Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Tactless Tactician

Yet Another Attempt At StreetPass

Recommended Posts

Hello everyone!

I've been trying to make a StreetPass team as challenging as possible without using MUs. To this end, I've scoured the net for any effective gimmicks or strategies only to come to the conclusion that anything one can assemble, any reasonably competent player can destroy it using Pair-Up. And yet, as one last tribute to Awakening before If is presumably released stateside sometime next year, I wanted to devote one final save file to making a challenging StreetPass team and would appreciate any advice.

From what I understand, the most useful skills for this endeavor are as follows:

General Skills:

Limit Breaker: Without this, almost any tactic employed will undoubtedly fail.

Counter: Might as well attempt to kill through passive damage if active damage fails.

Aggressor: Provided one has a chance to initiate combat, they ought to hit as hard as possible.

____'faire': An alternative to Aggressor that becomes the only comparable option for female units.

Vantage: Since it’s HP-based, it only ought to be used on a unit with Miracle.

Procs:

Lethality: When used selectively, it can be a great asset. Personally I intend to limit use of it to half my team or less, to discourage auto-dismissal.

Miracle: Useful in a select number of instances, particularly involving Vengeance or Counter.

Vengeance: Primarily useful with Miracle. Being a guaranteed proc doesn't hurt either.

Luna: For when Lethality and/or Vengeance isn't used, but a proc could still help.

Hit/Avoid:

Lucky 7: +20 Hit/Avo for seven turns. Few StreetPass battles will eclipse this limit.

Quick Burn: Start with +15 Hit/Avo with a general decrease (1 Hit/Avo?) per turn.

Anathema: -10 Avoid/Critical Avoid to enemies within a 3-tile radius. Notable for encompassing the attack range of all weapons except for Mire. But other Hit/Avo skills seem more effective.

____'breaker': +50 Hit/Avo against a single weapon type. Useful if a unit is locked into a weapon type, or if one simply wants added utility against tomes or bows.

Hit+20: Self-explanatory.

On to the weapons. Usually, over-reliance on Celica's Gale will make a team even easier to defeat, provided a player slaps on Tomebreaker. What can be done to introduce a little variety? Granted, all forgeable weapons will have +3 Mt / 25 Hit.

Weapons:

Celica’s Gale: The most accurate 'brave' range 1-2 weapon in the game.

Brave ______: Be it a sword, lance, axe, or bow, the opportunity to hit twice is invaluable.

Eirika’s Blade: May be more useful than a Brave Sword due to its higher accuracy.

Superior _____: Can be equipped when sortied to act as a ‘Breaker’ during the first player phase.

Dragonstone+: Despite its lack of a Brave effect, there aren't any skills or weapons that reduce its accuracy like WTA or ‘breakers’. There are ‘hazards’ like Wyrmsbane, and the Falchion variants, Wyrmslayer and Book of Naga which all deal effective damage. And Aegis which halves damage, but none of these hinder its accuracy.

In order to narrow things down a bit, it seems that in order to be an effective unit in StreetPass, a unit should possess as many of the following classes/skills as possible:

Class Sets and Skills:

Thief: Lucky 7 and Lethality

Wyvern Rider: Swordbreaker, Lancebreaker, Quick Burn

Dark Mage: Anathema, Vengeance, Tomebreaker

Barbarian: Axefaire and Counter

Fighter: Counter and Axebreaker

Mercenary: Axebreaker and Bowbreaker

Cavalier/Knight: Luna

Priest: Miracle

Myrmidon: Vantage, Swordfaire and Lethality

The Barbarian/Fighter/Mercenary line have significant overlap, with the former two being male-exclusive.

The Myrmidon line, while quite useful in-game for Vantage, Swordfaire, and Lethality seems to be superseded by the Thief line with Vantage's decreased prevalence, and the latter's access to Lucky 7.

Cavalier and Knight seem to be functionally similar in regards to having Luna in common, and few other skills of value in a StreetPass setting. Paladin may be a superior ending class though due to its higher movement and generally higher speed and skill.

But before getting into my own theory-crafting setups, I also have a couple questions on this matter that I'd appreciate some guidance in:

Questions:

1. As only two units in this file can use boots, is it best to give them to high movement units to enhance it even farther, or give it to someone with lower movement for the surprise factor?

2. The MU is treated as the ‘boss’ of the StreetPass AI and, from what I've observed, seems to spawn furthest from the player’s units. Does this usually happen or does it fluctuate?

3. Are any ‘hackforges’ applied if the recipient’s file is on Hard mode or above? And does this only apply if weapons are unforged? Also, from what I recall, having a higher difficulty on the file the team is generated in does nothing. Is all of this accurate?

My Unit:

For a setup like this, a MaMU is personally favored due to being an innate Counter-bomber with the potential to also run Miracle/Vengeance. There is also more versatility in potentially being able to pass on their class set to up to two more units. Granted, FeMU can do the same, but only with Lucina (who gets all she needs in a StreetPass setting from Olivia in my opinion).

