PAIRINGS The Pairing Thread

[Czar_Yoshi]

Why would Gerome be the exception? I'm not seeing it. I can see how Gerome would be better on someone with a +5 Speed mod for Wyvern Lord or a 40 Speed class, but in that case I would expect it to apply to Yarne too. What am I missing?

He's a) almost strictly inferior to Yarne as a parent for Morgan (nobody wants Cherche's -1/-1 Skl/Spd when Panne's +2/3 are on the board), and b) unable to get Hit+20 and Berserker. So not actively bad, just eclipsed by someone else.

What do you mean when you say FeMU can't pass classes to anyone but lucina?

Avatar-M can pass his classes on to all his kids, so if he marries someone who already has a kid tied to them, their kid gets to cash in. Lucina is the only child tied to their father instead of their mother, so if you want Avatar-F to pass on a ton of classes to someone, it has to be her (since that's the only way for Avatar-F to have two children).

[Nicholai]

MaMU would pair well with those females that lack access to GF, then.

Sort of obvious when you think about it, but I guess I never had to put any stock into pairings because the game was too easy to worry about how OP your OP units were. Would something like +Spd -Lck/Def MaMUxPanne be a waste, then? If the goal is to yield two super units with MaMU, does it matter all that much who you stick Robin with?

Sorry about the large number of questions.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Maybe. The thing is, in addition to the kids, you have to think about how well Avatar performs- (s)he is one of your best units, so you want to give them a spouse capable of doing well in combat.

In Avatar-F's case, she's completely self-sufficient and the best one-man army in the game (except Chrom in certain cases). Avatar-M is better at specialized roles, but he relies on teamwork from his wife a lot more. In Panne's case, the duo will do very well ingame, Morgan will do comparatively poorly ingame, Yarne will do comparatively well ingame, Panne and Avatar will do poorly postgame, Morgan will do well postgame, and Yarne will do normally (for Yarnes in general, which is very well) postgame.

The other thing to keep in mind when choosing who to marry is that S supports are a lot better than A supports, but there are only 13 kids, which is an odd number and means someone's getting benched unless you marry G2 (and thus don't pass your classes to anyone). Obviously, this doesn't matter in the slightest if you weren't planning to use all the children in the first place, but if you are, it's really important.

Additionally, with some planning ahead most of the children are capable of getting everything they could ever want without Avatar's help in the first place- this is particularly true for Yarne and Laurent. As for where he can be put to use, Nah makes the best use of his classes (at the cost of a very bad postgame wife in Nowi), while Severa makes the most of his mods postgame (+Spd/-Def), and also gives him a very good wife (Cordelia is one of the best 3 first gen units to marry for postgame optimization).

[Nicholai]

Going with the assumption that I were to optimize for Nah and by extension Morgan from the start of a run, which would be the best asset and flaw to take? As a defensive character is it best to accentuate that, or mitigate the weaknesses in offense and speed as much as possible? With MaMU added to the list of fathers capable of proxy passing pegasus knight through fighter(?) class conversion you can round out all 3 that would need a specific father for GF.

It's hard to wrap my head around it all without a solid end goal, really. Trying to optimize for Apo. without even having the DLC yet (lel) is tricky. Kind of feeling like the powerful magic units would support as sages or DF, physical units as Berserkers, with rallies and staffers for movement and Sniper pairs for tricky enemies. Which child in which roles is a toughie, because a lot of them can do a lot of things. Offensive child core seems obvious, with any males that can't get GF getting aggressor and sitting in the back.

That means that pairs that maximize classes might be more important in the long run than mods, unless a child has everything already (Cynthia/Brady) and only needs maybe one thing to be optimal for a specific role. With Donnel!Kjelle, MaMU!Nah, and Gaius!Noire I can get three extra GF users, but at the cost of somewhat iffy mods on Kjelle. I guess I'll have to give it another look over.

[burgerkong]

Keeping in mind that my FeMU is +Def -Lck and I very much don't want to give Chrom the avatar, where should her classes go? Since it's all a matter of mods, is there anything that even wants defense?

