QUINTESSENCE? DONT UNDERSTAND

[General Banzai]

To address one more argument, yes other villains leave incompetent and weak underlings to do the jobs they are assigned, even if they are the most important things to their plots at the time, without a real explanation. Even in SS. Chapter 6 of SS:

Riev:

Heh heh heh... Pray it goes as you say. Very well. Do what you must. I must return to the capital.

Novala:

Will you not stay and see how Eirika looks in captivity?

Riev:

Unlike two other layabouts I know, I do not have such time to waste. I have much to do for out master. A mountain of tasks awaits me. My time is far too precious to waste on the likes of that royal whelp. Trifles such at these are best left in the hands of servants...such as you.

This is exactly what Ursula does. Really, you could swap the two quotes, with the exception of the "Law of the fang" bit, and get, essentially the same results.

For starters, unlike Ninian and Nils, the twins of Renais are not Grado's top priority at the moment. An important priority, yes, but there are other important priorities facing Lyon/Grado at the time. In fact, Riev is never ordered to catch Eirika; he is given other orders specifically by Vigarde in Chapter 3 while it is Glen who is ordered to capture Eirika.

Vigarde:

Riev. Duessel. You are charged with the defense of the empire. ...I will speak to you individually with more details later.

So we actually see in the game that Vigarde has given Riev orders OTHER than to capture Eirika. So when Riev says "I have a mountain of tasks to preform for my master", that statement has grounding in what Vigarde actually said just a few chapters earlier. Admittedly, what Riev is supposedly doing is never explained, and that is a point against the game. But do note that:

1. Eirika and Ephraim, while priorities for Grado, are not THE top priority, unlike Ninian and Nils for Nergal.

2. Vigarde has already delegated not one but two Grado generals to capturing Eirika and Ephraim. Those generals are Glen and Valter, not Riev.

3. Vigarde expressly gives Riev orders OTHER than to capture Eirika and Ephraim. Thus, why Riev would find these two not of much interest to him at this moment in time is perfectly logical and supported by in-game evidence.

[Othin]

Well, of course whether it was done good or bad is another thing entirely. You're right on that point.

Actually, the chances of their meeting were already low to begin with. Eliwood was near Kathelet due to his monthly spar with Hector (I don't remember the actual time-frame, but the point is still the same that he couldn't possibly be there all the time). And the reason he didn't make it in time, hence why Hector is complaining if you visit him, was due to having encountered the whole kidnapping situation by chance.

It basically boils down to those many factors happening at the same time: That he had a reason to be in the area, that it was where Lyn would be passing through, that the kidnapping was also in the same area, that he got to see the kidnapping and decided to interfere.

And it was necessary. If not to show the player that you'll be using him later in the game, then go for the in-game reason: help Lyn out. Had it not been for Eliwood, Lundgren would've received the help he requested, making Lyn's journey more difficult of even reaching the point of impossible, as at least 4 other Marquesses had answered in Lundgren's favor.

Actually, let's think this through. Had they really helped out, just imagine what would mean for Lycia as a whole. From Matthew's visit to Hector, you learn Ostia is aware of the whole thing and considering of intervening if things get out of hand. Now that would certainly have sparked Ostia into action, and whether or not the conflict would've escalated further, it's highly likely that it would've fulfilled Nergal's plans sooner than expected. Not saying that was guaranteed to happen, but hey, it would've been convenient for him.

So what you're saying is, something very unlikely happened by chance. Why wouldn't something else very unlikely have happened by chance?

You're thinking too closely in terms of what the game set up. It could just as easily have been made so that Lundgren would not ask for help, deciding that he had to deal with the threat himself in order to appear strong as a ruler. And if he had requested the help, there's no guarantee that the marquesses would have all been willing to give it to him - getting themselves involved in a military conflict because of the claims of a new ruler rising up under questionable circumstances? Especially if they were to keep the part where his assassins attack Marquess Araphen for no reason.

