FE: if sold as two (three) separate versions in Japan

[AlphaZero]

I don't feel that what IS is doing is underhanded at all really. While I can see where people are coming from. The two games apparently play differently as Nohr has more limited resources and Hoshido is more like Sacred Stones and Awakening. If there really just trying to stay faithful to their older demographic while still trying to please the new fans and/or let them try out a recent FE similar to the classics that is fine. Sure some feel that this could be a difficulty option, I agree with Ownagepuffs that it was a better move to make two games on a system more people have than on a new system that chances are, not many people have due to virtually no new software as of now.

But it's not Pokemon.

This could be said of MANY franchises that do two versions or DLC in a similar way.

[ckc22]

On one hand, if every versions of the game are as individually as long as Awakening, why should we expect to get 2 games (potentially 3) for the price of one?. If IS really broke the bank trying to make 2-3 complete game and release them at the same time, is it really so wrong for them to try get back some of the money they invested.

Uh... because all advertisement/media has indicated that the point of this game is being able to choose between two sides, which is basically no longer true in Japan and perhaps no longer true in NA. Furthermore - so much of this is copy pasted straight out of Awakening that I extremely doubt it's taken some huge amount of investment - the engine, coding etc all needed minor tweaks at best. This is a cashgrab.

When the Emmeryn choice and dual endings in Awakening essentially did nothing a lot of people here complained "what bullshit, why didn't they do branching paths?"... Now that IS actually gives them what they want, these people still complain!

3DS carts aren't very large. They have around 4GB of memory, but that's not a whole lot if you consider lots of large-scale games are exceeding 25GB nowadays and reaching 50GB. If they plan to release both routes in one cart in the West, they're going to need a bigger cart. DLC is a non-issue because it's stored in the SD card so it can be as large as they want, and SD cards have far higher capacity than 3DS carts.

It's funny because, whenever someone here brought the fact the split choices in Awakening were purely cosmetic, and criticized the game for it, I reminded them that a game with multiple branches is fairly complex and requires a lot more cart space than something more linear. No wonder they're releasing If as two carts.

1) But they aren't giving branching paths thats why people are annoyed.

2) FE:A was ~1gig. The game could be 4x that size and fit on a cart. Even then nintendo offers up to 8gb carts.

Edited April 5, 2015 by Red Fox of Fire

[goodperson707]

^ They are giving choices though. just the main split is versions.

Main site

"The keyword for this new Fire Emblem is “if”. With Hoshido and Nohr as the backdrops, the player must make choices, which will affect the story, battles, recruitable characters, while progressing two very contrasting stories."

The battles thing might mean a small branching path too.

[ckc22]

^ They are giving choices though. just the main split is versions.

Main site

"The keyword for this new Fire Emblem is “if”. With Hoshido and Nohr as the backdrops, the player must make choices, which will affect the story, battles, recruitable characters, while progressing two very contrasting stories."

The battles thing might mean a small branching path too.

Except for the one major advertised choice - which army to side with - which was alluded to in the first direct and basically confirmed in the second NA one. This is disingenuous at best, it's potentially blatantly misleading fans.

I don't care if each version has a billion hours of content. It's not what was shown and it's not what I want. It is a way for Nintendo to make a bunch of money off of fans who will buy anything they put out.

[goodperson707]

Nowhere do i see a advertisement of a route split in the first direct i don't have a transcript but all i see are choices are important. And the 2nd one im not sure i just checked the main site on thursday to get the facts from the japan side and heard there were two versions and stuff. And went meh.

[BBM]

if you don't like their choice to split the games, then don't buy them; it's really that simple?

It's Nintendo's game so they have the right to do what they want. If NA gets the Japan treatment, you're probably right in that fewer people will buy the games; but if they're spending more it could still result in higher profits for them, and that's what they should be focusing on, not what makes you happier.

[Book of Ereshkigal]

I don't care if each version has a billion hours of content. It's not what was shown and it's not what I want. It is a way for Nintendo to make a bunch of money off of fans who will buy anything they put out.

Well, sounds like your best course of action is to not purchase it.

[B.Leu]

if you don't like their choice to split the games, then don't buy them; it's really that simple?

I don't swim in money. Unlike some people who can afford four kind of 3DS and buy the same game two time, because of the region localization. :p

Not that this is a bad thing, I actually admire them. I guess. But dude, I don't swim in money, and I'm not the only one.

Still, I want to note something, well, people already said that, but shutup.

