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FE13: A Faustian Bargain?


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You have to admit though that random-chance-activation skills have very little bearing on tactics. Just look at the Ike/BK fight in PoR for instance. It's a fight which demand activation of Aether, but that activation is entirely random and thus the fight is entirely luck-based.

That's not the way to make a strategy game. For every other random-chance mechanic in the Fire Emblem series, there is a way to influence the chances to your favor. You can increase ally crit with certain weapons and nullify enemy crit with high luck. You can increase hit and avoid chances by using certain weapons. It becomes a tactical choice about which units/weapons to use.

Chance-activation-skills, however, have none of that. You can only choose to give someone the skill or choose not to, and in FERD you couldn't even choose not to. Meanwhile it's difficult for developers to give enemy units these same skills because the player would be annoyed if they lost to a random chance that they had absolutely no impact in swaying. Note how in the last stages of FERD they simply gave every unit Mantle. That was an attempt to reinstate strategy into a game whose last quarter had devolved into the realm of either assured victory or random chance.

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Well, Celice, you're actually quite right. Hopefully we're past all this nonsense now, because I'm done answering to it.

Anyways, the issue with the skill system and why I brought it up isn't so much the nitty-gritty of the tactical implications, it's something bigger. I feel like there's been this trend in the recent games, namely FE10 and FE11, that is inching more and more towards units just being generics with a face and a name. Something really special about Fire Emblem that, I feel, sets it apart from other games in the genre (like Advance Wars) is that each unit you get is unique. They have personalities, they have faces, they have special skills, a class. The characters live, they die. You're immersed in this world where all of your allies are special. Not only is Raven a Level 5 Mercenary, he's a man on a quest to avenge his fallen House. Lucius is following him because he was taken is as an orphan by the Cornwell family, and units like Franz aren't just Cavaliers, Franz is an apprentice trying to live up to his father's shoes (a legendary Knight of Renais). With skills, FE10 took away the personal aspect of skills, allowing you to freely just swap them around and making the fact that a unit comes with a skill much less important, since you can just reassign them next chapter. With the skill system returning in FE13, it looks like, from the screens we've seen, there's going to be a plethora of generic skills (HP +5, Crit +5, etc.) that are just freely exchanged between units with no capacity limits or anything. Skills on a unit won't matter, because every unit that joins just adds their skills to the pool anyways (all Fiona was good for was the free Savior and Imbue scrolls). After FE11 added reclassing, which took away almost all uniqueness based on class, the FE13 skill system appears to be taking away all uniqueness based on skills.

In FE10, you found out that Leonardo was royalty from reading the developer's notes, not from the actual game. FE11 you could basically remove 90% of the cast from their joining chapter and it wouldn't change a thing in the story. FE12 reversed this trend, thankfully, with bringing back supports and base conversations. Fortunately, it looks like they're bringing supports in FE13, an encouraging sign (pray to your deity that they aren't FE10's generic two-line conversations), and the preparation/map menus show no signs of reclassing. Two steps forward, one step back. Skills have gone from personal, enhancing traits to an equivalent of items that just buff your abilities. Maybe it's a better gameplay mechanic, that remains to be seen. But I just have to lament the apparent loss of personal skills.

Edited by Arch
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Not sure this is the right topic to have a..Skill tier list of all silliness, but I feel FE4 is also a crappy place to start. Due to no skill manuels or ability to switch skills over to other characters, it's more just a character trait rather than something you can tier up.

If we wanna tier skills, FE10 would be the better place to start since it's then they are a resource rather than a trait, along with the fact that it will be relevant to FE13 since skill swap will be happening.

Perhaps I wasn't clear: This is not a skill tier list or anything of the sort. The purpose is not to rank and compare skills, and certainly not in isolation: the purpose is to evaluate and compare the games themselves in terms of the relevance of their skill systems.

Not really. I can't think of any good skills that force trade-offs: there aren't many. Gamble, which is dire, Parity, which is usually dire and only useful because FE10 lategame bosses have a tendency to stand on FE5-style +10 DEF tiles (and also authority stars), Sacrifice (hohoho), Wildheart (lololol), and Blossom (which is only good because BEXP lets you avoid the negative while reaping the benefits). Some of these skills have niche value, but I would hardly call these the skills that "actually matter", and none of them are better than the likes of Adept, or Resolve, or Wrath, or so on.

