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Crusader Kings x Genealogy of the Holy War


Pou
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I'm not entirely sure how much help to expect you'll receive for any of the CK2 modding itself, or what to offer myself (I'm a nerd for the game, but I'm not sure if I'm a "consultant" quality nerd, almost certainly nothing better than what you can just find on SF), but regardless I must say,

Oh, Dear God, yes

God fucking speed you, I love this idea. (not literally, taking your time is cool too)

Just curious, do you know if you can mod the start date numbers? On reflection, that doesn't really matter even as much as I thought (not much), because there's no reason why you'd have to place the mod anywhere near the game's timeline, especially given IIRC the year date of the game's beginning, 757, won't be available even when Charlemagne comes out, but the timeline of the Jugdral universe is of course listed in the game's section on SF itself, among what I hope is a fair amount of other trivia. Just, uh, in case you didn't know, and in case that might be of any use whatsoever.

Edited by Rehab
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I placed a bet this would either be empty wishful thinking or someone begging for someone else to make a hack.

I was wrong. This could be incredible.

AWESOME! I'd love to have something like this!

Will you be adding in unique units/aspects and the like (like mages and wyverns, class-changes, and the like) or will this simply be a new map/reskin?

Crusader Kings' combat engine really isn't sophisticated enough for that to matter. Are you at all familiar with it?

Besides, wyverns are just heavy cavalry, really.

Though, perhaps as cultural retinues...

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Have you posted this over on the official P'dox forums? There's some pretty remarkable mods over there. If you can find any other modders who are also FE fans, I'm sure you could get some help.

You can absolutely mess with start dates. In fact, that's actually incredibly easy to do. It's just editing a txt file. I played a couple games starting in 867 before I bought Old Gods by doing that, although I couldn't play the pagans.

Anyways, I look forward to this and wish you luck! The mod itself will be in English, though, right?

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Just curious, do you know if you can mod the start date numbers? On reflection, that doesn't really matter even as much as I thought (not much), because there's no reason why you'd have to place the mod anywhere near the game's timeline, especially given IIRC the year date of the game's beginning, 757, won't be available even when Charlemagne comes out, but the timeline of the Jugdral universe is of course listed in the game's section on SF itself, among what I hope is a fair amount of other trivia. Just, uh, in case you didn't know, and in case that might be of any use whatsoever.

What a well of information! I think I'll include the backstory once everything is delivered. I want to play with the Republic Rome Grandville

AWESOME! I'd love to have something like this!

Will you be adding in unique units/aspects and the like (like mages and wyverns, class-changes, and the like) or will this simply be a new map/reskin?

I am thinking of making Wyvens Thracia and reunited Thracia only. Pegasi are reconverted horse archers, but specialists get movement bonus. Mages are going to be split into 3 elements, with triangle in duel-events but in combat generally fire sucks wind rules. They trigger special events like fire in sieges. Silesia is going to be strong and brittle. They are also holy troops retinues, special building units and specific retinues.

Have you posted this over on the official P'dox forums? There's some pretty remarkable mods over there. If you can find any other modders who are also FE fans, I'm sure you could get some help.

You can absolutely mess with start dates. In fact, that's actually incredibly easy to do. It's just editing a txt file. I played a couple games starting in 867 before I bought Old Gods by doing that, although I couldn't play the pagans.

Anyways, I look forward to this and wish you luck! The mod itself will be in English, though, right?

Once there is an alpha I'll post on there. I'm going to go slowly at first cause I'm intimidated by the Game of Thrones mod lol. The topics are quite similar.

Scedule is to keep posting pictures until alpha. So much groundwork has been done by the fans already. I'm very worried about correct naming I've for example got Arya down as Ira. If your less interested and just want a custom character please submit some lol! I'll make a quiz and post it in Snes Games later. This is 100% in english. I'll make a French version after all the english has been done.

Edited by Pou
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Oh, I actually missed this. Would like a lot.

Yeah, that Game of Thrones mod does change the start date. The problem being that I heard that the game gets laggy if it gets behind the normal range in terms of years - i.e the game gets laggier the longer it goes on. I dunno if it's an issue in that case.

Though tell me, was there any resources for hacking or was that all on Paradox's site? I had a brief time modding basic stuff in Total War, though it was mainly just text files. How exactly do you do it?

I dunno if there's anything I can do to help but if you need some, \o.