Honestly, all in all, it's just difficult to imagine much of anything happening if Eliwood hadn't acted, if that would even have had to happen to take 7 and 7x out of the story. Sure, Eliwood, Ursula, and the Black Fang appearing all helps tie in Lyn's Mode with the story later... but the damage caused by how nonsensically it happens makes it not worth that in the slightest.

[Acacia Sgt]

My problem is not that Nergal goes from regretful to suddenly sane, but that he does that and then loses his sanity again, inexplicably, marginalizing his statement of "why did I want power?" That is what I don't understand. If Nergal really does regain his focus at the end, why does he still summon the dragons?

Well, he is dying at that point. Sure, it jogged his memory, but again, in his corrupted state and dying self, you can't really expect him to act composed. Let's see that quote again, shall we?

''Why? Why must I lose? More power... I must be...stronger... I... Why? Why did I... want power? ......Quintessence? ...Don't...under...stand... but... Gaa... Not like this... I will not die...like this. With my last breath... tremble...and...despair. Hwah ha ha... Ha...ha ha ha...''

Sure, he starts questioning, but judging from it, it doesn't look like it's because he has actually remembered, more like things came back to him (like Aenir in the real quote) but with his current issues, he can't make sense in them. Then afterwards, he seems to just shrug it off and proceed anyway with his plan. If anything, it was pieces of his old self finally resurfacing after so long, but since he was dying and his mind was corrupted, it changed nothing, and out of desperation of actually dying, he went on to finish what he started, what he did knew about what he was doing. That's how I see it.

[General Banzai]

So someone actually pointed out to me something very clever that FE7 did. At least, the Japanese version of FE7.

Apparently, "Aegir" is the Japanese equivalent of quintessence. This is interesting, as Nergal's wife is named "Aenir". The similarities give the quite clever implication that he is so obsessed with quintessence that he is literally married to it; or at least that his marriage to Aenir foreshadowed his fate to come. This gives his deathquote even more significance, as his question about "not understanding Aenir/Aegir" makes it seem that in his dying moments he has confused the two; implying that his pursuit for quintessence was because of his distraught over the death of his wife.

This is actually really clever. Bravo to the writers who did this. Unfortunately it was lost in translation (I guess they could have made Nergal's wife named Wintessence but that would be lol).

[Doga]

HORY FUCK, YOU GUYS. GUYS, WAIT A SECOND.

Stop this nonsense at once. Play the games. I'm sick of this shit. The man who presents this 11,000 word essay, for what? He does it for you, Serenes; he has no one else with which to confide such information. He believes himself to be better than he is; he thinks his opinion is above the others, and seeks to conquer this land. Hold you ground, Serenes! No not allow this wretched General seize the day! His efforts shall be in vain if we so decide to halt this horrid debate. He spends and wastes his life. Let the man atone. Let him learn his lesson.

Seriously, Banzai, I'm sick of this.

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

HORY FUCK, YOU GUYS. GUYS, WAIT A SECOND.

Stop this nonsense at once. Play the games. I'm sick of this shit. The man who presents this 11,000 word essay, for what? He does it for you, Serenes; he has no one else with which to confide such information. He believes himself to be better than he is; he thinks his opinion is above the others, and seeks to conquer this land. Hold you ground, Serenes! No not allow this wretched General seize the day! His efforts shall be in vain if we so decide to halt this horrid debate. He spends and wastes his life. Let the man atone. Let him learn his lesson.

Seriously, Banzai, I'm sick of this.

Why so serious?

[Othin]

HORY FUCK, YOU GUYS. GUYS, WAIT A SECOND.

Stop this nonsense at once. Play the games. I'm sick of this shit. The man who presents this 11,000 word essay, for what? He does it for you, Serenes; he has no one else with which to confide such information. He believes himself to be better than he is; he thinks his opinion is above the others, and seeks to conquer this land. Hold you ground, Serenes! No not allow this wretched General seize the day! His efforts shall be in vain if we so decide to halt this horrid debate. He spends and wastes his life. Let the man atone. Let him learn his lesson.

