FE6 HM LTC V1 - Completed in 133 Turns

[Irysa]

Nah Percival still has weapon ranks. Plus promoted unit EXP gain is complete piss, and he midgame is going to be mostly dedicated to training Lilina and the Nomads. I would not be surprised if Percival is better when he shows up, and he's still the only likely Durandal user (aside from maybe Roy lol)

Also I'm going to try to 5 turn Chapter 7.

Edited March 8, 2015 by Irysa

[Gradivus.]

Just from looking at WoD, I can see a 4-turning possibilty if you rig some sick enemy phases for shanna to dodge and crit; Roy recruits Zealot on 2, Shanna opens the door on 2 and (doesn't open the door in fact) counterdodgecritkills 2 Wyverns, Zealot ferries Roy around and counter(crit?)kills the 3rd Wyvern Rider, gives him to Marcus on 3 who drops him a fullmove farther, then some mounts kill reinforcements and someone kills the boss, so Roy can barely get to the throne.

I'm dumb. idk if I'm dumb.

Edited March 9, 2015 by Gradivus.

[Yojinbo]

I don't think he has any keys left to open that door on turn 2 with Shanna.

You get one in a Ch.4 Village but it's used in Ch.6 to open the room with Sue.

Edited March 8, 2015 by Yojinbo

[Irysa]

Shanna can fly over the wall though. 4 turn is actually still possible, I was examining it. Roy can barely be dropped in front of the boss on turn 3 and needs to hit both Armorslayer hits on EP then Shanna needs to hit two Steel Lance hits to kill Devias. Most of the treasure is defunct this way though, theres NO way I can get everything if I do this.

Edited March 8, 2015 by Irysa

[dondon151]

you can also buy keys from the vendor

the barrier staff is pretty important and i'm not sure if you can afford missing it.

[Irysa]

I think I can still get the Barrier staff in a 4 turn if I use Merlinus to get Chest Keys to the other side of the map on turn 2.

http://i.imgur.com/rflNkTx.png

This is what I'm looking at right now but there's actually a lot of leeway on turn 2 for getting Roy to Shanna.

[dondon151]

you can't physically reach the barrier staff by turn 4 from any of the starting positions, and the only unit who can reach by turn 4 is zealot if you somehow ORKO the armor near him and he goes to the right. but then how are you going to recruit noah; zealot won't be able to talk to him and roy can't talk to him either if you want to drop him adjacent to the boss on turn 3.

[Irysa]

Treck rescuing Marcus can reach the Chest in time. Marcus has to get Door/Chest keys out of Merlinus on Turn 2 before being rescued by Treck though.

EDIT: Agh you're right about the Armor. Drat

EDIT2: I think if I can ORKO the Armor with Marcus somehow this will work.

EDIT3: Marcus crit@SilverLance/SteelAxe will do it.

EDIT4: FUCK, I can't math, Roy doesn't double with the Armorslayer. It's still possible, just need insane crits.

Edited March 8, 2015 by Irysa

[Irysa]

okay so to avoid having to rig a 2% crit from Alan vs a particular Knight in the way on C7, I reviewed previous chapters to see where I could have gotten 2 extra sword wexp for armorslayer access. In chapter 2 I could changed my final turn order a bit so that Alan is able to kill a Soldier with a sword instead of a Javelin, which would put him at D Swords right now (tested, it's exactly short by 2 wexp). So for the sake of not having to go back and fix that right now, I'm just going to hack him to D Swords, but this is a change that will be adjusted for a final run.

the fix in question is at 7:44 minutes in my chapter 2 v2 video. Shanna will kill the Archer first so that Dieck can move off the tile one right of the soldier and go weaken the boss, then Wade attacks from one right instead of one down from the Soldier so that Alan can attack from one down instead of two down.

just letting ya'll know.

Also treck sue and merlinus might have to have the worst enemy phase ever to pull this off with the treasure I want.

Edited March 10, 2015 by Irysa

[Yojinbo]

Good thing Merlinus is immortal. What a guy.

[Irysa]

So I've been running through RNs and adjusting strats for basically four solid days now and I'm about ready to just give up on a 4 turn with the Barrier Staff. It is theoretically possible, the tiles all add up and I even figured out how to get Alan to Devias so Roy doesn't have to do the bosskill. Unfortunately Treck surviving Turn 2 Enemy phase is so disgustingly unlikely that even with RN abuse it's only a distant dream. The only way to get that Barrier Staff in 4 turns and recruiting everyone is to have Treck rescue Marcus on Turn 4 and head for the top right.

