metalsnowman3 Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 i believe tiki says to you that you have power like mine at least in english could be different in the original japanese writing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuxSpes Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 i believe tiki says to you that you have power like mine at least in english could be different in the original japanese writing It's definitely 'you have power like mine' in english And I think it refers to the fact that both of them are linked closely to one of the 2 dragons. Tiki of the Voice of Naga and can even replace her is she was to die while the Avatar is Grima's Vessel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Void Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 (edited) I'm sure the Heart of Grima is the Fell Dragon's soul or essence or (if Grima is from a fusion of the Earth Dragons) the lead soul or essence or the part of the Fell Dragon that gives what came about after the fusion direction. Edited February 1, 2014 by The Void Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceBrand Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Yeah, but how did characters end up with Grima's blood? We're not given any explanation, not even theb are minimum that we got regarding Bishop Galle or whatshisname. Maybe some of the avatar's previous ancestor were Earth Dragon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamicsat Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Maybe some of the avatar's previous ancestor were Earth Dragon? If that were the case, then we would have to explain either a.) how the Earth Dragons were unsealed by Naga, or escaped her seal, or b.) how Medeus found the time to get down and dirty with a human in his two brief visits to Archanea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airship Canon Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 If that were the case, then we would have to explain either a.) how the Earth Dragons were unsealed by Naga, or escaped her seal, or b.) how Medeus found the time to get down and dirty with a human in his two brief visits to Archanea. Or c.) There's already a fool with some Earth Dragon Blood that people keep forgetting about, despite the fact that you will know him if you've played the Jugdral games, because every time he shows up he makes your life hell. Who also happens to live, and is never implied to be chaste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceBrand Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 If that were the case, then we would have to explain either a.) how the Earth Dragons were unsealed by Naga, or escaped her seal, or b.) how Medeus found the time to get down and dirty with a human in his two brief visits to Archanea. If the grimeal were breading for a perfect vessel for Grima, that must mean somewhere along the line someone obtained Earth Dragon DNA. This could be from a human mating with an Earth Dragon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 If the grimeal were breading for a perfect vessel for Grima, that must mean somewhere along the line someone obtained Earth Dragon DNA. This could be from a human mating with an Earth Dragon. Fire Emblem doesn't have DNA, it has holy blood, and that can be transferred/bestowed in events like the Miracle of Darna. Considering that Awakening already has a precedent for inter-world travel (Ike/Priam) and Genealogy definitely happened before Awakening, I think there's a good change that said fool could be the source of the Grima blood. Two problems: why does the symbol on the brand change (developer oversight), and would the devs really intentionally include that subtle of a reference when they left so many plot holes that are so much larger in the game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Void Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Loptyr made a blood pact with a human. Why couldn't Grima do it too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 The main problem with Grima making the blood pact is that all the Earth Dragons are sealed away and insane. In order to make a blood pact with Grima, you'd have to a) let them out, and b) have him be rational enough to actually make the blood pact and not just eat you on the spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Void Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 (edited) What about Medeus? Going from his death speech in the Dragon's Table he should be there with the other Earth Dragons and he was able to speak as a Shadow Dragon. If Grima really did come from a fusion of all the sealed Earth Dragons then he would part of the fusion. Edited February 2, 2014 by The Void Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 While Medeus retained his sanity up until Shadow Dragon, his speech patterns change visibly across SD and Mystery as the games progress, which could be taken as evidence that his resumption of his Earth Dragon form is causing him to go insane, as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJWalker Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 I'm confused why everyone thinks Grima is a fusion of the earth dragons. Why would they just fuse? How would they just fuse? Why and how would the sealed sleeping dragons just become one entity? They're never implied to have this ability. If anything, the more likely answer to why the earth dragons are absent is that the writers simply forgot. This happens in all forms of media. Blizzard regularly forgets its own lore and comes up with shit on the go and then says "Oops, well that old info is no longer canon, this new stuff is." They constantly screw up and retcon things which is one of the reasons I gave up on following their lore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 (edited) I'm confused why everyone thinks Grima is a fusion of the earth dragons. Why would they just fuse? How would they just fuse? Why and how would the sealed sleeping dragons just become one entity? They're never implied to have this ability. If anything, the more likely answer to why the earth dragons are absent is