Fire Emblem 4 - Shin Patch

[marcus90]

I tried your Shin Patch. You really need to balance it better, cause some aspect of it makes the game very save-state needing (some doesn't)

1) The Elthosan Charismatic squad, for example, is bullshit I tell you, cause the madafaking horsies become preposterously untouchable.

2) You should try to make all footies have almost 7 movement, so they can be almost on par with all horsies, armors should have 6, generals and barons 7, Arden should be a Baron so he doesn't suck anymore.

3) Weapons should always and only stay at 50 uses.

4) Devil axe is shit, replace it with the original hero axe or let lex have continueso he can be a better unit.

4-1) If you want to keep the devil axe, make it LIGHTER, more POWAH, so it's worth the risk.

5) Makes Johalva a prepromoted Worriah with continue along side duel, so he can use a Killer Bow almost immetialy and be a much better worriah than before.

6) You may leave Legendary Weapons Bonus as they are, but half their power, so they are much more balanced.

7) Branched promotion is amazing, leave it as it is.

8) Dew really needs to get crazy speed and luck to be useful at base.

9) Lachesis could be a Master Knight immediately with crazy speed but lower than average everything else.

10) Better bases for Sophya.

11) Makes substitute characters better by giving them unique assortment of skills, better bases at join level but moderate growths.

12) Killer Axes should be at 1 range only.

13) Cuan needs to be a Prepromoted Flying Dragon Unit - no Dragon Unit on Generation one, Cuan is the most rational to approach that class.

14) If you really want to edit maps, change them in such a way that we have different path to try at for ranked playthroughs.

15) Knight Ring on Silvya immediately and 8 move for her, so she is decent as a dancer in this type of game.

16) Can you try Yaoi parings? (asked for fun really)

17) In Chapter 3, because the desert is a bitch to cross, can you try to create a single line of road or planure alongside the sea shore, so it's easier to reach Bridgitt with her sistah?

18) Hero Swords need 90 Hit.

19) Slim Sword should stay at C level, being 5 powah but get criticals to Armors, Dragons and Horsies, while staying costly.

20) Higher base stats to some characters, so they are better differentiated as archetypes?

[Elieson]

I tried your Shin Patch. You really need to balance it better, cause some aspect of it makes the game very save-state needing (some doesn't)

1) The Elthosan Charismatic squad, for example, is bullshit I tell you, cause the madafaking horsies become preposterously untouchable.

Deal with it

2) You should try to make all footies have almost 7 movement, so they can be almost on par with all horsies, armors should have 6, generals and barons 7, Arden should be a Baron so he doesn't suck anymore.

Get Better & Deal with it

3) Weapons should always and only stay at 50 uses.

Or No

4) Devil axe is shit, replace it with the original hero axe or let lex have continueso he can be a better unit.

4-1) If you want to keep the devil axe, make it LIGHTER, more POWAH, so it's worth the risk.

Get Better

5) Makes Johalva a prepromoted Worriah with continue along side duel, so he can use a Killer Bow almost immetialy and be a much better worriah than before.

Unnecessary

6) You may leave Legendary Weapons Bonus as they are, but half their power, so they are much more balanced.

Deal with it

7) Branched promotion is amazing, leave it as it is.

Good

8) Dew really needs to get crazy speed and luck to be useful at base.

Get Better

9) Lachesis could be a Master Knight immediately with crazy speed but lower than average everything else.

Give 3 reasons why this should be done.

10) Better bases for Sophya.

Get Better

11) Makes substitute characters better by giving them unique assortment of skills, better bases at join level but moderate growths.

Deal with it

12) Killer Axes should be at 1 range only.

Not necessary

13) Cuan needs to be a Prepromoted Flying Dragon Unit - no Dragon Unit on Generation one, Cuan is the most rational to approach that class.

No

14) If you really want to edit maps, change them in such a way that we have different path to try at for ranked playthroughs.

Or, just play the map as it is.