Not matter what path you'll choose, Norh will be your ennemy, so the theme of choice is even more screwed up.

Unless you'll end up as Norh's lapdog like Suzaku is for Britannia, then freaking GG IS.

Or maybe they'll do something else, I doubt it.

Edited April 5, 2015 by B.Leu

[goodperson707]

I don't swim in money. Unlike some people who can afford four kind of 3DS and buy the same game two time, because of the region localization. :p

Not that this is a bad thing, I actually admire them. I guess. But dude, I don't swim in money, and I'm not the only one.

Still, I want to note something, well, people already said that, but shutup.

Not matter what path you'll choose, Norh will be your ennemy, so the theme of choice is even more screwed up.

Unless you'll end up as Norh's lapdog like Suzaku is for Britannia, then freaking GG IS.

Or maybe they'll do something else, I doubt it.

Okay not going to get into money issues but your buying it at ( with Japanese prices)1.4 times with dlc.

And the theme of choice isnt screwed up you are sticking with your family in Nohr and will probably eventually depose of the emperor. You probably still fight the other side though. Also there are monsters I'm pretty sure the last part will involve them pretty heavily.

[BBM]

I'm not telling you to shell out a ton of money you can't; I'm telling you to not buy the games if you can't buy the money or disagree with their decision on moral/ethical grounds. If they still sell well and are as profitable as Awakening then well, probably the same thing will happen for future games. If the decision doesn't pan out, then it'll teach Nintendo that FE is still a niche franchise that can't afford alienating its fans.

also I kind of envision the Nohr route as exactly Suzaku in Code Geass; trying to change the country from inside and making the rulers realize that their path is incorrect

[NekoKnight]

if you don't like their choice to split the games, then don't buy them; it's really that simple?

It's Nintendo's game so they have the right to do what they want. If NA gets the Japan treatment, you're probably right in that fewer people will buy the games; but if they're spending more it could still result in higher profits for them, and that's what they should be focusing on, not what makes you happier.

Dislike for splitting the game is NOT an unpopular opinion. Whether it's true or not, this marketing tactic still looks like a cash grab and that's already draining a lot of people's enthusiasm. No one will question Nintendo's right to sell the game how they want to, they are just criticizing what appears to be a very consumer unfriendly move. The success and continuation of the series is being decided now. If Awakening was a flop, we wouldn't be having FE14. If FE14 is a flop, we won't have FE15, and I'd like to play FE15. Fans have a right to be concerned and critical of potentially bad moves.

[B.Leu]

also I kind of envision the Nohr route as exactly Suzaku in Code Geass; trying to change the country from inside and making the rulers realize that their path is incorrect

Problem is, Suzaku is a giant lapdog. Like Flynn from Tales of Vesperia, or the Chrom and his team from Awakening, and Naruto from Naruto.

The only reason they pretty much success in anything, is because of very convenients plot-device, or just because the plot say so. You don't change the world by doing Shonen-speech.

PS: I don't particually dislike Suzaku and Flynn, Chrom and Naruto though...

And what If I don't want to be a lapdog ? What If I want to stab good ol' Ganon-like-daddy in the back ? Or maybe even stab my familly by not-blood in the back ?

Same with the what if I join Hoshido, what if I want to stab THEM in the back ? What if I want to kill them ?

I'm sorry, but yes, the theme of choices is screwed up big time, since one, no matter what I do I'll end up being agaisnt Norh, and two, the "choice" they promote is by buying the game.

Edited April 5, 2015 by B.Leu

[feplus]

I'm concerned about the direction this game is taking, too, but we ought to pump the brakes on the assumption-making.

We don't know what role we'll play in the Nohr side of things. We don't know if the side we choose is the only choice -- maybe there are smaller, but still important, choices on each path. We don't know how much content each game will have. All we know for sure is the following:

1. In Japan, the primary choice is made at the checkout counter, not on the battlefield.

2. In Japan, the deluxe edition that includes both paths costs roughly 70 dollars.

3. Early on, the Nohr and the Hoshido are portrayed as morally one-dimensional.

Yes, those point towards a bit of a lazy cash-grab, but let's not bury the game just yet.

[goodperson707]

I'm concerned about the direction this game is taking, too, but we ought to pump the brakes on the assumption-making.