Edited by Tryhard
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ty I also live in Scotland for uni. I found out how to from this video on Youtube

after that it was plain sailing. I used Gimp to make my own map in the map files, cut out India completely (has to be 2048x2048) and then started drawing provinces from the FE4 map. Each province is a village, temple or castle in the game. But then I ran out of ideas for names and here I am :( As you see I don't have much terrain yet and rivers.bmp is a nightmare

If you have stuff you'd like to see in a fire emblem mod then suggest away. I just have no imagination ATM. I am tempted to start ripping off other games like FE6-7 for events.

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Let's see, brief ideas regarding things that come to mind that could be used:

-The crusaders Dain and Noba were brother and sister, and their descendants rule neighboring countries Thracia and Lenster. Of course the Thracians have always been kinda salty that their land is mountainous and hard to make a living off of, tending to force them into mercenary service elsewhere, while Lenster is fertile. There's obviously some drama potential there to give rulers in both countries claims to the other, though I'm not sure how to implement it myself.

-And is there any practical way to make a province with a lower maximum holding threshold, yet still have it be uniquely powerful militarily? Cultural retinues, and I'm not sure what else.

-How would provinces, Duchies/Counties/etc be denoted? According to castles/cities in the area, I might guess? Or are some of those better to call holdings? I wonder if the world might feel kinda cramped just going by that, though, since I don't remember there being that many of those in the first place. Might wanna inflate the number of counties a little? How many holdings would it make sense to have, then? I guess kinda remember the continent feeling like a relatively cramped place in the game itself, too (and like that that might be the case in a lot of Fire Emblem games). Should that be thought of as a limitation or a "feature" of the hack? Not sure how I'd deal with that question, either

-Both in the game and at least one of the mangas (more potential sources of info to work with), it's mentioned multiple times that incest is taboo even among the nobility, yet leads to kids with more powerful Holy Blood, and not a few times in the game shit goes down because some cousins (and closer) fall in love. There's event/scenario potential for days there, IMO.

-A version of that fucking Omen tribute string of events in CK2 that leads to a kid being declared the Antichrist or something could be made, but with the kid having Lopt blood of some kind instead (or maybe double Lopt blood, though might that make it extremely difficult to get? dunno). A Lopt tutor for your kid making them fucked up somehow sounds like it could be a thing, anyway.

-On that note, handling Lopt as a religion sounds interesting- maybe certain courtiers in various lands could have it? It sounds like a bit of a challenge to deal with- not quite all the countries are ruled by Holy Blood havers, but it seemed to me like a lot of them had their ruling structures in place in large part to protect against Lopt influence coming to power, so one might argue they'd see any Lopt regime or even Lopt-harboring regime anywhere as an existential threat. (Part of the basic plot of FE4 of course being that the Lopt cult had it so bad they had to manipulate basically the entire world into coming under their control again to even safely come out of that shitty desert in public) (But then that might be what Holy War (heh) mechanics are for, anyway)

-Unique religion mechanics to start with. Uhh, let's see: on Lopt's side, there's the 12 dark lords (IIRC whose making might sometimes kidnapping and brainwashing children, in addition to burning them at the stake or something, but then again that wasn't necessary for the ones in FE5, was it? more info than comes to my mind needed there, probably), basically-the-Antichrist when somebody with Full Lopt Blood comes of age, and maybe some relatively bad unrest? And maybe some sort of way to hold onto power in spite of it. Maybe something like a decadence mechanic. Not sure what else to give them, but there has to be some modifiers that could be made. Or something.

-On Edda, there's the 12 crusaders, a church maybe? Like maybe there could be a pope/papal state-alike at Blagi Tower. Not sure how to handle religious officials for either of them, though. Maybe there could be a bonus to vassal opinion for Holy Blood, and/or holy weapon ownership? Maybe the more holy weapon users a state has, the greater the effect (fucking Grandbell OP). I'm drawing blanks here otherwise, but again there has to be other stuff.

-Then again, RE "does it make sense to have actual individual Lopt-ruled countries," in some areas in particular, like near Yied (which maybe could be made mountainous in such a way as to make it fucking hellish terrain to invade in spite of smaller size, or something), Northern Verdane maybe, perhaps it'd make sense to have rulers (maybe, maybe not of king status) with the religion, or to have events that might lead to conversion be able (or more likely than in other places) to happen? Maybe those could influence peasant rebellions or the like. (Given that members of both religions are said to have burned suspected members/descendants of the other at the stake like every year when their respective religion was in power ingame, and that Alvis partially came to power to put an end to that).

