Quickhammer Mafia - Game Over

[Refakitty³]

Fair enough.

To be honest, if Jaraxxus voted me he would retroactively shoot up to my #1 lynch target even if it wasn't hammer, because Meta In Anonymous Games .

[Refakitty³]

Anyway, one more point against dondont.

i didn't think you were scum, i knew you were scum. evidently, you did not look that hard into my statement. i am also not limited by shots, so there is no need for me to claim given the following

He says he didn't need to claim.

And indeed, as the Town Rolecop, dondont would not have needed to claim. He would have just needed to push me and get me lynched without ever claiming his role.

But he didn't. He did nothing to argue I was scum until he claimed anyway. And why would dondont claim anyway if he had reasoned out it was detrimental for him to claim being a power role?

Because he's not actually the Town Rolecop.

[Cú Chulainn]

Just posting to say that I trust Wadatsumi over Dondont, since Wadatsumi is a townread of mine on effort/content if I guessed who he is right, and I don't like Dondont's change of opinion on him either. I'll look into it when I have time to though.

[SB.]

Votecount 2.2
Wadatsumi (3): dondont151, Supreme Intelligence, Sanaki (L-1!)

Sanaki (2): Noerin, Phantom of the Opera

dondont151 (1): Wadatsumi,

Not Voting (1): Jaraxxus

There are roughly 48 hours left in the phase. With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Countdown.

[Cú Chulainn]

##unvote

##Vote: Dondont

I've read the thread and I don't get how people chose to believe Dondont over Wadatsumi.

As Wadatsumi pointed out, Dondont's play doesn't match the supposed guilty he got. Also, the way he's pushing Wadatsumi comes across as too agressive and based on painting him as scummy. Look at this post for instance. It feels like Dondont is getting into a personal battle against Wadatsumi instead of a battle to determine who is scum.

On the other hand, Wadatsumi has been bringing up legit points against Dondont the whole D2.

Oh, and @Dondont: why did you choose to rolecop Wadatsumi?

Don't like how he gives no explanation of that. If you get into a 1vs1 against someone else who you have a guilty on you'd at least want to bring up the points that made you rolecop them in the first place as evidence against them.

@Supreme Intelligence: can you please explain your change of heart regarding Wadatsumi, and why Dondont is townier than him now when he was null before? Also I don't agree that Dondont's play makes sense as town rolecop, why would he not push his guilty at all?

[Marisa Kirisame]

Sanaki brings up a good point in that dondont as scum would've just kept quite and shot Wadatsumi instead of going for a 1v1, how this never occurred to me, I'll never know.

Scum!dondont turning around on their Wadatsumi read and claiming a guilty on them out of no where , all the while knowing that they have a good chance of losing the 1v1, just seems highly unlikely to me.

Wadatsumi crumbing cop shouldn't be taken as an alignment tell, Noerin, which you seem to be doing, but I say this because the scum!rolecop would want to seem more legit than the other, so leaving crumbs to be the 'legit one' isn't a stretch if you ask me.

I wouldn't say my read has 'turned around' on Wadatsumi but more like, they're in a 1v1 with dondont, whose actions I highly doubt are from a scum perspective, hence my vote's where it is.

[Cú Chulainn]

@SI: I'm talking about a lot but I don't have real thoughts on Wadatsumi's crumb. What

Do you think Dondont didn't pick on Wadatsumi's crumb? Do you think Dondont's timing for his claim, just a few posts after Wadatsumi's crumb, was random?

[Cú Chulainn]

Oh. Again, @SI: Why would town!Dondont reveal his guilty at the precise moment he did? Which motivations do you think he had? What do you think he wanted to accomplish?

[Rain Nijika]

Also, the speculation about me playing more like a 1-shot rolecop is arbitrary and bad, since there's no 1-shot town cop in this set-up.

But I'm not playing like a 1-shot scum rolecop. I'm just playing like a town rolecop, 1-shot or otherwise.

I can't stress enough how much a theoretical town dondont wouldn't have cared about the game state after outing his guilty. Town Wadatsumi would have.

I should also point out that dondont claiming not to think I'm scum isn't a crumb. It's a town read he had to backpedal on.