We don't know what role we'll play in the Nohr side of things. We don't know if the side we choose is the only choice -- maybe there are smaller, but still important, choices on each path. We don't know how much content each game will have. All we know for sure is the following:

1. In Japan, the primary choice is made at the checkout counter, not on the battlefield.

2. In Japan, the deluxe edition that includes both paths costs roughly 70 dollars.

3. Early on, the Nohr and the Hoshido are portrayed as morally one-dimensional.

Yes, those point towards a bit of a lazy cash-grab, but let's not bury the game just yet.

Uh no we dont know that for sure.

1. Digital copy is chosen at chapter 6

2. Its 83ish actually its on the main site and it contains 3 paths plus physical extras also for the 2 main paths with dlc its roughly 59 dollars

3 the game isn't out yet and more info is presumably coming.

On choices from the official web site tranlated bu the main site.

"The keyword for this new Fire Emblem is “if”. With Hoshido and Nohr as the backdrops, the player must make choices, which will affect the story, battles, recruitable characters, while progressing two very contrasting stories." I respect your oponion if you think its a cash grab but please check your "facts"

[Awakener_]

Interesting. I wonder what the box art will look like! I suppose the wallpaper on the official site.

Iwata specifically say "Making choices" as in plural form of choice. Even if both game were included in one disk, deciding which side is only one of the choices. There will be more choices to make in their respective storyline, different ways to achieve peace with Nohr on the Hoshido's side and different ways to reform Nohr on their side. Unless game is linear, I don't see any misleading on Iwata's words.

Edited April 5, 2015 by Awakener_

[feplus]

Uh no we dont know that for sure.

1. Digital copy is chosen at chapter 6

2. Its 83ish actually its on the main site and it contains 3 paths plus physical extras also for the 2 main paths with dlc its roughly 59 dollars

3 the game isn't out yet and more info is presumably coming.

On choices from the official web site tranlated bu the main site.

"The keyword for this new Fire Emblem is “if”. With Hoshido and Nohr as the backdrops, the player must make choices, which will affect the story, battles, recruitable characters, while progressing two very contrasting stories." I respect your oponion if you think its a cash grab but please check your "facts"

1. From what I understand, this only applies if you've purchased both versions. If you just pick up White or Black digitally, you're still locked to a particular path.

2. That's more expensive than I realized, thanks for the correction. Though this furthers the suspicion of cash-grabbery.

3. Which is why I said "early on."

You misunderstood my point. I was encouraging people not to make too many assumptions and dismiss FE14 as a cash-grab, even if some signs point in that direction.

[Mighty Kamina]

1. From what I understand, this only applies if you've purchased both versions. If you just pick up White or Black digitally, you're still locked to a particular path.

2. That's more expensive than I realized, thanks for the correction. Though this furthers the suspicion of cash-grabbery.

3. Which is why I said "early on."

You misunderstood my point. I was encouraging people not to make too many assumptions and dismiss FE14 as a cash-grab, even if some signs point in that direction.

I'm quite interested in finding out the file size of each FE14 cart. I remember seeing somewhere that 3ds carts can only have 8gb of data (please do correct me if I'm wrong), and the DLC would be downloaded to the SD card rather than the cart itself. So while I am suspecting it being a cash grab of sorts, it may also be file size limitations. (I do remember reading that each campaign will have about as much content as Awakening)

Edited April 5, 2015 by Monado Boy

[goodperson707]

1. From what I understand, this only applies if you've purchased both versions. If you just pick up White or Black digitally, you're still locked to a particular path.

2. That's more expensive than I realized, thanks for the correction. Though this furthers the suspicion of cash-grabbery.

3. Which is why I said "early on."

You misunderstood my point. I was encouraging people not to make too many assumptions and dismiss FE14 as a cash-grab, even if some signs point in that direction.

Still missing my point and if you state facts make them right.

1 theres only one digital copy you choose at chapter 6 but then your locked in. plz read key information on main site it makes intelligent debate so much easier

2 it gets you 3 paths not 2 though. Plus swag. But you can get the other main path for your physical or digital copy for around 17 dollars with dlc.

3 "early on" implies in game not IRL, you might want to try "so far"instead.

I too don't want assumptions which you may or may not be intentionally helping fuel them.

Edited April 5, 2015 by goodperson707

[feplus]

I am confused by your attitude.

1. Which is what I said.

2. I never said otherwise.

3. It does not imply that.

The only "misinformation" I provided was the price of the deluxe version, which is actually more expensive than I remembered.

[goodperson707]

I am confused by your attitude.

1. Which is what I said.

2. I never said otherwise.

3. It does not imply that.

The only "misinformation" I provided was the price of the deluxe version, which is actually more expensive than I remembered.

