New to the game!

[Knusperkeks]

Hello everyone~!

I decided to play this game thanks to recommendations of others!

I do not have much of a history to speak of. Started the series with Awakening a few months ago and cleared L+ with it. I'd say my skill is decent/average.

Now for my question: I have literally no clue how to play FE7, and since it is quite old now, I figured there might be some gimmicks which influence the way one experiences the game (game mechanics/gameplay related/weird AI behaviour)?

Are there units which I should stay away from, or are there units which get hopelessly outclassed later on, to the point of making you think "If I had known Y exists, I would have never bothered training X".

It's not that I'm asking for a tier list. I tried solving these questions on my own, but didn't read the few threads I found on the topic too much (out of fear of getting spoiled).

If it is not too much to ask for, could you please give me a little guideline? Even if it's very generic, I can still work with it!

Edited March 7, 2015 by Knusperkeks

[Irysa]

If you can beat Luna+ FE13 I sincerly doubt you will have any problems with this game even on the hardest difficulties (which btw, you should probably get a save file for, since the default difficulties are a joke). The first 11 maps (Lyn Mode) are basically an extended tutorial with a plotline, and are extremely easy, since "Hard Mode" only turns off the forced tutorials. The main thing here is that the units you train here come back later in the game and you can also use some statboosters on them prior to the end of the mode.

[spoiler=Cheese Warning]

If you want to really cheese the game then funnel EXP into a good unit of your choice in Lyn Mode (usually either Florina, a Pegasus Knight, or Sain or Kent, your Cavaliers), and distribute the statboosters or promotion item as you see fit. Florina likes both the Seraph Robe and the Energy Ring, if you want to train Lyn she also likes them.

After 11 the game changes protagonist and the main plot starts. When it comes to early maps, Marcus is like Frederick except he only really stops being good like in the last 1/4 of the game, so unless you have a strong desire to train a bunch of earlygame chumps once you start Hector/Eliwood mode, feel free to spam Marcus with zero regrets (he doesn't mind getting a Speedwing, and needs bosskill EXP to stay relevant tho). You only make it harder on yourself by opting to train earlygame units. Javelins and Handaxes are amazing in this game and conveniently Paladins can use them so worth stocking up on those whenever you have a chance. Basically every prepromote in this game is good, wheras growth units are all kinda meh unless they're on a mount or can use magic (I guess Hector, Raven, and Oswin if he counts kinda subvert the rule but whatever) Speaking of mounts, mounted units can use their remaining move after basically any non combat action, so that's pretty useful and good to keep in mind. This ability is called "canto".

Stealing is a thing in this game, so watch for enemy inventories to to see if they have loot you can steal. Notably, there's the Silver Card and Member Card, watch out for those. To make training staff users easier you will probably want to take note of the Chapter 21E/22H Secret Shop which sells a bunch of helpful and elusive Staves (you need the Member Card on the unit who is on the tile to visit it).

There's a bunch of hidden loot on the Desert map. You don't need to deploy thieves to get these items reliably though, there's a trick you can do that involves resetting the game in a map (it auto suspends, don't worry), then reloading, looking at a character's statistics with the R button, then moving onto a Tile with a hidden item with it for a 100% chance to pick up the item. I think you can also do it via using an item then cantoing onto the right tile but that one I'm less sure about.

That about covers it aside from some other stuff that is not really that important or RNG related tricks. You might have to look up some recruitment requirements for characters in this game since they're not always entirely intuitive.

Edited March 7, 2015 by Irysa

[eclipse]

FIRST: Unless you have a copy that's been played through at least once/have an appropriate ROM and save file (don't ask where to get the ROM, you're on your own), you're stuck with Lyn Normal Mode. My condolences.

SECOND: Remember pair-up? There's Rescue, but instead of units donating stats to each other, the "rescued" unit is off the field and can't be targeted by attacks/staves, and the "rescuer" takes a penalty to their Skill and Speed (both of which are halved). Taking a unit costs a turn, and so does dropping him/her/it. Who can rescue who is determined by something known as CON (which also affects AS. . .y'know what, Lyn Normal Mode should introduce you to the general outline of this game, so even if it's a snoozefest, strategy-wise, you'll learn some vital mechanical things).

