Bunselpower Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 The main appeal of Lon'qu!Severa over Virion!Severa is that the 1 extra speed allows you to hit 50 SPD as a Hero with AS+2, and grants Swordfaire to use as Hero. That's pretty much it; by comparison Virion also grants Archer (for a Sniper build, or potential BK) & Tomefaire. In the end though, Virion's just generally more coveted as a father compared to Lon'qu. Lon'qu doesn't give a proc (so not good for Owain or Inigo) and doesn't give +Hit skills (so not good for Gerome or Yarne), which heavily limits his options. Perfect, that is exactly what I was looking for. Then I have no problem moving Lon'qu elsewhere. Probably Laurent, maybe give Gregor to someone else. But who... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burgerkong Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 Perfect, that is exactly what I was looking for. Then I have no problem moving Lon'qu elsewhere. Probably Laurent, maybe give Gregor to someone else. But who... Gregor's unfortunately kind of limited as a father. No procs (so not Owain, Inigo, Nah) or +Hit skills (not Yarne). So his ideal children already have a proc and are not hard supports. Gregor!Brady is also a solid option if you REALLY want a physical Brady. Gregor!Noire or Gregor!Kjelle are also fine as options for non-GF females. Kjelle has better Speed (45 as a Hero for example) while Noire has a niche Double Bow Sniper thing if you want to do that (though her SPD kinda sucks). Gregor!Gerome was a popular one for Berserker & Armsthrift, but he lacks any +Hit Skills that Gerome wants so badly, forcing you to run Dual Support+ & breakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 Gregor!Gerome was a popular one for Berserker & Armsthrift, but he lacks any +Hit Skills that Gerome wants so badly, forcing you to run Dual Support+ & breakers. Technically Gerome always has tantivy, so if you're careful about placement you can always use that. But another great use for Gregor is as a Grandfather for Yarne!Morgan. Both Morgan and Yarne will make awesome assassins and achieve 100% DS if you do +Skl for Robin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PM ME MARIANNE ART Posted June 17, 2015 Author Share Posted June 17, 2015 How do these look? Sumia!Lucina @ Sniper (GF, Luna, Aether, DS+) X Virion!Yarne @ Berserker (Hit+20, Axefaire, Aggressor, Deliverer) Sumia!Cynthia @ Sniper (GF, Luna, Aether, Bowfaire) X Ricken!Owain @ Sage (GF, Luna, Aggressor, Tomefaire) Donnel!Noire @ Sniper (GF, Luna, Bowfaire, AT) X Speed!Avatar @ Assassin (AT, Luna, Swordfaire, Aggressor) Stahl!Severa @ Sniper (GF, Luna, Bowfaire, AT) X Gregor!Laurent @ Sage (AT, Aggressor, Anathema, Tomefaire) Say'ri!Morgan @ Bride (GF, Ignis, Lancefaire, AT) X Libra!Inigo @ Dread Fighter (GF, Aggressor, Astra, AT) Vaike!Nah @ Hero (AT, Axefaire, Luna, Deliverer) X Lon'qu!Brady @ Sage (GF, Luna, Aggressor, Tomefaire) Gaius!Kjelle @ Wyvern Lord (GF, Luna, Lancefaire, AS+2) X Henry!Gerome @ Berserker (Anathema, Axefaire, Aggressor, Deliverer) It's rather boring in terms of classes (I like snipers), but I think it works. Opinions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burgerkong Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 Technically Gerome always has tantivy, so if you're careful about placement you can always use that. But another great use for Gregor is as a Grandfather for Yarne!Morgan. Both Morgan and Yarne will make awesome assassins and achieve 100% DS if you do +Skl for Robin. I always forget about Tantivity :P As for Gregor!Yarne, it's a solid option if you're going for a niche 100% DS team setup, but Virion!Yarne achieves the same SKL, has access to Bowfaire, & improves Morgan's SPD. Obviously Virion is in higher demand as well, but he's better if he's available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) How do these look? Sumia!Lucina @ Sniper (GF, Luna, Aether, DS+) X Virion!Yarne @ Berserker (Hit+20, Axefaire, Aggressor, Deliverer) Sumia!Cynthia @ Sniper (GF, Luna, Aether, Bowfaire) X Ricken!Owain @ Sage (GF, Luna, Aggressor, Tomefaire) Donnel!Noire @ Sniper (GF, Luna, Bowfaire, AT) X Speed!Avatar @ Assassin (AT, Luna, Swordfaire, Aggressor) Stahl!Severa @ Sniper (GF, Luna, Bowfaire, AT) X Gregor!Laurent @ Sage (AT, Aggressor, Anathema, Tomefaire) Say'ri!Morgan @ Bride (GF, Ignis, Lancefaire, AT) X Libra!Inigo @ Dread Fighter (GF, Aggressor, Astra, AT) Vaike!Nah @ Hero (AT, Axefaire, Luna, Deliverer) X Lon'qu!Brady @ Sage (GF, Luna, Aggressor, Tomefaire) Gaius!Kjelle @ Wyvern Lord (GF, Luna, Lancefaire, AS+2) X Henry!Gerome @ Berserker (Anathema, Axefaire, Aggressor, Deliverer) It's rather boring in terms of classes (I like snipers), but I think it works. Opinions? There is no concievable situation in which that deliverer would be useful on Gerome. He'd have the exact same movement as Kjelle. Replace it with AS+2. Also, you'll probably be seeing better and more stable damage on Kjelle if you replace Lancefaire with Astra and just use axes. Otherwise it looks okay. Edited June 17, 2015 by Alastor15243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 I've never used Stahl!Nah before, so what's a good build? She'll want to be a Paladin or Sniper, taking advantage of Stahl's Luna/Astra procstack inheritance. If you pair her with a +3 Spd class (Berserker/Hero/BK), she'll hit 75 in those classes when up front without All+2. Her last skillslot is empty because of no GF, so you can run something like Deliverer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 She'll want to be a Paladin or Sniper, taking advantage of Stahl's Luna/Astra procstack inheritance. If you pair her with a +3 Spd class (Berserker/Hero/BK), she'll hit 75 in those classes when up front without All+2. Her last skillslot is empty because of no GF, so you can run something like Deliverer. Pretty sure you're mistaken. Stahl!Nah has 39 speed as a paladin or sniper, a +5 speed bonus would get her to SIXTY NINE speed, not 75. