FionordeQuester Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) I'm always curious about these things, because as someone who's a bit of a writer himself, I always like hearing about the differences between two versions of something, whether it's WHAT was said that was changed, or rather the WAY something was said that got changed. For example, when hearing Gangrel talk, there's a heck of a difference between, say, whatever Gangrel said ... "I will crush them like I crush glass!" ...and... "I will break them as easily as I break wind!" Both lines have the same meaning, but one is obviously WAY more hammy and stupid than the other one. Not that I'm saying that the first line is what Gangrel said in the Japanese version (I don't know what it was), but I'm guessing it was something else...probably something much less silly. Anyways, I actually really like the dialogue for this game. It's clear to me that whoever localized this game had a really good sense of humor, and outside of a few stupid moments here and there (Gangrel breaking wind and the like), seems to have done at least a decent job of localizing this game. And I'm firmly of the belief that sometimes the English version of a story/game is better BECAUSE liberties were taken rather than in spite of that fact (for example, Black Knight's survival from FE9 to FE10 was a heck of a lot less stupid in the English version than the Japanese version). But, then, I don't know for sure. Basically, what I'm asking is, was this localization done in the style I'm thinking of? Where it's probably not word-for-word, had some liberties here and there, and also had a lot more jokes than in the Japanese version (I'm almost certain Gangrel, for as silly as he is, wasn't talking about how easily he could break wind in the Japanese version)? Or was it more like FE11, which seemed like a fairly word-for-word translation, but just with much fancier dialogue? Edited January 15, 2014 by FionordeQuester Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Well, not sure if much beats: "SEE HOW MY MUSTACHE BLOWS IN THE WIND!" in all honesty. I also think the localizers had a hard-on for Medieval style-isms in the vein of George R.R. Martin. (Chrom says "seven hells" in EXPonential Growth, and the characters refer to underpants as smallclothes, etc. Theres a lot of stuff like that in the game that im sure isnt worded that way in the Japanese version.) Rey has spoken of some personality tweaks that were either expanded on in the English version or embellished. Henry seems to be a lot less into being hilariously morbid in the Japanese version for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) http://fe-according-to-japan.tumblr.com/ If you want interesting insights on localization changes, I suggest you follow that tumblr. ...which you probably already do, seeing as you got the "wind jokes". As described by that same blog, accurately IMHO, is that "The localization prizes entertainment value over rigid adherence to characterization". Which definitely gives more of an appeal to a wider audience. It was done very well, and as such, had a bigger following than say... a strict "word for word" localization. For more info, look up "Woolseyism"... it's a trope ya know. Elitist weebs like myself are just going to have to suck it up. Edited January 15, 2014 by shadowofchaos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Book Bro Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 It's clear to me that whoever localized this game had a really good sense of humor, and outside of a few stupid moments here and there (Gangrel breaking wind and the like), seems to have done at least a decent job of localizing this game. Totally agree with this. I do recall some arguments arose when people found out Henry's supports with Olivia were changed significantly to alter his backstory. Some preferred the changes while others absolutely hated them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoNameAtAll Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Hey, Gangrel breaking wind is amazing and y'all know it. Solidifies the Gangrel = Joker comparisons I've seen, even if Gangrel didn't do anything as heinous as the Joker did with Tim Drake in that flashback in Batman Beyond... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionordeQuester Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 Yeah, I thought of using Woosleysism, but I wasn't sure enough people would be familiar with that term. Also, as much as I praised the localization...that HenryXOliva support...DANG! NoA just RUINED that character, didn't they?! They literally changed him from a legitimately tragic guy, to a GAG character! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I'd say the only place where localization encounters significant challenges, is when the setting of the game takes place in Japan. As in what happened in the Phoenix Wright series. From Awkward Zombie Traditional American Kotatsu. EAT YOUR HAMBURGERS, APOLLO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Odinson Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I think given what they got to work with the localizers overall did a good enough job. There's a few things that could've been handled better, but it's pretty hard having to deal with the cultural differences and difficulties with translating the nuances of Japanese speech patterns (or so that's what I've gathered from hanging around Rey) so I'm not going to be hard on them for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sifer Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 "I will break them as easily as I break wind!" - Gangrel I love it when translators have a sense of humor... the more Scooby Doo references in Japanese games the better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionordeQuester Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 Wait, that was a Scooby Doo reference?