No matter how you slice it, Treck (25 hp) has somehow survive (in disp hit, not truehit):

84 hit 13 dmg x 2 from a Mage (this is easy to rig)

56 hit 9 dmg from a Soldier

72 hit 9 dmg from an Archer

87 hit 7 dmg x 2 from an Archer

66 hit 12 dmg x 2 from a Wyvern

So far the furthest I've gotten is him dying on the last Javelin from the Wyvern...obviously this also doesn't consider what else people might have to dodge on enemy phase in the meantime but I've worked hard at reducing that so this is basically the main sticking point. If Treck didn't get doubled this would be more realistic. The best I can do as a distraction is to have a low HP Sue or Lance try to lure an Archer or Soldier off but even hacking and fucking with defence values they only go for them if there's a kill chance and then they'd have to dodge a bunch of Cavaliers/Knights/Soldiers who would otherwise be spreading out their firepower.

A 4 turn without the Barrier staff is trivial, as is a 5 turn with it, and I'm really considering just settling for the 5 turn right now.

Edited March 12, 2015 by Irysa

[momogeek2141]

Why does he need full health? Can't you just rig it to dodge the Mage, soldier and wyvern?

[Irysa]

He doesn't need full health, I'm just saying he has to survive through it. It's easy for me to rig a double miss from the Mage, but because enemy attacks are all really spread out and movement burns RNs, he's getting attacked by a bunch of enemies in a non linear fashion meaning it's difficult to find RNs that cooperate, especially considering that the amount of RNs used to determine movement aren't consistent. As I said, the farthest I've gotten is him dying on the last Javelin from the Wyvern, where he dodged both the Mage attacks, the Soldier, then got hit by the Archers (2 hp left) and died to the Wyvern doubling him.

There's also the matter that some units like Merlinus don't dodge early on in the enemy phase which messes up the string orders. Basically I can only safely search for the Mage hit values (and still need to adjust the number I end the enemy phase on depending on what leads up to it) and everything after is pretty erratic.

Edited March 12, 2015 by Irysa

[momogeek2141]

...wow. I didn't know the move burns apply to enemies too.

[Lord Raven]

Yeah, it's actually a very limiting factor to just about every strategy. It determines the exact path they take and the AI actions, which is why sometimes Klein/Tate don't move or the Chapter 21 Wyverns don't move.

Edited March 12, 2015 by Lord Raven

[Belf]

I don't see why skipping the barrier staff will be such an issue. Since your units are getting perfect level ups, they'll all have passable resistance as well as decent durability and avoid, and you can rig enemy misses later on. Just because dondon said you might need it doesn't mean you will. I don't know why you don't just take the time to look ahead and ascertain the necessity of the barrier stuff. If it truly is needed, then at least you know whether to compromise for the 5 turn.

[Lord Raven]

The Barrier staff makes it easier to get Saul to promotion level. For reference he should be promoted by Chapter 12 (after you get your first Lightning tome) and you can get him to Level 12 by the time chapter 11 ends with the Barrier and Torch staffs, with an A after promotion (B before). He also needs an A in Staffs ASAP and you're not healing every single turn with a Heal or Mend staff either, so the Barrier staff passes the time.

Rigging EP misses is also a pain the ass, Virgil.

Edited March 12, 2015 by Lord Raven

[dondon151]

have you considered rescuing marcus on turn 2 with someone else and then handing him off to treck on turn 3

also the barrier staff is solely for the EXP, not for the actual res boost. even with rigging someone getting hit on EP every turn, you're still getting less EXP with a mend use, and you also have much less leeway to get a turn 1 staff use.

but what do i know, getting saul to L10 before lightning becomes buyable should be easy enough without barrier. lord raven managed to squeeze out an extra 2 level ups before promotion though.

Edited March 12, 2015 by dondon151

[Irysa]

As has been stated, getting the Barrier staff is primarily for the EXP. Saul will be like level 5.9 after Chapter 7. I estimate without barrier and with torch 120~ EXP in Chapter 8, 40 in 8x, 90 in 9, 80 in 10. That leaves me about 80 to 90 EXP short of level 10 for chapter 11. That means Saul will barely just be able to reach level 10 for Chapter 12, but will be 2 mag less than Raven's run. That's kind of a big deal.

have you considered rescuing marcus on turn 2 with someone else and then handing him off to treck on turn 3

Marcus has to kill the armorknight in the way so that can't happen.