15) Knight Ring on Silvya immediately and 8 move for her, so she is decent as a dancer in this type of game.

Deal with it

16) Can you try Yaoi parings? (asked for fun really)

This...I can accept

17) In Chapter 3, because the desert is a bitch to cross, can you try to create a single line of road or planure alongside the sea shore, so it's easier to reach Bridgitt with her sistah?

Get Better

18) Hero Swords need 90 Hit.

Get Better

19) Slim Sword should stay at C level, being 5 powah but get criticals to Armors, Dragons and Horsies, while staying costly.

Not needed

20) Higher base stats to some characters, so they are better differentiated as archetypes?

Banzai would tell you. Bases have nothing to do with archetypes. Get better reasoning

There. Yaoi pairings are the only logical thing you mentioned.

[marcus90]

There. Yaoi pairings are the only logical thing you mentioned.

TROLL HARDER DUDE :X Really, I try something, I suggest you things, you say anything is bad? WTF? Me no modder, but if you go for a balanced game, well, it has to be challenging, not frustrating! (Super Thracia 776, for example, if played on a cartridge the unpolished version it is, would be bullshit, and I wouldn't like playing a chopped version of FE4 with alleged "new content" and just few altered maps).

[Caliban of Sycorax]

I tried your Shin Patch. You really need to balance it better, cause some aspect of it makes the game very save-state needing (some doesn't)

1) The Elthosan Charismatic squad, for example, is bullshit I tell you, cause the madafaking horsies become preposterously untouchable.

They're still beatable.

2) You should try to make all footies have almost 7 movement, so they can be almost on par with all horsies, armors should have 6, generals and barons 7, Arden should be a Baron so he doesn't suck anymore.

No.

3) Weapons should always and only stay at 50 uses.

No. He's balanced Holy Weapons this way, by giving them less uses so you have to repair them more.

4) Devil axe is shit, replace it with the original hero axe or let lex have continueso he can be a better unit.

4-1) If you want to keep the devil axe, make it LIGHTER, more POWAH, so it's worth the risk.

Lex with Continue? Uh, no. He's fine as is.

5) Makes Johalva a prepromoted Worriah with continue along side duel, so he can use a Killer Bow almost immetialy and be a much better worriah than before.

Why?

6) You may leave Legendary Weapons Bonus as they are, but half their power, so they are much more balanced.

He's already balanced them enough.

7) Branched promotion is amazing, leave it as it is.

Sure.

8) Dew really needs to get crazy speed and luck to be useful at base.

Dew in combat? LOL.

9) Lachesis could be a Master Knight immediately with crazy speed but lower than average everything else.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

10) Better bases for Sophya.

Who the hell is Sophya?

11) Makes substitute characters better by giving them unique assortment of skills, better bases at join level but moderate growths.

Subs are supposed to be weaker.

12) Killer Axes should be at 1 range only.

Then there's no ranged axes. It's fine as is.

13) Cuan needs to be a Prepromoted Flying Dragon Unit - no Dragon Unit on Generation one, Cuan is the most rational to approach that class.

Absolutely not.

14) If you really want to edit maps, change them in such a way that we have different path to try at for ranked playthroughs.

He's already done that, somewhat.

15) Knight Ring on Silvya immediately and 8 move for her, so she is decent as a dancer in this type of game.

Congrats, you've now trivialized the game.

16) Can you try Yaoi parings? (asked for fun really)

I agree with this. SigurdxLex~

In all seriousness it's not doable, however. The inheritance would be fucked.

17) In Chapter 3, because the desert is a bitch to cross, can you try to create a single line of road or planure alongside the sea shore, so it's easier to reach Bridgitt with her sistah?

Maybe, but it's still possible. Besides, it's tough in Vanilla to reach Briggid, why should it be suddenly easier because it's Shin Patch?

18) Hero Swords need 90 Hit.

Why?

19) Slim Sword should stay at C level, being 5 powah but get criticals to Armors, Dragons and Horsies, while staying costly.

That makes it broken.