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Wait, that was a Scooby Doo reference?! See: Harvest Scramble DLC. Miriel x Sumia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJWalker Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) You know, I actually prefer the localized version of Henry over the Japanese one. Far too many 'sociopathic' characters these days get turned into Stepford Smilers. It's way too overdone. Why not have a character who genuinely enjoys stuff like blood and death on the good guys side? Another thing I really enjoy is the way the characters talk using medieval mannerisms. They may not be as widely used as in FE11 but definitely done well. In FE11, characters like Julian or Navarre speaking in the same way as Caeda or Jagen seems strange but in FE13, for the most part, the way characters talk match their personalities and the ones who speak in that medieval tone are the ones who are suited to it. Stuff like 'Chrom's Vigilantes -> The Shepherds' is also brilliant. How the hell are the members of a group led by the Prince of the country (and having the complete support the queen too) 'vigilantes' in any way? Gangrel is brillliant. I'm not sure how Walhart is in the Japanese version but he's great too. Love the localized names on the legacy characters as well. There are a few baffling ones like 'Raquesis' but a couple of bad ones don't ruin anything for me. The overall polish for this game is also great. Aside from the plot, I actually really like this game. Edited January 15, 2014 by Ranger Jack Walker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RightfulGod Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Mm, the localization was alright, and I really like how they implemented some of the jokes in. But even then, I still don't really like how Henry was done. I dunno, seeing the way he acted in the Jap version was much more appealing to me because I felt like he actually cared a lot more. The most worst culprit is probably the dialogue parts after Endgame, and well.... I'm not quite sure how to explain it, but I definitely like Japanese Henry more. I still love his character regardless, I just felt they could have cut back on his gimmick. Oh well, just my two cents. So all in all, I feel pretty indifferent towards the localization... A lot could have been done better, but there's not much for me to complain about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) Stuff like 'Chrom's Vigilantes -> The Shepherds' is also brilliant. How the hell are the members of a group led by the Prince of the country (and having the complete support the queen too) 'vigilantes' in any way? That's the thing with describing the JPN names in English... it just doesn't work. General words in the language work in that language, because it's in that language. "Jikeidan" doesn't need a name, nor does it have to fit in the translation of "vigilante". Moreso on the line of "A group that moves according to its own will". I mean even one of the localization team members described the Shepherds as "Ylisse's vigilante group called the Shepherds" or something like that in an early trailer. The completely new word Ylisse still bothers the hell out of me, considering all the rainbow and flower references. Edited January 15, 2014 by shadowofchaos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionordeQuester Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) But even then, I still don't really like how Henry was done. I dunno, seeing the way he acted in the Jap version was much more appealing to me because I felt like he actually cared a lot more. The most worst culprit is probably the dialogue parts after Endgame, and well.... I'm not quite sure how to explain it, but I definitely like Japanese Henry more. I still love his character regardless, I just felt they could have cut back on his gimmick. The problem for me in regards to the English version is that Henry comes off as basically not human. He's a psychopath who is seemingly without emotions. Combine that with how he does things like licking his own blood, and well...the guy's dialogue can be just plain unpleasant to read when he's not making humorous puns ("Usually I just disarm them by removing their arms!"). With the Japanese version, it seems to me like he still has some of that, but he has other qualities that actually make him human as well, therefore making him more interesting, and, in my opinion, more pleasant to read... I mean, hey, if the localization team wants to talk about how battlefields would become "boringfields" without any violence, go right ahead! That was funny! But...I don't think you need to go as far as to change his personality, especially if he was actually sympathetic before, you know? Edited January 15, 2014 by FionordeQuester Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) The problem for me in regards to the English version is that Henry comes off as basically not human. He's a psychopath who is seemingly without emotions. Combine that with how he does things like licking his own blood, and well...the guy's dialogue can be just plain unpleasant to read when he's not making humorous puns ("Usually I just disarm them by removing their arms!"). With the Japanese version, it seems to me like he still has some of that, but he has other qualities that actually make him human as well, therefore making him more interesting, and, in my opinion, more pleasant to read... I mean, hey, if the localization team wants to talk about how battlefields would become "boringfields" without any violence, go right ahead! That was funny! But...I don't think you need to go as far as to change his personality, especially if he was actually sympathetic before, you know? If I read supports of the likes of Henry, it's usually not him I consider inhuman. Lack of empathy, sadism and cruelty are things that really exist among humans. What I find harder to believe is that people who supposedly have empathy would treat him like his behavior is nothing out of the ordinary and even marry him. That is what really creeps me out. You don't even need empathy in order for this behavior not to make sense. It's a basic survival instinct. While Henry might have a backstory that explains his behavior, it does very little to justify how everyone else treats him. What trauma did they suffer in order to think that Henry behaves like a normal human being who poses no treat? Quite