Florete Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Want to know something hilarious? Ilyana with 39 mag (max), a +2 atk support, and a 36 MT Rexbolt does 31/100 HP damage to 100 HP, 46 res Dheginsea. Base Caineghis with no supports and no Blood Tide does 32/100 HP damage to 100 HP, 50 res Dheginsea. Dheginsea gains 4 Res against Caineghis? Wow, that is hilarious! Edited January 14, 2011 by Yui Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Ilyana's durability in general. Let's review. HP Capping is likely. Def is questionable. Not to mention she also has to take a defense tile to even come close to staying alive... Well, that makes sense. Though like I said, I wouldn't send anyone after Dheg unless they were at full health, since he kills just about anyone in 2 combat rounds. Even more so for close-rangers (I'm looking at YOU, laguz royals!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Well, that makes sense. Though like I said, I wouldn't send anyone after Dheg unless they were at full health, since he kills just about anyone in 2 combat rounds. Even more so for close-rangers (I'm looking at YOU, laguz royals!). What? Naesala is 2HKOd, base Nailah is 2HKOd exactly (just a single point of HP will make it 3) and the others are just plain better (Caineghis is like a 5HKO). And since Dheg has 1-2 range, what does close range matter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 What? Naesala is 2HKOd, base Nailah is 2HKOd exactly (just a single point of HP will make it 3) and the others are just plain better (Caineghis is like a 5HKO). And since Dheg has 1-2 range, what does close range matter? I'd rather not watch my progress go up in smoke because of Ire, which only activates at 1 range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Nihil completely erases any chance of getting slammed in the balls by Ire. You have 3 of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Nihil completely erases any chance of getting slammed in the balls by Ire. You have 3 of them. Ok, but at any rate, it isn't as if I'll be using any of the laguz royals, so meh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) I see... sorry about that, I just felt that it would be a good idea to train her, seeing how she's forced into Endgame (and with forced deployment too, unlike Sothe). I guess that's not feasible in Hard Mode. Alot seem to understand that being forced on the map means being forced at battle. Yet, that case isn't true for anyone. You can easily have a base level Micaiah for Endgame. Yeah, with Thani, she should still be capable of killing Marshalls... if she had the Speed to double them, that is. She'll never have the Spd to double them. She needs 28 AS to double most of them. And that would mean she would've needed to cap Spd at second tier (needs two previous Speedwings for that) and then, either take a third Spd wing once at 3rd tier, or, BEXP to 99 and await Blossom levels, expecting a Spd proc. Heck, this applies in NM, even she doesn't double most Generals there. And why use Eddie? His Res growth is terrible and you need alot of it for the Endgame chapters. Not really. He has pretty reliable dodge on his own by 3rd tier. And he will likely be having a support with someone by then. I managed to pull Ike x Edward A support starting at 4-1 and ending at 4-E-5. Well, maybe, but I still refuse to take laguz royals to endgame. Ok, but at any rate, it isn't as if I'll be using any of the laguz royals, so meh. Could you please stop basing yourself on personal preference on an arguement? There are alot of things most of us actually don't do despite tier lists assuming otherwise, yet, we don't go and say "OH HAY I HAET DEPLOYING UNIT X AT SAID CHAPTER". When we happen to be arguing about the game, we don't use our personal preference if we are referring to another person. We don't like taking 3643745865489567855967960986986986 turns Endgame abusing Kurthnaga or whatever you do. So I suggest you quit it with that. It's annoying, so full of bias and it makes it hard to make you understand a point, when in the first place, you refuse to admit it because "You don't play that way". Also, you overrate 2-range at maps we are suppose to 1-2 turn anyway. And the laguz royals are your key to that. Edited January 14, 2011 by Soul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anouleth Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 *cue jaw drop* How do you even get THAT many transfers??? I struggle just to get even half of the number of transferred characters you did. Actually, it's a pretty poor transfer list, she missed a lot of easy ones. Like strength on Ike, strength on Tanith, strength on Jill, skill on Oscar... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Could you please stop basing yourself on personal preference on an arguement? There are alot of things most of us actually don't do despite tier lists assuming otherwise, yet, we don't go and say "OH HAY I HAET DEPLOYING UNIT X AT SAID CHAPTER". When we happen to be arguing about the game, we don't use our personal preference if we are referring to another person. We don't like taking 3643745865489567855967960986986986 turns Endgame abusing Kurthnaga or whatever you do. So I suggest you quit it with that. It's annoying, so full of bias and it makes it hard to make you understand a point, when in the first place, you refuse to admit it because "You don't play that way". Also, you overrate 2-range at maps we are suppose to 1-2 turn anyway. And the laguz royals are your key to that. And yet I absolutely refuse to use the laguz royals because I'd rather not take the fun and challenge out of endgame. And I pretty much had my faith in most laguz units reduced to nothing because they have the leveling speed of molasses transformed and die super easily untransformed - an annoying catch-22 situation, to be blunt. And I'm more of a passive battler in this game than an aggressive one. Actually, it's a pretty poor transfer list, she missed a lot of easy ones. Like strength on Ike, strength on Tanith, strength on Jill, skill on Oscar... Maybe so, but still... Who'd have the patience to get transfers for so many characters in the first place? Definitely not me, and I doubt you'd have that much patience either. Edited January 14, 2011 by Malik Maxwell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNG Princess Posted January 14, 2011 Author Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Actually I wasn't planning on transfering Ike he just happened to cap, I guess I was lucky he capped speed although I would of liked if he capped more stats. Reyson also happened to transfer himself. Sothe was raised by BEXP only ^_^ I never deployed him. The mages + Rhys, Mist, and Elincia spammed ward staff thats why they capped. I was hoping to cap str on Jill and Tanith but Tanith seemed impossible, and Jill would of capped str if I gave her the boost I realized I hadn't although I thought I did :(. Astrid was close to capping def but I made the mistake of giving the boost to Nephenee, and between Elincia and Callil I made a mistake I accidentally gave Elincia the magic boost and Callil the speed bost when it was clear Elincia would naturally cap magic and Callil was going to naturally cap speed. as for Ilyana although I like her character too but I won't use her for endgame. I remember using her in my last PT and she takes more training than Astrid does imo. I know I have Fiona in my team and thats the reason why I can't bring anymore lower tiered units ^_^ I think its a challenge enough to try to do low turncounts with someone like Fiona. Don't get me wrong the position in the tier list has nothing to do with my preference :). Edited January 14, 2011 by Queen_Elincia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 And yet I absolutely refuse to use the laguz royals because I'd rather not take the fun and challenge out of endgame. And you still don't get it, do you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Actually I wasn't planning on transfering Ike he just happened to cap, I guess I was lucky he capped speed although I would of liked if he capped more stats. Reyson also happened to transfer himself. Sothe was raised by BEXP only ^_^ I never deployed him. The mages + Rhys, Mist, and Elincia spammed ward staff thats why they capped. I was hoping to cap str on Jill and Tanith but Tanith seemed impossible, and Jill would of capped str if I gave her the boost I realized I hadn't although I thought I did :(. Astrid was close to capping def but I made the mistake of giving the boost to Nephenee, and between Elincia and Callil I made a mistake I accidentally gave Elincia the magic boost and Callil the speed bost when it was clear Elincia would naturally cap magic and Callil was going to naturally cap speed. Hmmm... And you still don't get it, do you? No, it's that I just don't care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 No, it's that I just don't care. Then why do you bother whining about laguz royals if we don't care either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Laguz barely need a leveling speed. The closest is pretty much... Ranulf... And maybe Ulki. They only need to hit Level 30 for their masteries, and they have until Part 4 where it might be necessary. Nailah only wants to level for the possible +Spd point to double Auras, and that's not a big deal anyway. Naesala doesn't really need levels either, but its possible to get 1, and then you have a 60% chance of getting +2 Atk. Cain, Giffca, and Tibarn need no such levels. Volug is a different case, but one key advantage he has is that the enemies he faces are Laguz, at least for two chapters. He isn't required for Part 4 and his circumstance with other DB units is also valid (his mastery might be a little harder to obtain unless he leans on Paragon). Of course Volug is far from bad. Mordecai needs no EXP; just Resolve. Lethe, Kyza, and Lyre are useless barring Lethe's one chapter. Skrimir is Part 4 (not Endgame). Nealuchi is Part 2. Vika is Part 1. Maurim is Part 1 + wanting Resolve in 4-4. That's it really. BEXP helps cover some of Ranulf, Janaff, and Ulki. Volug can somewhat leech off of Dawn Brigade's. That's about the worst a laguz "needs" leveling. Finally, keeping laguz untransformed AND being attacked? That shouldn't happen under normal circumstances. There is only a sparse amount of instances where, assuming you pan things out, where an unexpected untransform happens. Mordecai