"cannon" speculation?

[metavision]

i've read a few people (here and a few other places) say that the cannon mother for lucina is sumia, is this true or how do we arrive at this conclusion if it's still up in the air?

is it because she has the highest priority with krom if all the girls have the exact same amount of support with him? i always though MU would fit more and just assumed that she was last in priority so that the player doesn't have to jump through hopes to insure that she isn't forced into marriage with Krom.

after reading the majority of supports in the support thread it seems like there are more "special" conversations (parent/child/sibling/as a couple) if MU is paired with Krom, and rightfully so since they are both main characters, wouldn't that be a pretty good indication of something being more cannon? or is that just because perhaps the others aren't up yet?

not going to lie, would love to see an awesome butt kicking female lead/lord (instead of a shrinking violet) for a FE game, actually have her be relevant for the *entire* plot, AND have her get her much deserve man candy who isn't useless himself. the fact that there is a possibility of two of these in one sitting? Sign me up plz.

but really aside from all that, sumia does seem like a weird cannon choice. is there something that goes on in game to point this out or is it just the priority thing? mariabel would seem like a better cannon choice imo just because she is the childhood friend trope and japanese usually eat that up. sumia knows her friend taimo has a crush on krom and even if taimo is supposed to be the fated 'unrequited love' in this game that seems like bad taste.

just wondering.

[Fanfaire]

Sumia is the highest choice for Krom because Tiamo tears make for great nutrition for their child.

Nothing like betraying your best friend that always protects you than stealing away the man she's in love with.

Edited August 8, 2012 by Fanfaire

[Momo]

Wouldn't she be the canon mother because of the opening movie?

[metavision]

Wouldn't she be the canon mother because of the opening movie?

nothing happens in the opening movie, or in the cutscene that it's taken from. nothing romantic anyway. Krom is about to get attacked and Sumia swoops in to pick him up. here's a vid with all the cg movies :

starts around 4:59

[Othin]

Krom's potential wives don't actually have a priority system.

It's because Sumia appears as Krom's wife in the opening movie, and because she has restricted pairings, like Krom. Other characters in the regular "Gen 1" group can pair with any of each other of the opposite gender.

[CrashGordon94]

No, there aren't any cannons in this game I'm afraid.

[metavision]

Krom's potential wives don't actually have a priority system.

It's because Sumia appears as Krom's wife in the opening movie, and because she has restricted pairings, like Krom. Other characters in the regular "Gen 1" group can pair with any of each other of the opposite gender.

what opening movie is this? i thought i saw all of them. could you tell me which one it is?

and by priority i meant what was referred to here: http://www.serenesforest.net/fe13/support.html

also, technically, Taimo has a restriction as well. just sayin'.

No, there aren't any cannons in this game I'm afraid.

yeah i was thinking that as games with similar features usually tend to be like this, so i was just wondering if this different or if people who just liked sumia elevated her status to cannon.

Edited August 8, 2012 by metavision

[Onestep]

First of all, you're mispelling 'cannon'. It's 'canon'. Secondly, there is no 'canon'. Sumia is just assumed to be the base choice due to the opening movie and the fact that she is number one on the priority list. Which is fairly solid reasoning as it goes.

The reason that FeMU will NEVER be Lucina's canon mother is simple. MU can be either male or female. IS will never want to alienate a major faction of their fanbase, and so will never declare either MaMU or FeMU to be canon.

Just deal with the fact that IS has given you a blank slate to work with. Neither MaMU or FeMU are canon, nor is anything else (including pairings) in the game. Except that Gimle get's his ass beaten into the ground, one way or another.

Edited August 8, 2012 by Onestep

[Othin]

what opening movie is this? i thought i saw all of them. could you tell me which one it is?

also, technically, Taimo has a restriction as well. just sayin'.

The movie that plays from the title screen. Not sure where to find a video of it online. It's not one of the twelve movies in the Movie Viewer, although it has some scenes from them.

Tiamo doesn't have a restriction. Lacking a Krom support is the standard.

Males: Frederick, Viole, Sol, Vake, Callum, Donny, Ronku, Richt, Gaia, Grego, Libera, Henry

Females: Liz, Soiree, Miriel, Mariabel, Velvet, Tiamo, Nono, Sarya, Olivia, Serge

Those are the "standard" groups, where any of the males can pair with any of the females. Anything beyond that is a bonus. Krom and Sumia, however, do not fit into those groups, only being able to pair with each other, MU, or three other characters each.