frankly, I prefer if the localization doesn't even pretend he is anything but a comic relief character and nothing that happens during his supports his to be taken seriously. Edited January 15, 2014 by BrightBow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionordeQuester Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) If I read supports of the likes of Henry, it's usually not him I consider inhuman. Lack of empathy, sadism and cruelty are things that really exist among humans. What I find harder to believe is that people who supposedly have empathy would treat him like his behavior is nothing out of the ordinary and even marry him. That is what really creeps me out. ...Do they really do that? Reading up on his supports for my own thread, it seemed like everyone was weirded out by his behavior to some degree. It's just that they were able to get over it, one way or the other. Edited January 15, 2014 by FionordeQuester Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) ...Do they really do that? Reading up on his supports for my own thread, it seemed like everyone was weirded out by his behavior to some degree. It's just that they were able to get over it, one way or the other. Well, Lissa's irritation last for about 2 lines until the end of their B support and is immediately forgotten afterwards. Other characters deal with it even faster. How does Sully react when she finds out that Henry almost killed her with a curse? "You're crazy! But I'm even crazier for having asked for the damn thing... So wait a second. What do you mean about the first curses not taking? Does that have to do with strength or willpower or something?" And so the topic has already moved somewhere else. Needless to say, not only was she minutes away from dying but he only stopped the curse because she was actively asking it. He would have snuffed out her life and she knows it. I don't have all supports, so maybe you know any that shows a bit more then brief surprise that gets quickly forgotten but all I saw have the others just happily hanging out with this psycho like he is such a pleasant company. It's the same with Tharja. She curses Stahl in her B support. What is his first line in their A support? "Hey, Tharja. Whatcha doing with that big crystal orb?" As if the previous conversation that ended with him fleeing the scene never happened. Frederick's supports with them are also fun since it applies to both of them. He only cares that these two are making their exercises and even ignores it when they directly curse him. And he is the same guy who was accusing the Avatar of being a Plegian spy just because there was no evidence to the contrary. But the two evil Plegian mages who abuse him and the rest of the party are for him somehow beyond suspicion. Edited January 15, 2014 by BrightBow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I guess another nitpick I'd have is the thesaurus usage. I'm pretty sure when the demo came out, I wasn't the only one that had to look up "halidom". Or "Id" to find out that it's pronounced like the "id" in "acid". "I" sounds more... umm... romantic-ish? "The journey to find one's self"? ...that or maybe I'm just salty from them taking out the pun "I"ntroduction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJWalker Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Miriel though... Yeah, that's definitely way too much. You don't need to have a character spam obscure words to make them sound smart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) The one thing I love best about the localization is that my favorite character in the game references the president of Nintendo of America himself. :3 Frederick: My body is ready, Avatar! The next sample, if you please! Only Frederick is worthy of speaking the same words as the great Reggie Fils-Aime! Edited January 15, 2014 by Anacybele Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) Miriel though... Yeah, that's definitely way too much. You don't need to have a character spam obscure words to make them sound smart. In Japanese, while she does sound smart... she doesn't use speech patterns and vocabulary that people wouldn't be able to figure out... As in, while they might not know how to pronounce the word, the kanji is meaning based... and they'd know what she was saying. It's complex... but not *THAT* complex. In depth: Allow me to ameliorate your erudition. Edited January 15, 2014 by shadowofchaos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionordeQuester Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) Everything you said Brightbow While that may be the case, again, to WHAT extent was Henry exaggerated in the localization? That's the question we need to ask ourselves. Because in those supports, he may have, again, been more...normal, in the Japanese version, hence why people put up with him. Also, that thing with Frederick and Tharja...yeah, I thought that was kind of odd too, especially when he didn't make anything of Tharja constantly stalking Robin, their tactician. I'm thinking you just have to assume that her supports with Frederick took place after she'd already been around for a while. Edited January 15, 2014 by FionordeQuester Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Manic Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Miriel though... Yeah, that's definitely way too much. You don't need to have a character spam obscure words to make them sound smart. In Miriel's case, I'd argue it's not for the purpose of making her sound smart but making her awkwardly difficult for other characters to understand and relate to. And it's successful at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Book of Ereshkigal Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) I guess another nitpick I'd have is the thesaurus usage. I'm pretty sure when the demo came out, I wasn't the only one that had to look up "halidom". I don't get this, I figured the word was related to "to Hail" as in you hail from somewhere fancy essentally? Or did I make that up lol Edited January 15, 2014 by L95 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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