You are right in a sense that you can't really control when Cancel activates, so it's not really something you can build a strategy around, but that should be fixed in a way other than assigning a tradeoff. Perhaps let the unit activate it every four turns, or something. Perhaps you could put in a "skill gauge" that depletes when the character uses skills to prevent overuse and would have to wait for it to increase back over time. You'd keep the random chance of activating though, but you'd be able to "force" it to activate at the cost of depleting your skill gauge, or something like that.

FE9 and FE10 failed at making good trade-offs; that does not mean the system as a whole is flawed. Again, I must point to Berwick Saga as offering just a few excellent examples of how it can be done better.

http://serenesforest.net/wiki/index.php/Berwick_Saga_Skills

A few skills stand out as notable. I believe I've already mentioned Pulverize a few times; it allows a character to double their attack power on their first melee attack if they use it before moving and in exchange for reducing the character's Defense to 0 for the duration of the battle. Two axe users use the skill to break through high-defense enemies and OHKO almost anything else, at the cost of being sometimes tricky to set up or risky to use. Like with most skills in its game, Pulverize is limited to the characters who have it from the start, both ensuring that it remains an ability unique to those two characters and preventing it from winding up in the hands of a character that would be game-breaking with it, such as a mounted unit that could move afterward. It's also used by several enemies throughout the game, and must be planned around when fighting them.

Surprise is particularly relevant, as it similarly requires use before movement, in exchange for negating the enemy's ability to counterattack. (Unlike Pulverize, one of its users is mounted, and can therefore move afterward.) Indeed, movement tends to be the sacrifice for most of Berwick Saga's skills, for a variety of uses. Perhaps the most notable skill that uses a more "conventional" trade-off is Deathmatch. It targets an enemy able to counterattack, and locks them into five rounds of combat, almost guaranteeing an immediate kill if the user can kill the enemy first, but risking heavy damage in the process. Enemies cannot usually be killed in one round without special weapons or skills, so as one of the fastest and least restrictive ways of killing enemies, it plays a substantial role in defining the two characters with access to it.

Time between uses is a great alternative trade-off, and also one seen with a few skills in Berwick Saga, but with a simpler system where you simply select to use it when it's charged and when you need it rather than having some random occurrence as well. An example is Starstrike, which requires seven turns to charge but unleashes five consecutive attacks when selected, allowing for quick and controlled removal of major threats with almost no risk. (Used only by one character, and only after promotion.)

It's not even just attacks to focus on, either, with abilities like Guard, having a character cut their own defense and avoid in exchange for protecting an adjacent ally from all attacks, entering combat in place of them. The three characters with the skill can all use it effectively but differently, with their varying merits in terms of offense, defense, and mobility.

Of course, there are many more options, but I think these make for some great examples of concepts to work with to improve tactics and character variety. There's also the matter of having a game where using those skills effectively is a key skill to master rather than just overkill. Berwick Saga certainly accomplished that, and I think IS is capable of making a game like that as well.

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On the topic of skills, I'm actually quite happy that we can apparently freely switch them. I'm betting there will still be skills like Astra, which only certain classes can wield, although seeing as Lockpick and Mug can be freely traded, I'm not gonna be waging much...

Yeah, I guess trading skills reduces character personalisation, but FE has generally been half story and half gameplay, and since gameplay is what really matters, I'll happily sacrifice some personalisation for a more customisable and viable skill system.

Since a few people mentioned it, I personally think stat boosters as items are pretty clumsy. I can strategically decide to feed Amelia a Speedwing, but what happens when she sucks or gains tons of speed later or just plain snuffs it?

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I don't think story is even relevant for this. It's more of a matter of, which is better for gameplay: Making every character as different as possible with their own substantial merits, or making them all the same? Seems to me making them different allows for more interesting choices in terms of your team as a whole.

It's the same reason as why I prefer Golden Sun's Djinn system to, say, FFV's job system. (Haven't played enough of any other game with a job system enough to talk about them.) You have options, but you have to work within limits and dealing with costs rather than just doing what you want, and characters have important core abilities that can't simply be traded away. This is also why I advocated FE4's generation system as an example of good customization in the other thread, having the same truths to it.