For Apotheosis, nope. Defense isn't that useful unfortunately, given how hard the enemies hit and how much offense is emphasized over defense. Tanking is certainly doable, but in general your goal is killing enemies in a single turn rather than fighting it out over multiple.

FeMU will want to marry 2nd gen if not with Chrom. I have no clue who you'd want to give her to, but probably someone with a nice Speed modifier to make up for MU's poor one.

Going with the assumption that I were to optimize for Nah and by extension Morgan from the start of a run, which would be the best asset and flaw to take? As a defensive character is it best to accentuate that, or mitigate the weaknesses in offense and speed as much as possible? With MaMU added to the list of fathers capable of proxy passing pegasus knight through fighter(?) class conversion you can round out all 3 that would need a specific father for GF.

It's hard to wrap my head around it all without a solid end goal, really. Trying to optimize for Apo. without even having the DLC yet (lel) is tricky. Kind of feeling like the powerful magic units would support as sages or DF, physical units as Berserkers, with rallies and staffers for movement and Sniper pairs for tricky enemies. Which child in which roles is a toughie, because a lot of them can do a lot of things. Offensive child core seems obvious, with any males that can't get GF getting aggressor and sitting in the back.

That means that pairs that maximize classes might be more important in the long run than mods, unless a child has everything already (Cynthia/Brady) and only needs maybe one thing to be optimal for a specific role. With Donnel!Kjelle, MaMU!Nah, and Gaius!Noire I can get three extra GF users, but at the cost of somewhat iffy mods on Kjelle. I guess I'll have to give it another look over.

Going for MU X Nowi is fine, since it turns Nah (arguably the worst child for Apotheosis) into a great one by virtue of MU's classes. As I stated above, Defense is mostly worthless, so unfortunately you're going to want to go +Speed Asset to patch up Morgan & Nah's otherwise bad Speed modifiers. +Mag is an option, but they'd be limited to Valkyrie (Dark Flier misses out on 69 Speed threshold with Sages).

You honestly don't really need an end goal, at least for me personally. I usually have in mind a few new pairings that I want to try, then I theorycraft the rest and do it. Knowing the cookie-cutter builds (i.e. DF x Sage, Sniper x Berserker, Males with Aggressor + -faire, etc.) helps make this process easier.

And yes, classes >> mods. Keep in mind though that Speed mods are somewhat important, and that you don't need to run every child, since you need the space for Chrom, rallybots, staffbots, etc.

Edited May 29, 2015 by burgerkong

[Knusperkeks]

Ignoring the confrontational and mildly insulting tone you've been using towards me

Don't flatter yourself, you're not getting any special treatment. Everyone is equal.

how amazing the cavalier tree is is kind of irrelevant, because Chrom already gives it to his children.

Ingame only and from an efficiency perspective: There is no time to waste on useless children characters who are weaker than their parents. Lucina is one exception. Have you ever seen Quick Burn Lucina?

Explain to me why Paladin access for Sully and wyvern access for Sully is so much more useful than Galeforce, particularly in lunatic?

Comparing units: Sully has better combat performance than Sumia when paired with Chrom. Especially when Lunatic is all about amassing critical mass as early as possible. This of course assumes you don't want to let Robin and Chrom solo the game, which is yet faster than Sully and Chrom, which is faster than Sumia and Chrom.

If you - for any reason - want to recruit children, then Kjelle's paralogue is one of the easiest in the game and won't take too much time to complete. Cynthia's/Inigo's are much more demanding in stats.

[PM ME MARIANNE ART]

So since I like to plan ahead

Beating apotheosis in my current file is almost ready (forging every weapon takes goddamn forever, not even mentioning capping everyone), and I'm going to make another file with a FeMU with more min-max like pairings for challenges and such. This is what I was thinking, and keep in mind I don't know the hardcore min-max stuff that well

FeMU x Virion (Sue me) for speed/skill mods and he really won't be needed elsewhere

Chrom x Sumia - Sniper!Lucina and Dark Flier or Falcon Knight Cynthia

Libra x Olivia (OMG I LOVE INIGO'S HAIR IN THIS PAIRING) Dread Fighter or Sage

Henry x Cherche - Berserker!Gerome

Lon'qu x Cordelia - I have no idea what to do with this pairing but I just know it's good

Gaius x Sully - either paladin or Wyvern Lord

Vaike x Nowi - Hero!Nah

Donnel x Tharja -Probably sniper?

