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West vs East themes

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Ah, right. Sorry I probably got a bit direct there, when people mention Romans I automatically think to super stereotypical Romans.

It's fine, don't worry about it haha.

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That would be awesome, with the style of our current artist I doubt we'll see most of that sadly, but bits and pieces may show up.

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I for sure don't want to see a good vs evil thing. War is pretty grey and I'd like the side I chose to feel like the right side for me not like the side I had to pick because the other people were dicks. I'd love for some kind of reward for doing all the bonus chapters or something to be able to unit to the two forces against what ever is creating the monsters if that is a third force. I love an ending where I can get everyone on my side despite the disagreements we might of had (Like Overclocked Devil Path.)

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That would be awesome, with the style of our current artist I doubt we'll see most of that sadly, but bits and pieces may show up.

Kozaki will do broad strokes, but he's more into stylized designs with flair. Actually, the Eastern faction's designs remind me a bit of the characters from Samurai Warriors that have a grounding in reality, but then add some over-the-top elements to really make them pop. Sometimes they get gaudy, but mostly they add a lot of personality to the visuals.

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That makes some amount of sense, maybe it'll become clearer when we see more footage/pictures. I guess I'm one of the few who got a semi roman feel from part of the army

Hey we all have preferences, I personally don't like the stechhelm too much, but I defend it in terms of Awakening because people tend to say its not a realistic helmet when it actually was if that makes sense.

Yeah, if I get to talk about one of my favorite designs from awakening, since for all the ludicrous designs awakening has (the ones that don't make sense. like the cavaliers collars, or whatever you wanna call them), the snipers has to be one of my favorite designs, with a gothic style breastplate, and while I don't think the helm is based on any historic ones? I still kinda like it, it kinda reminded me of gaidens snipers for some reason (suddenly wishing that awakenings snipers would have pulled their bow out of their chest).

Buff coat eh? That would be pretty neat

Yeah, I thought what would have been the most accessible kind of armor (outside of mail), that the common man would use on his travels, and I think it would be a buff coat.

I just hope there isn't gonna be katana glorification (or for a European sword for that matter), I see enough of those on other discussions I'm on, after all, it's basically a two handed short saber (and yes I know how it's made, though only in theory)... and I hope I didn't just spark an argument "which sword is superior".

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I wonder if there will be characters that are from "minor" cultures that have their own unique designs. Now we know this is East vs. West but there's still characters from the Middle East, Northern Europe, Steppes, etc. Maybe they can pull some from other time periods such as Classical Greece! Fire Emblem has always had wanderers and mercenary characters that are recruited through gold or just visiting obscure villages on the map.

I think Warriors Orochi 3 did it pretty well. It had Sengoku Jidai and Three Kingdoms characters and some outsiders like Joan of Arc and Achilles showing up as playable.

Edited by IGdood

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I think both sides at the beginning will be antagonize toward the Avatar/Protag, toward the end of the trailer when that knight and that samurai is fighting we seen the dancer again. This led to me to think that the dancer girl perhaps served as some mcguffin role with something about her that the both factions want. The Shepherd or whatever our main group will be called in the game will be the 3rd party that help her, both sides will probably be the Valm of this game. Plus the MCs will most definitely be from the Western's side seeing the way Kamui(Avatar?) dressed and that he had a maid.

Edited by Awakener_

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I wonder if there will be characters that are from "minor" cultures that have their own unique designs. Now we know this is East vs. West but there's still characters from the Middle East, Northern Europe, Steppes, etc. Maybe they can pull some from other time periods such as Classical Greece! Fire Emblem has always had wanderers and mercenary characters that are recruited through gold or just visiting obscure villages on the map.

I think Warriors Orochi 3 did it pretty well. It had Sengoku Jidai and Three Kingdoms characters and some outsiders like Joan of Arc and Achilles showing up as playable.

That could be really cool, I'd love to have an Arabian fighter on my side.