With this minor preamble aside, here is what I've devised so far. Open to suggestions:

MaMU (+luk/-str) -Wyvern Lord: 85/55/42/47/48/59/55/40 10 movement (Boots)

-Paladin: 85/51/42/49/50/59/51/52

Finn’s Lance/Brave Lance

Limit Breaker, Miracle, Counter, HP+5, Iote’s Shield/Acrobat

The luck asset is for higher Miracle procs, while a strength flaw is the only one that doesn't hurt luck or speed. Being locked to Finn’s Lance, which provides +2 strength and luck, ensures that MU will attempt to Counter–bomb, though a Brave Lance may be better should the first attack be dual-guarded. HP+5 means that MU can be all-but-KO’d, but due to Miracle, deal 84 damage, killing a standard player’s unit. Iote’s Shield is to negate a Wyvern Lord’s flying weakness, while Acrobat removes most terrain penalties for a Paladin. Would Vengeance or a Hit/Avoid skill be better, and which class seems more effective?

Chrom!Inigo-Dread Fighter: 80/54/49/53/54/57/48/52

Celica’s Gale, Brave Sword, Brave Axe

Limit Breaker, Rightful King, Vantage, Lethality, Counter

Has a 23% base chance of activating Lethality with a potential irl chance of ≈43% via two hits of Celica’s Gale. Perhaps Patience or Hit+20 would be better than Counter?

Olivia!Lucina-Dark Flier: 80/48/53/54/55/57/41/50

Celica’s Gale, Brave Lance

Limit Breaker, Rightful King, Vantage, Lethality, Iotes Shield

Similar to Inigo, but with Iotes Shield instead of Counter. Would Hit+20 be better to ensure a hit, or All Stats +2 for that extra Lethality percentage point?

...and that's all folks! No not really...

While I'm somewhat set on the above units, even those are open to suggestions. On top of that, I still have seven more units to account for!

When considering mods, inherent classes, and complementing skills from potential parents, this is what I devised so far:

Pairings:

Child Class Sets:

Notable skills

Parents

Owain Priest, Myrmidon, Barbarian:

Miracle, Vantage, Swordfaire, Lethality, Axefaire, Counter

Would benefit nicely from a Dark Mage father, or Donnel’s luck (+6 mod = 61 luck as a promoted unit with LB). Other than that, he just needs to exist.

Potential fathers: Libra, Henry, Donnel, MaMU, filler (Ricken, Virion etc.)

Brady Priest, Cavalier, Mage:

Miracle, Luna

Could benefit from a Counter father. Besides that, his only notable feature is his +3 luck mod.

Potential fathers: Vaike, Donnel, Gregor, Gaius, MaMU

Kjelle Knight, Cavalier, Myrmidon, Wyvern Rider

Luna, Vantage, Swordfaire, Lethality, Swordbreaker, Lancebreaker, Quickburn

Aside from lacking Miracle for M/C (which she can’t get aside from MaMU), she has a plethora of useful skills. She could benefit from more breakers or hit/avoid skills.

Potential fathers: Henry, Libra, Vaike, Donnel, Gaius, MaMU

Cynthia Cleric, Pegasus Knight, Knight

Miracle, Luna, Lancefaire, Tomefaire

While excellent in-game, she needs some work to be StreetPass usable. Frederick only provides Wyvern Rider, Chrom is taken by Olivia and would only provide Aether, the Archer class, and overlapping Cavalier class anyway. Henry provides Counter as well as Dark Mage and Thief skills. Gaius provides Counter as well as Thief and Myrmidon skills.

Potential fathers: Gaius, Henry, MaMU, filler (Frederick)

Severa Mercenary, Dark Mage, Pegasus Knight

Bowbreaker, Axebreaker, Tomebreaker, Anathema, Vengeance

Could use a father with Wyvern Lord for ‘omni-breaker’ potential. Thief would also be beneficial for Lucky 7 in addition to Quick Burn.

Potential fathers: Frederick, Virion, Lon’qu, MaMU

Gerome Wyvern Rider, Priest, Fighter

Miracle, Counter, Swordbreaker, Lancebreaker, Axebreaker

Would benefit from Dark Mage, for Anathema, Vengeance, and Tomebreaker. Or maybe Donnel for that luck mod.

Potential fathers: Libra, Henry, Donnel, MaMU

Yarne Taguel, Barbarian, Thief

Counter, Axefaire, Lethality, and Lucky 7 (can also inherit a breaker or Quick Burn from Panne if his father lacks Wyvern Rider)

Aside from getting the full Wyvern Rider class set from a father, Libra could work for Miracle/Counter/Vengeance, while Kellam provides Miracle and Luna (albeit with Thief overlap)

Potential fathers: Kellam, Frederick, Virion, Libra

Laurent Mage, Dark Mage, Barbarian

Anathema, Tomebreaker, Vengeance, Axefaire, Counter

Works well with a Miracle father or, barring that, someone that buffs his Hit/Avo in general.