Edited by Othin
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Anyways, the issue with the skill system and why I brought it up isn't so much the nitty-gritty of the tactical implications, it's something bigger. I feel like there's been this trend in the recent games, namely FE10 and FE11, that is inching more and more towards units just being generics with a face and a name

You need to be careful of calling out FE11 (and FE12) for a nose-diving series. The game was a shit-poor remake that did nothing other than put a new wrapper on a two-decade, clastrophobic game. No mechanics were updated, no stories were rebranded, the content wasn't even expanded. Rather than be a good remake, it was a repackaging. The reclassing was an attempt to give the player a bit more fun with an incredibly limited game.

If these were completely original titles, twice in a row, that pursued a similarly-fixed gameplay style, that regressed back into the early 90s of gameplay mechanics, then you could say the series was snuffing itself out. But, why would someone reasonably try and argue that the first game is a regression? It's the first game, not a new title--it's already happened.

And in FE10, I never got the feeling once that a character lost their identity because their skills were no longer locked. I got the acute feeling, however, that I could, take any character I liked, and make them even better. I completely supported the feature, and because it's not forced on the player to swap skills, there's no reason to call it a bad mechanic or a slip into making things worse. It's left to the player to take the choice, and if they think it will make their game worse... don't do it? An incredibly simple response :)

EDIT: We need to remember that the choice to unlock skills in FE10 was likely based on a gameplay perspective. The game is incredibly jarring and segmented. Allowing skills to be trasnferable didn't really slaughter the individual potential, because the potential wasn't really available to work with in FE10. This is also likely why there's reclassing in FE11 and FE12: the way the game plays, there's no real negative aspect to including swapping. The cost is minimized because the loss is minimal. Everything is circumstantial--if we don't look at it that way, you're doing to have a skewed idea of what's happening exactly.

I can strategically decide to feed Amelia a Speedwing, but what happens when she sucks or gains tons of speed later or just plain snuffs it?

It's always annoying :/ Especially when the only character who would really benefit the stat boost is only at a low level, and very likely to turn out great in that stat regardless of the item use. I do like them however, for the ability to give my favorite units a little boost in whatever stat I feel. Just like skills in FE10, and potentially, FE13 as well :)

Edited by Celice
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Well, Celice, you're actually quite right. Hopefully we're past all this nonsense now, because I'm done answering to it.

Anyways, the issue with the skill system and why I brought it up isn't so much the nitty-gritty of the tactical implications, it's something bigger. I feel like there's been this trend in the recent games, namely FE10 and FE11, that is inching more and more towards units just being generics with a face and a name. Something really special about Fire Emblem that, I feel, sets it apart from other games in the genre (like Advance Wars) is that each unit you get is unique. They have personalities, they have faces, they have special skills, a class. The characters live, they die. You're immersed in this world where all of your allies are special. Not only is Raven a Level 5 Mercenary, he's a man on a quest to avenge his fallen House. Lucius is following him because he was taken is as an orphan by the Cornwell family, and units like Franz aren't just Cavaliers, Franz is an apprentice trying to live up to his father's shoes (a legendary Knight of Renais). With skills, FE10 took away the personal aspect of skills, allowing you to freely just swap them around and making the fact that a unit comes with a skill much less important, since you can just reassign them next chapter. With the skill system returning in FE13, it looks like, from the screens we've seen, there's going to be a plethora of generic skills (HP +5, Crit +5, etc.) that are just freely exchanged between units with no capacity limits or anything. Skills on a unit won't matter, because every unit that joins just adds their skills to the pool anyways (all Fiona was good for was the free Savior and Imbue scrolls). After FE11 added reclassing, which took away almost all uniqueness based on class, the FE13 skill system appears to be taking away all uniqueness based on skills.

In FE10, you found out that Leonardo was royalty from reading the developer's notes, not from the actual game. FE11 you could basically remove 90% of the cast from their joining chapter and it wouldn't change a thing in the story. FE12 reversed this trend, thankfully, with bringing back supports and base conversations. Fortunately, it looks like they're bringing supports in FE13, an encouraging sign (pray to your deity that they aren't FE10's generic two-line conversations), and the preparation/map menus show no signs of reclassing. Two steps forward, one step back. Skills have gone from personal, enhancing traits to an equivalent of items that just buff your abilities. Maybe it's a better gameplay mechanic, that remains to be seen. But I just have to lament the apparent loss of personal skills.