Stahl x Panne - Berserker!Yarne

Gregor x Miriel - Sorc or Sage!Laurent

Ricken x Lissa - Sage!Owain

I don't know where to go with Brady but I know he's pretty good already so eh

so yeah, help me out and such

Edited May 29, 2015 by Luck Dancelot

[Ownagepuffs]

Woah it's like deja vu in here. If I didn't know any better I'd think Knusper was Vascela's alt.

So since I like to plan ahead

Beating apotheosis in my current file is almost ready (forging every weapon takes goddamn forever, not even mentioning capping everyone), and I'm going to make another file with a FeMU with more min-max like pairings for challenges and such. This is what I was thinking, and keep in mind I don't know the hardcore min-max stuff that well

FeMU x Virion (Sue me) for speed/skill mods and he really won't be needed elsewhere

Chrom x Sumia - Sniper!Lucina and Dark Flier or Falcon Knight Cynthia

Libra x Olivia (OMG I LOVE INIGO'S HAIR IN THIS PAIRING) Dread Fighter or Sage

Henry x Cherche - Berserker!Gerome

Lon'qu x Cordelia - I have no idea what to do with this pairing but I just know it's good

Gaius x Kjelle - either paladin or Wyvern Lord

Vaike x Nowi - Hero!Nah

Donnel x Tharja -Probably sniper?

Stahl x Yarne - Berserker!Yarne

Gregor x Miriel - Sorc or Sage!Laurent

Ricken x Lissa - Sage!Owain

I don't know where to go with Brady but I know he's pretty good already so eh

so yeah, help me out and such

Lancefaire Wyvern Lord or Swordfaire Hero/Assassin/Bow Knight, depending on what you need/who is supporting her.

[Knusperkeks]

Woah it's like deja vu in here. If I didn't know any better I'd think Knusper was Vascela's alt.

I have no idea what you're talking about.

So since I like to plan ahead

Beating apotheosis in my current file is almost ready (forging every weapon takes goddamn forever, not even mentioning capping everyone), and I'm going to make another file with a FeMU with more min-max like pairings for challenges and such. This is what I was thinking, and keep in mind I don't know the hardcore min-max stuff that well

FeMU x Virion (Sue me) for speed/skill mods and he really won't be needed elsewhere

Chrom x Sumia - Sniper!Lucina and Dark Flier or Falcon Knight Cynthia

Libra x Olivia (OMG I LOVE INIGO'S HAIR IN THIS PAIRING) Dread Fighter or Sage

Henry x Cherche - Berserker!Gerome

Lon'qu x Cordelia - I have no idea what to do with this pairing but I just know it's good

Gaius x Kjelle - either paladin or Wyvern Lord

Vaike x Nowi - Hero!Nah

Donnel x Tharja -Probably sniper?

Stahl x Yarne - Berserker!Yarne

Gregor x Miriel - Sorc or Sage!Laurent

Ricken x Lissa - Sage!Owain

I don't know where to go with Brady but I know he's pretty good already so eh

so yeah, help me out and such

I think this is a good team.

[Ownagepuffs]

I have no idea what you're talking about.

This is similar to how I went back and forth with Vascela about the same topic. You're bringing up the same points he did, too. I don't mean this in a bad way, of course. I think it's the polarizing nature of Sumia as a unit that makes it hard to agree on.

Edited May 29, 2015 by Ownagepuffs

[burgerkong]

FeMU x Virion (Sue me) for speed/skill mods and he really won't be needed elsewhere

FeMU x Virion actually isn't a bad choice due to his base classes & mods. He's one of the better 1st gen Males for Apotheosis thanks to having 2 of the best -faires and Hit+20. If you're OK going Magical, +Mag/-Def are good for both FeMU & Virion @Sage, and allows Morgan to do.