Seriously, Banzai, I'm sick of this.

So you're not joining in?

JOIN THE DARK SIDE DOGA.

Edited July 26, 2011 by Othin

[Mekkah]

The OP was fun to read, and confirmed that it wasn't just me who was confused by the plot at some points. It's things like Elbert being alive for so long that always subconsciously bothered me, but I always wrote it off as "I must be missing something".

[Anouleth]

Haven't played FE4. Furthermore, the problem is not that Lyn kills all these soldiers, but that she does so and afterwards smiles and cracks jokes and talks about listening to music. This is where the cheeriness is destructive to the story. A game where you are fighting wars, where life and death is in the balance, should not be upbeat and happy. There is a time and place for a cheerful mood; this is not one of them.

sirius business

So I guess Lyn is never allowed to be cheerful? She meets her grandfather, and she's supposed to not be happy? And if you think that other Fire Emblems aren't saccharine in the same way, then go read some Epilogues.

You missed the point. I'm not saying the FE6-FE7 art is bad; just more geared towards children. Also, not sure where you're going with the pedophilia; once again I have not played FE4.

but the FE6-7 art IS bad (that's why nobody in FE7 looks quite so dumb as Lance/Alan/Noah). It's not that it's geared towards children.

And you are seriously insane if you really think that:

Childish, immature garbage

Serious business for adults

Capturing Galzus in FE5 isn't easy. >.>

I didn't say it was easy, just that it was possible. And it's even easier just to kill him.

In Thracia the weapon triangle gives +/-5 hit. It's +/-15 in FE6, which is triple. Also, it's debatable whether YOU think the weapon triangle makes a difference in FERD. But if the developers took it out of Hard Mode, they obviously thought the game would be harder without it.

Nope.jpg

Infinite range staves are harder for you because the enemies have them more often than you do.

More staves for you to capture off them.

The fact that you can abuse movement stars doesn't mean the game is easier; any game can be abused somehow. It'd be like saying abusing the RNG so everyone gains move every level up means that Thracia is easier than FE6.

It's a random element in a game that already has a lot of random elements.

Also, you are once again missing the point. The point is not that FE6 is broken and Thracia is not; the point is that the strategic elements in FE6 are easier to comprehend for a child than those in Thracia. The weapon triangle is easier for a child to understand (it's rock paper scissors) than that there are stars which correspond to a random chance that your characters will move again.

You make that sound like a bad thing. Fire Emblem is an extremely complicated and difficult RPG. It is not very accessible. I don't think there's anything wrong with making it more accessible. And even if a game is accessible, that doesn't necessarily mean that it's "for children". Tetris is an extremely accessible game. Yet it is not a "kid's game"

Yes, why give us pointless gameplay? Why not think harder and meld the story and gameplay together, as they do in other Fire Emblems?

Well, for those of us who actually enjoy playing Fire Emblem, we're just happy to have more chapters even if they are Random Banditos. FE7 is a pretty long game, with 34 chapters and assorted Gaidens.

The point is that rock-paper-scissors is hardly a strategic element whatsoever. The point is that it's easy to exploit and usually better for the player than the enemy. Finally, rock-paper-scissors itself is a game that every child can comprehend. Skills/movement stars/capturing/fatigue, especially since these features are not explained in-game, are far more complex and take a more developed mind.

So you think that not explaining core gameplay elements is a good thing?

In addition, I don't know if I could really say that Skills/movement stars/fatigue are really more complex. Most skills in FE5 are just combat skills that don't require any kind of input on the player's part. Movement stars are the same. Whereas to take advantage of the weapon triangle, you have to select the correct weapon.

Edited July 26, 2011 by Anouleth

[VincentASM]

I haven't played FE7 in ages, so can't really comment about the story. I do remember there being some confusing moments and leaps of faith, but nothing that would bother me. Most FE games have pretty good stories, by my standards, but nothing exceptional so that I would try to nitpick them. Well, maybe except FE4's timeline between generations, which has me really confused at times.

