BrightBow Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 And with regards to Nowi, it is a slightly uncomfortable pose for the OA, but her in-game portrait is actually not particularly offensive. Even if the fact that her portrait only shows her head would trivialize it, there is still her battle model and her confession images. They don't grant you that benefit. Pegasus knights in this game don't really wear dresses any shorter than the norm for this series. Over half the games feature them without any sort of pants, FE4 had high leg slits which are arguably just a different form of sex appeal, and the Elibe games had both high leg slits AND short skirts. I am sorry, but what are leg slits? To me, Jugdral's legwear seems to be pretty consistent between genders for the most part. As for Elibe Pegasus Knights: Yeah, they suck. The odd tendency to keep all the females with bare legs has always irritated me. But I would have hoped that they would have improved that, instead of making it even worse. All I'm seeing in this thread is a lack of awareness of anything before FE9, with people shutting their ears and going lalalalala. You don't have to agree with the "sexy" art from Kozaki, but you'd have to criticize the series as a whole. Personally I could spend a lot of time ranting about the old art (and probably did so) but Awakening made my complaints completely trivial. The old art had it's issues but things have still massively changed for the worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quick Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 (edited) The blatant sexualization of this game is stupid and is almost impossible to thoroughly hide, but don't forget that the art style of this game changed all together from an art design inspired by anime but had it's on flair, to something that is just completely anime. It makes me wonder why the hell they gave the permission to make the character designs to somebody who has never played the past FE games. Yusuke Kozaki did a good job on No More Heroes but damn he wasn't meant to draw FE characters. Edited March 28, 2013 by Quick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bookofholsety Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 the norm for FE artwork (and presumably that of most games) is actually to contract the services of artists not normally employed by IS. the only two FE artists who are credited in games other than the ones they did OA for are Sachiko Wada and Katsuyoshi Koya (the latter is a borderline case since I'm not sure whether his TCG artwork was actually done alongside FE3/4 or afterward); the other notable ones - Eiji Kaneda (FE6/7, DLC!Ike), Senri Kita (FE9/10, DLC!Marth), Masamune Shirow (FE11) and Daisuke Izuka (FE12, DLC!Eirika) - were all newcomers to the series. I doubt that any game developer would require an artist to be familiar with prior works, since most of the time that's kind of unfeasible and not exactly absolutely critical as for Kozaki's response: honestly this doesn't surprise me in the slightest. considering the high saturation of sexualisation in Japanese gaming, it almost makes perfect sense that he just doesn't realise that that's precisely what he's churning out. perhaps it could also be seen that it's served to blur his view of female characters in such a way that "oh hey fanservice is totally female character traits", but I'd rather not cast aspersions upon the character of someone about whom I know little Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interceptor Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Sure are a lot of Puritans in this thread. Did I step into a time warp? Buy stock in Apple, everyone; you can thank me later. I think that the character designs are excellent. Not all of them are my cup of tea, but if that's what it takes to keep Fire Emblem games coming overseas, then bring on the band-aid Nowis. There are designs that I like a lot, like Mirel, Lucina, Lon'qu, and Vaike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Sure are a lot of Puritans in this thread. Did I step into a time warp? Buy stock in Apple, everyone; you can thank me later. I think that the character designs are excellent. Not all of them are my cup of tea, but if that's what it takes to keep Fire Emblem games coming overseas, then bring on the band-aid Nowis. There are designs that I like a lot, like Mirel, Lucina, Lon'qu, and Vaike. Puritians? Sure... You know, I can build straw men too. And considering the purpose of Nowi's predecessors in "No more Heroes", it's not going to be a pretty one. But that's not getting us anywhere now, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legault! Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Sure are a lot of Puritans in this thread. Did I step into a time warp? Buy stock in Apple, everyone; you can thank me later. I believe this is less a matter of "Puritans" and more a matter of "I'm not a fat sweaty weeaboo who needs sexualized children in my strategy RPG title." Awakening's designs are less "bad" and more just.. embarrassing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faye Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Oh, Nowi only LOOKS like she's 10, but don't worry, she's really over 1000 years old! ^ That there is one excuse I seriously hate. :| Nowi is blatant lolibait. I know people complain about Nowi and never mention Ricken/Donnel, and I don't know about other people, but my beef with Nowi is her outfit. I'd be against marrying R/D if either of them was dressed sexy like Nowi is. If the wanted to dress her like that, they could at least make her as tall and mature-looking as Tiki. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legault! Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Oh, Nowi only LOOKS like she's 10, but don't worry, she's really over 1000 years old! ^ That there is one excuse I seriously hate. :| Nowi is blatant lolibait. I know people complain about Nowi and never mention Ricken/Donnel, and I don't know about other people, but my beef with Nowi is her outfit. I'd be against marrying R/D if either of them was dressed sexy like Nowi is. If the wanted to dress her like that, they could at least make her as tall and mature-looking as Tiki. I agree, but don't forget her personality: she plays house. She has the mind of a preteen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quick Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 I agree, but don't forget her personality: she plays house. She has the mind of a preteen. Well, while the skimpy outfit hurts, keep in mind that Tiki was even more childish in the FE series before Awakening. Does it excuse Nowi? No, but this still isn't the first time this has happened. Frankly, I don't want another Nowi thing, she's already here and she sucks and we have discussed her a million times so.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interceptor Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Puritians? Sure... You know, I can build straw men too. And considering the purpose of Nowi's predecessors in "No more Heroes", it's not going to be a pretty one. Do your worst, bro. This is a thread that contains the phrase "visible garters". I feel like I intruded upon a church meeting where people are complaining about the latest issue of "Bare Ankle" magazine, and how it represents the unraveling of polite society. I believe this is less a matter of "Puritans" and more a matter of "I'm not a fat sweaty weeaboo who needs sexualized children in my strategy RPG title." Whoops, Legault beat you to it. I agree, but don't forget her personality: she plays house. She has the mind of a preteen. Not that I am condoning her character design or anything, but Nowi's supports suggest that this is just an act. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sol Falling Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Puritians? Sure... You know, I can build straw men too. And considering the purpose of Nowi's predecessors in "No more Heroes", it's not going to be a pretty one. But that's not getting us anywhere now, right? I don`t remember any lolis in the NMH games. Meanwhile, Nowi's outfit might be skimpy but I can hardly see it as sexualized. So her top looks like a "band-aid" (or something?)? It still does more than enough to cover her breasts. If IS/Kozaki wanted Nowi to be seen as actually sexy, they could certainly have done much worse. The point of Nowi is having a childish personality despite being hundreds of years old. In line with that, her overall childish look with bows and frills and outfit which exposes her navel perfectly capture her childish innocence. In fact, the skimpy (but non-sexual) aspect of Nowi's outfit does a lot to precisely establish this. You wouldn't start perving at kids you see on the beach, would you? By comparison, Tiki's art can easily be said to be more sexual/more easily sexualized than Nowi's despite ostensibly showing less skin, but then, isn't that completely appropriate given the difference in their character personalities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 (edited) I don`t remember any lolis in the NMH games. Meanwhile, Nowi's outfit might be skimpy but I can hardly see it as sexualized. So her top looks like a "band-aid" (or something?)? It still does more than enough to cover her breasts. If IS/Kozaki wanted Nowi to be seen as actually sexy, they could certainly have done much worse. You couldn't have missed them. Travis has them on his normal T-shirt in both games. And in Desperate Struggle, Henry catches him masturbating while watching their show. Edited March 28, 2013 by BrightBow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legault! Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 http://serenesforest.net/fe13/img/nd_nono.jpg "Not sexualized" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arvilino Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 http://serenesforest.net/fe13/img/nd_nono.jpg "Not sexualized" What are you attracted to pink hearts and little girls or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legault! Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 What are you attracted to pink hearts and little girls or something? Most people would consider stripper boots, no shirt, her wink, and that pose to be sexualized. Please stop trying to defend a game with embarrassing art design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interceptor Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 http://serenesforest.net/fe13/img/nd_nono.jpg "Not sexualized" Uhhh, she's basically a little kid in a bathing suit with a cape and lots of hearts and bows everywhere. Are you entirely certain that you're not projecting, here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quick Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Uhhh, she's basically a little kid in a bathing suit with a cape and lots of hearts and bows everywhere. Are you entirely certain that you're not projecting, here? It's still extremely sexual for no reason, ah well. Like I said, why are we talking about Nowi and not other characters that haven't been pushed over a million times? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 I don't really like to link to something like this but whatever: If I may present: The Bizarre Jerry girls from Yusuke Kozaki's previous work on No more Heroes http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080506041935/nomoreheroes/images/b/b2/Nmh-cranberry_strawberry_blueberry.jpg See any similarities to Nono's wardrobe? http://serenesforest.net/fe13/img/1025/nono.jpg She is effectively Strawberry with a different haircut and color pallet. And more hearts and ribbons, which really just makes things worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legault! Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 (edited) Uhhh, she's basically a little kid in a bathing suit with a cape and lots of hearts and bows everywhere. Are you entirely certain that you're not projecting, here? Second person implying I'm a pedophile because I'm not a unbathed, unemployed loser who pretends to be smart on the internet. She's wearing stripper boots and very little clothing. She plays house. Nowi says she's been around the block thousands of times. You, the player, can marry her. She has a child. She has a confession scene. She is sexualized. I don't really like to link to something like this but whatever: If I may present: The Bizarre Jerry girls from Yusuke Kozaki's previous work on No more Heroes http://images2.wikia...y_blueberry.jpg See any similarities to Nono's wardrobe? http://serenesforest...g/1025/nono.jpg She is effectively Strawberry with a different haircut and color pallet. And more hearts and ribbons, which really just makes things worse. BrightBow you should be banned from this site You are clearly a PROJECTING PEDOPHILE Edited March 28, 2013 by Legault! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quick Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 BrightBow you should be banned from this site You are clearly a PROJECTING PEDOPHILE Please tell me you're being sarcastic, I wouldn't be surprised if you are but still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legault! Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Please tell me you're being sarcastic, I wouldn't be surprised if you are but still. Obviously I was being sarcastic, in response to Interceptor's profound idiocy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sol Falling Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 (edited) I don't really like to link to something like this but whatever: If I may present: The Bizarre Jerry girls from Yusuke Kozaki's previous work on No more Heroes http://images2.wikia...y_blueberry.jpg See any similarities to Nono's wardrobe? http://serenesforest...g/1025/nono.jpg She is effectively Strawberry with a different haircut and color pallet. And more hearts and ribbons, which really just makes things worse. Is that even drawn by Kozaki? Sure doesn't look like it. Pretty sure I remember a mention about an actual magical girl anime with the same character designer (not Kozaki) coming up soon, as well. Second person implying I'm a pedophile because I'm not a unbathed, unemployed loser who pretends to be smart on the internet. She's wearing stripper boots and very little clothing. She plays house. Nowi says she's been around the block thousands of times. You, the player, can marry her. She has a child. She has a confession scene. She is sexualized. You are very funny. Honestly, while I don't have a problem admitting that there are probably people who would have no problems sexualizing Nowi no matter the portrayal of her character (i.e. as a child), the absurdity of the fact that you honestly cannot conceive of that image in any way except sexually is downright hilarious. Edited March 28, 2013 by Sol Falling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legault! Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 I think it's probably worth mentioning that, in fairness, this kind of sexualization seems very common in contemporary Japanese animation. It's not just Mr. Kozaki. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interceptor Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Second person implying I'm a pedophile because I'm not a unbathed, unemployed loser who pretends to be smart on the internet. Don't be silly. Certainly I wouldn't hire you to babysit, but I'm not suggesting that you're a degenerate pedophile. I'm saying that your position is more than a little bit breathless, and might not be as mainstream/reasonable as you seem to think it is. She's wearing stripper boots and very little clothing. She plays house. Nowi says she's been around the block thousands of times. You, the player, can marry her. She has a child. She has a confession scene. She is sexualized. Is your copy of Awakening different than mine? I don't remember a Nowi H-scene. Maybe my memory is fading in old age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 (edited) Is that even drawn by Kozaki? Sure doesn't look like it. Pretty sure I remember a mention about an actual magical girl anime with the same character designer (not Kozaki) coming up soon, as well. Were there other artists working on No more Heroes? Unfortunately the English side offers no credits. You've got to keep in mind, that they are fictional Anime characters in an already cartoonish world. So of course they have to contrast with the real people there. And if you still can't remember them: Here a screenshot from a scene at the beginning of the game with Travis hugging a poster of them while making a creepy face while moaning "Moe". http://www.gamefaqs.com/wii/933024-no-more-heroes/images/screen-3 Of course, when No more Heroes sexualized little cartoon girls like that, it was a satirical take on the Otaku culture. When Fire Emblem did it, it was because... ...IS thinks really low from the people that buy their games? Edited March 28, 2013 by BrightBow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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