-Ohhhh dude. Reforming the Lopt Empire being a thing. Duh. (and maybe "eradicating the Lopt cult from the face of the world" for Edda? potential for something there anyway)

-On that note, I'm thinking about different countries/regions having variable tolerance for __ religions in EU4, but I dunno how easy to fit in something like that would be. Or do they already have that and I'm dumb?

E: Oh wait yeah, they have rulers with "tolerant towards ___religion" traits already, at least.

-Oh, Holy Sites. There's Blagi Tower in Northwest Madino for Edda, aaand... maybe Yied Desert in general, and the Spirit Village in Verdane for Lopt? I feel like there's got to be other stuff, though I'm not sure whether to look more at the chapter dialogue or some lore notes. Also, there's a couple events with magical items popping up out of nowhere in the game, like the Hero Axe in Southern Verdane and the Pursuit ring in I-forget-where Agustria. Maybe there could be Pagan hotspots there? Or something

-Which chapters of FE4 have unaffiliated bandits or pirates raiding villages, again? Don't quite remember, and I feel like there's some lines missing from the chapter scripts on SF where random bandits would pop up and say "haha time fer lootin" etc, though a lot more of the looters might be the actual chapter antagonist forces than I remember? I feel like it can't just be Chapter 3 in Madino with the Orgahil Pirates, regardless. Maybe groups like those could serve as replacements could serve as replacements for adventurers. (if anybody on this planet wants to implement something like adventurers)

-(Independent) Mercenary brigades are an actual thing in the game itself, remembering Beowulf and of course the Thracians (their whole status as both a kingdom and independent merc force might be interesting to try to implement), but I forget what they tend to be named like. I wanted to say that some of them are called __Ritters, but come to think of it most of those might be the armies of countries themselves? I forget, help me out dudes

-I haven't actually played through FE5, to my shame etc, so I'm not sure what that game has to offer in terms of ideas. I should get some stable copies of shit together and play it through regardless, but does anybody else have anything to add about them?

Edited by Rehab
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I kept going ooooooo. I like the council of 12 idea for the Lopts it will make them seem more spread out and evil. I will rework the Aztec events to make child hunts. Reforming the Lopt is a great idea and makes sense because even Levin/Holsey says their religion had saints. The Jewish events are going to come in handy. I am feeling more positive about the Lopts who I also planned to just drop in the Yied desert(a king title for kicks).

To start from k_Thracia why not make it an empire? Or Lief simply moved his primary title to Thracia after the war? In short it's just like Spain 1066, even separate cultures for the Manster union. Thracia will be poorer but more stable/loyal + dibs on mercenaries.

I am not so sure about army size and holdings (they are barons in FE4 right? Remember Alvis's baron army?). I like small armies ATM and terrain defence will be buffed forests, hills and mountains like 1,2,3 (vanilla is 0,1,2).

About incest yeah I have events dealing with holy blood and I made twins both allowed to inherit major (only 1 kid per family normally) so twinsest is on the horizon unless I now nerf it with events. Thanks. Here are what bonuses you get from Holy Blood. I am thinking of making minor inherit chance 80 or 75 to spruce things up but ATM I'm testing.

Baldur_major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 4
martial = 2
intrigue = 2
stewardship = 2
}
Baldur_minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 2
martial = 1
intrigue = 1
stewardship = 1
}
odo_major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 4
intrigue = 6
}
odo_minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 2
intrigue = 3
}
Hezul major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 4
martial = 6
}
Hezul minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 2
martial = 3
}
Noba major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 6
martial = 4
}
Noba minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 3
martial = 2
}
Dain major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 10
}
Dain minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 5
}
Neir major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 4
martial = 6
}
Neir minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 2
martial = 3
}
Ulir major= {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 4
stewardship = 6
}
Ulir minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 2
stewardship = 3
}
Fala major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 4
learning = 6
}
Fala minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 2
learning = 3
}
Tordo major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 4
intrigue = 6
}
Tordo minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 2
intrigue = 3
}
Forseti major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 10
}
Forseti minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 5
}
Naga major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 2
learning = 8
}
Naga minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 1
learning = 4
}
Loptyr major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 2
learning = 8
}
Loptyr minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 1
learning = 4
}
Blaggi major = {
inherit_chance = 20
health = 2
learning = 6
stewardship = 2
}
Blaggi minor = {
inherit_chance = 99
health = 1
learning = 3
stewardship = 1
}

Holy weapons will be found on an adventure/pilgrimage something your you/son/daughter can partake from 16-?. "Your son has stolen a rulers Holtsey!", "Your daughter has harassed troops", "you've found _____!". I just like to imagine that's how all fire emblems bloody start.
I had an idea for the Blaggi Tower but couldn't make it work so i'll keep silent. Yied will have sloooooow movement, high attrition like the HIP mod. I need to continue Thracia someday too. But yeah thanks for the ideas they are scrumptious.
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since Lenster, Manster, Alster and Conote are meant to be the Irish provinces of Leinster, Munster, Ulster and Connacht just copy paste them

I can't imagine editing that map is that fun.