Potential fathers: Kellam, Libra, MaMU, filler

Noire Archer, Dark Mage, Knight

Hit+20, Bowbreaker, Tomebreaker, Anathema, Vengeance, Luna

She has an innate -2 luck mod, making her less suitable for Miracle+Counter+Vengeance. Instead, she can be converted into a Lethality user or dodge-tank.

Potential fathers: Gaius, Gregor, Stahl, filler

Nah Manakete, Mage, Wyvern Rider

Swordbreaker, Lancebreaker, Quick Burn, Tomefaire

Has potential due to Dragonstone usage, but requires significant investment to be made usable. Henry is notable for providing several Hit/Avo skills from his Dark Mage and Thief classes. Can alternatively be paired with Donnel to make a third-gen Morgan with two male-exclusive skills (albeit with Dragon weakness).

Potential fathers: Henry, Donnel, MaMU, filler

Morgan All relevant classes and skills (aside from Aggressor and Counter)

She could be raised as a third-gen unit to inherit two male-exclusive skills, namely Counter and HP+5, letting her run a similar setup to MaMU. Or she could run a duplicate skillset to whatever sibling she has. A child fathered by Donnel (like Donnel!Kjelle, Donnel!Nah, Donnel!Severa) would be an ideal candidate, but someone like Gaius/Henry!Cynthia could suffice as well, without ‘ruining’ Morgan’s mother in the process.

This basically becomes a question of what six children besides Morgan should be used, and whether Morgan would be better off with an equally versatile sibling or functioning as a MaMU 2.0. What do you think?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You know that Miracle doesn't work against Dual Strikes, right? As long as the enemy's DSes damage you, you've literally got a ~5% chance of survival (DS doesn't proc) even if you somehow both manage to trigger Miracle exactly on their third lead attack and you aren't dead by then.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You know that Miracle doesn't work against Dual Strikes, right? As long as the enemy's DSes damage you, you've literally got a ~5% chance of survival (DS doesn't proc) even if you somehow both manage to trigger Miracle exactly on their third lead attack and you aren't dead by then.

Yes, I'm familiar with how the Dual system works. That's why I didn't include skills like Aegis or Pavise.

From my understanding, Miracle does have use however in conjunction with skills like Counter or Vengeance.

If the AI spawns far enough away from the player that they're able to close the gap and attack, Miracle makes Counter viable.

And while unlikely, if the AI is somehow able to survive the onslaught, Vengeance will be able to significantly add to the damage output.

Thank you. I just finished looking it over.

It seems that they tested a series of different strategies, many of which revolved around some use of Counter or Lethality.

While inconclusive seeing as the topic appeared to close due to inactivity, the collaborators' latest and presumably most effective tactics seemed to focus on Hit/Avo stacking, incorporating Counter when possible, and using Lethality sparingly (if at all?).

They also seemed to eschew the use of Vantage, which makes some degree of sense seeing as outside of a rare Miracle proc, a unit is either going to be at full HP or dead.

I still think that it should not assume DLC...

Umm... Is this with regards to the opening post or to the link Knusperkeks posted?

Either way, I'd have to respectfully disagree. Without Limit Breaker, the AI's hit/avoid rates would be abysmal, and skills would proc with even less frequency (although it's still easy enough to get Vengeance to always proc without it).

Would you care to elaborate on your statement?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's a matter of appeal. DLC filled teams don't really succeed more, so all it does is restrict the player base who can use it. That's a huge reason why lethality is great--anyone can use it and have a usable team. I want there to be a successor to this. I want topics like this that try to find a better way to tinker with streetpass. It's just that I don't think it's fair to exclude a population simply because.... "because."

I'll still comment on certain ideas that run it, but know that I feel a little excluded.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What Vascela might have meant with not assuming DLC is that you shouldn't automatically assume the person who gets to fight your team isn't guaranteed to have DLC. Though I'm not too sure on that one. I agree that one has to go all-out to even have a sliver of hope to have one's units win streetpass battles.

Edit: I got ninja'd.

Will you still feel bad if we pretend to not use our DLC and just work skill setups which are based on 4 skill slots?

Edited by Knusperkeks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's a matter of appeal. DLC filled teams don't really succeed more, so all it does is restrict the player base who can use it. That's a huge reason why lethality is great--anyone can use it and have a usable team. I want there to be a successor to this. I want topics like this that try to find a better way to tinker with streetpass. It's just that I don't think it's fair to exclude a population simply because.... "because."

I'll still comment on certain ideas that run it, but know that I feel a little excluded.

What Vascela might have meant with not assuming DLC is that you shouldn't automatically assume the person who gets to fight your team isn't guaranteed to have DLC. Though I'm not too sure on that one. I agree that one has to go all-out to even have a sliver of hope to have one's units win streetpass battles.

Edit: I got ninja'd.

Will you still feel bad if we pretend to not use our DLC and just work skill setups which are based on 4 skill slots?

Well, I do have a second save file I was going to overwrite for a new FeMU playthrough that I could use for this instead...

