on your interpretation he didn't. The most important part, though, is the final sentence. Whatever may or may not have been incorrect earlier, the final sentence on its own was fine.

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I made a video and its uploading in youtube so you could see in detail what i did. Sothe and Ilyana are transfered though (and are the more important ones in the chapter too along with Eddie and Kurth).

Good strat. It's a shame Micaiah was 1 mag short of OHKO on Burton and you had to resort to forcing a miss with Eddie, though. I didn't get the Wind Edge in 1-3 because it would have made getting the Angelic Robe and 3000G and finishing in 6 turns impossible.

I'm not sure if the same results would occur for unstransfered characters ^^' though.

I don't think it's possible, at least with recruiting Aran. Sothe more or less doesn't matter, but Ilyana with no spd transfer doesn't double anything on the map but a fighter and you can't use her to KO the soldiers that enter the map with Aran.

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Good strat. It's a shame Micaiah was 1 mag short of OHKO on Burton and you had to resort to forcing a miss with Eddie, though. I didn't get the Wind Edge in 1-3 because it would have made getting the Angelic Robe and 3000G and finishing in 6 turns impossible.

I don't think it's possible, at least with recruiting Aran. Sothe more or less doesn't matter, but Ilyana with no spd transfer doesn't double anything on the map but a fighter and you can't use her to KO the soldiers that enter the map with Aran.

thank you ^_^ oh I just tried playing that chapter with no transfers and you're mostly right about Sothe he performs almost the same and you're correct about Ilyana.

Even in a playthrough with no transfer It is possible to kill the boss with Micaiah I used the same tactics for Micaiah+Sothe+Edward+Nolan but it involved a little bit of luck (either Sothe landing a critical on the armor or Nolan hitting it on the next turn which is turn 6). However recruiting Aran was a lot harder since it involved inefficient play. Well I probably played it inefficiently I guess ^_^ because I depended on Leonardo to dodge Aran's javelin throw. Aran wasn't recruited until turn 5 though. Ilyana(spreed transfered) can be utilized in a good way for Aran to have a better opportunity to gain cexp just like it was shown in the video ^_^, otherwise its usually longer to recruit him while still playing it in 6 turns. Well it seems that way to me for now ^_^.

It happened something like this:

The spot behind where Aimee lands on turn 1 is where Leo is placed on turn 2 or 3 (can't remember), Ilyana is placed right next to him, Laura in back of her and on turn 2 Kurth and Aimee move right next to Laura and Ilyana. When Aimee is killed Kurth stays next to Laura and two enemies attack Kurth at a time, Ilyana isn't attacked at all Leonardo gets hit by a knight and heals himself or Laura heals him. Leo has to dodge Aran's hit, on player Phase Ilyana attacks the knight that attacked Leo enemy phase starts Knight moves away to self heal. Aran moves in to attack Leo at 1 range. Player phase Leo moves behind kurth to attack an enemy, Laura recruits Aran. Ilyana keeps on range attacking enemies, Laura spam heals, Leo, chips, and Aran walls (he gets to attack an enemy on Turn 5-Enemy phase and Turn 6.)

Edited by Queen_Elincia
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Woah I've been absent for like, 18 hours.

Thank you Elincia for help proving my point it isn't Entirely impossible to kill the armor, Burton and arrive within,and doing so in 2 turns.

Before anyone one says "But Sothe is transferred, this is unreliable blahblahblahblahblah", Sothe would be doing 9 damage with the Kard +Doubling at base. Nolan does 6 with the hand axe at Base. 30 Damage in 2 turns with 1 round of combat from Sothe. Sothe kills the archer. Given Micky Sues position, she has just enough move to Arrive.

Edited by Joerachi
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Actually, a bigger problem is that Eddie has a Wind Edge.

He doesn't need it actually ^_^ i just put it on him so he can gain CEXP and have a chance to crit the archer on enemy phase all I want is him getting hit by the archer to get in wrath mood for a better chance to get rid of that archer. Nolan and Eddie can tag team on said archer if it goes wrong. If his HP is what you're worried about, Micaiah has a turn of doing nothing so she can sacrifice on him. (all she did was get shoved, kill archer, move, move again, kill boss, escape)

I personally think that wind edge is worth getting.

Edited by Queen_Elincia
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