My breadcrumb is much clearer.

what i meant was that you are not playing the way a limitless town cop would. if you were attempting to play poker and got a royal flush in your first draw, you do not throw all your beans into the table immediately. the same ideal can be applied towards your play today; there is no benefit towards you jumping up and down to remind us all that you think i'm mafia. instead, you gave mafia all the information they need without ever saying anything, and in a scenario where you were town cop, you'd be shot on the spot tonight regardless of the flip.

how does this even make sense?

your breadcrumbs did not need to be that clear. i cannot state this any more clearly; the phase is not even halfway through, you had no need to behave the way you did as town cop. if you were town rolecop and you were to flip, as i said already, town would dissect every one of your posts in what is now a six page game, not to mention the future posts you make for the remainder of this phase. you throwing out a crumb in every post you make does not make you any more likely to be town today than i am for not smothering everybody with information that a four year old watching scooby doo could identify in their sleep. if it were to come to a point where you just push for my lynch and i had turned out to be vanilla instead of rolecop, you could just as easily take your words and say "it was a reaction test to see what would happen. i never claimed anything, all i did was apply pressure."

Anyway, I was planning to do this when claiming, so let's look at the other players with dondont's alignment in mind.

Jaraxxus: I dunno about this dude.

At first I thought he was town, but I think Sanaki's points here are pretty valid.

Also, maybe it's just me, but it makes me kind of uneasy how he stopped responding to me when I made my crumb, only for dondont to fakeclaim soon after. I would like Jaraxxus' explanation for this.

Still, I can't shake off the feeling he's too motivated to be scum.

Would consider lynching.

Noerin: I can't seem to get a strong read on Noerin. She posts a bunch of words that are basically OK.

But it feels to me that dondont was like, trying to set her up to look bad with that prod vote here.

Not very interested in lynching this dudette.

Phantom of the Opera: This dude is pretty scummy. Like, in Phantom post here, he mentions dondont, but tip-toes around saying anything meaningful about him.

When Phantom posts again here, he acts like dondont is kind of scummy, but doesn't commit to anything, which is, like, really convenient if the two are scum.

Both of his posts end in small comments about other players which pad out the post, but, like, don't actually mean anything. I don't like this.

Also, it's pretty shifty how dondont gets irritated at me for calling him out as a lurker here.

Would lynch.

Sanaki: Sanaki is pretty town I also love signing up for anonymafia and softclaming my identity in every post.

Really though, I like this dude. I think there's a sense of honesty in his posts which he wouldn't have as scum, even though he lacks conviction.

In fact, the lack of conviction can easily be explained by his apparent rustiness.

I also doubt he would be, like, drawing attention to dondont with a potentially hypocritical case about not checking the votals if the two players were buddies.

The way dondont asks for elaboration on my ED1 case on Sanaki (#36) but, like, doesn't try to get involved with it is like dondont wanted Sanaki to be a mislynch, but didn't want to be the one pushing it.

Wouldn't lynch.

Supreme Intelligence: Don't really like this dude anymore.

His post here was reasonable, but, like, if he really thought my early play was townie (#60) and picked up on my crumb (#86), I would think he would have, like, raised more points in my favor instead of just going along with dondont immediately.

Also, in #86, he doesn't really give good reasons for why I supposedly handled my claim poorly, and doesn't explain what more I could have done with the info in my hand.

Would lynch.

Personally, I would lynch dondont, roleblock Jaraxxus, then go Phantom -> Supreme Intelligence.

But that's just me.

Of course, if the 1-shot roleblocker claims after dondont flips scum, we have at least one more clear.

this casing would be fine if you were not building every one of your reads with a yet-to-occur associative flip as the foundation for it. town does not need to spend this day looking for associative reads when they don't have definitive information on the alignment of either cop claim

I should also note that my crumb to Jaraxxus was made with, like, the expectation the player would pick up on it and probably sheep me.

Reminder that dondont's handling of his "guilty" is objectively worse for the town than mine.

you constantly spouting that your handling is superior over mine turns your "objective" argument into a subjective one

Anyway, one more point against dondont.

He says he didn't need to claim.

And indeed, as the Town Rolecop, dondont would not have needed to claim. He would have just needed to push me and get me lynched without ever claiming his role.

But he didn't. He did nothing to argue I was scum until he claimed anyway. And why would dondont claim anyway if he had reasoned out it was detrimental for him to claim being a power role?

