Ranked Runs

[sunshineYON]

I'm doing my first ranked run on normal mode. I've never done one and this is to prepare me for ultimately completing a S-Rank HHM run. I would appreciated if you guys could me some pointers.

Some questions that comes to mind.

- To retain 80% of the funds, what is the rule of thumb on the number of promotion items I should use? I get the gist that oceans seal and fell contract are no go.

- Is it wise to use weapons such as longsword, heavy spear, etc. over cheap iron weapons?

- I'm getting the vibe that I should spam Mani Katti.

- This is a fresh run on a blank rom, i.e. forced Lyn Normal Mode. Is there anyway I can check how I ranked there? Or do I have to wait until I complete ENM? It's kind of frustrating not knowing how I did on that run until I beat the whole game. I did get a white gem though, I assume that means I got 5 stars in funds.

- Should I use stat-ups at all? Is it worth it. I know it is all variable, but I'm sure some choices out-prioritize others. I had to give up using the energy ring in LNM fearing for my funds rank, as there was no clear cut way to check my progress in LNM.

- Promoting lords seems pricy. Since Hector is not required in ENM, is it prudent to use another unit in his place? (despite the fact that Hector is my favorite unit in the game :( )

- I'm most worried about tactics and funds, questions about the other categories:

- Does survival count the units that died before a reset? I know this game keeps track of "losses" of the units, if so, I've already failed.

- I have 5 stars overall in Exp and Combat, I think these are a given? Unless they are harder to maintain in later chapters?

- Everyone talks about HHM in ranked runs, so finding info on ENM is pretty hard. So far, I'm doing okay, as it is ENM, but should I even worry about a lot of the aspects that make ranked runs challenging while in NM? (i.e. am I worrying too much?)

Thank you.

Edited April 17, 2012 by goopy

[Raven]

One mistake you seem to have made already is in assuming that your Lyn Mode ranks carry forward into your Hector/Eliwood mode, when in truth, they do not. You could have easily used the Energy Ring in LNM with absolutely no effect on the ENM funds rank.

Survival doesn't count unit deaths before a reset, so you're safe there.

Enemies in NM are a fair bit easier than those in HHM, so combat isn't something to worry about too much. Just try to keep a balance between gaining a fair amount of EXP and raising a handful of units to promote.

As for promotion, I'm not sure how tight the funds rank is in NM compared to HHM. I'd suggest spending no more than 80,000 G on promotion (that's 8 normal promotions, or 6 normal promotions and 1 Lord promotion (not including Eliwood since he is forced).

[sunshineYON]

One mistake you seem to have made already is in assuming that your Lyn Mode ranks carry forward into your Hector/Eliwood mode, when in truth, they do not. You could have easily used the Energy Ring in LNM with absolutely no effect on the ENM funds rank.

No, no, I am aware Lyn Mode and HE Modes are separate. I just wanted to hit two birds with one stone by getting an S in LNM as well, since I've never done a ranked run in general. But there is no way to check if I S'd in Lyn mode, to my understanding, other than beating Eliwood Mode.

Thanks for the advice. Right now I'm going insane over the tactics rating, barely behind the threshold. Though people say funds is a lot harder to maintain in the long run. Chapter 20 has a 5 turn limit for 5 stars, wtf.

[Raven]

Personally I'd have done them on seperate occasions, considering trying to S-Rank one mode can potentially hinder certain aspects of the other mode. Lyn mode is small enough to do in an hour or so. I'm currently working through HHM and I used LHM to put in some early levels to certain units, and killing others off so I don't have to raise them, but they get the level bonuses they'd receive in HHM anyway.

[sunshineYON]

Personally I'd have done them on seperate occasions, considering trying to S-Rank one mode can potentially hinder certain aspects of the other mode. Lyn mode is small enough to do in an hour or so. I'm currently working through HHM and I used LHM to put in some early levels to certain units, and killing others off so I don't have to raise them, but they get the level bonuses they'd receive in HHM anyway.

I mainly S-Ranked, or attempted to in Lyn mode to get the white gem, but yeah, it is pretty short, but I detest Lyn mode so I just wanted over with. I know what you mean, as being stingy in Lyn mode can have an effect on your units in E/H mode in terms of their stats.

Why did you kill of some units again? Can't you just not deploy them/not lead them into combat? I don't understand why killing off units is beneficial, unless the Exp Rank maximum is proportional to the number of units you have. I know they can't "die" in LN but still.