Alternatively +Spd is solid if you want Morgan to be very fast, allowing him to run a variety of different classes.

Libra x Olivia (OMG I LOVE INIGO'S HAIR IN THIS PAIRING) Dread Fighter or Sage

Lon'qu x Cordelia - I have no idea what to do with this pairing but I just know it's good

Gaius x Sully - either paladin or Wyvern Lord

Donnel x Tharja -Probably sniper?

Gregor x Miriel - Sorc or Sage!Laurent

I don't know where to go with Brady but I know he's pretty good already so eh

Libra!Inigo can run physical if you want as well; his Str mod is still positive and just 1 less than his Mag. I'd recommend Sage for the damage output though, since you won't have room for 2 -faires and will just use Tomes for the most part anyways.

Lon'qu!Cordelia, as OwnagePuffs mentioned, mainly uses her incredible Speed mod to run Wyvern Lord with AS+2 and a Berserker Pair Up and still hit 75 Speed, or Hero with AS+2 to hit 75 Speed with any 0 Speed Pair Up.

As for Gaius!Kjelle, she can run the same set as Lon'qu!Severa with Wyvern Lord (requires AS+2), or can achieve 75 Speed without the AS+2 as Paladin, but still requires the Berserker Pair Up. Paladin is lower damage, but is nice for the +2 Spd Pair Up bonuses if you're running her with a Galeforce partner.

Donnel!Noire is kind of slow, so keep in mind she'll only hit 41 Speed as a Sniper. It's certainly still great (Galeforce, and you can go Armsthrift Sniper with Double Bow and other shenanigans), but you'll have to settle for a +Spd Pair Up without hitting 75 Speed, which is certainly still fine.

I'd recommend just running Sage with Laurent. Sage's superior offensive stat caps generally outweigh dark magic access. If you want to run VVDS+ with Lucina, Sage''s lower defense make it easier to set up (though if that's the case Lucina probably wouldn't be running Sniper).

Brady will just take whoever is leftover, this is kind of where marrying Virion bites you in the butt :P Kellam is prolly his best option left

[Admiral "Bull" Halsey]

For Gaius x Tharja, I don't know if having Counter for Noire would be beneficial (as a Sniper)...is it worth investing/grinding Gaius as a Warrior until he reach Lv. 15...? -_-

Edited May 29, 2015 by Formerly Colm

[Ownagepuffs]

Nope. Snipers are player phase nukes that shouldn't fight on enemy phase at all.

[Knusperkeks]

This is similar to how I went back and forth with Vascela about the same topic. You're bringing up the save points he did, too. I don't mean this in a bad way, of course. I think it's the polarizing nature of Sumia as a unit that makes it hard to agree on.

I wasn't aware such a debate took place. Thanks for clarifying. I still stand by my point that:

Chrom x Sumia. The in game and post game dominance is incredibly far above everything else. Except Chrom x Robin, but it's pretty close

Is an erroneous statement. I won't let you get away with the 'everyone has their own style' attempt at an excuse to diffuse the situation and drive it into a stalemate. The fact that I can bring up this many advantages Sully has over Sumia is a testament to that. You're trying to make it look like this:

Robin >> Sumia >>>>>>>>> Everyone else

When in fact it is like this:

Robin >> Everyone else.

[PM ME MARIANNE ART]

FeMU x Virion actually isn't a bad choice due to his base classes & mods. He's one of the better 1st gen Males for Apotheosis thanks to having 2 of the best -faires and Hit+20. If you're OK going Magical, +Mag/-Def are good for both FeMU & Virion @Sage, and allows Morgan to do.

Alternatively +Spd is solid if you want Morgan to be very fast, allowing him to run a variety of different classes.

Libra!Inigo can run physical if you want as well; his Str mod is still positive and just 1 less than his Mag. I'd recommend Sage for the damage output though, since you won't have room for 2 -faires and will just use Tomes for the most part anyways.