Because he's not actually the Town Rolecop.

you still have yet to argue why i should be dropping crumbs about my role and results with such ferocity rather than biding my time and releasing info as it would become necessary as the day progresses

if i were to come into the thread and just squawk like a parrot "wadatsumi is scum, just vote him, look everything he's said is scummy and doesn't matter if it is actually town or not" every five minutes, the validity of my word would be reduced significantly to that of the boy who cried wolf. to speak over you would require more effort than i'm honestly willing to put into this game, and i would prefer not to repeat the same point constantly; i would rather spend my time during the game with what time i can focus on post analysis towards reading into the other players and try to determine information without having to speak over you to get those conclusions out in the open. since you have a mouth the size of a mammoth's, i opted for a more direct route.

at this point, i would hope that town can direct their focus in two directions; between me and wadatsumi, and amongst the remaining four (plus themselves) players, and worry about planning tomorrow's lynch tomorrow with associative reads and interactions being examined after evidence has hit the table. town would be stretching their thoughts thinly if they spend their efforts looking between the two of us, everyone else, and associative reads between two people who have yet to have their alignment confirmed. there is no need to rush things out, so don't act like there's a time clock with two hours on it when there's still two days remaining

it feels to me as though you are trying to capitalize on feigning contribution when you're in fact just in a hurry to have things go your way. rushing to get me lynched could have potentially ended the phase early, since you do not know the level of cooperation players would put in with you, and even if scum turbolynched one of their own, with the literal loaves you've dropped, you would unlikely to see the sunrise, meanwhile town would be left with a second phase cut short by what could be another accident. either way, at this point, unless the roleblocker hits the mafia shooter tonight, both of us are dying between this day phase and this night phase. the difference between you and i though is that i spent my time before making my role public looking around for other information, while you incidentally brought light onto your own alignment by keeping your tunnelvision aimed directly towards me, and claim to examine other players under the assumption that others will just follow your word. you portray yourself as defending town, but you're masking your own words with "by the way lynch him" openly placed into every argument you throw at me

##unvote

##Vote: Dondont

I've read the thread and I don't get how people chose to believe Dondont over Wadatsumi.

As Wadatsumi pointed out, Dondont's play doesn't match the supposed guilty he got. Also, the way he's pushing Wadatsumi comes across as too agressive and based on painting him as scummy. Look at this post for instance. It feels like Dondont is getting into a personal battle against Wadatsumi instead of a battle to determine who is scum.

On the other hand, Wadatsumi has been bringing up legit points against Dondont the whole D2.

Oh, and @Dondont: why did you choose to rolecop Wadatsumi?

Don't like how he gives no explanation of that. If you get into a 1vs1 against someone else who you have a guilty on you'd at least want to bring up the points that made you rolecop them in the first place as evidence against them.

if you think i am pushing wadatsumi too aggressively, yet you take sides with the player who has dedicated this entire phase to twisting every word i have said against me. are you looking at things objectively or subjectively

Oh. Again, @SI: Why would town!Dondont reveal his guilty at the precise moment he did? Which motivations do you think he had? What do you think he wanted to accomplish?

i recall somebody asking me this other than noerin, but i am not able to find the post in question. my reasons for claiming when and how i chose would fit nicely in a bullet list

• i suspected mafia on the wagon. noerin did not stand out as having done that much to this point, and i was townreading sanaki, leaving 2hu and wadatsumi, of whom the former appeared more town than the latter. i don't think i need to explain why i did not scan myself
• since the beginning of this phase, wadatsumi was devoting every single one of his posts to what appeared to be mindless tunneling, or what could be interpreted as a poor crumb dropping with a gambit in his head. these bias contributions only help the town if he would have been: the town role cop, only interested in lynching me, and doing it as quickly as possible
• with several players dissatisfied with my posting style, i opted to pursue a path of "actions speak louder than words" so to speak, and dropped the ball
• he is rushing for a quicklynch, which is the last thing town needs to stumble into again. the ramifications of an accidental second quicklynch are beyond terrible
• rather than have town expend efforts trying to interpret my posts, and sit by patiently while wadatsumi tries his heart out to get a dogpile on me as quickly as possible, i brought up my info under the assumption that wadatsumi would do nothing but call me scum and stuff his posts with filler
• from wadatsumi's pov, i am scum, but there is questionable benefit to the town for him to prolong the phase. with wadatsumi's aggressiveness towards me, the last thing i want is for players who just agree with him to pile votes on me while i sleep, resulting in another early ending phase

[Cú Chulainn]

So, people who are voting Wadatsumi: I want you to answer how the following points from Dondont's case make sense from his perspective.