[Raven]

Why did you kill of some units again? Can't you just not deploy them/not lead them into combat? I don't understand why killing off units is beneficial, unless the Exp Rank maximum is proportional to the number of units you have. I know they can't "die" in LN but still.

I'll give you an example:

If you use Lyn mode to focus on only a handful of units so they are stronger in the coming Eliwood/Hector mode, then the units you do not use will not gain any experience. Bear in mind any and all surviving units of LM will retain their level, experience and stats in the crossover to E/HM.

However, killing a unit in LM allows them to evade this, so they receive not the stats, level and experience they died with in LM, but their base levels and stats they receive in E/HM, as though you had completely avoided doing LM with that unit at all.

Take Sain: You get him in LM at Lv.1. You get him killed in LM, and he comes back in E/HM at Lv.4, with improved bases and all.

http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=26138 The first post in this topic was my own plan for LHM and how I'd raise/kill units there ready for HHM.

Edited April 17, 2012 by Raven

[sunshineYON]

I see. I didn't think of that. Though units I tend to use on the Lyn run are the only units I tend to use from that mode when I make the transition to H/E mode. Though for HHM, I can understand, because some units may be vital for that particular time despite you not wanting it on the final team.

[Aethereal]

Resetting doesn't count against survival, no worries there.

EXP is the tough rank, but I don't honestly know about ENM compared to HHM. I didn't promote either lord in my S-Rank, and I would imagine promoting Hector would be kind of a waste.

I'll have to check again, but I think I promoted like, 6 units? Sounds about right. Lean on your pre-promotes for combat and tactics, and feed kills to unpromoted units as often as possible. Pent, Marcus, and Harken are basically your best friends.

I think I used an angelic robe for a specific purpose, and otherwise didn't see a good reason to blow a ton of funds for minor boosts. Stat boosters are meh.

I wouldn't stress over effective weaponry. There's not a lot of situations where it'll be worth it , since it can usually be duplicated by Mani Katti. Keep 'em with Merlinus.

You probably are worrying too much, but it doesn't hurt to be prepared with something like this. Anyways, good luck.

[sunshineYON]

Resetting doesn't count against survival, no worries there.

EXP is the tough rank, but I don't honestly know about ENM compared to HHM. I didn't promote either lord in my S-Rank, and I would imagine promoting Hector would be kind of a waste.

I'll have to check again, but I think I promoted like, 6 units? Sounds about right. Lean on your pre-promotes for combat and tactics, and feed kills to unpromoted units as often as possible. Pent, Marcus, and Harken are basically your best friends.

I think I used an angelic robe for a specific purpose, and otherwise didn't see a good reason to blow a ton of funds for minor boosts. Stat boosters are meh.

I wouldn't stress over effective weaponry. There's not a lot of situations where it'll be worth it , since it can usually be duplicated by Mani Katti. Keep 'em with Merlinus.

You probably are worrying too much, but it doesn't hurt to be prepared with something like this. Anyways, good luck.

I usually don't like prepromotes because I like "raise" my units, though they are there for a reason. It would be dumb not to use them if I want to achieve an S rank realistically. Looks like I'm going to have to say goodbye to a few of my units solely for the purpose of not getting fund screwed.

And yeah, I guess the way to go is - costed weapons, i.e. Mani Katti, or iron weapons, as they have almost double the uses of any other weapon and at half the costs, effectively quadrupling their usefulness in funds.

Also, is it realistic to get all 5 stars on the desert chapter? It seems impossible to find all the treasure, steal the guiding ring from one of the warriors, get the necessary EXP (Don't let Pent hijack it all), and beat the chapter in 9 turns or less, seems inhuman. This is the first chapter that has given me a headache. Not the mention the movement penalties.

[GreatEclipse]

The Funds rank on ENM is actually more difficult than you would think, since you lack the silver card or any 0 requirement chapters, so I would go easy on promotions and stat boosters. Most enemies outside HHM are such a joke that it barely matters who fights them, so feel free to use pre-promotes.

[sunshineYON]

Is there advantages in choosing certain routes, i.e. make it easier on certain ranks. LIke is Kenneth's map easier than Jerme's? And Lloyd vs. Linus, which one, etc.

[GreatEclipse]

Kenneth is easier to clear under the turn requirement just by nature of being a seize map. At least on HHM, it also has the benefit of being easier due to far fewer promoted enemies, plus you get an extra Speedwings. Linus map generally is preferable to Lloyd because you get a much better unit. On NM, however, you may want Lloyd instead because you can access the arena earlier in the map (Linus has a higher turn requirement on HM to make up for it), and even Wallace does fine in combat given the pathetic enemies.

