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Quick Question on Making Combat Animations


Zsword
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Heyo, I've been working to make a custom battle animation for the GBA era games... purely out of boredom, but I can't seem to find some, relatively key data that would really help make it shine. I've tried searching for the answers but after about an hour of frustration I just can't seem to find them.

The primary one being, as a melee attack, what are the dimensions that a typical sprite has to stay within?

How many frames does a typical sprite have, over what duration? (I know Cavaliers have very few frames compared to most classes, while Hero's have a ton, so I understand this isn't just a flat value)

About how many pixels over does the game make the layer transition from front to back for the enemy sprite and the attacker sprite? (AKA: what region should I be aiming for the sharp bit to properly be stuck in the bad guy?)

I hope these aren't too tedious, thanks in advance. ^^.

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I made a post but it got lost :c

The primary one being, as a melee attack, what are the dimensions that a typical sprite has to stay within?

Pretty liberal (think as long as it's within the screen you're fine), check out the wyvern and pegasi attacks.

How many frames does a typical sprite have, over what duration? (I know Cavaliers have very few frames compared to most classes, while Hero's have a ton, so I understand this isn't just a flat value)

Typically 20~30, not sure about the duration. Imo, less than 5 seconds or even shorter for an animation that's going to see a lot of use.

Dodges are a special case, think they're locked to 2 or 3 frames.

About how many pixels over does the game make the layer transition from front to back for the enemy sprite and the attacker sprite? (AKA: what region should I be aiming for the sharp bit to properly be stuck in the bad guy?)

I overlay the sprite positions over a screenshot or the basic templates from:

http://serenesforest.net/sprite/new_tutorial.htm

http://serenesforest.net/sprite/battle_adv.htm

Most characters jump or slide into the enemy position, so tweaking the gap isn't difficult as long as it's not 1/4 of the screen.

Last bit of advice if you're just starting, don't worry about making it game-ready too much, just have fun with it. ^^

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8358c79b32.png

Just don't fall off the platform (or do, that could be pretty meta)

429acfc770.png

If you're planning to insert anything you make in a hack, keep the parts covered by the HUD in mind, and also notice there really isn't a lot of space between the battlers; that's why a lot of animations have the attacker jump in a big arc through the air, or step back first. Otherwise, not something to worry about

About 20-30 frames for a non-crit attack. Less than that is too choppy, more is probably too long or too smooth and will stick out. In terms of time you're only looking at ~1.5-4 seconds of animation, and that's including three quarters of a second for pausing at the start/pausing on the hit. It's about an average of 0.07 seconds per frame, which is 4 ticks at 60fps (also as a note, never go below 0.02 seconds per frame, browsers usually have trouble with less)

Just cut off about in the middle of the average target's chest idk

Edited by BwdYeti
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Yeah, I already did some 'for funzies' Pallette Swaps/Real simple edits to get a general feel for it:

AgQOj5v.gif

s2xeYLX.gif

Nothing too fancy, there's a frame or two in the Great Knight I know I need to fix up towards the start/end where his helmet innexplicably gets larger (really bad over sight. >.<) and that the cavalier is REALLY incosistant with how his arm wants to be armored or not. (I think that was a Pallette error that slipped out from under my nose, I was more concerned with trying to make the ponytail look right) With something I plan on building from the ground up, I hope such simple errors won't slip by >.<;;

THanks for the info guys. I'll maybe comeback once I have a base sprite built up for just standing there and looking pretty. (Kinda need a solid base before you animate it, after all. :P)

EDIT: Whoooo boy have I given myself a head ache trying to get this to work out, but my brain just seems incapable of telling my hands what the image wants to look like, let me show you all what I've gotten so far for basic critiqueing to help me get to something even remotely close to a finalized base image. (Let alone starting the animation process @.@;;)

xIBBGjx.gif

Yes there's a lot of blank space, shut up, it's the size I'm working in to leave myself some scratch room. and it's just, ugh, getting even this far felt like an unpleasant chore and it still doens't look good, one thing I definatly notice is the head feels too small, and looking straight ahead just doesn't fit with the pose, so I've been dabbling with makign it angled (Current beta of that is viewable, just below the sword.) So many things are wrong with this and I got frustrated to no end trying to fix them. @.@ EVERYTHING looks FLAT, especially the tunic, which is just a monstrosity, the boots and legs aren't bending right, and it's just, uuugh. @.@

Edited by Zsword
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Huh, I just noticed the pose I'm going for is very similar to Hector's Armads pose, maybe I can rip it off pull some inspiration from that to help get me off the ground.

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I made a post but it got lost :c

Pretty liberal (think as long as it's within the screen you're fine), check out the wyvern and pegasi attacks.

Typically 20~30, not sure about the duration. Imo, less than 5 seconds or even shorter for an animation that's going to see a lot of use.

Dodges are a special case, think they're locked to 2 or 3 frames.