I agree with this completely (apart from the point Celice made about FE11), Fire Emblem has had, among other things, some brilliant and compelling characters and good characters are characterised by everything about them. I've gone on about classes before but a unit's class tells us about their day-to-day life and backstory - Nino's class was important in her support conversations with Erk and allowed an extra avenue of characterisation to be explored. Skills count too: in FE9 Rhys' serenity and Boyd's tempest were there to reinforce what we knew about them and Stefan's pre-equipped astra is a testament to his skill; even in FE10 Tormod's celerity gets a two-line mention in dialogue that expands on his relationship with Muarim.

Granted, from a gameplay standpoint more customisation is normally a good thing but there has to be some sort of compromise, like in FE4 where you could apply skills and stat boosts but to go back on your decision could be quite costly.

Edited by Byte2222
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On the topic of skills, I'm actually quite happy that we can apparently freely switch them. I'm betting there will still be skills like Astra, which only certain classes can wield, although seeing as Lockpick and Mug can be freely traded, I'm not gonna be waging much...

Yeah, I guess trading skills reduces character personalisation, but FE has generally been half story and half gameplay, and since gameplay is what really matters, I'll happily sacrifice some personalisation for a more customisable and viable skill system.

Since a few people mentioned it, I personally think stat boosters as items are pretty clumsy. I can strategically decide to feed Amelia a Speedwing, but what happens when she sucks or gains tons of speed later or just plain snuffs it?

Oh come on now, really? >.>

We're talking a bit about the progression of the Fire Emblem series as a whole here, and I think I should throw some things out there. For starters, people are going on about the series taking a nose-dive, but you have to remember that the series already DID take a nose-dive, at least from a gameplay standpoint.

If these were completely original titles, twice in a row, that pursued a similarly-fixed gameplay style, that regressed back into the early 90s of gameplay mechanics, then you could say the series was snuffing itself out.

^This is a 100% accurate description of FE6 and FE7. I've talked about the Thracia/FE6 transition before but I'll bring it up again here as an example of a place where the series already did take a complete U-turn in direction. We had to spend 5 whole games just to get halfway to where we were with Thracia (as far as gameplay is concerned). The schism is so distinct that the complete Fire Emblem series can be basically divvied up into two entirely different series: a first series, spanning FE1 through Thracia, and a second series, spanning FE6 through FERD. The other poster, however, was right when he said that we need to analyze FESD/FE12 from the perspective not that they are new games but rather enhanced ports of old games.

Now what we're discussing in this thread is whether or not FE13 is another reversion, the start of a third series, if you will. The argument here is that we're not making a reversion but rather going in completely alien territory. We're asking whether or not Fire Emblem is stripping the hallmark of the series--the individualized, well-developed characters--in favor of senseless generics which you build up using bland, exchangeable stat increases. But on a further look, one finds that this isn't new territory. Remember the shards (or whatever the fuck they are) from FE3, which increase growth rates of characters holding them? Or the scrolls from Thracia which do the same thing, so that with the right combination of scrolls you can make nearly everyone in the game cap every stat? Not to mention how FE4 is completely based around "building" units. In FE4, you have the ability to determine whether certain characters are the inheritors of Holy Weapons or not. The idea of being able to control to a decent degree a unit's stats has been around in a large amount of the games. FE3, 4, 5, 10, 11, and 12 all have unit customization as a large aspect of the game. Arguably FESS does as well, with the branched promotions. I mean, Ewan makes all that hubbub about being a Sage but you can just slap him with the Druid class without any trouble.

So that we're going about making all this noise over swappable stat-ups is a tad silly. Does it remove unit individuality? Yes. Is it new? No. Is it a deal with the devil (or a Faustian bargain)? No. From what we've seen so far, you have less control over the customization of your units than in FE3, Thracia, or the remakes, and arguably even FERD as well since we've seen nothing of a stat-influencing bexp system yet. Meanwhile we've seen the return of supports, seemingly indicating a reinstatement of the storyline individuality of units which we saw in FE6 through PoR.

But still people complain! And then there's the crap about the anime style, as though Fire Emblem has not been anime-style before. I mean, really. This is all just an excuse to poke the new game with a stick and say "IT'S RUINED FOREVER!"

Honestly, I'd venture to say that what we've seen of it so far is less revolutionary for the series than what we saw in FERD.