...sure, why not? It would be an intriguing challenge to see what we could come up with when not relying on DLC.

I predict that with Limit Breaker, Aggressor, and less notable but still useful skills like All Stats+2, Iote's Shield and Res+10 no longer in the pool, there will be more 5-breaker or 4/3-breaker + Quick Burn and/or Lucky 7 sets. Anathema, Patience, and Prescience will have more value, and the MU will be more likely to have two children for versatility (if MaMU) or marry into royalty for a third RK+Lethality unit (if FeMU).

And I didn't mean to exclude anyone. I was simply attempting to work with the tools at my disposal.

Edited by Tactless Tactician

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Alright, assuming a no-DLC team, we'll have to establish a few metrics:

1. MaMU or FeMU?

MaMU is more effective at introducing variety into the second-gen gene pool, but can also produce a decent 'super Morgan':

Skill: Lon'qu!Severa!Morgan has the highest skill at 58 as an Assassin

Defense: Kellam!Nah!Morgan has the greatest defense at 64 with Dragonstone+ boosts, or 61 as a General

Meanwhile, FeMU is generally better at producing 'super Morgans':

Strength: Vaike!Gerome!Morgan caps strength at 61 as a General or Berserker

Magic: Ricken!Laurent!Morgan excels in magic, hitting 56 as a Sage

Speed: Lon'qu!Yarne!Morgan reaches 57 speed as an Assassin

Luck: Chrom!Brady!Morgan has 54 luck. Technically Donnel!Brady!Morgan has 66 luck, and Donnel!Inigo!Morgan has 57 luck if Luck+4 is passed, but C!B!Morgan has a 64% chance to proc Miracle with Rightful King

Res: Libra!Brady!Morgan has 52 resistance as a Sorcerer

Also, FeMU has the distinct advantage over MaMU in being able to produce a third unit with Rightful King, a now invaluable passive skill as Limit Breaker is no longer on the table.

A +Skill FeMU can produce a Chrom!Inigo!Morgan with a skill cap of 55 as an Assassin. As far as Lethality is concerned, 55/4 = 13.75. However, assuming the game rounds down, we effectively lose a percentage point, meaning Skill +2 from the Archer line could be considered to bump the cap to 57 and Lethality's proc rate to 14%, with a total activation rate of 24% with RK.

2. What Stats Are More Valuable?

Strength/Magic: Being able to do as much damage as possible is appreciable. However total damage output can be considered expendable, if some damage can be sacrificed for overall higher stats, or a more complementary skillset.

Skill: Affects both a unit's accuracy, and it's likelihood for activating a skill. In most cases, this should be as high as possible, especially if using skills like Luna or Lethality. For Vengeance users, anything over 50 is a bonus (though not necessarily superfluous).

Speed: Again, this goes back to the principle of anything we can do, they can do better (with pairup). So, while it could be useful to have one or two high-speed units (especially as this contributes heavily to a unit's Avoid stat) we should expect that the majority (if not all) of the units theorycrafted here will be doubled by the player.

Luck: Of lesser weight in Hit/Avo formulas with Skill and Speed having more precedence respectively. Still, it would be remiss to neglect it entirely, and it's of particular note for Miracle users.

Defense/Resistance: Limit Breaker or no, we should expect that the player is likely able to double our units (or quadruple them in the event that they use Brave weapons of their own). Factoring in any Dual Strikes which can still reach into the 80s an 90s even without Limit Breaker, unit survivability is negligible at best.

3. What Skills Should Be Used?

Skills of note are similar to those listed the OP of this topic, the removal of those such as Limit Breaker and Aggressor aside.

Among other things, this now means that '+2' skills may see some use, and 'faire' skills are among the only options for both male and female units looking to receive an additional passive boost to their damage output.

With Luck caps being decreased by 10 as well, Miracle's already questionable viability has plummeted still further, making Hit/Avo skills such as breakers even more valuable. Tomebreaker and Bowbreaker in particular have increased value, as Iote's Shield (even seldom used as it were) is also no longer an option.

Vengeance will still activate reliably, but Luna procs will suffer somewhat.

And Counter may see more use in conjunction with the aforementioned Tomebreaker and Bowbreaker in an attempt to make players leery of both ranged and melee combat.

4. What Classes Should Be Optimized?

Again, the list of preferred classes is similar as to what it was in the OP. Dark Mage and Wyvern Rider are readily appreciable for their associated breakers, while the Archer line has been elevated due to the base class's 'Skill +2', as well as being an alternative to the Mercenary line for acquiring Bowbreaker. Myrmidon is also somewhat more valuable for providing Swordfaire, which is now appreciable by male and female units alike with the removal of Aggressor.

5. What Weapons Should Be Used?

Aside from the aforementioned 'Brave' and 'Superior' weapons, we may be more inclined to try our hand using Regalia and other 'rare weapons'. Keeping in mind that each Regalia weapon is limited to one per team under these circumstances, here's a list of what I feel to be among the more effective weaponry among their ranks:

Swords:

Levin Sword: 10 Mt, 80% Hit. One of the few 1-2 range swords in Awakening, and the only one that can be forged to have higher accuracy. However, the fact that its damage dealt using a unit's magic stat limits it to hybrid classes such as Dark Knight and Grandmaster, especially in the absence of the Dread Fighter class.