- He is claiming that it makes no sense for Wadatsumi to push his guilty, claiming that's not the way a limitless rolecop would play. (Why not? I'd also push my guilty if I had one. That's the way you get people lynched)

- He says that it makes no sense for Wadatsumi to look for associative reads so early. (Why not? If I had a guilty, I'd begin looking for associative reads ASAP)

- Rushing his lynch (How? I don't see where Wadatsumi is attempting to get Dondont lynched in little time instead of pushing hard)

- Tunnel vision (Where? If you check Wadatsumi is the one who is trying to get reads on other people, not Dondont)

And that's all, at least in the last post. The rest is filler, personal attacks, fearmongering and self defense. Wow.

I know that it's kinda hard to objectively consider someone when they're basically screaming at you, but please, take a moment to reconsider. There is no way that Dondont is town.

[Cú Chulainn]

@Noerin: My problem with your vote is that Sanaki isn't really misrepresenting anything at all. Here's #26: http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=52063&p=3599967

They voted A True Friend for outright not contributing in the thread and stating that, in addition to finding them to be over reacting to a vote. Its true that ATF's behavior could be considered as that from either alignment in vacuum, but in that particular context, it would be quite hard to argue their behavior as that coming from a townie. Thus, I feel like you're nitpicking their vote in particular since there's less explanation to it. This looks scummy in my eyes.

My problem is, then, that you didn't pick on dondont's vote on ATF either. Why so? Their vote had even less explanation than Sanaki's. Also what of Wadatsumi? Was their stance on ATF reasonable? Their reasons for voting ATF were very similar to Sanaki's, except they had more posts of shorter sizes.

Forgot about this. It's hard to really determine why I think someone's vote is scummy as opposed from others, since I don't usually compare people's reasonings one by one. I can do it though, just point out which points from the others are similar to what I argued about Sanaki.

I think the point Sanaki made about ATF's reaction is null. The point I find scummy, and explained, is the other one: Sanaki voted ATF on not doing well, saying that his attitude benefited scum; while this proved to be true, I don't see how they saw it as scum play.

As you can see, this has nothing to do on how well explained the vote is, or the posting style.

[Refakitty³]

what i meant was that you are not playing the way a limitless town cop would. if you were attempting to play poker and got a royal flush in your first draw, you do not throw all your beans into the table immediately. the same ideal can be applied towards your play today; there is no benefit towards you jumping up and down to remind us all that you think i'm mafia. instead, you gave mafia all the information they need without ever saying anything, and in a scenario where you were town cop, you'd be shot on the spot tonight regardless of the flip.

how does this even make sense?

your breadcrumbs did not need to be that clear. i cannot state this any more clearly; the phase is not even halfway through, you had no need to behave the way you did as town cop. if you were town rolecop and you were to flip, as i said already, town would dissect every one of your posts in what is now a six page game, not to mention the future posts you make for the remainder of this phase. you throwing out a crumb in every post you make does not make you any more likely to be town today than i am for not smothering everybody with information that a four year old watching scooby doo could identify in their sleep. if it were to come to a point where you just push for my lynch and i had turned out to be vanilla instead of rolecop, you could just as easily take your words and say "it was a reaction test to see what would happen. i never claimed anything, all i did was apply pressure."

this casing would be fine if you were not building every one of your reads with a yet-to-occur associative flip as the foundation for it. town does not need to spend this day looking for associative reads when they don't have definitive information on the alignment of either cop claim

you constantly spouting that your handling is superior over mine turns your "objective" argument into a subjective one

you still have yet to argue why i should be dropping crumbs about my role and results with such ferocity rather than biding my time and releasing info as it would become necessary as the day progresses

if i were to come into the thread and just squawk like a parrot "wadatsumi is scum, just vote him, look everything he's said is scummy and doesn't matter if it is actually town or not" every five minutes, the validity of my word would be reduced significantly to that of the boy who cried wolf. to speak over you would require more effort than i'm honestly willing to put into this game, and i would prefer not to repeat the same point constantly; i would rather spend my time during the game with what time i can focus on post analysis towards reading into the other players and try to determine information without having to speak over you to get those conclusions out in the open. since you have a mouth the size of a mammoth's, i opted for a more direct route.