20) Higher base stats to some characters, so they are better differentiated as archetypes?

lolarchetypes.

Comments from the test monkey in bold. Read them.

EDIT:

TROLL HARDER DUDE :X Really, I try something, I suggest you things, you say anything is bad? WTF? Me no modder, but if you go for a balanced game, well, it has to be challenging, not frustrating! (Super Thracia 776, for example, if played on a cartridge the unpolished version it is, would be bullshit, and I wouldn't like playing a chopped version of FE4 with alleged "new content" and just few altered maps).

THIS ISN'T A BALANCE PATCH. IT WAS NEVER MEANT TO BE A BALANCE PATCH.

It's Shin's FE4 version of Super Thracia, in a sense, with a little less trolling.

Edited April 9, 2012 by Laurence Olivier

[Shin]

Hey there, before we put the grumpy cap, let me have a look.

I tried your Shin Patch. You really need to balance it better, cause some aspect of it makes the game very save-state needing (some doesn't)

1) The Elthosan Charismatic squad, for example, is bullshit I tell you, cause the madafaking horsies become preposterously untouchable.

- The Cross Knights? Funny, I haven't had any previous reports of them being impossible. I'll take a look at it.

2) You should try to make all footies have almost 7 movement, so they can be almost on par with all horsies, armors should have 6, generals and barons 7, Arden should be a Baron so he doesn't suck anymore.

6 is almost 7. If I recall, a lot of people have noted Ardan's improved performance. Especially with 6 move and incredible durability.

3) Weapons should always and only stay at 50 uses.

Holy Weapons have 30 uses to balance how good they are.

4) Devil axe is shit, replace it with the original hero axe or let lex have continueso he can be a better unit.

Devil... axe?

4-1) If you want to keep the devil axe, make it LIGHTER, more POWAH, so it's worth the risk.

I don't get it.

5) Makes Johalva a prepromoted Worriah with continue along side duel, so he can use a Killer Bow almost immetialy and be a much better worriah than before.

He promotes to warrior, and with only 8 levels to go, it's not that much of a wait. He'll get continue when he promotes anyway.

6) You may leave Legendary Weapons Bonus as they are, but half their power, so they are much more balanced.

15 might isn't that much :P.

7) Branched promotion is amazing, leave it as it is.

I don't remember putting in branched promotions.

8) Dew really needs to get crazy speed and luck to be useful at base.

He's meant to be delicate, don't forget he can use bows.

9) Lachesis could be a Master Knight immediately with crazy speed but lower than average everything else.

Any reason in particular?

10) Better bases for Sophya.

Sophia? Dierdre? Her bases are pretty usable, I don't see any reason to up them.

11) Makes substitute characters better by giving them unique assortment of skills, better bases at join level but moderate growths.

Already done it. My current changelog's out of date.

12) Killer Axes should be at 1 range only.

Nah. I wanted to have a Killer Axe, but there are no free spots, the Hand Axe merged with it.

13) Cuan needs to be a Prepromoted Flying Dragon Unit - no Dragon Unit on Generation one, Cuan is the most rational to approach that class.

I think Cuan likes his pony. I don't see any reason why he needs to fly.

14) If you really want to edit maps, change them in such a way that we have different path to try at for ranked playthroughs.

There's only so much I can change maps by without redoing them from scratch. I'm also at the mercy of the ingame events, they don't like me moving too much around.

15) Knight Ring on Silvya immediately and 8 move for her, so she is decent as a dancer in this type of game.

No. In drafts, everyone wants a dancer, and for good reason.

16) Can you try Yaoi parings? (asked for fun really)

1st gen, not happening, 2nd gen... it's probably possible.

17) In Chapter 3, because the desert is a bitch to cross, can you try to create a single line of road or planure alongside the sea shore, so it's easier to reach Bridgitt with her sistah?

Desert... sand? Sand is easy to cross. Plus, I don't intend on making things easier ^^.

18) Hero Swords need 90 Hit.