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I wonder if there will be characters that are from "minor" cultures that have their own unique designs. Now we know this is East vs. West but there's still characters from the Middle East, Northern Europe, Steppes, etc. Maybe they can pull some from other time periods such as Classical Greece! Fire Emblem has always had wanderers and mercenary characters that are recruited through gold or just visiting obscure villages on the map.

I think Warriors Orochi 3 did it pretty well. It had Sengoku Jidai and Three Kingdoms characters and some outsiders like Joan of Arc and Achilles showing up as playable.

Warriors Orochi 3 was a COMPLETELY different beast. They were throwing in mythological characters, fictional characters, and Ryuu Freaking Hayabusa. It was like Super Robot Wars or Project X Zone; plot and coherency played second fiddle to stupidly awesome, bat-buggering-insane spectacle.

I don't think we'll get Mongols, Chinese, Korean, etc in terms of other cultures. It's probably going to be samurai vs Age of Exploration Imperialist nations modeled after empires like Spain, Britain, France, etc.

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I just hope there isn't gonna be katana glorification (or for a European sword for that matter), I see enough of those on other discussions I'm on, after all, it's basically a two handed short saber (and yes I know how it's made, though only in theory)... and I hope I didn't just spark an argument "which sword is superior".

While Katanas are awesome yes I hope there isn't a specific glorification. All swords are designed for different means and are equally beautiful (I like swords lol).

Kozaki will do broad strokes, but he's more into stylized designs with flair. Actually, the Eastern faction's designs remind me a bit of the characters from Samurai Warriors that have a grounding in reality, but then add some over-the-top elements to really make them pop. Sometimes they get gaudy, but mostly they add a lot of personality to the visuals.

Yeah I got a Samurai Warriors vibe too, which I don't mind. I actually like Kozaki's stylized designs truth be told.

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I'm a huge fan of this theme, especially since it's going to increase the type of design and classes we have for the character. It's amazing it took so long for the Fire Emblem series to delve so deeply in the Eastern design roots, although people like the swordmaster had that influence in the last game.

This might be much, but I'd love the game to be a metaphor for the clash between Eastern (Japanese) gaming and Western (North American) gaming that has been going on for the last decade. As the Japanese market has declined, an increased amount of focus has been in North America. Nintendo stands alone almost as a developer completely unaffected by this shift, perhaps to their own detriment. This really isnt Nintendo's style but it's what I thought of when I first saw this theme.

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While Katanas are awesome yes I hope there isn't a specific glorification. All swords are designed for different means and are equally beautiful (I like swords lol).

European sabers are probably my favorite type of sword, but generally, I agree with you, that all types of swords can be incredibly beautiful.

I don't know if I have just been unlucky, or if there just happen to be a lot of people buying into eastern mysticism, quite often if I'm in an argument about certain weapons, someone starts to argue how the katana is the most awesome thing to ever exist.

And your other point, yeah, most swords fulfill their purpose and that's why they became popular and known.

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I'm loving this theme, I like the aesthetics and the armour and the weapons. I just hope we don't have any designs like the Awakening knights.

I just hope there isn't gonna be katana glorification (or for a European sword for that matter), I see enough of those on other discussions I'm on, after all, it's basically a two handed short saber (and yes I know how it's made, though only in theory)... and I hope I didn't just spark an argument "which sword is superior".

I think this thinking of Katanas being better than Western swords comes from the complicated process in making them and all the advanced techniques in smithing, but the reason for this was that Japan didn't have much good quality metals so they needed advanced sword-making techniques to compete with their overseas enemies.

Besides, Ulfberhts are the most advanced swords.

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European sabers are probably my favorite type of sword, but generally, I agree with you, that all types of swords can be incredibly beautiful.

I don't know if I have just been unlucky, or if there just happen to be a lot of people buying into eastern mysticism, quite often if I'm in an argument about certain weapons, someone starts to argue how the katana is the most awesome thing to ever exist.

And your other point, yeah, most swords fulfill their purpose and that's why they became popular and known.

Well we can blame fiction for that, I just love katanas because of their design honestly.