Lon'qu!Cordelia, as OwnagePuffs mentioned, mainly uses her incredible Speed mod to run Wyvern Lord with AS+2 and a Berserker Pair Up and still hit 75 Speed, or Hero with AS+2 to hit 75 Speed with any 0 Speed Pair Up.

As for Gaius!Kjelle, she can run the same set as Lon'qu!Severa with Wyvern Lord (requires AS+2), or can achieve 75 Speed without the AS+2 as Paladin, but still requires the Berserker Pair Up. Paladin is lower damage, but is nice for the +2 Spd Pair Up bonuses if you're running her with a Galeforce partner.

Donnel!Noire is kind of slow, so keep in mind she'll only hit 41 Speed as a Sniper. It's certainly still great (Galeforce, and you can go Armsthrift Sniper with Double Bow and other shenanigans), but you'll have to settle for a +Spd Pair Up without hitting 75 Speed, which is certainly still fine.

I'd recommend just running Sage with Laurent. Sage's superior offensive stat caps generally outweigh dark magic access. If you want to run VVDS+ with Lucina, Sage''s lower defense make it easier to set up (though if that's the case Lucina probably wouldn't be running Sniper).

Brady will just take whoever is leftover, this is kind of where marrying Virion bites you in the butt :P Kellam is prolly his best option left

Thanks for the help fam

So what about them being paired together? I feel like I have all magical guys and all physical girls. I'm not even sure how to pair them among each other. Gerome or Yarne will take Lucina, and then the other can be with one of the wyverns (Kjelle/Severa), and then Morgan can go physical or magical without a problem, but then all my other boys are sages (except Inigo may be a dread fighter but you get the idea). Then I only have Cynthia and Noire as Dark Fliers to accommodate them and the other two will be stuck with physical partners

Edit: Wait new idea. You said both wyvern lords would like berserkers as pair ups. So then I could do something like this

Dark Flier(?)!Lucina x Sage!Laurent (I think that's what class she should be for VVDS+)

Wyvern!Severa/Kjelle x Berserker!Gerome/Yarne

Sage!Owain x Dark Flier!Cynthia

Sage!Brady x Dark Flier!Noire

This seems solid, then Morgan could be a Wyvern (I believe with Virion and +Spd he could still hit 75) and he could be with Nah, however, that leave Inigo on his own and I'm not sure how to deal with that.

Edited May 29, 2015 by Luck Dancelot

[Czar_Yoshi]

Going with the assumption that I were to optimize for Nah and by extension Morgan from the start of a run, which would be the best asset and flaw to take? As a defensive character is it best to accentuate that, or mitigate the weaknesses in offense and speed as much as possible? With MaMU added to the list of fathers capable of proxy passing pegasus knight through fighter(?) class conversion you can round out all 3 that would need a specific father for GF.

It's hard to wrap my head around it all without a solid end goal, really. Trying to optimize for Apo. without even having the DLC yet (lel) is tricky. Kind of feeling like the powerful magic units would support as sages or DF, physical units as Berserkers, with rallies and staffers for movement and Sniper pairs for tricky enemies. Which child in which roles is a toughie, because a lot of them can do a lot of things. Offensive child core seems obvious, with any males that can't get GF getting aggressor and sitting in the back.

That means that pairs that maximize classes might be more important in the long run than mods, unless a child has everything already (Cynthia/Brady) and only needs maybe one thing to be optimal for a specific role. With Donnel!Kjelle, MaMU!Nah, and Gaius!Noire I can get three extra GF users, but at the cost of somewhat iffy mods on Kjelle. I guess I'll have to give it another look over.

OK, let's say you marry Nowi with the end goal of getting GF on all three of Kjelle, Nah and Noire, and you succeed. But because you married first gen, you have one more girl than you have boys, so you have to bench one... And because they all have GF, you have to bench one with GF. Now you've just lost any GF advantage you may have gained from picking Nowi.

This won't sink your team, but it's a big reason why people typically don't use Avatar x Nowi for optimization/minmaxing much anymore.