Balmung: 13 Mt, 90% Hit. Despite being inferior to a forged Brave Sword in terms of effect and accuracy, its +5 Speed boost may prevent a unit from being doubled.

Ragnell: 15 Mt, 70% Hit. The only 1-2 range blade dealing physical damage that's usable by any sword-wielding unit. That's just as well, as it has both higher might and accuracy compared to the Myrmidon-exclusive Amatsu. The +5 to Defense is a nice boost too. Hit boosting skills are recommended with this one though.

Seliph's Blade: 12 Mt and 90% (superior to that of an unforged Brave Sword btw) and can still be forged. It also provides +2 Res and Speed.

Lances:

Gradivus: 19 Mt and 85% Hit, it's a 1-2 lance with a built-in Elixer effect. Hit+20 would be recommended with its use to offset its lesser accuracy.

Finn's Lance: 8 Mt and 85% Hit, and forgeable for more. Its +2 boost to Defense and Luck make it a niche option for Miracle users.

Ephraim's Lance: 11 Mt and 80% Hit, and forgeable. It provides a nice +2 boost to the wielder's Strength and Speed.

Axes:

Hauteclere: 21 Mt and 70% Hit. Its Elixer-esque effect makes it similar to Gradivus, despite lacking the 1-2 range. Again, Hit+20 and other accuracy-boosting skills would be recommended with this weapon's use.

Orsin's Hatchet: 4 Mt and 85% Hit. Despite its low base Mt, it can be forged, making it among the most accurate of ranged physical weapons.

Hector's Axe: 15 Mt and 75% Hit, being forgeable on top of its +2 boost to Strength and Defense gives it 20 Mt and 100% Hit assuming a 3 Mt / 25 Hit forge.

Bows:

Longbow: 9 Mt and 70% accuracy that can be forged form more. 2-3 range is nice, despite it being locked to Snipers.

Parthia: 19 Mt and 95% Hit, it has a built-in 'Ward' effect, and can be equipped by all bow-using units.

Yewfelle: 15 Mt and 85% Hit, it grants +5 Speed when equipped.

Nidhogg: 16 Mt and 75% Hit. It also grants +10 luck. Useful for bow users with a Miracle/Counter setup hoping to incite the player to use melee attacks. Best used with Hit+20 and other similar skills though,

Double Bow: 13 Mt and 70% Hit that provides +5 Strength. A more powerful, but less accurate Longbow.

Innes' Bow: 13 Mt and 115% Hit. A bow that can have 140 Hit deserves some mention. This may be the only weapon that could be forged for +5 Mt / +15 Hit.

Tomes:

Valflame: 16 Mt and 80% Hit, its +5 Magic gives it an effective Mt of 21. Quite powerful, but I'd still recommend Hit+20 to accompany it.

Mjolnir: 18 Mt and 70% Hit. While it has less Mt than Valflame, its +5 Skill boost could come in handy, slightly augmenting the tome's own accuracy. If used, accompany it with Hit/Avo skills.

Excalibur: 13 Mt and 100% Hit. Also has 30 crit, but that's negligible. Keep in mind that it can only be obtained via the Double Duel: Army of Shadow if excluding Infinite Regalia as a source.

Forseti: 14 Mt and 90% Hit. Provides +5 speed which can be useful.

Book of Naga: 15 Mt and 80% Hit. It's effectiveness to dragons basically makes it a magical Exalted Falchion in terms of might. It also provides +2 Defense and Resistance.

Staves: Generally, it's inadvisable to use staves as you'd need to devote a healer to the task, usually by preventing them from equipping weapons. However if you still feel compelled to have one:

Rescue: Could be used to randomly mess with AI unit placement depending on AI. Anything the player can't determine can potentially benefit the AI Team.

Goddess Staff: Restores all HP to all allies in range. Can only be used once. It's almost a shame Armsthrift can't be used on staves...

Fortify: A poor-man's Goddess Staff. At least they're purchasable in bulk.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Book of Naga provides +5 Def/Res respectively.

What opponents do you plan to optimize against?

Thanks for correcting that inaccuracy.

Anyway, I was thinking of an Olivia!Lucina+Vaike!Gerome!Morgan (+str/-def) or Ricken!Laurent!Morgan (+mag/-def) pairup as a hypothetical opponent.

For stat values, we could assume that Lucina would either be an Assassin or Dark Flier, and Morgan would be either a Berserker or Sage respectively.

According to the pair-up chart http://old.serenesforest.net/fe13/double.html

They'd have +2 boosts across the board from a presumable S-rank, and most likely +3 to all relevant stats across the board as well.

