Ephraim and Klok's FE7 Randomizer

[Klokinator]

DOWNLOAD LINK FOR FIX PATCH V0.72

[kurthnaga]

Oh look, there's another topic. I've been using the one from the concepts thread until Klok mentioned this one recently... like yeah... so I just got here! Wooh! I'm gonna start trying it out, but a few questions:

Is Hector still bugged to revert if you promoted him before his forced promotion?

Also, the Randomizer link isn't in the OP.

[Klokinator]

Not sure how to fix the main lord promotion glitch. Just don't promote them, or enjoy having a ridiculously broken 4 tier lord XD

quoted from post directly above yours

In other news, I must have erased the randomizer DL link. Oops. Added it. Keep in mind it's a newer version than the one in the old topic.

Edited April 4, 2014 by Klok

[Venusaur]

So I've been doing a few randomizer runs of my own (using a customized ROM that bumped Eliwood/Lyn/Hector's bases) using the old version, but once I heard this was out I decided to eschew that custom ROM and just use the fix patch/updated randomizer. Might as well not have Soldiers be complete deadweight anymore. I've been playing on a fresh HHM (no Lyn mode) like I always do, and I've got a few complaints about the fix patch, from what I've seen.

- Here comes the major one: That door key you added near the door south of your starting point? If you have an Archer or Nomad (I got the latter), that one little key makes the map virtually impossible to beat without some serious luck. Turn 1 enemy phase that Soldier pops the south door, and from there either you run out of Vulneraries before you can clear out all of the approaching enemies from the south or you try to go through the west and get mobbed to death. If Matthew dodges 2 Soldier attacks (both above 50% hit, even with no weapon) it's possible to rout the southern group, and from there you break the wall (rescuing after each chip from Matthew so that you don't take any hits) and surround the Archer in the north so he can't attack (at this point Hector had 2 HP and Matthew had 9), steal the Vulnerary, kill him and then defeat Wire.

Part of the beauty of the original Ch. 11 is that you can go west or you can go south, and going west is often the better option if your class can't handle continuous tanking very well. That door key essentially forces you to go south, ruining that particular choice and narrowing the possible strategies down to just one. And the worst part is that this randomizer doesn't affect any of the thieves, meaning that the keys aren't even needed in the first place! I can see the point of the keys if the randomizer did affect Matthew (don't want to get screwed before you even begin), but since this doesn't I'd say just take out the keys in the fix patch for this randomizer (there's a separate version for each, isn't there?). Why fix what isn't broken?

Incidentially I did a run with that one key removed and the map became orders of magnitude easier. Go figure.

- The enemy thief AI behaves very oddly- it opens the south door in the treasure room like usual... and then flees, not even bothering to touch the chest with the Red Gem. There goes the challenge of reaching the Gem before the thief/stealing it off of him, now it's almost completely uncontested; all you have to do is go get it, watching out for the Knight.

- Fighter!Oswin uses the Hand Axe animation for up-close attacks, which I know is intentional but it just irks me considering weapon statistics aren't randomized with this particular randomizer. Like the keys, I'd take this out too, though it's obviously not as high-priority as the keys.

EDIT: Forgot one, it's kind of odd that the Armory in Ch. 12 doesn't sell Iron swords/lances/axes. early Javelins/Hand Axes are appreciated, but it just seems a bit out of character.

I think that's about it for now, maybe I'll have some more when I get a little further. Despite all of the negativity in my post I do appreciate the fixes, they were pretty sorely needed (especially the tomes in Ch. 12).

If you're wondering what I did to the Lords before the fix patch, I gave Eliwood a +3 to everything but Luck, Hector got +4 Str/Def +3 HP/Res +2 Skl/Spd and Lyn got the reverse of Hector. Sounds pretty familiar, doesn't it?

Edited April 4, 2014 by Venusaur

[Klokinator]

(there's a separate version for each, isn't there?). Why fix what isn't broken?

You can use the old fix patch if that's an issue, or open nightmare and take 4 seconds to remove that key. I have seen that issue in progress and my best solution is to set the enemies in the south to "Pursue after 2 turns" AI, so that they'll wait two turns instead of rushing you the moment the door is opened.

- The enemy thief AI behaves very oddly- it opens the south door in the treasure room like usual... and then flees, not even bothering to touch the chest with the Red Gem. There goes the challenge of reaching the Gem before the thief/stealing it off of him, now it's almost completely uncontested; all you have to do is go get it, watching out for the Knight.

