Shadow Mir Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Why is Lucina forced to go magical? Units like Gerome are assumed to physical so why can't other units do the same? Is it because of mod issues? I didn't say, or imply, something like that. Second, I'd say there's a world of difference between a unit who can get as much as a +7 Strength mod, and one whose Strength mod only maxes out at +2, barring being parented by Avatar (not to say you couldn't use a magical Gerome; I've read something saying that could actually work, seeing as he gets Sage naturally). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ownagepuffs Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 (edited) I didn't... you thought that I thought my personal reasons influenced my gameplay reasons which... they do not. And I thought every female has to be a Dark Flier because of how overpowered Dark Flier x Sage couples are? Easy there, we're all friends here. I've seen some people conflate personal preference with game play and I thought you were doing it so my bad. I've seen things like "Inigo is cooler as Chrom's son and optimization doesn't matter so Chrom x Olivia is Chrom's best pairing" as an argument for Chrolivia being optimal before, which is a contradicting statement. Anyway Sage access is important for Tomefaire Dark Flier. But not every girl has to be Dark Flier. Dark Flier x Sage is powerful but not to the point where it is the only thing you should have. The point is Sumia!Lucina can compete with Olivia!Lucina in the Physical department with Sumia!Lucy's natural Paladin and Sniper access but Sumia!Lucina blows Olivia!Lucina out of the water in the magic department so Sumia!Lucina's got much more versatility on her side. For Physical, Olivia!Lucy > Sumia!Lucy but not by a large margin. However for Magic Sumia!Lucina beats Olivia!Lucina hard. Sumia!Lucina simply has more positives than Olivia!Lucina does, that's all. This also addresses your second point about Sumia!Lucy having to go magical. She doesn't, Maribelle!Lucina does. It's just that Sumia!Lucy can compete pretty well in the magical and physical departments with Olivia!Lucina and Maribelle!Lucina while having the option to switch between them at will. Neither Maribelle!Lucina or Olivia!Lucina have that luxury. All of this is coupled with the fact that Sumia!Lucina grants you Chrom!Cynthia, who is Jesus on Wings. Edited June 23, 2014 by Ownagepuffs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galenforcer Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Second, I'd say there's a world of difference between a unit who can get as much as a +7 Strength mod, and one whose Strength mod only maxes out at +2, barring being parented by Avatar (not to say you couldn't use a magical Gerome; I've read something saying that could actually work, seeing as he gets Sage naturally). Like... not really. Assassin!Lucina could just quad if she needs to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 (edited) Like... not really. Assassin!Lucina could just quad if she needs to. And so can anyone else, which makes me wonder just what your point is... At any rate, units like Gerome are assumed to be physical for the same reasons that units like Owain and Brady are assumed to be magical - mods. Owain and Brady have mothers with negative Strength mods, whereas Gerome has a mother with a +3 Strength mod and a 0 mod for magic. Edited June 23, 2014 by Levant Caprice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galenforcer Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 And so can anyone else, which makes me wonder just what your point is... At any rate, units like Gerome are assumed to be physical for the same reasons that units like Owain and Brady are assumed to be magical - mods. Owain and Brady have mothers with negative Strength mods, whereas Gerome has a mother with a +3 Strength mod and a 0 mod for magic. If she quads, then she'll take down her foe, regardless of what stat she mains. It's not like everything on the map has Lethality+(although that would have made Apotheosis actually challenging). Sage!Gerome was not an outrageous idea for the fact that the defense/resistance gap is pretty significant(Pavise+, Helswath), meaning his lower magic stat is more preferred than his higher strength stat. Makes you wonder why physical classes even exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 If she quads, then she'll take down her foe, regardless of what stat she mains. It's not like everything on the map has Lethality+(although that would have made Apotheosis actually challenging). Sage!Gerome was not an outrageous idea for the fact that the defense/resistance gap is pretty significant(Pavise+, Helswath), meaning his lower magic stat is more preferred than his higher strength stat. Makes you wonder why physical classes even exist. I'd assume that if it truly didn't matter, we wouldn't be going back and forth like this... And in spite of that, you see everyone and their grandma recommending Vaike!Gerome as a Berserker... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ownagepuffs Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 If she quads, then she'll take down her foe, regardless of what stat she mains. It's not like everything on the map has Lethality+(although that would have made Apotheosis actually challenging). Sage!Gerome was not an outrageous idea for the fact that the defense/resistance gap is pretty significant(Pavise+, Helswath), meaning his lower magic stat is more preferred than his higher strength stat. Makes you wonder why physical classes even exist. While there is a notable discrepancy in Def/Res in Apotheosis, it actually isn't very big. On average it's like a 5 point difference, with some enemies actually having higher Res than Def. The most notable case is the Wave 2 Sniper boss who has 70 Def and 46 Res. There is also the opportunity cost of optimizing a Sage Gerome. There are only 3 dads that give a positive Mag mod IIRC. Libra, Henry, and Ricken. While Ricken would make him into a notable Sage, you end up losing out on the much more superior Ricken!Owain. Libra and Henry leave Gerome a +2 Mag for Sage. But Henry also gives Gerome Axefaire and Henry!Gerome would rather be a 62 Str Zerker with a 17 Mt weapon than a 53 Magic Sage with a 9 Might weapon. Libra!Gerome can do 55 Mag Sage and that's it. There's not real opportunity cost for Libra!Gerome, but Libra!Gerome isn't on par with a Physical Gerome for damage output on most enemies. And in spite of that, you see everyone and their grandma recommending Vaike!Gerome as a Berserker... Stahl!Gerome is the way of the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PM ME MARIANNE ART Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 I like Chrom and Olivia because I like seeing Chrom with Olivia Inigo has blue hair and luna Two of my favorite things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 I like Chrom and Olivia because I like seeing Chrom with Olivia Inigo has blue hair and luna Two of my favorite things Oh right, I never posted it in here. Here you go. Enjoy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8lfqa9W5Bk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ownagepuffs Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Oh right, I never posted it in here. Here you go. Enjoy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8lfqa9W5Bk Dang it, SoC. Also, Azure Flame = Kite from .Hack. Someone had to say it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numot Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Personally I find that Sumia!Lucina is better because she has more options and has Tomefaire access, which is a big selling point because of Def/Res differences mentioned before. And Cynthia with Aether is Jesus on wings. And I prefer Libra!Ingio to physical Ingio because of above mention again as well as Cecilia's Gale use. Libra gives Ingio Tomefaire and Vengeance to go with his natural vantage, merc line and galeforce inheritance. So I rate Libra!Ingio very highly compared to physical Ingio's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PM ME MARIANNE ART Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Oh right, I never posted it in here. Here you go. Enjoy. (video) Looks like your waifu bias is still going strong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Also, Azure Flame = Kite from .Hack. Someone had to say it. Well, dammit. Why didn't I think of that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 (edited) Looks like your waifu bias is still going strong Nah. Yes, for someone else. I still have a bunch of clips for the cut-in collection I still haven't done that has people killing non-JP speaking characters. Edited June 24, 2014 by shadowofchaos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Book of Ereshkigal Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Nah. You like Nah now? I didn't think she was your type. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irony Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 I actually had a decent Lucina and I paired Chrom and Olivia (but then- Chrom had been a lvl 15 lord, and Olivia a level 15 Dark Flier by the time I got to chapter 13... I like grinding so much....) and then the resulting Inigo was slightly badass.... With slightly being an understatement.... But they weren't even the best children of that playthrough. That went to a Donnel!Noire. Literally, she had to be one of the most badass snipers that you will ever see... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faye Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 This thread is bullshit, everyone knows Chrom's one true love is Village Maiden. People do what they want, shouldn't that be answer enough? \o/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ownagepuffs Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 This thread is bullshit, everyone knows Chrom's one true love is Village Maiden. People do what they want, shouldn't that be answer enough? \o/ You mean the same maiden that Inigo is trying to fuck in his Paralogue? Well there are specific reasons people like Chrolivia. They like the family dynamic more, Blue Haired Inigo, Inigo as Lucy's younger bro, FE4 reference. So "people do what they want" isn't answer enough lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaia Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 Personally I find that Sumia!Lucina is better because she has more options and has Tomefaire access, which is a big selling point because of Def/Res differences mentioned before. And Cynthia with Aether is Jesus on wings. I think you're forgetting that Olivia!Lucina is physical Lucina. As in has-no-use-for-tomefaire Lucina. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 I don't know about others (didn't even know it was a "thing", if it actually is"), but the reason I like to pair Chrom and Olivia are the following: - I, inevitably, pair The Vaike and Marribella, The Avatar and Sumia, Sully with Kellam (assuming I am using both of them) and I'm forgetting something. - Olivia is better than the Iron Maiden and it's a quick and easy pairing for Chrom. - My Project Plan, "Les Infantes Miserables" (or something along those lines), which include the powerful children being Brady, Cynthia, Kjelly and of course, Inigo and the wonderful Astra/Rightful King/Armstrift combo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 (edited) I think you're forgetting that Olivia!Lucina is physical Lucina. As in has-no-use-for-tomefaire Lucina. He was talking about Sumia!Lucina. I don't know about others (didn't even know it was a "thing", if it actually is"), but the reason I like to pair Chrom and Olivia are the following: - I, inevitably, pair The Vaike and Marribella, The Avatar and Sumia, Sully with Kellam (assuming I am using both of them) and I'm forgetting something. - Olivia is better than the Iron Maiden and it's a quick and easy pairing for Chrom. - My Project Plan, "Les Infantes Miserables" (or something along those lines), which include the powerful children being Brady, Cynthia, Kjelly and of course, Inigo and the wonderful Astra/Rightful King/Armstrift combo. This is just me, but why run Astra when you have Luna, which is generally better all around? Especially when Astra bites you in the ass several times over if you run into a Counter enemy. Edited June 26, 2014 by Levant Caprice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galenforcer Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 I'd assume that if it truly didn't matter, we wouldn't be going back and forth like this... And in spite of that, you see everyone and their grandma recommending Vaike!Gerome as a Berserker... If you end with a 1-round, that's that. You can deal 20 or deal 15, but as long as you can deal 80 by the end of it, you've accomplished what you needed to do. Vaike!Gerome was a option some notable people(like Endgame) suggested and it later snowballed into the standard. So did pairs like Virion x Olivia and Kellam x Nowi. Once American players finally got the map, the mod situation hardly matter when it came to taking out the enemies and now people don't have to feel too conflicted with who to pair their parents with(Frederick and Ricken were redeemed from an optimization point, and Gregor and Lon'qu got the shaft). I still remember the days when everyone hyped up Sol, Armthrift and PavGis as the best skills in the game(aside from the obvious Galeforce). Now it's Dual Strike+, Vengeance, Vantage and Luna. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 (edited) So... if it "really didn't matter when pair up breaks the game anyway"... why are you two still going back and forth about optimization in regards to Lucina's mother? The real reason people use the pairing is for Inigo in regards to gameplay. The difference for Lucina isn't so large that it even matters in regards to beating Apotheosis. ...in fact the whole "max stats" optimization for this particular pairing isn't even really optimization besides saying "Hey guys! I have the best children!" Edited June 26, 2014 by shadowofchaos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 So... if it "really didn't matter when pair up breaks the game anyway"... why are you two still going back and forth about optimization in regards to Lucina's mother? The real reason people use the pairing is for Inigo in regards to gameplay. The difference for Lucina isn't so large that it even matters in regards to beating Apotheosis. ...in fact the whole "max stats" optimization for this particular pairing isn't even really optimization besides saying "Hey guys! I have the best children!" Hmmm. At the same time, as far as Inigo goes, I've read that Stahl!Inigo is more-or-less the same as Chrom!Inigo (and imho, I don't think Rightful King is some kind of game-changer). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkhead Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 This is just me, but why run Astra when you have Luna, which is generally better all around? Especially when Astra bites you in the ass several times over if you run into a Counter enemy. It sounds alot more fun, to me. Luna's activation rate is already pretty decent, so, I might as well go for a cool-looking skill that has cruddy chances of activating. I want to see Inigo spam Astra with Armstrift and Swanchika. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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