is pretty much the exception since he needs to be untransformed to hit Resolve range. Just keep healthy on Olivi Grass (very easy). Edited January 14, 2011 by Tyranel M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNG Princess Posted January 14, 2011 Author Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) doesn't mordecai die if he's untransformed? I remember him getting killed in the desert by the purge user chapter I can't remember exactly ^_^ if its 4-3 or 4-2 Edited January 14, 2011 by Queen_Elincia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Laguz barely need a leveling speed. The closest is pretty much... Ranulf... And maybe Ulki. They only need to hit Level 30 for their masteries, and they have until Part 4 where it might be necessary. Nailah only wants to level for the possible +Spd point to double Auras, and that's not a big deal anyway. Naesala doesn't really need levels either, but its possible to get 1, and then you have a 60% chance of getting +2 Atk. Cain, Giffca, and Tibarn need no such levels. Volug is a different case, but one key advantage he has is that the enemies he faces are Laguz, at least for two chapters. He isn't required for Part 4 and his circumstance with other DB units is also valid (his mastery might be a little harder to obtain unless he leans on Paragon). Of course Volug is far from bad. Mordecai needs no EXP; just Resolve. Lethe, Kyza, and Lyre are useless barring Lethe's one chapter. Skrimir is Part 4 (not Endgame). Nealuchi is Part 2. Vika is Part 1. Maurim is Part 1 + wanting Resolve in 4-4. That's it really. BEXP helps cover some of Ranulf, Janaff, and Ulki. Volug can somewhat leech off of Dawn Brigade's. That's about the worst a laguz "needs" leveling. Finally, keeping laguz untransformed AND being attacked? That shouldn't happen under normal circumstances. There is only a sparse amount of instances where, assuming you pan things out, where an unexpected untransform happens. Mordecai is pretty much the exception since he needs to be untransformed to hit Resolve range. Just keep healthy on Olivi Grass (very easy). Ok, but it's part of why I dislike laguz. And strike level going up with the speed of molasses doesn't help. Not that I expect anyone to care... On Muarim: Being vulnerable to critical hits makes me sweat. doesn't mordecai die if he's untransformed? I remember him getting killed in the desert by the purge user chapter I can't remember exactly ^_^ if its 4-3 or 4-2 4-3 has a Purge user. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) doesn't mordecai die if he's untransformed? I remember him getting killed in the desert by the purge user chapter I can't remember exactly ^_^ if its 4-3 or 4-2 In Part 4, Mordecai has to keep transformed. I guess I should specify Part 3 in particular, since that is when Mordecai can stay healthy (untransformed). And strike level going up with the speed of molasses doesn't help. Sadly, this is your (only) valid point within the entire thread so far. Strike Level, I can confess, is really irritating. On some units. Janaff, Ulki, and Volug shouldn't have a major issue with it. Of course the royals, bar Naesala, have SS Strike. S Strike is fine for Naesala too; he still has Canto and insane procs for Adept and Tear to make up for it. Ranulf is probably the only one, but he's pretty useless in Endgame I'd think. Cat Strike is eh as it is. Only real noteworthy thing is Rend, and that's about it. He can survive with A Strike by tossing him the Energy Drop, which should help net his ORKOes for a while (barring Generals). On Muarim: Being vulnerable to critical hits makes me sweat. Just like every other character that isn't really deemed "necessary", why does it matter? Unless you're making it a goal to keep everyone alive, Maurim dying shouldn't be an issue to begin with. I wouldn't shed a tear if Ilyana died after Part 1 and when she carried her stuff to the Greil Mercenaries. If Rolf died in 3-1, I probably wouldn't hit the reset button for that either. Play some FE:SD. You'll get more heartless after that. Edited January 14, 2011 by Tyranel M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNG Princess Posted January 14, 2011 Author Share Posted January 14, 2011 I don't let my characters die I was just raised like that by Fire Emblem I never let anyone die even if i'm not using them. Its like an unwritten rule, I'll restart for anybody. BTW Muarim isn't so hard to fix, just make him work on player phase and he should be good enough to stay alive. On enemy phase enemies gang up on him which is why he can die. I'd buy him a pure water ^_^ and idk if he can use fortune but it seems like he can't fit fortune and resolve. Also Daunt can help him out a bit right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Strike Level, I can confess, is really irritating. On some units. Janaff, Ulki, and Volug shouldn't have a major issue with it. Of course the royals, bar Naesala, have SS Strike. S Strike is fine for Naesala too; he still has Canto and insane procs for Adept and Tear to make up for it. Ranulf is probably the only one, but he's pretty useless in Endgame I'd think. Cat Strike is eh as it is. Only real noteworthy thing is Rend, and that's about it. He can survive with