The child hunts from FE5 seem the most obvious but perhaps hordes could be formed by the Twelve Warlords/Deadlords - that or characters could succumb to a trait of corruption from the warlords? Basically what Rehab said.

Were you thinking of anything fancy with the De Jure duchies/kingdoms or just the standard boundaries we can see on the map provided for FE4?

I think this was the Ritter thing you were talking about, Rehab? Though I'm not entirely sure it was the thing you were looking for. I have no idea, as well. http://www.fireemblemwiki.org/Knight_brigades_of_Grannvale

That wiki and the other would probably be useful for ideas if you read through them, too. I like the details on the number of enemies in each castle on the bottom of the nations screen of the first link.

Edited by Tryhard
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since Lenster, Manster, Alster and Conote are meant to be the Irish provinces of Leinster, Munster, Ulster and Connacht just copy paste them

Don't forget Meace should've been Meath~

This all looks fantastic.

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Ah yeah, that's what I had in mind, danke Tryhard. Maybe owning the given province could give you access to the respective ones as a mercenary group? Whatever works.

-Oh, and in clicking around the wiki I managed to get reminded that pilgrimages to Blagi Tower "for the wealthy and faithful" were a thing (and that the Orgahil were set up to defend travellers from the other pirates, who would raid those pilgrims).

-And rereading, I'd forgotten that Blagi Tower itself is a reminder that not all Loptyrians are evil, having been built in dedication to the traitor bro of Loptyr, Maira. Maybe Mairism could be a heresy of the Lopt Cult? And (this is all according to designer's notes, I think), Blagi built the tower to revive "the old Earthen religion," so would it be it was simultaneously holy for Eddans and "pagans?" Or is it the case that the Church of Edda is basically Jugdrali paganism, and it just also has the Twelve Crusaders as deity figures? If that's not the case, what actually is the religion of the Twelve Crusaders called again? Fuck, this could get complicated

-I'd also forgotten that originally, magic in the form of spellbooks and staves actually came from the Lopt, specifically the bishop Galle who made a blood pact with Loptyr. Some modifiers could probably be gleaned from that, at the very least.

-Oh oh, and I'm wondering how the Valkyrie Staff could be handled. And just if it could be.

Edited by Rehab
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Don't forget Meace should've been Meath~

how could I forget?

I found this page very helpful in terms of a timeline between Archanea, Valencia and Jugdral - though a lot of it is separate from each other and it is speculation, still kind of interesting. If nothing else should give you an overview of the history of Jugdral on the left side. Pretty basic but I don't think the game laid down too much foundation either. Most of the events of Archanea and Valencia appear to take place afterwards.

http://www.fireemblemwiki.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Archanea,_Valentia_and_Jugdral

Galle, for example, travelled to Archanea, and as above was the first with a blood pact with Loptyr.

Another possibility could be a event chain for another Miracle of Darna or a similiar effect should Lopt get too strong aka how the Twelve Crusaders were total badass. Indeed, this was pretty much the origin of Holy Blood. Perhaps if a certain percentage or above of the land is currently of the Lopt religion?

Mairism as a heresy of the Lopt Cult sounds cool.

so would it be it was simultaneously holy for Eddans and "pagans?" Or is it the case that the Church of Edda is basically Jugdrali paganism, and it just also has the Twelve Crusaders as deity figures? If that's not the case, what actually is the religion of the Twelve Crusaders called again? Fuck, this could get complicated

I don't know if there was a name or if it was encompassed in Edda, but the Twelve Crusaders got their powers from Naga and co. so would it be worshipping of the Divine Dragons? Then again, I think Naga was eventually considered a god in Jugdral anyway, so a religion like such would probably involve Naga - and Blagi formed the Church of Edda, so I don't even know.

"After the Empire was destroyed, Blagi went back to his Mairist home town that saved and nurtured him. However, that land was already destroyed by the Imperial army, and what struck his eyes was the dispersed corpses of priests. Suprised and terrified, he went on to save the ruined world, and in order to release the people from the aftereffects of the Loptyrian Church, strived to revive the old Earthen religion. This was because it was the one and only religion for the people who are put in a place against Loptyr, and the Mairist bishops were also wishing for it. At that point, Blagi constructed a new church with his homeland of Edda as the base location, and at the same time constructed a gigantic tower at the island that protected and nurtured him." from the developer's notes.

