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cyron

Making archers better

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In Fire Emblem archers are notorious for being hard to use and ineffective, due to lack off an enemy phase causing them to not make as many kills, deal as much damage and fall behind in terms of experience. Short off 1 range bows what do you think could have been done to make archers more effective in awakening.

For me I think that if the archer tree simply had some different skills it would be far more effective.

For the archer class itself if instead of skill plus 2 archers received veteran (or paragon) it would help them keep up in terms off experience, and in place of their level 10 skill they received dual strike plus (there natural skill got them extra avoid on the player phase thats useless since the point of being an archer is to not be countered on the player phase) allowing them to be more effective pair up partners, and would let them deal damage and gain experience on the enemy phase.

Snipers, would also have been the sensible choice for gale force in place of dark fliers since it would have allowed them to make up for their poor enemy phase by making more kills in the player phase (Plus bows are the most accurate weapon type having extra hit is worthless(it would replace hit plus 20 not bow faire to be clear). This also would have balanced gale force because it would have been more of a hassle to obtain so in a no grind run it would be likely that only Virion could obtain it.

For bow knights, I think that if they had a skill that automatically shifted from bows to sword and swords to bows to counter on the enemy phase it would make it practical to use bows, or at least carry them, it would also make up for the lack of common 1-2 range swords)

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Base stats should be higher, because most Archer in the series has joke base(FE7, FE8, and FE13 has this IIRC)

Put Dragons!

And Wyverns!

And Flying Dragons!

And an Indosiar Dragon who gives 300 EXP per kill and has flying weakness!

Also more Dragons to kill!

See: FE12. Its an effective marketing strategy that promotes the usage of Archer.

Edited by I have a Dragon Boner

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Kickass growths. Better skills. Staves. Yeah that could actually be useful. Change all bows to 2-3 and have longbows be 2-4. Also give them flying mounts. And canto.

Edited by Randa

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Better skills, Archer tree has the worst skillset ever (The only good skill is Bowfaire... ).

I agree with giving galeforce to them, it suits well with a 2 range only class.

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Give Archers/Snipers counter, good game.

That would be a helpful

Attacking from 5 tiles away.

i put forth the idea in a hacking thread (i think thats what it was) where they were trying balance bows they though that it would make enemy archers to annoying since you couldnt defend your healers and other squishy units.

Base stats should be higher, because most Archer in the series has joke base(FE7, FE8, and FE13 has this IIRC)

Put Dragons!

And Wyverns!

And Flying Dragons!

And an Indosiar Dragon who gives 300 EXP per kill and has flying weakness!

Also more Dragons to kill!

See: FE12. Its an effective marketing strategy that promotes the usage of Archer.

that works to,

Kickass growths. Better skills. Staves. Yeah that could actually be useful. Change all bows to 2-3 and have longbows be 2-4. Also give them flying mounts. And canto.

staves dont really make much sense though, 2-3 range would help a lot

1-5 range bows on promo.

again that would be to unbalanced

Give archers galeforce.

No I'm being completely serious.

Or just spawn more pegs that are able to be ohko'd by archers

i agree

Virion should have gotten higher bases and replace +20 Hit Rate with 2-3 Range for only bows like Radiant Dawn and made the Yewfelle 1-2 range.

that would be a better way of implementing 2-3 range so you have to become a sniper to access it as opposed to warriors and assassin getting it to so its a niche

Edited by Cyron

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It might help if they had more range, possibly up to 4 spaces away? Ballista becoming much more common could help too, or just being a weapon like they were in shadow dragon. Or just make a bunch of 3-13 archer clones.

Edited by Sol Man

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Give them better base SPD. Seriously.

Virion's 5 base SPD doesn't help him out much. Sure, he's off to a better start than archers like Wil, Tomas, and Rolf, but he's still pretty bad.

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Give them better base SPD. Seriously.

Virion's 5 base SPD doesn't help him out much. Sure, he's off to a better start than archers like Wil, Tomas, and Rolf, but he's still pretty bad.

I'd argue FE9 Rolf is better than Virion. FE10's definetely is. Wil is also probably better and at least tomas can reclass.

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Well, FE9!Rolf has BEXP access, and of course FE10!Rolf is better. I can see where you're coming from about Wil, since FE7 enemies are weaksauce, and I suppose you're right about FE11(I assume we're talking about this version)!Tomas.