I've noticed this too.

- Fighter!Oswin uses the Hand Axe animation for up-close attacks, which I know is intentional but it just irks me considering weapon statistics aren't randomized with this particular randomizer. Like the keys, I'd take this out too, though it's obviously not as high-priority as the keys.

Use the old fix patch or deal with it. Making a fix patch for two randomizers isn't easy.

EDIT: Forgot one, it's kind of odd that the Armory in Ch. 12 doesn't sell Iron swords/lances/axes. early Javelins/Hand Axes are appreciated, but it just seems a bit out of character.

You can get those on chapter 13, 14, and 15. (EM Ch numbers)

I don't play Hector/Lyn mode with the randomizer. It's too hard to balance since you're screwed 90% of the time when you get shit reclasses anyway. Just play Eliwood mode for now.

If you're wondering what I did to the Lords before the fix patch, I gave Eliwood a +3 to everything but Luck, Hector got +4 Str/Def +3 HP/Res +2 Skl/Spd and Lyn got the reverse of Hector. Sounds pretty familiar, doesn't it?

No, because I would never do something that imbalanced. Lol.

Edited April 4, 2014 by Klok

[kurthnaga]

I think Raven's inventory got messed up... with the fix patch.

Legaults weapon levels were messed up

Hawkeye and Wallace had two S ranks

Edited April 6, 2014 by kurthnaga

[Klokinator]

New fix patch is up, V0.73. The changes are extremely minor, you won't even need to use them for much in my opinion but you can if you want.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/28014061/Randomizer%20Shit/Fix%20Patch%20V0.73.ups

Edited April 7, 2014 by Klok

[kurthnaga]

Does this patch fix Pent's ability to get killed in one turn in the desert chapter?

[Klokinator]

That's a good question. I might even have a good answer for it eventually.

(Read: I have no idea but probably not)

[kurthnaga]

13x is still fogless-of-war, and 15 is the nighttime tile set, though no longer hidden.

Edited April 9, 2014 by kurthnaga

[Klokinator]

Those are weird bugs, by the way. Was it determined my fix patch did that? In any case, what chapters had the wonky fog? Tell me and I'll fix all of them. Could have sworn there were others.

[Fateborn]

I bet it's because of your Chaos Mode. :o

[Klokinator]

While those are odd similarities to chaos mode, they should be completely unrelated. I used a fresh clean rom for the fix patch. Also I wouldn't do something silly like change fow unless it was an accident, like maybe I opened the fix patch rom in nightmare instead of chaos mode and thought I was editing chaos mode. Even then, I finished work on those chapters in chaos mode MONTHS before doing the fix patch, so I had no reason to touch them.

It's just weird to me.

[Fateborn]

Might as well double check :P

[kurthnaga]

This didn't happen to me when I did the randomizer without the fix patch, so I believe it is your fix patch. If I can ever get past the desert level (can I edit a rom in nightmare and have it affect the game without having to start a new file?) then I'll let you know of the others, right now all I have is

13x is missing fog, and 15 has the wrong tileset.

If I remember correctly, the chapter with Nino and Jaffar (26? The one thats battle before dawn) also was lacking fog.

[delambra]

I just finished an other ENM run.

- Characters :

Pent has been nerfed far too much. He's supposed to be a good character, now, he's not.

And this is my hector when pent comes :

Louise was good (better than in vanilla) without being broken.

Harken was much better than how he's supposed to be. Even without amazing growths, he's epic. I know he's always a good character, but he's just too good (the problem being his crazy strength)

-Animations

Isadora and Hawkeye animations are still broken for me. (not sur if it is only me)

And Jerme's animation has been replaced by a cavalier animation (strangely)

-Various things.

You forgot to auto-level pent in the desert chapter (22, iirc), it can be easily done with nightmare, but you might as well change it. Without it, he doesn't last 1 turn.

Same thing with Jaffar. He's not auto-level in chapter 26 as a NPC, and is not auto-level in chapter 26x when he joins the group either. He will also have a shitty strength thanks to his very bad strength growth.

Chapter 13x and 26 don't have FoW. The patch makes it, because it has FoW with randomizer only. And 15 and 16x are night-time, but shouldn't.

The T3 mage classes were really cool. The ubersage felt a bit to powerful (7 move, 4 S ranks, better stats than archsage and dark druid). And if the main lord is a mage, he will be able to promote in chapter 27 to a T3 class, making him a really good character.

I think that's everything i have to report. I have some savestates, but i don't think you will need them.