Maximizing classes is nice for playing around but at the end of the day any classes you have that you aren't either in or using a skill from aren't helping you. Prioritizing classes you're going to use is important- equally so to mod thresholds, because they determine what classes you'll be able to end in while being at maximum performance. Everything else is just extra (they still matter, just not as much).

Ingame only and from an efficiency perspective: There is no time to waste on useless children characters who are weaker than their parents. Lucina is one exception. Have you ever seen Quick Burn Lucina?

Fortunately, there are a good number of children who are stronger than their parents too, so I should be all set.

...I'm not quite sure what's so great about Sully!Lucina though. I've used her several times and she falls off hard once my Staves/Tomes/GF core gets rolling (much later than it should because her, her sister and her mother are all unable to contribute) by virtue of not being able to keep up. Quick Burn? It's a dodgetanking skill, and... Dodgetanking starts to fall off around where children show up thanks to forges and Hit+10. Definitely not as good as an early dodgetank *coughSumiacough*.

The draw of Chrom x Sully is pretty obviously the two chapter head start on Sumia in support, which combined with the +Def from Sully's Cav lets Chrom wreck face in Cht.5 and get much easier training for a strong start. It's all about that strong start, and once you hit midgame it's about making the best of what you have (still might be pretty good, not denying that) instead of transitioning into something better.

Responses to everyone else coming after I get to class.

Edited May 29, 2015 by Czar_Yoshi

[Knusperkeks]

By the time you set up your galeforce shenanigans, I'm already done with the game and can do something else.

Earlygame stability is all that matters. Quick Burn is good in that it lets you reliably hit lances, even with base Lucina. The fact that you believe I'm taking Quick Burn to try to avoid tank with a unit which has trash stats shows how clueless misguided you are.

Edited for political correctness.

Edited May 29, 2015 by Knusperkeks

[Czar_Yoshi]

Wow Knu, your Sully!Lucina needs inheritance to patch up her hitrate? That's not really selling me on her. At all.

You also might want to rethink your reason for playing the game if your only goal is to finish as fast as possible so you can do something else.

Thanks for the help fam

So what about them being paired together? I feel like I have all magical guys and all physical girls. I'm not even sure how to pair them among each other. Gerome or Yarne will take Lucina, and then the other can be with one of the wyverns (Kjelle/Severa), and then Morgan can go physical or magical without a problem, but then all my other boys are sages (except Inigo may be a dread fighter but you get the idea). Then I only have Cynthia and Noire as Dark Fliers to accommodate them and the other two will be stuck with physical partners

Edit: Wait new idea. You said both wyvern lords would like berserkers as pair ups. So then I could do something like this

Dark Flier(?)!Lucina x Sage!Laurent (I think that's what class she should be for VVDS+)

Wyvern!Severa/Kjelle x Berserker!Gerome/Yarne

Sage!Owain x Dark Flier!Cynthia

Sage!Brady x Dark Flier!Noire

This seems solid, then Morgan could be a Wyvern (I believe with Virion and +Spd he could still hit 75) and he could be with Nah, however, that leave Inigo on his own and I'm not sure how to deal with that.

Magical x magical and physical x physical is a nice way to keep it simple, but keep in mind that classes like Hero don't give any Str or Mag on pairup, so you could have them support either a physical or magical unit with the same performance.

Laurent will want to be a Sage. He can take or leave VV- I don't use it, myself- but his class will stay the same.

Gaius!Kjelle can also be a Paladin with similar performance to a Wyvern. You'll lose flight and 4 Str, but you gain 2 Spd so you can take off All+2 (so -2 more Str) and hit the same Spd threshold, letting you use both Luna and Astra. There's no strictly superior option, it's a matter of taste.

The one thing to watch out for with male Wyverns is that they don't have room for All+2 (because of Agg) and they can't S with Berserkers. In Morgan-M's case, he'll need +7 Spd (Spd asset) and a Hero/Bow Knight support to hit 75. Nah can do that best with Vaike as her father (Axefaire inheritance).

Inigo should be Kjelle's husband over Gerome. You'll get more bang for your buck that way. He's Chrom!Inigo, right?