75 hit is enough. It hits twice and almost as hard as a Silver Sword. Giving it an even bigger advantage is a no-no

19) Slim Sword should stay at C level, being 5 powah but get criticals to Armors, Dragons and Horsies, while staying costly.

5 is too strong, Sigurd ended up using it to destroy bosses. A rank because it rewards people for having an A rank.

20) Higher base stats to some characters, so they are better differentiated as archetypes?

I don't get it.

Right now, the Shin Patch is reasonably challenging. However, there are some parts that Horace said were easy, which translates to being not-too-bad. The aim wasn't to make minimal changes but to develop each unit's niche into something unique. It was also designed to provide a new challenging experience, since enemies have changed and moved about, something people won't expect.

[Klokinator]

I might play this. I hated FE4 because of the massive maps, abused backtracking, and overall tedium in every map, but I might replay if this is as fun as everyone says.

[General Horace]

the cross knights don't need a nerf if they can all be taken out easily in one EP by Cuan

I should really try a subs playthrough of second gen in this sometime.

[Rapier]

the cross knights don't need a nerf if they can all be taken out easily in one EP by Cuan

I should really try a subs playthrough of second gen in this sometime.

I already am. 21 Skill Tristan with Charge is pretty OP. @_@

I'm not playing the newest version, but the units are pretty OP as it is. HeroAxe!Skasahahaha kills anything that crosses his patch, Arthur murders anything with his Pursuit Ring, Holsetinny will most of the time dodge and kill everything, Lakche kills anything that crosses her patch, Leaf is sucking because idk how to play with him, Oufaye is simply OP. I'm even finding it too easy now. =P

Also Shin, make a FE6 Shin patch someday!

[Kngt_Of_Titania]

I'm only on the home castle in C3 right now, but I should give some feedback on what I noticed so far, since I'm a test player in a sense. I'll probably add more later.

General:

> Noish. The lack of pursuit REALLY hurts him, and he just doesn't...he's bad, simple as that. From what I can tell, he just doesn't have a proper skillset, mainly because the proc rates of them depend on stats he's not very good in (SKL/SPD). He'd be a good candidate for a skill revamp. I'd find him way cooler, for example, with something like Moonlight Sword and a large SKL growth rate/base, although I wonder if that will make him too similar to Alec.

Prologue:

> You said that some people hated this chapter; after you get used to it, it's not bad, but it's easy to get caught in a crappy situation here if you rush to save the villages. The church near the repaired bridge is a bit of a godsend, but the one closest to the starting point is...annoying, or useless, from what I found. However, this is hardly a big issue.

> The rush of brigands/axe-users after the bridge is repaired is easily the hardest part of this chapter. The fact that hand axes now are killers (and that a bunch of them wield it) can mean you get gibbed by sheer bad luck, which can be irritating if RNG frowns on you, although I rarely see them proc it.

Chapter 1:

> Kinbois is an ass. Seriously. The bastard has 46 ATK and Continue. And moves. If continue procs, he can (and has repeatedly, to my irritation) ORKO Ardan. There are obviously ways around it, but 2 ranging him means he can kill you with Critical OR Continue, depending on if your name is Azel or Midayle.

> I saw you mention that you buffed Dew so he can hold back the army for Aideen. For the most part, this works well, but there is one thing that is...off, I guess. The captain with the hero axe can OHKO Dew until he gets a few good durability levels under his belt, attacks twice (obviously), and has a 20% hit chance with forest terrain. Dew living comes down to RNG if you use him to hold off the army sometimes. Maybe I did it wrong.

Chapter 2:

> Getting the Bargain Ring is insane. Not only do you lose turns from losing 1 MOV from mounted units, you lose 1 turn on top of that for sure because Sigurd is...1?...space short of recruiting Lachesis on the turn you'd probably do it in vanilla. I've managed to get it, but you, at the very best and have Sigurd manage to keep moving without ever being blocked by anything ever, have 2 turns left (1 if you get the Elite Ring and recruit Beowulf, which you obviously want to do).