I overlay the sprite positions over a screenshot or the basic templates from:

http://serenesforest.net/sprite/new_tutorial.htm

http://serenesforest.net/sprite/battle_adv.htm

Most characters jump or slide into the enemy position, so tweaking the gap isn't difficult as long as it's not 1/4 of the screen.

Last bit of advice if you're just starting, don't worry about making it game-ready too much, just have fun with it. ^^

I don't think dodges are locked to two frames. The final boss of The Last Promise waggles his finger at you if he dodges, and it looks to be to be more than two frames. Correct me if I'm wrong though, it's been awhile.

Yeah, I already did some 'for funzies' Pallette Swaps/Real simple edits to get a general feel for it:

AgQOj5v.gif

Not bad, honestly! My Soldier and your Great Knight could hang out. :P SrPBNKO.png

Seriously though, good start. You seem to have an eye enough to notice flaws like how choppy the cavalier is and the like.

I suggest shading the helm crest, if you feel like playing with it more. The Great Knight is my favorite FE animation.

Reskins are a great way to get a feel for spriting. I wholly encourage you to do them. Another tactic I like to use is to shear off everything but the feet of a sprite and work upward from there.

Huh, I just noticed the pose I'm going for is very similar to Hector's Armads pose, maybe I can rip it off pull some inspiration from that to help get me off the ground.

Absolutely. Reference everything, constantly. Splice pieces and recolor! Also, look at all the frames of any FE animation - You can get some really good poses and angles out of them that you might not see normally.

Also, this is a neat little read on the basics of pixel art, if you haven't played around with them before : http://www.pixeljoint.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11299

Also any program that does onion skinning is really fantastic for taking a load off animating.

As far as the custom goes, his arms are super bendy and almost gumby-like to start. They make him look a bit like he's made of, well, putty.

Edited by Siuloir
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One head swap later, with a kind donation from Hector, we get....

yVnvZua.gif

Definatly an improvement, I was feeling so good I added the wings and a tail!

... I think my pallette needs a total re haul before I begin animating though, and the tunic still refuses to come out looking even remotely decent. >:I

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One head swap later, with a kind donation from Hector, we get....

yVnvZua.gif

Definatly an improvement, I was feeling so good I added the wings and a tail!

... I think my pallette needs a total re haul before I begin animating though, and the tunic still refuses to come out looking even remotely decent. >:I

Getting better. I admire your bravery - Wing shading is not an easy thing to do.

Also, you should move his head maybe a pixel to the far point of view. Also his torso doesnt look lined up with his legs.

Edited by Siuloir
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... So, when you say into the far point of view, do you mean, like, moving it 'back' by putting more of the torsos pixels, up front of it, or moving the head Right a mixel so that it looks a little more like he's just, leaning back a bit? (Your terminology confuses me, but I do see what you mean on the mis alignment.) I"m not gonna make any more edits tonight cause sleepy, but I can definatly set the cogs in motion for tomorrow, after homework.

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Yeah, before I move on with anything I'm gonna need some advice on how to make the chest piece, not bland as all get out, as well as some tips to finagling the pallette more to help with that, I've done a little experimentation on the side but everything seems to come out worse, not better. @.@

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For wing shading, look at the wyverns. They're your best bet.

For the rest of the shading, have you tried putting down a specific light source? Generally FE sprites have a single light source that all the shadows/shading comes from.

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I dabbled with that idea, but my biggest issue is I can't seem to find any sort of 'texture' for the shirt that doesn't look either incredibly awkward or bland, I tried taking it out and going bare chested, but the sprites size (and my mediocre pallette that I still have no real idea how to fix. @.@;;) just makes that a non option cause I lack room to do decent looking muscle tones.

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Okay, for dem wings. Look at Myrrh, she seems like a good example. 0F459TF.png

Right now it looks like he has glowy radioactive wing "fingers"

EDIT: looking again, the radioactive stuff seems intended to be the skin between the fingers, well, if that's what it is, it needs to be more folded up, as his wings are folded, yet the skin is apparently pulled tight.

Edited by L95
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Alrighty, after a little more fussing I came up with...

89sUJ3O.gif

alrighty, Critique away. (No, It's not great yet, I'm just trying to make some form of progress. @.@;;

He has some dark banding on his closer arm that makes it look segmented, I assume it's because it was spliced.

Head still needs to go about a pixel toward the hilt of the sword, IMO

Draconic wings are going to look like Myrrh's as L95 linked. Bats are a decent reference, gargoyles (if you want fantastical) are another.

Sword is a bit flat, and the crossguard of the blade seems to go higher than the blade itself, thus giving the impression it loops around.

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Yeah, I've just given up on this, I've spent a good couple hours trying to fix it, and it just doesn't work. I just don't have the mental capability of making this image in my head turn into an actual product, even if I got the base sprite worked out, I couldn't even possibly begin animating it with a shred of my sanity in tact.

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