A Strike by tossing him the Energy Drop, which should help net his ORKOes for a while (barring Generals). Okay... Just like every other character that isn't really deemed "necessary", why does it matter? Unless you're making it a goal to keep everyone alive, Maurim dying shouldn't be an issue to begin with. I wouldn't shed a tear if Ilyana died after Part 1 and when she carried her stuff to the Greil Mercenaries. If Rolf died in 3-1, I probably wouldn't hit the reset button for that either. Play some FE:SD. You'll get more heartless after that. And there's the rub; I'm not one to allow anyone dying on me. I don't let my characters die I was just raised like that by Fire Emblem I never let anyone die even if i'm not using them. Its like an unwritten rule, I'll restart for anybody. BTW Muarim isn't so hard to fix, just make him work on player phase and he should be good enough to stay alive. On enemy phase enemies gang up on him which is why he can die. I'd buy him a pure water ^_^ and idk if he can use fortune but it seems like he can't fit fortune and resolve. Also Daunt can help him out a bit right? Fortune, huh? Well, that'd be assuming that it wasn't sold for 3000 gold. And Daunt? Ehh... I'm not sure, other than it prevents warriors from having crit on him. Edited January 14, 2011 by Malik Maxwell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Play some FE:SD. You'll get more heartless after that. Do you have to play it? Honestly, I let any scrub without a personality die if I'm not using him/her. It can't be inhumane if they're cartboards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel M Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Do you have to play it? Honestly, I let any scrub without a personality die if I'm not using him/her. It can't be inhumane if they're cartboards. If you want to become an arrogant tyrant such as myself, I'd highly recommend it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dondon151 Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 (edited) Dheginsea gains 4 Res against Caineghis? Wow, that is hilarious! Probably even funnier is the fact that Caineghis targets res only against one enemy in the game. Anyway I don't let units die either, but I also find ways around things. Quite honestly, if you're (not RF) complaining about strike WEXP progression being slow, I don't see why you're complaining about leveling up in general being slow. Volug gets SS strike by 4-1 with no help at all (not like you can really help strike WEXP) while DB beorc units struggle to reach tier 3. Ulki and Janaff can get S strike as soon as 3-11 if you use them extensively in 3-7, but any beorc not named Ike, Titania, or Haar will have trouble reaching --/20 without significant help. Ranulf is a more difficult case due to being a cat, and Mordecai is basically unsalvageable in this respect, but it's a lot easier to raise strike WEXP for Ulki, Janaff, and Volug than it is to just get EXP for most other units. Edited January 15, 2011 by dondon151 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 Best magic user in the game. If only because he shaves us turns Endgame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNG Princess Posted January 15, 2011 Author Share Posted January 15, 2011 (edited) Oh I think I see dondon's point, although it is a pain to raise Laguz levels they don't worry much about stats (i'm mainly talking Mordecai and Volug ^_^). The beorc require some sort of effort too, not to raise their weapon levels but to get better stats. So beorc and laguz are even but beorc > laguz with ranged attacking. Edited January 15, 2011 by Queen_Elincia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narga_Rocks Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 In Part 4, Mordecai has to keep transformed. I guess I should specify Part 3 in particular, since that is when Mordecai can stay healthy (untransformed). Sadly, this is your (only) valid point within the entire thread so far. Strike Level, I can confess, is really irritating. On some units. Janaff, Ulki, and Volug shouldn't have a major issue with it. Of course the royals, bar Naesala, have SS Strike. S Strike is fine for Naesala too; he still has Canto and insane procs for Adept and Tear to make up for it. Ranulf is probably the only one, but he's pretty useless in Endgame I'd think. Cat Strike is eh as it is. Only real noteworthy thing is Rend, and that's about it. He can survive with A Strike by tossing him the Energy Drop, which should help net his ORKOes for a while (barring Generals). Just like every other character that isn't really deemed "necessary", why does it matter? Unless you're making it a goal to keep everyone alive, Maurim dying shouldn't be an issue to begin with. I wouldn't shed a tear if Ilyana died after Part 1 and when she carried her stuff to the Greil Mercenaries. If Rolf died in 3-1, I probably wouldn't hit the reset button for that either. Play some FE:SD. You'll get more heartless after that. Well, in Resolve!Muarim's case you lose Resolve, which is annoying. But most don't lean on resolve in 4-E anyway, I suppose, so it's not that big a loss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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