Edited by General Banzai
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Fire Emblem needs publicity. Perhaps it does take a certain kind of person to want to play SRPG's, but in the end it needs publicity. Changes are only needed when sales flop like they have been, and action is being taken accordingly. However, these changes won't mean a thing unless they get noticed and establish a wider audience. IGN fails to mention them often, among other gaming websites, despite the great efforts at Intelligent Systems and great ratings the games receive. It's difficult for this genre to be noticed...

Edited by Phoenix Wright
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I've talked about the Thracia/FE6 transition before but I'll bring it up again here as an example of a place where the series already did take a complete U-turn in direction.

Um... sorry for going off topic, I tried googling and cannot find said patch. Would you mind pointing me in the right direction? Sound very interesting.

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Um... sorry for going off topic, I tried googling and cannot find said patch. Would you mind pointing me in the right direction? Sound very interesting.

He is not talking about a patch. He is talking about the change ("transition") the series made from FE5 to FE6.

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He is not talking about a patch. He is talking about the change ("transition") the series made from FE5 to FE6.

Whoops. I misread it as 'translation'. Sorry. Nothing to see here.

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Skills count too: in FE9 Rhys' serenity and Boyd's tempest were there to reinforce what we knew about them and Stefan's pre-equipped astra is a testament to his skill; even in FE10 Tormod's celerity gets a two-line mention in dialogue that expands on his relationship with Muarim.

Then why didn't Makalov start with Gamble? wink.gif

But still people complain! And then there's the crap about the anime style, as though Fire Emblem has not been anime-style before. I mean, really. This is all just an excuse to poke the new game with a stick and say "IT'S RUINED FOREVER!"

NOONE is complaining because FE13 has anime style graphics. Did you ever stop and think that maybe, just maybe, that not all animes look the same and maybe people like the more old school anime feeling of the past games rather than the...more modern anime stylings of FE13?

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Then why didn't Makalov start with Gamble? wink.gif

NOONE is complaining because FE13 has anime style graphics. Did you ever stop and think that maybe, just maybe, that not all animes look the same and maybe people like the more old school anime feeling of the past games rather than the...more modern anime stylings of FE13?

Makalov starts with Tempest, which is close enough.

Also, how far back are we going for this more "old school anime feeling"? Because if I recall correctly the Reed bothers were sporting some mad belt buckles, and there hasn't been a single game in the series free from bubbly-eyed loli girls in miniskirts.

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Also, how far back are we going for this more "old school anime feeling"? Because if I recall correctly the Reed bothers were sporting some mad belt buckles,

I don't think it's so much changing to an "anime style" or "new school anime" as it is a sense of change from simple character designs that feels, if nothing else, more like the series we've all grown to love and less like every other JRPG in the world.

and there hasn't been a single game in the series free from bubbly-eyed loli girls in miniskirts.

I actually find these characters frustrating too, but I know a lot of people like fanservice. That said, I think the bigger problem, for me is this: Even ridiculous character designs were outliers. FE13, with the little that's been released about characters has: A Paladin in what looks like a mech suit, a character that probably goes through a bottle of hair gel a day and has ridiculously over exaggerated and generic anime facial expressions, and the chick with a thousand buttons.

All that said, I'm still trying to catch up on the entire conversation. Sorry if this is an interruption, or has already been adressed.

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I'm more interested in how we're going to be getting some of the tradeable skills. Is it going to be like the DS FF4 remake, where there's special skills you can give to whoever you want, which you have to get on your own--but there are still unique skills chained directly to specific characters? I think it might be more interesting this way, making all the smaller, augmentational skills a lot more side-questy and reward-based than just stealing it from existing characters :E

What I meant was skills that activate on command with some kind of tradeoff, like Gamble. I think that's a pretty cool way to do them because you can reap the benefits without just crossing your fingers and hoping for the best but it still has some strategy to it.

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I'd personally be happy.

You're one of them rare ones and I applaud you.

On the subject of skills, I wish they did an intermediary between FE9 and FE10's version, where certain skills (besides masteries, like personal skills) can't be removed from the unit, but those don't exist much . However, there would be learnable skills that you get as items/manuals that can be freely swapped around. So I'm not much of a fan of all skills being freely movable, since I do like a level of individualization on my characters beyond faces.

But I guess it'd be hilarious if I load everything ever on to my favorite character ever and proceed to rampage.