at this point, i would hope that town can direct their focus in two directions; between me and wadatsumi, and amongst the remaining four (plus themselves) players, and worry about planning tomorrow's lynch tomorrow with associative reads and interactions being examined after evidence has hit the table. town would be stretching their thoughts thinly if they spend their efforts looking between the two of us, everyone else, and associative reads between two people who have yet to have their alignment confirmed. there is no need to rush things out, so don't act like there's a time clock with two hours on it when there's still two days remaining

it feels to me as though you are trying to capitalize on feigning contribution when you're in fact just in a hurry to have things go your way. rushing to get me lynched could have potentially ended the phase early, since you do not know the level of cooperation players would put in with you, and even if scum turbolynched one of their own, with the literal loaves you've dropped, you would unlikely to see the sunrise, meanwhile town would be left with a second phase cut short by what could be another accident. either way, at this point, unless the roleblocker hits the mafia shooter tonight, both of us are dying between this day phase and this night phase. the difference between you and i though is that i spent my time before making my role public looking around for other information, while you incidentally brought light onto your own alignment by keeping your tunnelvision aimed directly towards me, and claim to examine other players under the assumption that others will just follow your word. you portray yourself as defending town, but you're masking your own words with "by the way lynch him" openly placed into every argument you throw at me

if you think i am pushing wadatsumi too aggressively, yet you take sides with the player who has dedicated this entire phase to twisting every word i have said against me. are you looking at things objectively or subjectively

i recall somebody asking me this other than noerin, but i am not able to find the post in question. my reasons for claiming when and how i chose would fit nicely in a bullet list

• i suspected mafia on the wagon. noerin did not stand out as having done that much to this point, and i was townreading sanaki, leaving 2hu and wadatsumi, of whom the former appeared more town than the latter. i don't think i need to explain why i did not scan myself
• since the beginning of this phase, wadatsumi was devoting every single one of his posts to what appeared to be mindless tunneling, or what could be interpreted as a poor crumb dropping with a gambit in his head. these bias contributions only help the town if he would have been: the town role cop, only interested in lynching me, and doing it as quickly as possible
• with several players dissatisfied with my posting style, i opted to pursue a path of "actions speak louder than words" so to speak, and dropped the ball
• he is rushing for a quicklynch, which is the last thing town needs to stumble into again. the ramifications of an accidental second quicklynch are beyond terrible
• rather than have town expend efforts trying to interpret my posts, and sit by patiently while wadatsumi tries his heart out to get a dogpile on me as quickly as possible, i brought up my info under the assumption that wadatsumi would do nothing but call me scum and stuff his posts with filler
• from wadatsumi's pov, i am scum, but there is questionable benefit to the town for him to prolong the phase. with wadatsumi's aggressiveness towards me, the last thing i want is for players who just agree with him to pile votes on me while i sleep, resulting in another early ending phase

Scum post.

[Refakitty³]

dondont's strategy is evidently to push bad play as the right way to play mafia, so, like, I don't really have anything to say to him since I'm not convincing him to vote himself.

If you have something you want me to respond to, then ask me.

[Rain Nijika]

So, people who are voting Wadatsumi: I want you to answer how the following points from Dondont's case make sense from his perspective.

- He is claiming that it makes no sense for Wadatsumi to push his guilty, claiming that's not the way a limitless rolecop would play. (Why not? I'd also push my guilty if I had one. That's the way you get people lynched)

- He says that it makes no sense for Wadatsumi to look for associative reads so early. (Why not? If I had a guilty, I'd begin looking for associative reads ASAP)

- Rushing his lynch (How? I don't see where Wadatsumi is attempting to get Dondont lynched in little time instead of pushing hard)

- Tunnel vision (Where? If you check Wadatsumi is the one who is trying to get reads on other people, not Dondont)

And that's all, at least in the last post. The rest is filler, personal attacks, fearmongering and self defense. Wow.