Edited March 12, 2015 by Irysa

[Irysa]

Okay, raw numbers for what mag saul needs just to demonstrate.

A 2 turn of chapter 17S is possible with 20 Mag on Saul and a Boots Flier. If I don't get Barrier I basically lose 2 levels (10/1 Saul is 12 Mag), so that means I have 8 chapters to get 8 levels on Saul.

1 Warp is required for a 2 turn of Chapter 14x. At least 2 Warps are going to be needed for a 4/5 turn of Chapter 16 (this may be ambitious), but I will likely need 3 Warps in order to secure some treasure. 16x needs 1 Warp. 5 Warps only translates into 2 levels. Even chucking in the odd Hammerne and Sleep staff and likely a fair amount of combat in Chapter 12, 13 and 14, getting 6 another 6 levels seems highly unlikely. Getting 4 on the other hand seems doable. That means this is basically a Turn for Turn exchange, skipping Barrier costs a turn but getting it saves a Turn.

It miiiight be doable to get to 20 mag without Barrier though.

Edited March 12, 2015 by Irysa

[Yojinbo]

Do you actually need to Warpskip 14x though? You can probably clear the chapter in about 3 turns with Lalum, superShanna, durableRoy and the assistance of Miledy so Warpskipping saves only a turn or two that can later be saved somewhere else perhaps. Shaving off turns in Ch.16 should definitely be your main focus because of his how much you can gain with a warpskip and recruiting Cath already in Ch.12.

[Irysa]

I'm not sure what you're getting at. Why would I not want to warpskip 14x?

I am in no way hurting for Warps in this playthrough, and Saul's staff rank is not going to be a problem. I actually save Warp uses compared to 0% due being able to only have to Warp Roy+Bosskiller in many scenarios. The problem is Saul's EXP gain.

I actually did some more calculations and a 2 turn of 16x is possible with 20 Mag as well. That means I have one LESS map in which to pull this off than I previously thought :\

Saul needs 13 levelups in total + promo in order to reach 20 mag (4 Base + 3 Promo gain), and his EXP gain gets halved for staff use after promotion, so abusing Barrier as much as possible (17 exp per use) can result in an extra 2 levels before promotion. However he does get combat exp after promotion. Chapter 12 offers good opportunities to get EXP for him with combat through walls, and for 13 he can probably also get the body ring and kill the top group of enemies himself (also likely using the Sleep Staff). He will also probably be killing the troupe of Wyverns and the Manakete to the top left of Chapter 14. He'll have to get EXP somehow in 15. Warping as much as possible is actually beneficial afterwards because it IMPROVES Saul's rate of EXP gain.

The core issue is whether or not 8 levels in 7 maps is possible. 6 is definitely doable (which is what I'd have if I get the Barrier Staff), but otherwise he has to get at least 1.15 levels a map on average after chapter 11. If this is possible it will be extremely tight. 1 in 12 is doable, 1 in 12x I think is doable (even if I 4 turn), although Lalum will have to dodge A Lot Of Shit. 1 in 13 is probably doable, 1 in 14 is doable, 1 is not happening in 14x even if I do extra pointless warps but the exp surplus can offset this. 1 in 15 is doable, and 16 is warp bonanza so whatever.

Edited March 12, 2015 by Irysa

[Gradivus.]

to make dondon's turn 2 non-treck rescue on Marcus suggestion doable, can you use two hand axe crits to kill the armor with marcus, instead of a steel axe one? that way, Marcus would be deployable 2U1R of Roy, and Lance or some other mount can rescue-drop roy, having started 2R1U of him, so he is far enough to rescue Marcus after his crit assault. Marcus would also still be close enough to be given the chest key by merlinus on turn 2.

[Irysa]

You're misunderstanding which Armor Marcus needs to kill.

http://puu.sh/gxikc/2a1c5e4cac.png

Its this one. This dude has to die on turn 2. There is no way to boost Marcus in a rescue drop fashion the extra tiles needed to reach the barrier staff on turn 4 if he has to kill that armor knight.

Edited March 12, 2015 by Irysa

[Gradivus.]

I know that this armor was meant; Marcus, having started 1R2U of Roy barely reaches the 2-range of this armor within 2 turns. I didn't realize that the other armor is at 2-range aswell.

Edited March 12, 2015 by Gradivus.