Edited May 29, 2015 by Czar_Yoshi

[Knusperkeks]

She doesn't need it. It pushes her over the top to the point at which she can annihilate enemies even with weapon triangle disadvantage. The context here is efficiency. That has been established a few pages ago. Learn to read.

[Integrity]

knock it off

EDIT: by "it" i mean the pointless insults, not the debate, lol

EDIT2: i mean, i guess the suspension is going to knock off the debate too somewhat

Edited May 29, 2015 by Integrity

[PM ME MARIANNE ART]

Magical x magical and physical x physical is a nice way to keep it simple, but keep in mind that classes like Hero don't give any Str or Mag on pairup, so you could have them support either a physical or magical unit with the same performance.

Laurent will want to be a Sage. He can take or leave VV- I don't use it, myself- but his class will stay the same.

Gaius!Kjelle can also be a Paladin with similar performance to a Wyvern. You'll lose flight and 4 Str, but you gain 2 Spd so you can take off All+2 (so -2 more Str) and hit the same Spd threshold, letting you use both Luna and Astra. There's no strictly superior option, it's a matter of taste.

The one thing to watch out for with male Wyverns is that they don't have room for All+2 (because of Agg) and they can't S with Berserkers. In Morgan-M's case, he'll need +7 Spd (Spd asset) and a Hero/Bow Knight support to hit 75. Nah can do that best with Vaike as her father (Axefaire inheritance).

Inigo should be Kjelle's husband over Gerome. You'll get more bang for your buck that way. He's Chrom!Inigo, right?

Inigo in this setup is Libra!Inigo. So that would leave

Lucina x Laurent

Owain x Cynthia

Brady x Noire

Kjelle x Inigo

Severa x Yarne (In theory, could those two be swapped? I mean Severa and Kjelle are so similar that would it matter which one is married to which?)

Morgan x Nah

That leaves Gerome unpaired. Also, Wyvern Lord Virion!Morgan only hits 44 speed, so would he be able to hit 75 speed with the +7 from Nah? If he doesn't, he could be a Berserker with 50 speed, but that leaves him with a movement problem. To fix that, would he want to have deliverer, or would I just slap boots on him?

[Vascela]

I've never really had any Lucina fall off (and Sully x Chrom still stand as a strong galeforceless pair even after Lucina is recruited). [When you get back from class], what were your main drawbacks on falling?

[Czar_Yoshi]

Well, I guess that's that.

Inigo in this setup is Libra!Inigo. So that would leave

Lucina x Laurent

Owain x Cynthia

Brady x Noire

Kjelle x Inigo

Severa x Yarne (In theory, could those two be swapped? I mean Severa and Kjelle are so similar that would it matter which one is married to which?)

Morgan x Nah

That leaves Gerome unpaired. Also, Wyvern Lord Virion!Morgan only hits 44 speed, so would he be able to hit 75 speed with the +7 from Nah? If he doesn't, he could be a Berserker with 50 speed, but that leaves him with a movement problem. To fix that, would he want to have deliverer, or would I just slap boots on him?

44 Spd? Have you got a Mag/Res flaw? He should have 45 (38+7+10+10+8+2 =75), and Hero Nah will give +8 total.

If you need a bit more Spd and don't want to sacrifice your Mov, that's what Paladin is for.

Severa and Kjelle's husbands are pretty swappable. The only reason you wouldn't want to is if Kjelle is a Paladin and her +Spd bonus lets Inigo hit a threshold (he's a galeboy so he'll be coming up front, Yarne never will). Of course, a Wyvern with All+2 will have much stronger Dual Strikes than a Paladin without, so there's a good reason to give the Galeboy a Wyvern too. Yeah, you can swap them however you like.

You do get two pairs of Boots and there's no benefit to keeping them unused. If you have enough 8-Mov units that you can use them to get your entire team to 8 Mov, I recommend using them that way. If you can't and will have 6-Mov units regardless, then just use them on units you'll want to be using more often (probably double Galepairs and/or AT units).

I've never really had any Lucina fall off (and Sully x Chrom still stand as a strong galeforceless pair even after Lucina is recruited). [When you get back from class], what were your main drawbacks on falling?