Something that caught my eye though, about the Fire Dragon being referred to as children, this is actually mentioned by Ninian right before she leaves:

I yearned to see it once

again... Our homeland...

Those children...the fire dragons...

They were like me...

Kind of lazy to look up the description of the Fire Dragon though. I have a feeling the "ancient" part might be a reference to them being part of an ancient civilisation, not their actual age. When I have time, I may try and dig it up.

EDIT

Found:

An ancient, hateful dragon

that survived the Scouring.

The Japanese text looks about the same. Although I just thought of something, Ninian and Nils were both around during the Scouring, so even though the Fire Dragon is ancient, i.e > 1000 years old, it could still count as a child in terms of a dragon's lifespan. Tiki and Myrrh are both around a 1000 years old as well and they're kids.

Edited July 26, 2011 by VincentASM

[HongLei]

I thought that fe7's plot was to help add more depth to fe6.

Telling us about ...

How Eliwood knew Hector

Zephiel the wuss to Zephiel the jerk or any other word that you like to use to describe him better

introduce Briammond and Athos

More insight into the scourging

and btw level 22 living legend is talking about Pent not Athos, Athos has Luna that's about it, Pent has lot's of warpskipping fun

[Just call me AL]

HORY FUCK, YOU GUYS. GUYS, WAIT A SECOND.

Stop this nonsense at once. Play the games. I'm sick of this shit. The man who presents this 11,000 word essay, for what? He does it for you, Serenes; he has no one else with which to confide such information. He believes himself to be better than he is; he thinks his opinion is above the others, and seeks to conquer this land. Hold you ground, Serenes! No not allow this wretched General seize the day! His efforts shall be in vain if we so decide to halt this horrid debate. He spends and wastes his life. Let the man atone. Let him learn his lesson.

Seriously, Banzai, I'm sick of this.

Aside from the posts I see Anouleth making, this is the best post in the topic I see so far.

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

Aside from the posts I see Anouleth making, this is the best post in the topic I see so far.

i know my good sir.

god forbid humans disagree with eachother or give me an very amusing debate that leaves me questioning if i should like FE7's story or not.

[Momo]

I want to see you do this for another game.

I found it pretty funny, but I definitely disagree with your "Lords in the other games develop as characters" point. Every single lord is completely bland from start to finish. Even Ike acted exactly like every other lord, and promoting into one just made him the same class as all the others.

[Just call me AL]

i know my good sir.

god forbid humans disagree with eachother or give me an very amusing debate that leaves me questioning if i should like FE7's story or not.

There really shouldn't be anything stopping you from liking FE7's story though. Not even anything trivial such as a rant.

[-Cynthia-]

I think the OP made a number of good points as did the rebuttals, but ultimately I find that the plot issues in FE7 aren't bad enough to keep me from enjoying the game.

And yeah, I think you can do this with any FE pretty much. Throwing out a random example here, Chapter 11 Ephraim Mode, Riev warps to a ship full of monsters in the middle of the ocean to say something generically evil along the lines of "kill these guys"...and then just warps out before the battle starts. He's supposed to be organizing the downfall of a country on the opposite end of the map at this point. The Phantom Ship thing itself doesn't make the most sense, somehow boats being attacked in Grado means that there's no way to catch a boat between Carcino and Rausten?

[General Banzai]

There really shouldn't be anything stopping you from liking FE7's story though. Not even anything trivial such as a rant.

Or anything as trivial as numerous large plotholes and nonsense character actions and a lack of proper development for the main characters~

I thought that fe7's plot was to help add more depth to fe6.

Telling us about ...