I know that it's kinda hard to objectively consider someone when they're basically screaming at you, but please, take a moment to reconsider. There is no way that Dondont is town.

i'm stating that wadatsumi is being reckless, which does not make sense for town's proprietary power role to do unless there is a fabulous reason to do so.

i'll make this short. from your point of view, there is a 50% chance that i am mafia. if town lynches me today and i were to flip mafia, wadatsumi's content could help find the other mafia. if town lynches me today and i flip town, it's because town thought wadatsumi was more town than i, for reasons including wadatsumi's long term fake content. you would turn right around and lynch him tomorrow. that would mean that you are lynching me because i am not voicing long term game thoughts hours after the phase starts. there is looking for associative reads and there is pushing associative reads, and wadatsumi is guilty of the latter, which while useful in theory, should only weigh for 50% of your decision to vote for him or i

you must not be reading the entirety of wadatsumi's posts if you do not see the desire from a turbolynch

[spoiler=all of wadatsumi's posts prior to my claim]

Obviously, we lynch dondont today and lynch Phantom of the Opera tomorrow for lurking through "deadline" and then we win. game 2ez

I would like every player in the game to read dondont151's posts and post their read on him. Even if they don't think he's scum.

But I mean, they still should totally vote him afterwards anyway.

dondont is mafia.

A turbolynch on scum, yes.

I would really like to be lynching dondont right now.

if i was not trying to get reads from other people, why was i posting votes and checking for reactions? don't forget that i've posted (albeit smaller in size than wadatsumi's) reads on living players, and i've even voted for you to gauge for reactions in finding the other mafia today. please do not tell me that i have done nothing to get reads on other people

[Refakitty³]

Sanaki brings up a good point in that dondont as scum would've just kept quite and shot Wadatsumi instead of going for a 1v1, how this never occurred to me, I'll never know.

This isn't a good point because, like, if dondont knew I was the Town Rolecop, and assumed I had a guilty on him, I would have outed that before the end of the day if people weren't sheeping me. Which would have gotten him lynched.

As I've said, a Mafia 1-Shot Roleblocker going into a night versus two power roles and four vanillas is much, much worse than both scum going into a night versus only the 1-Shot Roleblocker.

The roleblocker might even stop dondont's buddy from shooting me.

Scum!dondont turning around on their Wadatsumi read and claiming a guilty on them out of no where , all the while knowing that they have a good chance of losing the 1v1, just seems highly unlikely to me.

It makes perfect sense in the scenario I explained.

Wadatsumi crumbing cop shouldn't be taken as an alignment tell, Noerin, which you seem to be doing, but I say this because the scum!rolecop would want to seem more legit than the other, so leaving crumbs to be the 'legit one' isn't a stretch if you ask me.

Actually, it is an alignment tell. If only because dondont did not leave a crumb.

Also, my actions line up more with the play of a rolecop, since, like, why else would I go out of my way to make scum think I wasn't the rolecop in reaction to A True Friend's lynch?

dondont's breadcrumb is not a breadcrumb. He committed to a town-read on me, then when I pointed out that made no sense with his claim, he had to backpedal.

Like, "if only I thought you were scum" doesn't mean what dondont said it meant, because if dondont knows I am scum, he also thinks that I am scum.

btw Noerin I appreciate you defending me, but, like, is there a reason you've seemed uninterested in the game until now?

I dunno, I would've expected you as town to be trying to talk to others more in your earlier content today.

Don't really know how to word this.

[Refakitty³]

Also, Noerin, who do you think would be dondont's buddy?

[Cú Chulainn]

@Dondont: I don't see how those are attempts to get a turbolynch going and not just attempts to pick up people's attention? Specially if I guessed who Wadatsumi is right.

You were posting to look active and contributing. However, what I meant is that now you're the one who is tunnelling on Wadatsumi.

@Wadatsumi: How have I been uninterested in the game? Also I'm trying to get scum lynched, if that means defending you then I'll gladly do it.

As for Dondont's buddy... uh, I'm waiting for Sanaki and SI to post more. My Sanaki read feels weaker and I don't like some of SI's logic. I'm waiting to read more posts from them to get better reads. Other people are null though, not townreads.