THIRD: Marcus is Frederick on crack. Like Frederick, pay attention to his Speed. Unlike Frederick, all he really needs is Speed with some Strength to be endgame material.

FOURTH: Take good care of your Torch staff.

[Knusperkeks]

Thanks, Irysa and eclipse! This information is exactly what I was looking for, I'll make sure to internalize everything the both of you conveyed to me before I get into the game. I really do appreciate it! <3

Canto sounds like an amazing ability in regards to positioning!

If anyone has any more ideas, please do not hasitate to mention it, no matter how trivial a thing you think it might be. At this point, all advice is useful!

Now I'm really looking forward to the game! :D

Edited March 7, 2015 by Knusperkeks

[Parrhesia]

Yeah, assuming FE13 Lunatic is anything like FE12 Lunatic, you're probably set to deal with any of the FEs as far as difficulty goes. If you can get a cleared save file from a mate, I would - normal mode in FE7 is a joke as far as difficulty is concerned, and the first ten chapters are a very rigid and frustrating tutorial.

I can't think of any units in FE7 that are flat-out unusable except maybe Nino - stick to your favourites, don't be afraid to use prepromotes and with the skills you have you'll be fine playing by your heart.

[Dual Dragons]

You can see supports and the support boosts on the main FE7 page but it works very differently from Awakening.

In FE7:

> supports are built based SOLELY on turns units are adjacent to each other; you don't need to do anything other than have them adjacent to each other by the turn's end

> rates building a support between pairs vary

> support bonuses are based on the pair's affinities

> supports are ranked by C, B, A

> you can only have 5 ranks on a character (unless a character in a pair dies, I think); C = 1, B = 2; A = 3

FE7 doesn't have as many enemies with status staves but they can be combated in a couple ways: either cure the status or raise the Resistance of a unit (this raises Avoid against status staves). Of course, killing them is an option as long as you can reach them.

It's not absolutely vital for a leisurely run but learning about Rescue and Drop tactics is very helpful. They can shave a lot of turns or save a unit from being in danger. Units can Rescue but cannot Drop on the same turn. Another unit, however, can Take and Drop a unit. Combine this with a mounted unit's ability to Canto and gain profit.

There's a building in certain maps called the Arena. Think of these as the Awakening Skirmishes except harder to control and only one unit will benefit at a time. Place a unit you want to train or to get money, the man will say a certain amount to bet (this amount is based on the enemy stats in relation to your unit's stats), accept or decline the offer. If you accept, he will tell you what your opponent is and at what level. If you win, you get double of what you put down; if you lose, you lose the money AND the unit.

> Of course it's exploitable. Even without knowing RNG-manipulation in its intricacies, you can keep declining until you get an amount that you like.

> You can also reset the game when you see the opponent and level screen; the auto-save doesn't kick in unless you actually enter the battle screen.

@Irysa: I actually never knew about the 100% pick-up with any character. Just read about it now. I'll have to try it out the next time I do a desert chapter!

[Parrhesia]

Oh yeah, that's another thing that's probably a key difference. The supports basically don't matter and require you to stand units next to each other for way too long. Nice little boost if you have it, but not worth sweating.

[MacLovin]

Marcus starts being "Average" during the last quarter of the game. Just give him a speedwing and he's golden.

He's capable of soloing waves of enemies if you want to do that.

Most earlygame dudes are chumps. The Lords are all decent to raise, since they're forced in plenty of chapters. Any mounted unit is good, and the mage you get in Lyn's mode is pretty decent in the long run if you want to give him a bit

of exp.

All of the prepromoted units are useable. Some are even really good! Pent

feel free to ask for help if you want to.

[Yojinbo]

You can easily wreck the game with heavy focus on mounted/flying units.

All Cavaliers [Lowen, Sain, Kent] and Paladins [Marcus and Isadora] are good units that are worth training. Note that if you skip Lyn mode you will only get 2 Knight Crests to promote the Cavaliers at a reasonable time so you may have to leave one of the Cavaliers behind at one point. Marcus benefits a lot from speedwings and Isadora will probably want the Body Ring.

You get a mounted staff user named Priscilla very early in the game and she's an amazing utility unit. There's no reason to not use her.