How Eliwood knew Hector

Zephiel the wuss to Zephiel the jerk or any other word that you like to use to describe him better

introduce Briammond and Athos

More insight into the scourging

I don't recall that Eliwood and Hector were such compelling characters in FE6 that they needed their own game to explain how they knew each other. They're both only in one chapter each. Bramimond and Athos are also not even in FE6; don't know why introducing us to them was all that important. I wouldn't expect in a prequel to PoR we get introduced to Soan, for instance. And about the Scouring, FE6 actually gives way more insight into it than FE7. In fact, FE6 really is ABOUT the Scouring, while FE7 is about dragons.

Also, about Zephiel, while the Bern royal family was one of the best executed elements of FE7, the story in lategame FE6 about how Zephiel killed his father and ascended the throne well explains why Zephiel was such a bitter person.

@Anouleth: The issue is that Hector and Lyn and Eliwood are cheerful even well into lategame, even when there is little cause to be. 23, 24, even 27... All the time they are cracking jokes and flirting with one another. It's unsettling. They have a deep lack of maturity and that doesn't change for much of the story.

As for your point on the art. You're missing MY point. I don't care if the art is bad or good. I'm not commenting on the quality of the art. What I'm commenting on is how the characters in FE6 either look much younger than those in FE5 (Allen, Lance, Noah, Klein, Wolt, Sue, etc), or more cartoonish (Merlinus, Gonzales, Bors, etc). That is the point. Even Roy looks younger than Leaf in the two pieces of art you posted, despite them supposedly being about the same age.

As for the accessibility, as with the weapon triangle argument we're straying from my main point. Okay, so maybe you want the game to be more accessible and I want it to be more complex. Two different tastes on that. Sure, whatever. I'm not trying to argue about gameplay elements in my original post. So maybe once or twice in the entire post I bring them up for whatever reason. I'm sorry. That's not what I'm trying to talk about. I'm trying to point out the flaws in FE7's story.

And I'm not sure about you, but when there's a plot going on and I see random bandits I groan. I groan about them in FE7 as well as FESS, only it's worse in FE7 since there are about six or seven more random bandits chapters. I groan about them in PoR because the plot isn't even hinted at until after you drudge through three of them. I groan about the single solitary one in FERD. Random bandits is an excuse to cram in a chapter. It's filler. There's nothing more to it than that.

Edited July 26, 2011 by General Banzai

[Othin]

Or anything as trivial as numerous large plotholes and nonsense character actions and a lack of proper development for the main characters~

[/size][/color]

I don't recall that Eliwood and Hector were such compelling characters in FE6 that they needed their own game to explain how they knew each other. They're both only in one chapter each. Bramimond and Athos are also not even in FE6; don't know why introducing us to them was all that important. I wouldn't expect in a prequel to PoR we get introduced to Soan, for instance. And about the Scouring, FE6 actually gives way more insight into it than FE7. In fact, FE6 really is ABOUT the Scouring, while FE7 is about dragons.

Also, about Zephiel, while the Bern royal family was one of the best executed elements of FE7, the story in lategame FE6 about how Zephiel killed his father and ascended the throne well explains why Zephiel was such a bitter person.

And then there's the matter of how most places where FE7 was released didn't have access to FE6 to begin with...

[Acacia Sgt]

And I'm not sure about you, but when there's a plot going on and I see random bandits I groan. I groan about them in FE7 as well as FESS, only it's worse in FE7 since there are about six or seven more random bandits chapters. I groan about them in PoR because the plot isn't even hinted at until after you drudge through three of them. I groan about the single solitary one in FERD. Random bandits is an excuse to cram in a chapter. It's filler. There's nothing more to it than that.

Except that is precisely the point of having filler. If it isn't random bandits, it would be just random soldiers or something like that. It wouldn't be different except for just who are you fighting against. And are you saying it's not possible for a bandit attack to happen? That's what they do. Most of the time the situation where they appear has it's explanations.