[Refakitty³]

I dunno. Last night I realized who you probably are and I feel like as town you try to talk things out with town-reads more often.

Maybe it's just because you didn't get many posts out before dondont started this shit.

Is there a reason Phantom is just a null read to you?

I kept feeling like his content was pretty bad for reasons I've outlined.

Like, even independently of associations with dondont.

[Cú Chulainn]

Well, it's hard to talk with other people when other people aren't here.

I'll ISO Phantom (not now), but the first time I read him I noticed nothing telling. I haven't looked into him well enough though.

[Olivier]

I think it makes sense for scum!dondont to claim town!rolecop after Wadatsumi's crumb. At least that way scum!dondont would manage to survive for another day, whereas if he didn't claim he'd just be pointed out by the rolecop and lynched. This also explains why Wadatsumi was so into lynching dondont from the very beginning, his actions make sense from this point of view.

I don't see how Wadatsumi would gain anything by crumbing rolecop, because we'd know his alignment as soon as his target flipped after the lynch. His legitimacy would only last for the remaining of D2. Seems like a dangerous gambit for scum to take.

I'm more inclined to believing Wadatsumi's claim over dondont's.

##Vote: dondont151

[Kamina]

My content does lack somewhat in performance time, that much I cannot deny. Intelligece's vote and logic do not pertain to his name. The best case scenario leaves us in 4/1 timing compared to the worse 3/2 situation. The consideration of the outcome does not appear to have crossed his mind.

##unvote

##vote: dondont

dondont's reactions to Wadatsumi's claims are rather unsightly. I am not convinced by the crumbs he left, which could easily be a passing comment left by scum to fall back on. It does not make sense for scum to make such accusations in Wadatsumi's situation. If dondont were to flip town, it would mean that Wadatsumi would become prime lynch material the following day, leaving his partner in a 2/1 for the final day, which is less than ideal. It simply does not make sense of scum to make a one for one trade, even against another power role.

If I am correct, my vote would be the final crescendo of the day?

[SB.]

Well, that sure was a phase.

[Olivier]

I'll admit, this is the first time I've been accused of scumhunting when I shouldn't be in a Mafia game. Unless the definition of scumhunting has changed since I used to play, because I remember when we used to make cases out of people not scumhunting good/hard enough.

Votes apply pressure, which helps get people to answer your questions. However, I don't have much experience playing in games this small: Should I be a bit less cavalier with my vote here?

The problem is when you vote without necessity. Was it necessary to vote them when all you wanted was to ask a question? I don't need to vote people to ask them questions, especially when it is a simple one, as yours was. That's why I said it felt like you were trying too hard to "scumhunt" (I don't consider voting someone for the slightest reasons as scumhunting, but then again this is SF Mafia, where everyone is a Texan Sharpshooter).

Talking about scumhunt, I don't recall you doing it at any period of the game. Like, you made a case against ATF, then answered to their rebuttal and never addressed it again (but you did keep your vote on them). You've been questioning players here and there but I don't see any cases that you decided to pursue. I'm not sure whether the term 'coasting' applies, but that's what I sense from your play. Like you're trying to be here but at the same time isn't contributing much.

Phantom of the Opera has the same problem. They seldom appear, and when they do, they don't actively take part in the discussion. They give some thoughts about what's going on, some of their reads, and then disappear into the mist. Makes it hard to read their intentions and makes me think they are trying to look like they're contributing while they're not.

@Wadatsumi

That was a coincidence. Unless you think there is a correlation and cause between our timing. Do you? Because I don't see where you want to get at.

Regarding dondont, I still can't read him, so I'm basing my read on the rolecop shenanigans that have happened so far.

[Olivier]

shit sb stop ninjaing me

[SB.]

As it turned out, dondont LTCing Day 1 meant that he didn't have enough levels to reliably kill the Day 2 boss. RIP.

dondont151, you are the Mafia 1-shot Rolecop. Once in the night, you may ##Rolecop a player and learn their role name, but not their alignment.

You win when the mafia achieves parity with the town.

It is now Night 2. Deadline is in 24 hours, so send in your actions for then. If I get all actions and an activity check from all vanillas in, I'll start the phase early.

Countdown.

Edited February 18, 2015 by SB.