1 uh actually no you said there were two versions.(black or white) Or plz use the games name to avoid confusion. Also you said originally that you cant make the decision in game when you can digitally.

2 you implied the larger price raises cashgrabery while ignoring the fact that you get 3 paths not 2 and that you can get 2 paths for an extra 17 dollars as DLC

3 then say early on in development or something.as saying early on the characters are morally one-dimensional does imply or leave open the meaning that the game gives bad characterization at the beginning to make you make a badly conceived choice. Also if we do get more information that rectifies this, then the fact you think their morally one- dimensional now has no meaning for purchasing purposes.

Also you did provide misinfomation when you said you get both paths in the premium version without mentioning the third path and extras. And that you cant chose your path on the battle field when in the digital version you can. Withholding contextual information that wouldn't support your point is Misinformation.

And my attitude is from the fact that your saying its not necessarily a cash-grab then only adding information that supports a cash grab to your argument. If you actually believe we should wait till release to judge then why don't you edit your original post (or repost it) to remove the misinformation/missing contextual information that implies they are making a cash grab more then the actual facts do.

Edited April 5, 2015 by goodperson707

[RJWalker]

Look at the scene from the trailer. Apparently, that's when you make the choice of whom to side with.

Except you don't. If you bought the physical version. you've already chosen the side before starting the game and this scene is useless and just trailer bait. Completely destroys the the presumed point of the scene if the decision is alread decided from the beginning.

[arvilino]

Look at the scene from the trailer. Apparently, that's when you make the choice of whom to side with.

Except you don't. If you bought the physical version. you've already chosen the side before starting the game and this scene is useless and just trailer bait. Completely destroys the the presumed point of the scene if the decision is alread decided from the beginning.

Unless the physical versions are placed in unmarked boxes or randomly assigned the customer has to make a similar choice anyway when buying it. Even if the game box simply caught somoenes eye in the shop and they just look at the back of the box for information about the gameplay/campaign contained in each one.

Also the trailer says "You can only choose one path", suggesting "you the player" not Kamui's decision. As gameplay is the most important factor the most most important question is what type of campaign the player wants to play.

Edited April 5, 2015 by arvilino

[NekoKnight]

Unless the physical versions are placed in unmarked boxes or randomly assigned the customer has to make a similar choice anyway when buying it, . Even if the game box simply caught somoenes eye in the shop and they just look at the back of the box for information about the gameplay/campaign contained in each one.

As the trailer says "You can only choose one path".

You're ignoring the dramatic implications of the "choice". If you picked up the Hoshido version of the game, you never had any intention to side with Nohr. In fact, you were planning on betraying them since before you put the cartridge in the 3DS. All the story and drama leading up to that climatic scene is a farce. As far as player investment is concerned, those players may as well skip the buildup of the first 6 missions because the choice already happened.

[astrophys]

I think that part of the reason that some of us aren't seeing eye-to-eye on this matter is different values we put no the SRPG aspects of the game versus the story aspects of the game.

If you're primarily concerned with the SRPG aspects, then something like what arvilino said applies: "As gameplay is the most important factor the most most important question is what type of campaign the player wants to play." Supposedly Hoshido and Nohr have somewhat different styles of handling things (such as access to easy grinding, overall difficulty, etc.) and have different styles of campaigns as such. Thus, if you're primarily interested in SRPG gameplay and campaign styles then you already have the core information you need long before you ever buy a copy.

If you're primarily concerned with the story aspects, then the concern that for the split versions "All the story and drama leading up to that climatic scene is a farce", as NekoKnight argues, becomes more relevant.

Yet depending on how much one values gameplay over story its possible that some people, in contrast, don't/won't care about this "farce" at all.

​Of course, things aren't black and white and there are people to which both of these aspects are highly important.

As for me, the story is a cool backdrop, but I'm more concerned with SRPG gameplay. As such, the "farce" of the choice isn't something I actually care about.

[NekoKnight]

As for me, the story is a cool backdrop, but I'm more concerned with SRPG gameplay. As such, the "farce" of the choice isn't something I actually care about.

That's fair. I don't have a problem with determining what play-style you enjoy ahead of time, although story remains an important aspect of the choices for me. Thanks for understanding.

Speaking of the story, with 5 missions (not counting the mission you actually choose an allegiance), will they even be able to makes a strong case for joining both factions? You need to have Kamui somehow meet and connect with all the members of BOTH families, in the midst of tutorials and other warm up style missions.

Edited April 5, 2015 by NekoKnight