Let's take Lyn Mode for example. If Lundgren hadn't become confident that Lyn wouldn't make it to Lycia, instead of bandits, Chapters 3, 4, and 5 would've just been against more hired thugs like Chapter 1. It's not much different than having a bandit group chase you. It would've still been filler. In fact, he hoped that she would fall to the bandits of Northern Bern, since as bandits, they basically attack random people who pass through to loot them. How could they wouldn't attempt to attack them then?

Granted, this would mean the same group of bandits wouldn't attack them 3 times in a row, except that there are reasonable explanations for it. The first time was because Florina being harassed by bandits, since it's what they do, not to mention that they were provoked since her pegasus fell on top of one of them. And being Lyn's friend, she would not hesitate to defend her. In fact, the whole way she insisted that the fight was pointless, but the bandits were angry and stubborn enough to not stop.

The second time was for revenge and do their job as bandits on the side, since they were planning of sparing the women so they could take them. And the last one was that their defeats got them angered much they were now doing so for their reputation's sake, even to the point they now wanted everyone dead. Doing their job no longer mattered for them at this point, they just wanted dead those who ruined them.

And even so, they weren't the only bandit group in the area, if it wasn't them, it would've been other bandits who would've attacked them. Since after all, that's what they do.

[Lord Raven]

Or anything as trivial as numerous large plotholes and nonsense character actions and a lack of proper development for the main characters~

Shut up.

[Vorena]

You guys are giving me too much to read. Stop that.

Besides, most of this stuff can be given a rough theory if you think of the situations.

Like the enemy levels in ch 7 compared with the situation that you mentioned. A simple solution to this is that Nergal is still working from the shadows. He does not have complete control over the black fang yet to make sure his orders are followed through with the utmost urgency that he might want. Therefore, the rest of black fang that is still intact treats the capture of two children as low priority thus why some of the weakest members are sent to do the bidding. Another simple solution is that black fang strength gains as time goes on with influence from Nergal's magicks. Why does the enemy have to stay inexperienced too?

When do morphs appear as enemies anyway en masse.

[General Banzai]

Except that is precisely the point of having filler. If it isn't random bandits, it would be just random soldiers or something like that. It wouldn't be different except for just who are you fighting against. And are you saying it's not possible for a bandit attack to happen? That's what they do. Most of the time the situation where they appear has it's explanations.

Let's take Lyn Mode for example. If Lundgren hadn't become confident that Lyn wouldn't make it to Lycia, instead of bandits, Chapters 3, 4, and 5 would've just been against more hired thugs like Chapter 1. It's not much different than having a bandit group chase you. It would've still been filler. In fact, he hoped that she would fall to the bandits of Northern Bern, since as bandits, they basically attack random people who pass through to loot them. How could they wouldn't attempt to attack them then?

Granted, this would mean the same group of bandits wouldn't attack them 3 times in a row, except that there are reasonable explanations for it. The first time was because Florina being harassed by bandits, since it's what they do, not to mention that they were provoked since her pegasus fell on top of one of them. And being Lyn's friend, she would not hesitate to defend her. In fact, the whole way she insisted that the fight was pointless, but the bandits were angry and stubborn enough to not stop.

The second time was for revenge and do their job as bandits on the side, since they were planning of sparing the women so they could take them. And the last one was that their defeats got them angered much they were now doing so for their reputation's sake, even to the point they now wanted everyone dead. Doing their job no longer mattered for them at this point, they just wanted dead those who ruined them.

And even so, they weren't the only bandit group in the area, if it wasn't them, it would've been other bandits who would've attacked them. Since after all, that's what they do.

See, the problem is that you proceed with the assumption that nothing interesting can happen in Chapters 3, 4, and 5. "Oh if it wasn't bandits it would be random hired thugs." Compare what happens in the first ten chapters of FESS to the first ten chapters of Lyn's Mode. People complain and complain about how short FESS is, when really FESS is simply concise. It cuts out the filler. There could have easily been only one chapter where Lyn fights the Ganelon bandits. One chapter to get out of Bern. The problem with filler as that it causes pacing problems; you spend too much time when nothing relevant to the plot occurs.