Edited April 9, 2014 by delambra

[Klokinator]

Ahhh thanks for pointing out all those issues. Jerme is broken because for some inane reason I used his custom animation slot for the female cavalier. I'll just remove his custom animation entirely, as the difference was always negligible from regular assassin. Thanks for the stat reports too, I thought I might have nerfed pent a bit too heavily.

The T3 mage classes were really cool. The ubersage felt a bit to powerful (7 move, 4 S ranks, better stats than archsage and dark druid). And if the main lord is a mage, he will be able to promote in chapter 27 to a T3 class, making him a really good character.

I think that's everything i have to report. I have some savestates, but i don't think you will need them.

It's worth pointing out that the Witch T3 isn't able to use Forblaze or Erishkigal, though I can't recall if I've made that droppable or not. I'll reduce the movement to 6 though, while DD and Archsage get 7. That should balance out the additional S ranks.

I'm tinkering with the idea of making GK a T3 for Paladins and Generals. It would have 6 movement instead of 7 for paladin and instead of 5 for Generals and but an S rank in swords/axes/lances. Main issue is all the work that'd entail for the map sprite and repointing the class array to make room. I probably won't bother.

Time to fix all these issues in any case.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Klok

[Psych]

You could make soldier promote to GK instead

[kurthnaga]

In your fix patch, would it be bad to boost Lyn's level just a tiny bit, as though I've played through Lyn's mode?

[Klokinator]

You mean boost her level in lyn mode? That's stupid lol. She can easily gain 10 levels if you play through Lyn mode. If you mean in hector/eliwood mode, I need to buff her stats a bit.

[kurthnaga]

Yeah sorry, I should've been more clear, I meant in Eliwood/Hector's mode. Otherwise it seems like no matter what her class is I have to baby her as though she's Nino in vanilla.

[HaruShion]

The latest fix patch seems to cause most classes who uses any axe weapons (iron,steel, killer... tested) to use the throw animation.

Edited April 17, 2014 by HaruShion

[Klokinator]

Yep. It sure does.

[Ramiel_]

Man, I have to say, I absolutely love this thing. Registered an account finally just to give some feedback. Playing Hector Normal, few issues I've noted so far

- My Hawkeye appeared as a Falcoknight, pretty nice, but the only item in his inventory was a Manni Katti, which he obviously couldn't use

- My Lyn is a Nomad, she's really great, but for some reason she can't use Short Bows. She can equip them from the item menu, but they don't appear as an option for attacks. Haven't seen any problems with any other kind of bow, just Short Bows.

- As noted above, Pent is really weak in the desert. Was able to rescue him with a Peg Knight, but without that mobility it could be pretty difficult. He also was a Sage there, but when I got him several chapters later he was a Bishop instead.

- Currently on 28H, Battle Before Dawn. As noted, no more Fog of War, but that's not a big issue. What is a big problem is that the chapter is pretty much unbeatable as far as I can tell. Zephiel gets swarmed by 6-7 enemies by turn 3, and unless you have the most amazing luck in history it's pretty much impossible for him to survive long enough to rescue him. I've rushed my fastest units as far as possible and can still only make it about 2/3 of the way before they gang up on him. I think Jaffar is supposed to move down and draw their fire away, but with him being weaker than normal he has to run and heal first turn, moving out of range for most; then, since he can pickpocket, he runs north to rob the thief rather than engaging the mob. I can rescue the weakened Jaffar with some effort, but I have no idea how I'm going to come even close to rescuing Zephiel. If anyone has ideas, let me know.

- On the other hand, Nino is insane. Still a lv 5 prepromote (Myrmidon for me), but with way higher stats. Sorry no screenshot, but she had something like 12 STR / 16 SKL / 20 SPD.

[Cerbuirus]

This tool actually brought a lot of fun to fe7, some stray observations based on my run (eliwood's story):
- in general the pre-promote npcs are way too weak with pent and jaffar being huge headaches due to having 18hp and 13hp respectively. also i didnt have any flying units on pent's chapter, although pent became a flying unit just to taunt me
- is there a fell contract in this game? i saw the ultimate contract which was redundant because eliwood was gonna promote on his own anyway
- the first few chapters were pretty painful because i had 5 pirates and 4 hectors, which was pretty hilarious. on the plus side i had a bunch of wolf beils

so yeah, keep up the good work

EDIT: Nevermind I read the description for ocean seal, my bad

Edited April 25, 2014 by Deesukae