that the writers simply forgot. This happens in all forms of media. Blizzard regularly forgets its own lore and comes up with shit on the go and then says "Oops, well that old info is no longer canon, this new stuff is." They constantly screw up and retcon things which is one of the reasons I gave up on following their lore. But the orbs are in this game (despite them all having different names now). I find it hard to imagine that IS remembered those but forgot their actual purpose. And as far as fusions go, Awakening does imply as much. Grima wants to fuse with Robin... instead of simply fusing with the big black dragon directly but that's the usual Awakening logic. The point is, that this would be a fusion between two shadow dragons. Edited February 2, 2014 by BrightBow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuvarkz Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Grima does not want a fusion as much as an overpowering. Fusion would imply some of Robin's personality would always remain present, not a hidden id trying to take control at some times. The blood pact might have been Grima needing a human avatar (as a mountain-sized dragon can't do some things); or in the sealing process someone must have taken the heart of grima on themselves, probably acquiring grima blood as part of the process. The orb theory leads me to think of the fact that either Medeus resurged somehow and absorbed the sleeping dragons' life energy, the being that hates humanity becoming Grima, and the orb's qualities were changed (alongside with the emblem and the Falchion's form) when the First Exalt and Naga made the pact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Void Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 (edited) Grima is way bigger than any of the dragons in Marth's games, has a bunch of eyes, and a humanoid face. Grima really isn't a dragon who came from being hatched. Put in how the Binding Shield was taken apart and the Dragon's Table is used differently and Grima coming from all those sealed Earth Dragons fusing isn't really a stretch. Edited February 2, 2014 by The Void Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJWalker Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 (edited) And yet, the Earth Dragons are never so much as referrenced. I'd say lack of research on their own damn franchise considering how messed up Valentia/Valm's geography is compared to Gaiden. Locations on that continent completely switch places, like Duma's Tower are now the location of the Mila Shrine ruins. You can't explain bizarre shit like that. And I'm gonna say that this fusion theory (just like 'Priam is Mist and Boyd's descendent' theory) is an overly complex solution to a problem that in reality, probably is far more straight forward. Edited February 2, 2014 by Ranger Jack Walker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cymbalina's Revenge Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Grima is way bigger than any of the dragons in Marth's games, has a bunch of eyes, and a humanoid face. Grima really isn't a dragon who came form being hatched. Put in how the Binding Shield was taken apart and the Dragon's Table is used differently and Grima coming from all those sealed Earth Dragons fusing isn't really a stretch. Except we already know from FE3 that an Earth Dragon gone wrong, as Medeus is going wrong after repeated resurrections, morphs into something far more fearsome, a genuine Dark Dragon. Grima could just as easily be one solitary Earth Dragon that's been corrupted into something horrific. A bunch of dragons doing something we've never known dragons to do across eleven main games and two remakes is kind of a stretch unless there's actually something supporting it. It's just as likely the whole Grima thing was just pulled out of the air because IS wanted a really cool-looking monster and nobody was thinking very hard about it. Like the goose-stepping troops in the trailer, y'know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Void Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 (edited) Do all corrupted Earth Dragons get humanoid faces and bunches of eyes? Edited February 2, 2014 by The Void Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuxSpes Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 I think the only stated details about Grima is that he's the opposite of Naga, a descendant of the Earth Dragon and hates humanity(and the descendant part is only in an artbook). Like most part of the story in this game, most inconsistencies or strange events an be brushed off as poor writing. It didn't stop me from enjoying it in my first playthrough, but any attempt to dig out details will leave you scratching your head. It does leave place for theories though, and Grima being a fusion of the Earth dragons spirits seems like a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCProductions Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 I`ve always thought that Awakening occurs in a different realm than Archenea. (God, I hope I spelled that right) put simply, the reason for the inconsistancies between awakening and FE 1,2,and 3 are caused due to ylisse being an outrealm of Archenea. In fact, there is evidence to support this, in the champions of yore dlc you visit talys which is referred to by name by the islanders. theres also the future past dlc in which you visit a world that is contradictory to the world you just left. Grima is not able to kill Naga in the main game,but he is in the dlc. In fact, these outrealms combined with Zelda`s split timeline, Super Paper Mario, and Sonic The Hedgehog`s established multiverse have led me to conclude that all video games canocally take place in the same universe, but not all universes are the same. This same theroy allows for awakenings discrepencies too. What happens in Shadow Dragon may not have happened exactly the same way in Awakenings realm. Plus, this can make Smash Bros canon, just smash bros is its own seperate universe. Dear Lord, I feel like I just wrote an essay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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