Once I got her into Wyvern the loss of P.Falchion hit her and she was stuck with nothing but Silver Lances to attack with. Usually I send her to Dark Flier (even though she already has GF) for the flying Tomes, but now was stuck with just Silver Lances and Javelins (wasn't using Spotpass on this run, so no Spears). She was still able to get picks well but eventually just fell behind and I transitioned her to a support. She hit Lv.15 around Cht.22 anyway (so her stats were pretty good) but I didn't really know what to do with her after that because she lacks all my usual ending classes, so I just put her back into Paladin for endgame.

She didn't do bad, per se, and still got two promoted reclasses. She just didn't do as well as I expect Lucina to do (she's usually one of my best units). If there's some other ending class I'm overlooking that makes her much better, please let me know (I know Wyverns are usually good but when I use them they're always begging for Falco supports and Kjelle was unable to fulfill that role).

Kjelle herself was mostly my fault for thinking maybe Swordmaster would work this time around, but I doubt she'd do better than Lucina even if they both got proper treatment.

Edited May 29, 2015 by Czar_Yoshi

[burgerkong]

Thanks for the help fam

So what about them being paired together? I feel like I have all magical guys and all physical girls. I'm not even sure how to pair them among each other. Gerome or Yarne will take Lucina, and then the other can be with one of the wyverns (Kjelle/Severa), and then Morgan can go physical or magical without a problem, but then all my other boys are sages (except Inigo may be a dread fighter but you get the idea). Then I only have Cynthia and Noire as Dark Fliers to accommodate them and the other two will be stuck with physical partners

Edit: Wait new idea. You said both wyvern lords would like berserkers as pair ups. So then I could do something like this

Dark Flier(?)!Lucina x Sage!Laurent (I think that's what class she should be for VVDS+)

Wyvern!Severa/Kjelle x Berserker!Gerome/Yarne

Sage!Owain x Dark Flier!Cynthia

Sage!Brady x Dark Flier!Noire

This seems solid, then Morgan could be a Wyvern (I believe with Virion and +Spd he could still hit 75) and he could be with Nah, however, that leave Inigo on his own and I'm not sure how to deal with that.

EDIT: Was late to the party LOL but I'll leave this here anyways

Because you married 1st gen, one of the kids is gonna be forever alone. That's just an unfortunate fact. Gerome will just have to sit it out, which is unfortunate. In that case, give Henry to Brady I guess, since Gerome's not going to be doing anything?

Lucina can certainly run Dark Flier, but Sniper x Sage is still pretty good too, and Sumia!Lucina is fast enough that she hits 69 Speed (doubling up to Helswath Berserkers) with a Sage partner.

If you want to run Dark Flier Lucina, I'd honestly recommend giving her Brady and giving Laurent to Noire, since Noire's performance as the Support is going to be worse due to lacking Tomefaire.

Everything else is great :D

With regards to the Wyvern Lord x Berserker thing, it's because Wyvern Lords have lower SPD caps, so the extra +8 SPD granted by Berserkers is pretty handy, and the damage output is insane thanks to Berserkers' +10 STR and both class' high STR caps.

Assuming Severa is running AS+2, she'll hit 75 Speed (43 base + 2 (AS+2) + 10 (Limit Breaker) + 10 (rallies) + 2 (tonics) + 8 (Pair Up) = 75), allowing her to double everything in Apotheosis. DS% will be a little low, but realistically you still kill most things even if you whiff one.

Edited May 29, 2015 by burgerkong

[Vascela]

I'm not one to complain about only using Silvers lol. I've never tried bow knight/sniper, but I've heard success there (regardless of Lucina's mother). I suppose your route depends on how long you want to stay in a base class. Going Lord > Cavalier > Promoted or Lord > Great Lord > Promoted.

Wyvern Lord also fairs better if she has Discipline (inherited or through Cavalier). I tend to stick to Chrom's class selection even over dark flier though. Paladin and Bow Knight seem to be the safest picks, with Wyvern Lord (or Sumia's Dark flier) being more aggressive picks.