There's a bunch of units that are pretty good but are kind of obsoleted due to the game's low difficulty - mostly good combat units who can't actually do anything that mounted units are unable to do. Magic users are generally overshadowed by Pent, a pre-promoted sage who joins later into the game. All Lord characters are bad/mediocre but Eliwood gets a horse upon promotion so you may want to give him some exp here and there to make sure he can keep up until then.

[MacLovin]

I'm pretty sure being swordlocked or bowlocked is what keeps units like Guy and Rebecca relegated to mediocre.

Dorcas/Bartre have mediocre speed, but they get 1-2 range and 1-2RKO everything in the lower difficulties.

Hector's pretty good on promotion, shame it takes so long. Lyn's kind of a cointoss. Use if you want to bring her along and not be useless in the forced chapters.

I'm pretty sure that you can raise all 3 cavs, but it'll require letting one use an earth seal. [Not like this game's that hard. It takes about 15 AS to double 80% of the game. What isn't doubled are some bosses, SM's, NTroopers, and some heroes.

Hand Axes and Javelins are you best friends in this game, above all else.

[Yojinbo]

Oh yeah, Earth Seal is a thing in this game. Feel free to use all three Cavs then.

[Lord Raven]

Don't be surprised if gains aren't as crazy or consistent as FE12/13... FE4-8 a 30% growth was considered okay, 40% was considered pretty good, 50% was considered very very good and 55+% was considered phenomenal.

Edited March 7, 2015 by Lord Raven

[momogeek2141]

Well..not exactly. For example, Lilina has a 35% speed growth, yet people complain she's slow.

[Yojinbo]

That applies more to FE4 & 5 where skills, weapons and items would make up for shaky growths.

[Jedi]

I'd say just wing it and use whatever characters appeal to you, FE7 isn't too bad difficulty wise, HHM even isn't too bad once you have a grasp on it.

Oh yeah, that's another thing that's probably a key difference. The supports basically don't matter and require you to stand units next to each other for way too long. Nice little boost if you have it, but not worth sweating.

However FE7's supports have some really top notch dialogue so if you like that kind of stuff I do advise you go for some supports.

Guides for how long it takes for X unit to support with Y can be found on the main site too.

[Refa]

Well..not exactly. For example, Lilina has a 35% speed growth, yet people complain she's slow.

That's just because her base is bad though and she joins really late.

[Yojinbo]

Lilina doesn't join late at all. She just has a really bad base spd and a very mediocre spd growth.

[Knusperkeks]

Hello again, thanks everyone for your rich replies! I'll summarize it for myself as well as all the others who will come after me and look for the same kind of help, let me know if I miss anything!

1. Tutorial is tedious.
2. All units are useful, base and pre-promoted ones alike.
3. Stealing is necessary (Silver/Membercard) -> Chapter 21E/22H Secret Shop
4. There is a certain strategy to guarantee success with finding hidden treasure on desert maps.
5. Character recruitments aren't entirely intuitive.
6. Torch staff is important.
7. Supports are build up by standing adjacent. Maximum of 5 ranks total. Not necessarily required but useful.
8. Fight status ailment inducing enemies with high res or lethal units.
9. It's possible to ferry a unit to places even after it already took action by using canto and drop/pick-up chains.
10. The notorious exploitable arena.
11. Marcus' usefulness (it seems to me he is one of the so called "Jeigan Archetype"-characters) is strictly linked to his speed.
12. I took a peak at the characters, apparently the mage mentioned by Howard the Duck is called Erk and is decent. I'm going to use him since magic is good.
13. High movement or even flight are great, partly because of canto.
14. Following that logic, Priscilla is very good thanks to staffs and high movement.
15. Not enough incentive to use units which don't have a mount because they don't gain enough to make up for the lack of utility.
16. Pent is good.
17. Lords are mediocre (this one breaks my heart a little, oh well) until they are promoted.
18. Hand Axes and Javelin's are my best friends.
19. Random growths are standard.

This should be plenty to keep the wolf from the door.

After playing the first few chapters, I already think of benching Sain for his ...frivolous behaviour. I realize some of it can be attributed to him being the one to make mistakes so the tutorial teaches me how to play but still... he's Virion all over again. Though in his case I suspect he has some kind of circumstance to him.