Edited by Luminescent Blade
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On the subject of skills, I wish they did an intermediary between FE9 and FE10's version, where certain skills (besides masteries, like personal skills) can't be removed from the unit, but those don't exist much . However, there would be learnable skills that you get as items/manuals that can be freely swapped around. So I'm not much of a fan of all skills being freely movable, since I do like a level of individualization on my characters beyond faces.

I don't mind exchanging skills like the stat boosters, but I do agree being able to freely swap skills as you want does make the characters more generic; so your idea would be optimal. It would also be kinda neat(at least for me) if you could only swap skills between characters that have a support.

Anyway, I'm easy to please so I'll be happy if FE13 has supports that are not generic, different levels of difficulty, permadeath, not being rewarded for killing your characters, and characters that I actually have a chance of using.

Edited by luchinania
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  • 3 weeks later...

Series doesn't need help. It still sells perfectly well in Japan.

You're right. It sells fine in Japan. Series needs help everywhere else. I don't think this is about Japan. It's about getting back on a growing trend internationally by appealing to a broader audience and putting the game in the spotlight (like the "first DLC on the 3DS" headline). Out of curiosity, I saw the headline on Kotaku and then searched for all other stories with the "Fire Emblem" tag. Dating back to the release of Path of Radiance, the DLC headline and announcement of FE13 (which was itself a headline because of the conference in which it was announced) were the only non-"this game just came out so we'll write a few paragraphs about it" that could be found. They're going for some spotlight, and going for a broader appeal with this new style and new approach, and it's all with the intention of enhancing commercial success.

I'd like to dispel this myth that FE is flourishing in Japan and not in NA.

Fire Emblem sells just as well (better) in NA as it does in Japan, and that is the issue: it is mediocre everywhere. It does not have a loyal userbase in any region like most series' tend to have. It is an absolute disaster in Europe.

If you look at sales charts for any of Fire Emblem's releases in NA, you will soon realize that they all sell equal to or better than they did in Japan. FE9's NA sales nearly DOUBLED its JP sales, for example.

So there is no easy road to popularizing FE. They have their market and it is niche. They sell about as well as a Disgaea game, to put things in perspective. The big difference is that Disgaea has an absolutely stalwart fanbase who buy all of the games in the series. Disgaea game sales are incredibly consistent in all regions, whereas with Fire Emblem you never know who's going to buy it and who isn't. That's the best comparison I can think of.

Fire Emblem is plagued by its genre, and possibly even the console options it has. SRPG is just not a popular genre, if trends continue it is unlikely that it will ever be mainstream. But I do agree that attempting to do what they can to get attention is a great idea. Even if some aren't happy with the changes they want to make, it is ultimately better for the series if they can get new fans and new people interested.

In any case, I don't have much to contribute to the current discussion, but I wanted to clear some things up about the series' popularity.

In short, if FE is getting headlines, it's a good thing no matter what it is that it is getting headlines for.

Edited by Tangerine
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Another thing is that if they piss off the "hardcore" fans, they'll still buy it. So if they draw "casual" players while doing so it's a net gain for them still.

I'm not saying this is good or bad, it's just worth mentioning.

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I'm more worried about whether FE13 will be released in the U.S. than how different it is... it's Fire Emblem. Really, it might be nice for it to change a bit... and if it becomes a bit more like other RPGs in a few ways, that's not all that bad either; it could draw more fans, give it more popularity...

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Well, you also have to consider that maybe NoA/NoE actaully saw that FE11 was nothing more than the NES game with updated graphics and a few extra whirlies here and there. While FE12 is a more substantial in comparison, adding in a number of cool things over the original, Nintendo may have figured that they didn't want another shoddy game to invest their money into having localized.

FE13 isn't an update of a shoddy game, it's an entirely new one. The only time new games don't get localized is if the game seems too impossible to localize (a very specific kind of title that may not warrant enough interest worth an investment) or there's better titles to invest in.

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Well, you also have to consider that maybe NoA/NoE actaully saw that FE11 was nothing more than the NES game with updated graphics and a few extra whirlies here and there.

I haven't played the NES game, but I'm pretty sure that Shadow Dragon adds more than better graphics and reclass.

While FE12 is a more substantial in comparison, adding in a number of cool things over the original, Nintendo may have figured that they didn't want another shoddy game to invest their money into having localized.

From what I heard, Shadow Dragon did quite adequately in terms of sales.

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