Some very good stuff here.

http://old.serenesforest.net/general/designer4_1.html

http://old.serenesforest.net/general/designer4_2.html

Edited by Tryhard
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I don't know much about this game, but I see a lot of in-depth analysis of the countries and traditions of Jugdral.

You know, there's a page for each country in the FE: Treasure book that describes the country in a fair amount of detail (although maybe not much you wouldn't know from playing the game) and it even lists the types of common occupations. Sadly the info is all in Japanese, but maybe I could translate the occupations when I have time.

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I don't know much about this game, but I see a lot of in-depth analysis of the countries and traditions of Jugdral.

You know, there's a page for each country in the FE: Treasure book that describes the country in a fair amount of detail (although maybe not much you wouldn't know from playing the game) and it even lists the types of common occupations. Sadly the info is all in Japanese, but maybe I could translate the occupations when I have time.

It's a grand strategy game normally set during the middle ages based on the feudal system - you take control of a family and control everyone in that succession while trying to do the best for your empire/country/dukedom/provinces over multiple characters. The whole feudal part is a nice fit with FE4, considering the dukedoms and such. Fun game, generally focused on politics, religion, warfare/combat, though it is abstracted etc.

Unfortunately I don't know too much about FE4/FE5 despite beating them a couple times.

Did you know if there was anything specifically on the 'religions' past those developer's notes on there, Vincent? Since any information on particular holy sites (I think Darna should count as one) or if there actually was a religion involving the Twelve Crusaders could be interesting to know, if there was anything. Cheers.

I see you updated the OP with another image, Pou, unless I missed it the first time. I take it that's the provinces? Looks really good!

Edited by Tryhard
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Ah ish sorry didn't see your comment. Yeah those are the provinces I am thinking of making a few island provinces to shore up Orgahil. The squares are in response to your question about possible conflict zones. I am now polishing off the map (I am really looking forward to doing Silesia). I want to put the alpha out but I'm busy translating other CK2 mods into english trying to get some e-reputation. I SWEAR ON THE SACRIMENTS IF CHARLEMAGNE F'S UP MY MOD ...

Blaggi Staff will only work on characters turned into stone. I know how to make people immoral but as far as "so-so died in battle continue from end date" I think it's beyond what we are alloted as modders. I got new pics but here are some that will NOT make the mod lol. It will probably use custom sets of portraits.

f1ay50.jpg

2hwfmmx.jpg

Edited by Pou
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Problem with using custom portraits outright, I think, would be that new children and such would look really weird - a lot more realistic than FE4's artstyle. I think the normal sets will cover the cast just fine - second guy honestly looks kind of like Jamka in my view.

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I agree (after testing out eyes) that the vanilla portraits are the best but the hair is lacking.

2q884kx.jpg

Here are a few renders I did this morning um. I found it's really easy working with lighter colours but not so good with darker.

alternatively there is a mod coming out that deals with the whole issue. But we remain forever in toon.

https://38.media.tumblr.com/459200979f1c993589ec8e10b545a59f/tumblr_n92u52aWTt1twvsceo1_r1_1280.jpg

https://38.media.tumblr.com/76deddfe7ffd83a67decfa271c3cb7ee/tumblr_n92t477sit1twvsceo1_1280.jpg

https://31.media.tumblr.com/8c8a53037942f98d1bab9932b4ba0717/tumblr_n94af9hpgw1twvsceo1_1280.jpg

EDIT: I just connected Yied to Yid ... I'm not jewish but I'm beginning to wonder ...

Edited by Pou
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  • 8 months later...
  • 2 years later...
  • 2 months later...

Apologies for reviving this, but I'm happy you Serenes folks noticed my mod. :D: Wasn't sure how much overlap there was between the diehard FE and CK2 fans.

It's progressing kind of slowly since it's mainly just me working on it in my spare time (with help from a few other kind souls every now and then), but it is slowly getting more polished. Or at least getting more features added. I have a new version up with more Jugdral stuff like the holy weapons, a Loptyrian sect, and some events for the early plot of FE4. The link Pou posted still points to the latest version. Please take it for a spin if you're interested.

If anyone here has feedback, ideas, or funny screenshots (like King Claud of Grannvale? How did THAT happen?), I'm all ears.

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