Katana's can only cut light armor and obviously limbs very easily and they break quickly when you clash them against another blade. Which isn't widely known.

a Claymore obviously can just smash armor if they are given a chance etc.

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Yeah I got a Samurai Warriors vibe too, which I don't mind. I actually like Kozaki's stylized designs truth be told.

funny thing is, one of the most RIDICULOUS designs from Samurai Warriors is Naoe's kanji helmet. Which actually existed:

Noae_Kanetugu_Yoroi.jpgYeah, someone actually wore this. Which is kind of awesome. Reality is stranger than fiction indeed.

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I think this thinking of Katanas being better than Western swords comes from the complicated process in making them and all the advanced techniques in smithing, but the reason for this was that Japan didn't have much good quality metals so they needed advanced sword-making techniques to compete with their overseas enemies.

Besides, Ulfberhts are the most advanced swords.

I wouldn't call it advanced, since if I remember correctly, Japan begun producing Katanas about 800 AD (yes, they had Tachis before that but they are a bit different), and they used a technique known as heath welding, which had been used in Europe since 300 BC. And Ulfberths you mention, you can call the European perfection of this technique, to which they added a twist, no pun intended (and yes, it's suspected they also twisted the bar they made to make the Ulfberths), although this technique is known as pattern welding, and justifiably so because the end result is beautiful.

And the reason Europeans ditched this technique was because they had better steel and they invented blast furnaces, and it was cheaper to make a blade from one homogeneous ingot and it was also more durable than a blade made from two different grades of steel

a Claymore obviously can just smash armor if they are given a chance etc.

Although true, I would rather use a mace, a war-hammer or a war-ax to bash armor than nick my blade

Katana's can only cut light armor and obviously limbs very easily and they break quickly when you clash them against another blade. Which isn't widely known.

The breaking part of a katana is an unfortunate side-effect in the way it's made, since it's made from two grades of steel, a lower grade which is not hardened, and thus softer, used for the back, and a hard edge, harder than any European smith would make it, which gives it a stiff blade, but if it's bent, it will stay bent. Due to it's hardness it's also prone to chipping on the edge, and well, if one would be unlucky enough could brake in half.

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I really don't see why we're having sword arguments here, but really no sword is meant to be used to clash against other swords. It dulls the edge of any blade, and is to be avoided at all costs.

Also, swords tend to be made for different purposes. Katanas are meant to go cleanly through one's heart, not to cut someone's head off. Different properties, different uses.

(Speaking as a non=professional, here.)

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I really don't see why we're having sword arguments here, but really no sword is meant to be used to clash against other swords. It dulls the edge of any blade, and is to be avoided at all costs.

Also, swords tend to be made for different purposes. Katanas are meant to go cleanly through one's heart, not to cut someone's head off. Different properties, different uses.

(Speaking as a non=professional, here.)

Katanas are primarily cutting swords so I don't see how one could just run through an opponent since the katana has very limited thrusting potential. And edge contact is on many occasions inevitable, since you would most likely parry with your blade rather than get injured.

And sorry for getting off topic.

But the thing that I really hope, and since they have said that the players decisions are going to matter, I really hope they won't make one side outright evil, if you get to pick your side, because I can see it being well done, but if it's going to be something like, one side is good and you can join them, on the other hand these other people are evil and you can also aid their cause, I'll be sorely disappointing. If they do the latter could it be offensive to westerners or Asians? maybe. I just really hope, that if you can pick your side, both have good motivations and it's more about the cultures interacting with each other.

I hope I'm not expecting to much, cause I agree with most people here, it would be fun to the different cultures and perhaps even subcultures interact with each other.

Edited by that one person

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Swords are a topic I like to delve into and that one person and I were already discussing armor so it kinda just went to blades.

But the thing that I really hope, and since they have said that the players decisions are going to matter, I really hope they won't make one side outright evil, if you get to pick your side, because I can see it being well done, but if it's going to be something like, one side is good and you can join them, on the other hand these other people are evil and you can also aid their cause, I'll be sorely disappointing. If they do the latter could it be offensive to westerners or Asians? maybe. I just really hope, that if you can pick your side, both have good motivations and it's more about the cultures interacting with each other.