[Book of Ereshkigal]

The opening: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vf6nJLVY9M0&list=PL580F6E9CBF63FD75&index=1&feature=plpp_video

Sumia is holding Lucina at 1:22

Edited August 8, 2012 by L95

[CrashGordon94]

yeah i was thinking that as games with similar features usually tend to be like this, so i was just wondering if this different or if people who just liked sumia elevated her status to cannon.

...Dude, you totally missed the point.

[Sock]

*cough* Giving credit where credit is due:

Wouldn't she be the canon mother because of the opening movie?

Thusly, here is a shot from the game's opening movie:

Edited August 8, 2012 by Tsamimi

[metavision]

First of all, you're mispelling 'cannon'. It's 'canon'. Secondly, there is no 'canon'. Sumia is just assumed to be the base choice due to the opening movie and the fact that she is number one on the priority list. Which is fairly solid reasoning as it goes.

The reason that FeMU will NEVER be Lucina's canon mother is simple. MU can be either male or female. IS will never want to alienate a major faction of their fanbase, and so will never declare either MaMU or FeMU to be canon.

Just deal with the fact that IS has given you a blank slate to work with. Neither MaMU or FeMU are canon, nor is anything else (including pairings) in the game. Except that Gimle get's his ass beaten into the ground, one way or another.

you are coming off a little aggressive for a simple question, lol.

I'm well aware that between having a cannon femMU or broMU the likelihood of a gender being picked is low and even then, not even in the favor for female (Bioware games, anyone?). I was just saying it WOULD be awesome if it were the case and acknowledged it was wishful thinking on my part. However, I also wanted to point out that IF a cannon were to be established, MU would make more sense than Sumia because of the reasons I listed.

Barring that though, I don't see why Sumia is the more legitimate choice over the other girls. Is it just because of the the priority (and movie, apparently)? If that is the case then I'll have to disagree that "it's a good reason". Seems like a poor reason and one that undermines her character. She doesn't seem like a person who would throw her friend under the bus like that. Mariabel growing up with Krom makes more sense, or even Soiree.

also: misspelling ;)

The movie that plays from the title screen. Not sure where to find a video of it online. It's not one of the twelve movies in the Movie Viewer, although it has some scenes from them.

Tiamo doesn't have a restriction. Lacking a Krom support is the standard.

Males: Frederick, Viole, Sol, Vake, Callum, Donny, Ronku, Richt, Gaia, Grego, Libera, Henry

Females: Liz, Soiree, Miriel, Mariabel, Velvet, Tiamo, Nono, Sarya, Olivia, Serge

Those are the "standard" groups, where any of the males can pair with any of the females. Anything beyond that is a bonus. Krom and Sumia, however, do not fit into those groups, only being able to pair with each other, MU, or three other characters each.

See, this is what I meant, thanks. I just didn't realize if I was missing something or not and I was. In fact I was missing two things.

@L95 - thanks man, i would have been searching for that video for a while.

...Dude, you totally missed the point

apparently so. why dont we go over that one more time then?

@Tsamimi - thanks, just now saw that after watching L95's movie.

[Onestep]

you are coming off a little aggressive for a simple question, lol.

I'm well aware that between having a cannon femMU or broMU the likelihood of a gender being picked is low and even then, not even in the favor for female (Bioware games, anyone?). I was just saying it WOULD be awesome if it were the case and acknowledged it was wishful thinking on my part. However, I also wanted to point out that IF a cannon were to be established, MU would make more sense than Sumia because of the reasons I listed.

Barring that though, I don't see why Sumia is the more legitimate choice over the other girls. Is it just because of the the priority (and movie, apparently)? If that is the case then I'll have to disagree that "it's a good reason". Seems like a poor reason and one that undermines her character. She doesn't seem like a person who would throw her friend under the bus like that. Mariabel growing up with Krom makes more sense, or even Soiree.

also: misspelling ;)

Did I come off as aggressive? My apologies about that if so. And yeah, misspelling was a typo in my case. You seemed genuinely unaware that you were getting canon wrong though.

But yeah, IS will never say that MaMU or FeMU is canon. And because of that, they'll never say that any particular pairing is canon either. Which sort of answers your question, I suppose.

And I didn't say that Sumia was a 'good' or 'legimate' choice. Merely that from what we've seen (her priority and place within the game's OP) she seems to be the girl that IS like using for their poster couple with Krom. Still doesn't mean she's canon in any way.

As for Tiamo... I'd like to imagine that she's mature enough to be happy for Sumia and Krom in the Verse(s) that that happens in, even if it's not necessarily what she wanted.