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FE9 Rolf has bexp, so yeah, he can catch up without any combat at all. Virion's worse.

i put forth the idea in a hacking thread (i think thats what it was) where they were trying balance bows they though that it would make enemy archers to annoying since you couldnt defend your healers and other squishy units.

Make Physic more common.

Edited by Chiki

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I'd argue FE9 Rolf is better than Virion.

...Never mind.

Edited by Levant Fortner

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Btw, the way to make Archers better without going into ridiculous territory:

Increased exp gain so that their chipping rewards them with enough exp to stay afloat.

Chip actually mattering.

Not terrible bases.

Dangerous few enemies as opposed to an army of them. (lol FE13)

Dangerous flying enemies that only they can handle reliably.

A reward for using them long-term.

The bolded one probably being the most important. They're notably better in the FEs with dangerous fliers like FE6 and 12.

Edited by Peekayell

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Let's see:

FE2- I haven't played it yet but 1-5 range seems to make it one of the most broken features in it

FE4- Midir is prone to rng screwness but Jamka, Bridgette, and Faval were actually good because of their high bases (even though their movt was bad)

FE5-bad archers errywhere

FE6-Shin was considered one of the better characters due to his really high bases for his level so he grew quickly and Klein and Igrene were useable because of their passable bases. Sue takes a while to be good and Wolt and Dorothy are pretty bad. And did I say wyverns appear everywhere

FE7-Louise is the only decent one because of auto A support with Pent and comes with A bows so she can use the brave bow as soon as you get her. Wil and Rebecca have pretty terrible bases and Rath comes too late

FE8-Innes is decent and he can double most enemies up to the last chapter and Neimi is pretty terrible

FE9-Astrid is competent due to paragon and can canto back to safety. Rolf takes too long to train up to par and lolShinon

FE10-Leo is bad and Rolf is decent but Shinon is better because of his better bases

FE11-I don't think there's any bow users that's good up till the end of the game

FE12-Lots of wyverns and dracos throughout the game makes training Ryan and Hunter!Draug a piece of cake and sniper is actually a great class

FE13-flying enemies are scare and Virion is the epitome of a bad bow user

So it seems like the pattern throughout the series is that all good bow users have good bases are someway to level up quickly enough to stay on par with the rest of the team. Flying enemies seem like a boon in the face of any bow users so maybe more flying enemies should appear in the next fire emblem and not just archers who can chip in the beginning and be benched for the rest of the game?

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Galeforce was what came to mind upon entering the thread.

Make 2-3 range more accessible

More variety in effective weaponry

Assist xp, maybe?

The ability to counter 1-2 range weapons even at 1 range.

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Let's see:

FE2- I haven't played it yet but 1-5 range seems to make it one of the most broken features in it

FE4- Midir is prone to rng screwness but Jamka, Bridgette, and Faval were actually good because of their high bases (even though their movt was bad)

FE5-bad archers errywhere

FE6-Shin was considered one of the better characters due to his really high bases for his level so he grew quickly and Klein and Igrene were useable because of their passable bases. Sue takes a while to be good and Wolt and Dorothy are pretty bad. And did I say wyverns appear everywhere

FE7-Louise is the only decent one because of auto A support with Pent and comes with A bows so she can use the brave bow as soon as you get her. Wil and Rebecca have pretty terrible bases and Rath comes too late

FE8-Innes is decent and he can double most enemies up to the last chapter and Neimi is pretty terrible

FE9-Astrid is competent due to paragon and can canto back to safety. Rolf takes too long to train up to par and lolShinon

FE10-Leo is bad and Rolf is decent but Shinon is better because of his better bases

FE11-I don't think there's any bow users that's good up till the end of the game

FE12-Lots of wyverns and dracos throughout the game makes training Ryan and Hunter!Draug a piece of cake and sniper is actually a great class

FE13-flying enemies are scare and Virion is the epitome of a bad bow user

So it seems like the pattern throughout the series is that all good bow users have good bases are someway to level up quickly enough to stay on par with the rest of the team. Flying enemies seem like a boon in the face of any bow users so maybe more flying enemies should appear in the next fire emblem and not just archers who can chip in the beginning and be benched for the rest of the game?

I dunno... the "flying enemies are scarce" bit you listed for FE13 sounds like it was more true for FE9, since outside of the ravens in chapter 12, fliers were pretty scarce before the Daein chapters.

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