I hope I'm not expecting to much, cause I agree with most people here, it would be fun to the different cultures and perhaps even subcultures interact with each other.

It would be really cool if both sides have good parts to em, it would make the game a bit bittersweet and grey. Haven't seen much of that in an FE

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This person analyzed katanas vs. longswords. Maybe it'll shed some light? Katanas would be low use, high crit, need a high weapon level....vice versa for regular swords.

aEGm1go_700b_v1.jpg

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funny thing is, one of the most RIDICULOUS designs from Samurai Warriors is Naoe's kanji helmet. Which actually existed:

Yeah, someone actually wore this. Which is kind of awesome. Reality is stranger than fiction indeed.

It's not even the most ridiculous design. I have seen samurai helmet with a worm on it. The variations with crab, shrimp are also available.

This person analyzed katanas vs. longswords. Maybe it'll shed some light? Katanas would be low use, high crit, need a high weapon level....vice versa for regular swords.

I will add these:

_Katana's damage will be lower against heavy armored enemy.

_Katana is more expensive than long sword.

Edited by Magical Amber

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This person analyzed katanas vs. longswords. Maybe it'll shed some light? Katanas would be low use, high crit, need a high weapon level....vice versa for regular swords.

aEGm1go_700b_v1.jpg

I've seen this but there are a few things that I would argue with, like the weight, that the katanas are more maneuverable, since the weight of the katana was around I believe 1,1-1,4 kg, while the longsword was on avarage something like 1,1-1,7 kg, if I don't completely missremember, so they are very close, but the katana also tends to feel a bit heavier because of the different balance.

The point of balance is different in the blades, for the longsword closer to the hilt, and for the katana closer to the tip, if someone is used to use a longsword picks up a katana, there is a chance it's going to feel like a baseball bat for them and vice versa.

And, if you measure the time it takes for the fastest moving part of the blade to hit an opponent, the longsword is technically faster, because it's longer, the point furthest from the hands moves the fastest, this is though the thin point, which can have slight difficulty sufficiently injuring an enemy, and the time it takes to hit an enemy with the parts of the blade you do cut with are close to the same if not identical

And also, the longswords weren't blunt, they were sharp blades, katanas just have better edge retention due to the harder steel. Though the other point is true, half-swording for both the katana and longsword, and the reverse gripp for the longsword.

Also, due to the fat blade and tip of the katana, your not going to thrust through mail, which was how the longsword was used against armor, thrusting through gaps in the armor, and the longsword during the periods of hardened and tempered steel armor, became pointer to be able to go through mail. Although neither of this blades are going to do significant damage to armor, especially not the high medieval armor, which is made out of springy steel, this is why they made specialized weapons for that, like maces and war-hammers.

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This is a rather fascinating discussion. Please keep it up. But speaking of Hammers...

There weren't any poleaxes or hammers in awakening

There are so Hammers in Awakening. Anyone who's ever tried to play Lunatic(+) without a guide has a certain Hammer using Fighter in Cht.1 permenantly ingrained in their memory. He's so prolific we even have a nickname for him (Hammertime).

Hammertime is going to get you on your next playthrough for disrespecting him.

Also speaking of Hammers, trying to beat Apo using nothing but Hammers is both a hilarious and very difficult challenge.

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A sword that would be fun if they took a bit of inspiration from, but probably wont, is the Indian pata, or gauntlet sword, its basically a sword you mount on your wrist, predominately used for cutting, I believe.

And if I'm not entirely wrong, these were used for combat.

Edit: I think it's used for cutting, because of how it locks your wrist, you can't move your hand, and your relying in your elbow and other body movement, which makes thrusting more difficult (that you can't move your wrist).

And think how fun it would look like to have a merc jumping around with it.

how it looks like:

hTej6RN.jpg

dEJoexk.jpg

how it's held:

MrA3zEO.jpg

Edited by that one person

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