[sunshineYON]

I'm in Vaida's chapter. Is it frowned upon in a ranked run to steal her spear? I usually do it for the lulz, and in this case, I'm not so sure if I should do it. Anyone who does ranked runs have any input in this?

[Raven]

Really, that's down to your own discretion. However the way I see it, it would be deemed as cheating simply because it will make certain things much easier - like the final chapter enemies, or certain strong boss units. If you want to illegitimately make things easier for yourself then that's fine, but I know I couldn't do it because I would want to earn any S rank the way it is meant to be earned.

But yeah, your call. If you aren't bothered about how you achieve your S rank, then go ahead, I say.

But if you're going to steal it yet not use it, then I don't see the point in stealing it at all.

[Paper Jam]

Experience is much easier to get in Normal mode than in Hard mode, so I wouldn't worry about that.

If you don't have the downloadable items from the Mario Kart: Double Dash disk, you can't get a Silver Card in Normal Mode, so items will be more expensive.

In general, Normal Mode doesn't allow as many turns per chapter as Hard Mode does, which affects not only your Tactics rating but also your Funds rating; chapters 16x, 20, and 23 (Linus) allow much more turns for arena abuse in Hard Mode than in Normal Mode.

Combat and Survival are about the same in Normal Mode as in Hard Mode, or maybe a bit easier.

In short, Funds is harder to 5-star in Normal Mode than in Hard Mode, and arguably Tactics is too. The rest are the same or easier.

Since Funds are so much tighter in Normal Mode, it follows that you should generally use Iron weapons, which have the lowest cost per attack. (A single attack with an Iron Sword sets you back 10g, or 460/46, whereas an attack with a Steel sword sets you back 20g, or 600/30. And a single use of a Silver Sword costs 75g, or 1500/20.)

You can find this out for yourself with any weapon by taking its cost and dividing by its number of uses to figure out how much your Funds rank goes down each time you attack with that weapon.

Edited April 19, 2012 by Paper Jam

[sunshineYON]

So I finished the run. Getting an S in Lyn normal mode and an A in Eliwood normal mode. I was worried the whole way for my funds and tactics rank, the only rank I fell short was in Exp, by 2 stars, derp. I have a save on chapter 29, and I'm pretty sure I can get 5 stars in Exp if I wasn't so careless, as I was more concerned for my funds/tactics. I killed a couple of bosses with level 20 ppl, and used Athos to finish some of the final Morphs. I can always spam staves as I now know that I didn't need to worry about money. I'm just too lazy now, I'll probably do it later.

For tactics I calculated that I used 279 out of the allotted 291, so that's 12 turns breathing room.

For Funds I ended with 931979g, surpassing S-Rank 922320g by 9659g. One more promotion would have spelled doom on this particular rank.

I calculated my win percentage to be 57% (737/1294), seems the most cake walk out of the ranks, considering there was multiple instances where I should have traded bow to a melee weapon before enemy phase, etc. that type of thing. (I used the character ending screen for the numbers, does that include Lyn mode statistics as well?)

Screenshots:

What does screens mean on the top right corners? And I'm pretty sure that the stars under that are tactician stars?

Thanks for the tips guys. Doing an S run was tiresome and unnecessarily nerve-racking, though I enjoyed it to a certain extent. I probably won't be doing another one for a while though :P

Edited April 22, 2012 by goopy

[Raven]

Screens = chapters played, basically.

And GJ there. Shame about the EXP rank, but the irony is that we all learn from our experiences.

[Geriba]

Don't feel bad about falling short on the experience rank. Given that funds are your main priority in ranked NM play, it's easy to lose track of high experience requirements in certain chapters, especially the last few. If you opted to use a lot of prepromotes and/or Athos down the stretch, this could have easily knocked a full star off your rating. How much did you use the arena? Seeing as you can get both gold and experience from arena battles at a relatively quick pace (especially with smart rescue/drop/dance strategies that allow for 3-5 battles per turn), in the future, try and plan so that any expendable turns you've accrued (and are likely to accrue) are spent arena abusing on Four-Fanged Offense.

So I'm sure you realize now that despite what you may have heard, ranking runs in this game can be tough. Very tough. It's a totally new way to play that demands close attention to detail. If you're in a particularly masochistic mood one of these days, give S-Ranking HHM a shot.

Edited May 2, 2012 by Geriba