[metavision]

Did I come off as aggressive? My apologies about that if so. And yeah, misspelling was a typo in my case. You seemed genuinely unaware that you were getting canon wrong though.

But yeah, IS will never say that MaMU or FeMU is canon. And because of that, they'll never say that any particular pairing is canon either. Which sort of answers your question, I suppose.

And I didn't say that Sumia was a 'good' or 'legimate' choice. Merely that from what we've seen (her priority and place within the game's OP) she seems to be the girl that IS like using for their poster couple with Krom. Still doesn't mean she's canon in any way.

As for Tiamo... I'd like to imagine that she's mature enough to be happy for Sumia and Krom in the Verse(s) that that happens in, even if it's not necessarily what she wanted.

that's because I was, lol. i did think it was canon but looked up "cannon" to double check and got the noun/physical version, then just assumed that "canon" was fanmade. i left "cannon" in after that on purpose.

in all fairness i was also confused about sumia because i hadn't seen the opening and just thought people liked her so used her as canon; sort of like how the gold saucer date works in FF7. To be fair though, even if femMU was canon, there's no way they could make a matching CG movie for all the different combos she could potentially be. They would have to do something like SWTOR, and there are times where the customization + animations have some really.....unfortunate consequences.

i'm sure Tiamo is happy for her friend and her secret crush; at least according to TV Tropes that's usually the case. I just kinda dislike the type of girl Sumia is and think Mariabel, Soiree or MU would have been better. She and Olivia seem like a Nadeshiko type. Grant it, it's natural for a Japanese game to love this stereotype but I'm so. over. it.

oh and for anyone that's never been to tvtropes.com, stop while you are ahead. i gave you fair warning.

[ATNAK]

I thought Sumia is considered the 'canon' wife because she slap Krom and there're times when other characters tease them or something

[metavision]

I thought Sumia is considered the 'canon' wife because she slap Krom and there're times when other characters tease them or something

now THAT I want to see ｡◕‿◕｡

[Just call me AL]

Based on what I've read so far, at least this game's done the best it could to avoid any chances of the pairs in it from being crack. I still have my doubts regarding canonicity, but I'm not one to argue if there's definite canonicity regarding Krom X Sumia. Either way, it won't mess up my game plans. Especially since the decision for who to pair Krom with is harder gameplay-wise when compared to something like Levin's pairs in FE4.

[BBM]

I wouldn't say that IS will never canonize any pairings. It's unlikely they'll do so with any MU pairings, but they 100% canonized Levin x Fury in FE5.

[paladin21]

I wouldn't say that IS will never canonize any pairings. It's unlikely they'll do so with any MU pairings, but they 100% canonized Levin x Fury in FE5.

And Leaf-Nanna in the FE5 ending, and it somewhat implies that Finn-Lachesis is canon too (or at the very least that they had some kind of relation).

[Othin]

In terms of pairings as they're seen in FE4, the one it actually indicates is Beowulf x Lachesis. It also indicates that Fin and Lachesis got together, but at a later time following the Battle of Barhara.

[Ein]

Unless IS says that Krom x Sumia is canon then no.

Sure it's more or less implied within the game and crap but the PLAYER still has the final word and junk.

[Onestep]

I wouldn't say that IS will never canonize any pairings. It's unlikely they'll do so with any MU pairings, but they 100% canonized Levin x Fury in FE5.

The problem with that is that MU can pair with pretty much everybody. And nobody wants their waifu/husbando to canonically get together with someone else.

Particularly in Japan, where they can get rabid about that kind of stuff. This is the problem with making a blank slate character to inset into a game. While it helps the player get into the game more, it also makes them feel more personally involved. Which makes them aggresive as shit about any canon they don't like.

Bioware, for example, managed to dodge the bullet in Mass Effect by flatly stating 'There is no canon. Whatever you did is canon to you. There is no overarching canon.' I'd imagine IS will do something similiar. Though they might decide to make one of the endings canon, as they're functionally identical barring a few details.

[BBM]

Well, that's what I said. It's unlikely they'll canonize any of MU's pairings, but they might canonize some others.

[Onestep]

Well, that's what I said. It's unlikely they'll canonize any of MU's pairings, but they might canonize some others.

But that's the thing. MU can pair with essentially EVERYONE. If they canonize a pairing between two people that MU could have romanced, then they're saying that MU canonically didn't romance either of those two. Which leads back to the problem I mentioned in my earlier post.

So the only pairings they can really canonize safely are those between characters that MU can't romance... Which is basically nobody, depending on what happens in-game. Except Mark, obviously.