Again, thank you Irysa, eclipse, Parrhesia, Dual Dragons, Howard the Duck, Yojinbo, Lord Raven, momogeek2141, Jedi and Refa for being so kind and write down so much, I didn't expect for people to go out of their way like this, it's highly appreciated!

Edited March 7, 2015 by Knusperkeks

[Irysa]

Lilina is from FE6 not FE7, people are just arguing about growth related stuff using her as an example.

Lilina doesn't join late at all. She just has a really bad base spd and a very mediocre spd growth.

Relatively speaking, Chapter 8 is somewhat "late" for a unit of her level and stats. It's at a point where she has to explictly be fed kills to have any chance of catching up and most of the units you've trained should be self sustainable by now. If she joined earlier she'd be able to join in on those training chapters where Marcus and Dieck are babying everyone and her speed wouldn't be that big an issue.

Edited March 7, 2015 by Irysa

[Ownagepuffs]

Dude you cleared L+. That's currently the hardest difficulty in the series, you don't need any advice.

Anyway, FE7 is kind of lol. Prepromote Emblem is what they call it. Marcus Emblem is another apt title. If you bench Sain, be sure to train Kent! There's nothing more I can add since you got everything you need to know from the wise people in this thread.

[Knusperkeks]

Dude you cleared L+. That's currently the hardest difficulty in the series, you don't need any advice.

Despite what you say, I feel like I do need it. But learning more about the game just for myself isn't the entirety of my intention.

As I suggested already, I didn't see a post like this anywhere.

This means that whenever a person shows up and asks for advice, anyone can link this thread! It's so useful right?

Anyway, FE7 is kind of lol. Prepromote Emblem is what they call it. Marcus Emblem is another apt title. If you bench Sain, be sure to train Kent! There's nothing more I can add since you got everything you need to know from the wise people in this thread.

Yes!

Edited March 8, 2015 by Knusperkeks

[Yojinbo]

The Member Card isn't that important in a regular run tbh. Since it's there you might as well pick it up but you probably won't need any of the items sold in the secret shops. Killer Weapons from 19E/20H are alright but the other shops are mainly there to buy Staves. They are important for ranked runs and LTC runs but it's not a big deal if you miss it.

Relatively speaking, Chapter 8 is somewhat "late" for a unit of her level and stats. It's at a point where she has to explictly be fed kills to have any chance of catching up and most of the units you've trained should be self sustainable by now. If she joined earlier she'd be able to join in on those training chapters where Marcus and Dieck are babying everyone and her speed wouldn't be that big an issue.

Joining a couple of chapters earlier wouldn't make up for the fact that she has the same spd growth as Lott with a lousy base of 4 spd. Her speed will always be an issue because 35% spd growth simply is not "OK" enough in FE6.

Edited March 8, 2015 by Yojinbo

[Irysa]

Nah, 35% is definitely fine if your base is good. Igrene for example.

But regardless, I disagree about it being an "issue" since she would stand a good chance of having enough speed to double slower enemy types in the Isles (lots of weighted down enemies) if she was available in the early maps for training. Given her ridiculous mag she is likely to ORKO, plus Roy support augments that even further. And she has base C Tomes so reaching B for Aircalibur without promoting should be easy if you're using her, which would also let her oneshot Wyverns for a while even if she doesn't double after that. It's not like Lugh is doubling the faster enemy types in this game either so her hitting harder would be more impactful most of the time anyway.

Like, just look at Cecilia. She is actually marginally useful in combat with kinda meh mag, meh speed. Sure she's on a horse but the same general idea can be applied to Lilina as well.

Edited March 8, 2015 by Irysa

[Sniper Knight]

Train your Pegasus Knights well. One of your Elysian Whips comes rather late, so if you may want to bench one.

Though Member Card isn't necessary, it is very helpful, allowing you to get Physic staves several chapters early.

[eclipse]

The Member Card isn't that important in a regular run tbh. Since it's there you might as well pick it up but you probably won't need any of the items sold in the secret shops. Killer Weapons from 19E/20H are alright but the other shops are mainly there to buy Staves. They are important for ranked runs and LTC runs but it's not a big deal if you miss it.

There's some really nice stuff in the secret shops, even for casual runs.

Like the aforementioned Torch staff, which is absolutely godly for getting Erk from D to C staves. Said shop is also the only other place to get Barrier, IIRC.

I really like my staves.