And the respective pair-up bonuses for the potential setups would entail the following:

Assassin: 2 str / 2 skll / 4 spd / 1 mov

Berserker: 5 str / 3 spd

Dark Flier: 3 mag / 3 spd / 2 res

Sage: 4 mag / 2 skll / 2 res

Olivia!Lucina has the following stats as an Assassin:

42 str/ 31 mag/ 51 skll/ 49 spd/ 47 luk/ 30 def/ 29 res |But with the following Berserker!Morgan in the rear, this adds:

+10 / +4 / +5 / +8 / +5 / +5 / +4 |resulting in a total of:

52 str/ 35 mag/ 56 skll/ 57 spd/ 52 luk/ 35 def/ 33 res |while leading

While V!G!Morgan has the following stats as a Berserker:

61 str/ 26 mag/ 38 skll/ 45 spd/ 44 luk/ 36 def/ 26 res |But with the preceding Assassin!Lucina in the rear, this adds:

+7 / +5 / +7 / +9 / +5 / +5 / +4 |resulting in a total of:

68 str/ 31 mag/ 45 skll/ 54 spd/ 49 luk/ 41 def/ 30 res |while leading

Meanwhile, Olivia!Lucina as a Dark Flier is as follows:

38 str/ 43 mag/ 44 skll/ 45 spd/ 47 luk/ 31 def/ 40 res |But with the following Sage!Morgan in the rear, this adds:

+4 / +9 / +7 / +5 / +5 / +4 / +7 |resulting in a total of:

42 str/ 52 mag/ 51 skll/ 50 spd/ 42 luk/ 35 def/ 47 res |while leading

And R!L!Morgan as a Sage:

28 str/ 56 mag/ 45 skll/ 46 spd/ 46 luk/ 26 def/ 42 res |But with the preceding DF!Lucina in the rear, this adds:

+5 / +8 / +5 / +8 / +5 / +5 / +7 |resulting in a total of:

33 str/ 64 mag/ 50 skll/ 54 spd/ 51 luk. 31 def/ 49 res |while leading

With the highest stat out of each of the four sets bolded for reference.

But what about other stat boosters? I'm not sure how much sense it would make to include tonics, +2 stat skills, and barracks boosts, but rallies are certainly significant enough.

Assuming non DLC (aka no Rally Heart), a duo of Rallybots could run the following sets for total coverage:

A female SpotPass character could run: Rally Spectrum, Rally Magic, Rally Skill, Rally Speed, and Rally Resistance

A male SpotPass character could run: Rally Spectrum, Rally Strength, Rally Skill, Rally Luck, and Rally Defense

This would basically equate to +8 to all relevant stats, except Luck which would be at +12, I think?

So the highest stats from each pair-up were as follows:

68 str/ 64 mag/ 56 skll/ 57 spd/ 52 luk/ 41 def/ 47 res (with all the highest stats except for magic and resistance coming from the Assassin/Berserker pair-up)

+8 / +8 / +8 / +8 /+12 / +8 / +8 |Now with Rallies taken into account across the board:

76 str/ 72 mag/ 64 skll/ 65 spd/ 64 luk/ 49 def/ 55 res |this is apparently what a unit would be up against. And this is without any other boosts from tonics, barracks, weapons bonuses etc.

I hope this is at least somewhat accurate considering my initial premise...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

S rank doesn't give +2 flat across the board but +2 to the class modifiers, as can be read near the end of the page you linked.

[email protected]:

61 str/ 26 mag/ 38 skll/ 45 spd/ 44 luk/ 36 def/ 26 res

Bonuses:

+5 str, +3 spd from Berserker class pair-up.

+2 str, +2 spd from A/S rank class modifier

+3 str, +2 mag, +3 skl, +3 spd, +3 lck, +3 def, +2 res from support unit stat bonus

total:

+10 str, +2 mag, +3 Skl, +8 Spd, +3 lck, +3 def, +2 res.

[email protected]:

42 str/ 31 mag/ 51 skll/ 49 spd/ 47 luk/ 30 def/ 29 res base

52 str/ 33 mag/ 54 skl/ 57 spd/ 50 lck/ 33 def/ 31 res with Morgan S supporting her.

All rallies sans heart is +8 to all and +12 to luck, correct.

Question: How much do you value movement?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

S rank doesn't give +2 flat across the board but +2 to the class modifiers, as can be read near the end of the page you linked.

[email protected]:

61 str/ 26 mag/ 38 skll/ 45 spd/ 44 luk/ 36 def/ 26 res

Bonuses:

+5 str, +3 spd from Berserker class pair-up.

+2 str, +2 spd from A/S rank class modifier

+3 str, +2 mag, +3 skl, +3 spd, +3 lck, +3 def, +2 res from support unit stat bonus

total:

+10 str, +2 mag, +3 Skl, +8 Spd, +3 lck, +3 def, +2 res.

[email protected]:

42 str/ 31 mag/ 51 skll/ 49 spd/ 47 luk/ 30 def/ 29 res base

52 str/ 33 mag/ 54 skl/ 57 spd/ 50 lck/ 33 def/ 31 res with Morgan S supporting her.