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 Yeah, that's what I meant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurningCandy Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 How would these go? Greg x Sully Fred x Sully Kellam x Sully Libra x Olivia Stahl x Olivia Virion x Olivia MU x Olivia MU x Anna FeMU x Libra FeMU x Inigo Henry x Tharja Stahl x Tharja Ricken x Tharja Ricken x Miriel Lon'qu x Miriel Henry x Miriel Virion x Cherche Gregor x Cherche Virion x Nowi Donnel x Nowi Gregor x Nowi Libra x Nowi Ricken x Nowi Chrom x Sumia Chrom x Maribelle Chrom x Olivia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 None of Sully's options are that great. Gregor is the best. Libra and Stahl both work very well with Olivia. Inigo is the better Avatar-F pairing, Olivia is the better Avatar-M pairing. Ricken is Tharja's best option there. Miriel can take any of them and be fine, but Henry contributes the least and is probably better elsewhere. Both of those will work great for Cherche. I like Virion slightly more. Nowi will be fine with Donnel, Gregor or Ricken, but none of them are her top choice. All of Chrom's options are great, but Sumia is the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunselpower Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 So for someone like Yarne or Gerome, how much does he need his hit rate boosted? Obviously it's situational, but are we talking on the scale of 20+ or something closer to 10? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 So for someone like Yarne or Gerome, how much does he need his hit rate boosted? Obviously it's situational, but are we talking on the scale of 20+ or something closer to 10? 20 is preferable, 10 is acceptable. So the most popular one is Hit+20 followed by Anathema, and then when all else fails, Tantivy. Only Yarne can get Hit+20 and Berserker, Anathema's easier to get, and both Yarne and Gerome can get Tantivy no matter who their father is (though Yarne has to inherit it). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 It's less of how much he needs it boosted and more of what number does he want to hit. 220 will give you 100% on all non-bosses in S.Apo, and you'll need to be a bit higher (257 iirc) for 100% on all bosses. Weapon Triangle matters too, though, and 100% Hit still doesn't guarantee dual strikes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunselpower Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 OK, so really any boost is a big help. The reason I ask is I don't know whether to use Stahl on nah or Yarne. I'm leaning toward Yarne, but those classes would be no joke on nah. The biggest difference I see is Yarne gets berserker axe faire, which makes much better use of hit plus 20, and while imperfect, nah gets slow and quick burn, so she can take someone else. Then comes me trying to get Henry off Gerome to put him on Owain, but that may not happen. Plus my Lon'qu Gregor decision. Oh well, I love this aspect of the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 But Nah's Skl and weapon type are likely to be better than Yarne's, so she's closer to the threshold. If you use Stahl on her, she probably won't be running Hit+20. Burns are really bad in Apo, by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunselpower Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 But Nah's Skl and weapon type are likely to be better than Yarne's, so she's closer to the threshold. If you use Stahl on her, she probably won't be running Hit+20. Burns are really bad in Apo, by the way. Oh there's probably no way nah gets that much facetime in apo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azz Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 So um, what would be a good set up for Virion!Gerome who would marry Gregor!Nah? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 So um, what would be a good set up for Virion!Gerome who would marry Gregor!Nah? The bench Honestly, those two would not be seeing much action thanks to neither of them having galeforce. They'll want to pair up with people who do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azz Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 I know, but more for ingame rather then endgame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 (edited) I know, but more for ingame rather then endgame. Virion'll wanna pass Hit+20 probably, and then Gerome is gonna want to be a hero as soon as possible, because that gives absolutely perfect pairup bonuses to support a manakete in-game. I can think of more ideal in-game partners though. As for Nah, yeah, she'll want to stay a manakete, because there's very little reason why a manakete would ever want to stop being a manakete in-game. Edited June 18, 2015 by Alastor15243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral "Bull" Halsey Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 (edited) Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't Virion!Gerome only good for just passing down Bowbreaker (for a full-breaker set)? Just curious. Edit @ Alastor15243: Thank you good sir! Edited June 18, 2015 by Formerly Colm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunselpower Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 What is the role of vantage in optimizing? Should you strive for one on each lead? One on each backup? It seems like a good skill to have on one member of a pair, but maybe not one worth fretting over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 (edited) What is the role of vantage in optimizing? Should you strive for one on each lead? One on each backup? It seems like a good skill to have on one member of a pair, but maybe not one worth fretting over. In-game, it's largely useless on anyone who doesn't have vengeance, so don't bother with it if you can't get both. In apotheosis, don't bother with it at all, there are much better loadouts to use. Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't Virion!Gerome only good for just passing down Bowbreaker (for a full-breaker set)? Just curious. Actually the main use is to give Gerome a faire, bowfaire, to use with his warrior class. At least in postgame. Having four of the five breaker skills sounds cool, but he has no need to have all those skills if he stays in the back, ingame he's not getting all of those skills, and postgame it's a massive waste of skill slots when there are better ways to consistently boost accuracy. Edited June 18, 2015 by Alastor15243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunselpower Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 So does that mean that Stahl Gerome with Hit +20 and bow faire as a warrior could be as good as Henry Gerome considering he bypasses the wt? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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