[Acacia Sgt]

See, the problem is that you proceed with the assumption that nothing interesting can happen in Chapters 3, 4, and 5. "Oh if it wasn't bandits it would be random hired thugs." Compare what happens in the first ten chapters of FESS to the first ten chapters of Lyn's Mode. People complain and complain about how short FESS is, when really FESS is simply concise. It cuts out the filler. There could have easily been only one chapter where Lyn fights the Ganelon bandits. One chapter to get out of Bern. The problem with filler as that it causes pacing problems; you spend too much time when nothing relevant to the plot occurs.

Except it can go either way. Or you drag the whole thing in one point, or you drag it somewhere else, assuming the same number of chapters stay, instead of taking out the fillers rather than just placing their slots somewhere else, where they would resurface the whole problem again.

The point about the trip through Northern Bern is that Lundgren hoped it's bandits would stop Lyn from ever reaching Lycia. Since bandits are commonplace, it actually makes little sense that only one group attacked them, and that overall they only got attacked by bandits just 3 times. However, doing so otherwise would be just as you say, needless chapters of filler. They can't just show you every single fight. So again, if it weren't 3 bandits chapters in Northern Bern, then it would've been more chapters against Lundgren's henchmen (assuming Lyn Mode keeps it's 12 chapters (10 plus 7x and the Prologue I mean)), hired thugs or Caelin soldiers, it doesn't matter, it would just be fights against people that don't drive the plot forward other than being 'one more battle to fight to reach our goal' kind of thing.

[General Banzai]

Except it can go either way. Or you drag the whole thing in one point, or you drag it somewhere else, assuming the same number of chapters stay, instead of taking out the fillers rather than just placing their slots somewhere else, where they would resurface the whole problem again.

The point about the trip through Northern Bern is that Lundgren hoped it's bandits would stop Lyn from ever reaching Lycia. Since bandits are commonplace, it actually makes little sense that only one group attacked them, and that overall they only got attacked by bandits just 3 times. However, doing so otherwise would be just as you say, needless chapters of filler. They can't just show you every single fight. So again, if it weren't 3 bandits chapters in Northern Bern, then it would've been more chapters against Lundgren's henchmen (assuming Lyn Mode keeps it's 12 chapters (10 plus 7x and the Prologue I mean)), hired thugs or Caelin soldiers, it doesn't matter, it would just be fights against people that don't drive the plot forward other than being 'one more battle to fight to reach our goal' kind of thing.

Why can't the bandits attack once? Lundgren can say that he believes that the bandits will stop her and then this is demonstrated when she is attacked by bandits. It didn't have to happen three (four actually) times. And again you assume Lyn's Mode has to keep its 12 chapters. There's no mandate saying this MUST happen. Lyn's Mode could be half the length as it is and still introduce all the tutorial aspects and be more interesting.

Edited July 26, 2011 by General Banzai

[Acacia Sgt]

Why do the bandits have to attack once? Lundgren can say that he believes that the bandits will stop her and then this is demonstrated when she is attacked by bandits. It didn't have to happen three (four actually) times. And again you assume Lyn's Mode has to keep its 12 chapters. There's no mandate saying this MUST happen. Lyn's Mode could be half the length as it is and still introduce all the tutorial aspects and be more interesting.

The whole assumption thing is to point that if it isn't a pointless fight over here, it would be a pointless fight over there. It was an example of what could happen if the chapter slot were to be moved. I kept it within Lyn Mode to keep it simple, since it's an structure on it's own and is smaller so it makes delivering the point easier to do.

When it comes to a game structured like FE, a filler chapter has the purpose of extra training for your units. This is why there are chapters where nothing much is happening other than being 'just one more battle'. Filler isn't bad as long as it's executed well. Drag it on and it can become bothersome, have it too short and there wouldn't be much chances to train units, unless the game has it's enemies to be overall weaker to accommodate the fact you didn't fought as many people on the way to gather EXP, items, etc.