All rallies sans heart is +8 to all and +12 to luck, correct.

Question: How much do you value movement?

That was an unfortunate mistake on my part. Thanks for the necessary corrections.

As far as movement goes, I assume you mean with regards to the AI units?

Well, I wouldn't mind sacrificing movement for defense (i.e. a General) if there were some way for such a pair to be reliably tanked.

While I have yet to do the calculations on this, I suspect that such would not be the case, however.

I was thinking that it might be a good strategy for the MU to have boots, almost regardless of what they are.

From what I recall, the MU is treated as the 'boss' of the StreetPass team, and will usually spawn furthest among the rest of the AI.

Other than that, high movement classes are acceptable if they have some perceived benefit.

For example, fliers are able to bypass most terrain, though a similar affect could be achieved by a Paladin or Bow Knight with Acrobat.

Besides this, most 6-movement classes have some other benefit, like the higher skill and speed of Heroes and Assassins for instance.

Did you have something particular in mind?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As far as movement goes, I assume you mean with regards to the AI units?

Well, I wouldn't mind sacrificing movement for defense (i.e. a General) if there were some way for such a pair to be reliably tanked.

While I have yet to do the calculations on this, I suspect that such would not be the case, however.

Even [email protected]+Def with Limit Breaker gets annihilated by brave weapons and dual strikes. The only way to live through a barrage of attacks is to avoid them.

To that end, speed is vital - It decreases the probability of the enemy doubling your unit. Of course this is a vain effort, but we can at least try to make it difficult for the enemy to just walk up with his snipers from 3 range and kill everything without any hopes of retaliation.

I was thinking that it might be a good strategy for the MU to have boots, almost regardless of what they are.

From what I recall, the MU is treated as the 'boss' of the StreetPass team, and will usually spawn furthest among the rest of the AI.

MU will spawn furthest from the enemy that's true.

From this quote I infer that you want your team to move as one, sticking together, because it would suck to have your units split off from one another just to be cherry picked by the opponent

Other than that, high movement classes are acceptable if they have some perceived benefit.

For example, fliers are able to bypass most terrain, though a similar affect could be achieved by a Paladin or Bow Knight with Acrobat.

Besides this, most 6-movement classes have some other benefit, like the higher skill and speed of Heroes and Assassins for instance.

I think movement is the most crucial stat of all, since it limits the amount of time your opponent has to take advantage of map architecture. Of course, all classes have their benefits, some of which you mentioned.

Did you have something particular in mind?

No, not particularly. I've had a few iterations of teams, the latest one is about half a year old, you can see it here. I doubt that it'll contribute much, if anything at all to this thread, but it won't hurt, I think.

OxgizMS.png?1

Do you want to use the logbook?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Even [email protected]+Def with Limit Breaker gets annihilated by brave weapons and dual strikes. The only way to live through a barrage of attacks is to avoid them.

To that end, speed is vital - It decreases the probability of the enemy doubling your unit. Of course this is a vain effort, but we can at least try to make it difficult for the enemy to just walk up with his snipers from 3 range and kill everything without any hopes of retaliation.

So, dodgetank or bust. Got it. Speaking of Nah, that reminds me: does having a dragon weakness mean anything significant in a StreetPass setting? Taguel only have to worry about Beastslayers whose 'effective' damage pales in comparison to Brave weapons. Is it similar for dragon weaknesses as well, despite the Awakened Falchion and Book of Naga having 15 Mt apiece?

MU will spawn furthest from the enemy that's true.

From this quote I infer that you want your team to move as one, sticking together, because it would suck to have your units split off from one another just to be cherry picked by the opponent

That's exactly right. Since it's an unknown as to what map the team would spawn on, I was thinking of having MU use the boots to alleviate any distance issues, possibly having them in a mounted class of some sort. Based on your next comment, that seems highly recommended.

I think movement is the most crucial stat of all, since it limits the amount of time your opponent has to take advantage of map architecture. Of course, all classes have their benefits, some of which you mentioned.

So, based on this, mounted classes are a plausible generality, with exceptions being when a unit performs noticeably better in another class for some reason. This makes me wonder who would be a good candidate for the second pair of boots. Morgan seems too cliche, and they'd likely be auto-targeted anyway by the player. Perhaps Morgan's sibling (if she has one) or to some random 6-movement unit for a surprise factor?

No, not particularly. I've had a few iterations of teams, the latest one is about half a year old, you can see it here. I doubt that it'll contribute much, if anything at all to this thread, but it won't hurt, I think.

OxgizMS.png?1

Do you want to use the logbook?

I'd prefer not to use the logbook. I personally find composing a StreetPass team a more interesting challenge when it's done strictly within the confines of the units given in-game.

Certain 'themed' teams of logbook MUs do have their appeal, but that's about it.

As far as your team goes, I actually like much of its composition. Apparently it's a high-movement Counter bomber team? It's the sort of thing we could still utilize even without the DLC aspects. Presumably all of the units are locked to Brave 1-range weapons, most of which are lances or swords, with the possible exception of Severa in her Hero class.