> Fuck. Those. Bolting. Mages. That section of the map sucks in general, with the mounted mages who 2HKO many of your units and the massive swarm of normal cavs. But trying to assault that castle means that only Sigurd/casters can really approach it without blowing up, as they 2HKO the vast majority of your army (or, well, mine) and get super awesome accuracy from the prince's FIVE leadership stars. Silence staff helped.

> The layout of the map and backtracking sucks enormously, but it always has.

All in all, great game, great patch! I can't write all of what I like about that since my hands would fall off before I ended up typing it all.

Edited April 10, 2012 by Kngt_Of_Titania

[Shin]

Good news everyone! I have found a nifty patch that makes Ambush FE5-style! Considering how minor a skill it is currently, this could make it pretty interesting. Now, being the benevolent tyrant I am, I'm going to let you guys vote on it! The results may sway which way I go with it!

[Anouleth]

Good news everyone! I have found a nifty patch that makes Ambush FE5-style! Considering how minor a skill it is currently, this could make it pretty interesting.

Ambush is far from being a minor skill IMO.

[Shin]

Ambush is far from being a minor skill IMO.

Perhaps, but it's an idea I'm throwing out there. There's always the Ambush/Wrath combo, but otherwise there are a lot of people who can't really use it well.

[Celice]

I saw for like Thracia's. It becomes a much more strategic element, where the player can employ how something occurs at all moments, rather than under specific conditions (more specific than the skill's requirement, at least).

[Darros]

Unless you make Ambush/Wrath not mix, I like FE4Ambush enough as it is. Lex/Arden Arthur and Tinny would be ridiculously OP.

[Airship Canon]

FE5/9 Ambush/Vantage is A LOT better than FE4 or FE10 (which was a -terrible- version of it), and it'd make for some interesting gameplay if you give it out to some random mooks as a gag.

Sure Vantage/Wrath is brutal, but...

[iavasechui]

Hmm either way is fine though it would be sweet to work all the time ^_^;

[iavasechui]

Hmm either way is fine though it would be sweet to work all the time ^_^;

[Anouleth]

I saw for like Thracia's. It becomes a much more strategic element, where the player can employ how something occurs at all moments, rather than under specific conditions (more specific than the skill's requirement, at least).

Restrictions breed creativity.

Unless you make Ambush/Wrath not mix, I like FE4Ambush enough as it is. Lex/Arden Arthur and Tinny would be ridiculously OP.

Not to mention that fighting Ishtar would turn into a massive headache.

[Shin]

Restrictions breed creativity.

As does freedom. There will be scenarios that would only be possible with one of the options. So far it looks like the FE5 option is pretty popular. The lack of option 3 votes angers me. Ishtar would admittedly be pretty annoying, but I'm sure I could make something unfair.

[Anouleth]

There will be scenarios that would only be possible with one of the options.

There is nothing you can do with FE5 Ambush that cannot also be done with FE4 Ambush since they do the same thing, it's just that FE4 Ambush has a prerequisite.

[Celice]

Which forces the players to meet that prerequisite to make use of it--making the use of it less applicable.

Limitation is good for creativity when you have a certain amount, and you're told what to do with it--you have the choice. Having special circumstances attached to those limitations restricting what you can do does not enhance creativity, as you're being told what you can't do with what you have.

You give us a sandbox--not a box with rules.

Edited April 18, 2012 by Celice

[arvilino]

Beyond Lex's Brave Axe, FE5 Ambush wouldn't make much of a difference. For example Lex! or Ardan! Arthur and Tinny aren't going to be much better with FE5 Ambush because they only significantly benefit from Ambush when they are below 50% HP so Wrath activates.

[Crimson Red]

hey can I share a link to this thread of your hack on other websites please?

[Shin]

hey can I share a link to this thread of your hack on other websites please?

Feel free to! No publicity is bad publicity!

[Shin]

Well, this is a predicament, all 3 options got 8 votes. I'll pretend the last one won.