One thing I'd like to bring up, is that since Olivia!Lucina can't become a Counter bomber (regardless of her mother), perhaps, she could see use as a Celica's Gale-toting Dark Flier?

Her stats as a Great Lord are:

45 str/ 31 mag /43 skll/ 44 spd/ 47 luk/ 41 def/ 39 res

While as a Dark Flier, she has:

38 str/ 43 mag /44 skll/ 45 spd/ 47 luk/ 31 def/ 40 res

Granted, she does lose 2 points from her primary attacking stat, but DF Lucina can go mixed with Celcia's Gale and Brave Lances. The 10 point drop in defense isn't good, but could the additional point of skill and speed be worth it? Of note is that she hits 44 skill as a DF, meaning she can get a solid 11% Lethality which goes to 21% via RK. Seeing as she had Aether and LB, perhaps LB could be dropped for Luna. Triple proc-stacking might seem excessive, but with 10 fewer skill, perhaps it could be beneficial?

Overall though, aside from Severa, this team is heavily reliant on swords or lances. A few more axe-users could provide a little more weapons versatility, or perhaps one could swap another Counter unit or two for a couple more (Lethality) magic-users?

Edited by Tactless Tactician

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The problem with dodge tank, is that hit rate is beyond easy to get. Avo is hard to itemize while hit rate is already given (dual support, hexnathema being almost staples to many units). That's not even factoring if the enemy is running hit rate+20 or any points in forge.

You can run lucky 7, quick burn, prescience, breaker, and the enemy will still have high hit rate on you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The problem with dodge tank, is that hit rate is beyond easy to get. Avo is hard to itemize while hit rate is already given (dual support, hexnathema being almost staples to many units). That's not even factoring if the enemy is running hit rate+20 or any points in forge.

You can run lucky 7, quick burn, prescience, breaker, and the enemy will still have high hit rate on you.

Then what would you suggest? A team full of Counter-Lethality units, with Hit/Avo skills to increase the chances of the AI at least being able to hit (and maybe roll Lethality) as opposed to attempting to dodge-tank?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just for the record: I'm not trying to force this thread into a certain direction. My believe is to let it evolve freely into whichever direction it feels like going. That's more interesting, fun, and will yield better results, which I'm certain of.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Then what would you suggest? A team full of Counter-Lethality units, with Hit/Avo skills to increase the chances of the AI at least being able to hit (and maybe roll Lethality) as opposed to attempting to dodge-tank?

Well that's the problem. That's what's kinda "forced." I see the point of this thread to find a substitution to lethality that's plausible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just for the record: I'm not trying to force this thread into a certain direction. My believe is to let it evolve freely into whichever direction it feels like going. That's more interesting, fun, and will yield better results, which I'm certain of.

Well, I'm personally interested in attempting to make as effective a team (comprised of only in-game units) as possible, though I'm of course open to suggestions.

Unfortunately, I don't have a second 3DS to test StreetPassing myself with, otherwise I'd quickly whip up a team comprised of a +Luck/-Str MaMU, an Olivia!Lucina and a Chrom!Inigo (the three of which I'm almost 100% set on using at this point) as the three 'constants' for the team, and test various combinations of children and skills over two or three files.

Well that's the problem. That's what's kinda "forced." I see the point of this thread to find a substitution to lethality that's plausible.

The only thing that might come close is AI Counter-bombing at 1-range.

And for such a stratagem, the few tactics that immediately come to mind are:

1. One or two male units throwing HP+5 onto their skillsets, so that they can possibly deal 84 damage with Miracle. Any more, and the player may simply slap on a HP+5 of their own or use a Tiki's Tear or Confect. Discretion is key.

2. Attempting to overwhelm one target on the AI phase through Counter-nuking, hopefully being sturdy enough individually to not be one-shot by the leading unit's first attack.

3. Mixing Counter and Lethality so that something triggers and hopefully deals damage (if not killing a unit outright)

Taking all of the scenarios into account, Gaius, Vaike, and MaMU are top tier fathers for having both Thief and Counter.

Kellam may see use on a son that inherently has Counter (like Laurent) due to having Priest and Thief despite his sub-par luck mod of -2.

Donnel too has utility as a Counter-father, and for his high luck mod. He'd probably be best off fathering Brady so that the latter can get Counter and make use of the resultant +7 luck mod for Miracle.

Gregor gets an honorable mention for Counter and Lethality.

Even FeMorgan can get in on the act by being the daughter of Gaius/Henry!Cynthia, CounterFather!Kjelle/Nah (Henry, Gaius, Donnel, Gregor, Vaike) or Donnel.

Donnel!Nah!Morgan in particular has the distinction of boasting a +9 luck mod, admittedly at the expense of -2 skill and speed mods (and a dragon weakness for what that's worth).

This would enable her to run a set of Miracle, Counter, HP+5 and two other skills.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let's do a bit of brainstorming.

I believe that the only way counter can be utilized is to put it on units which are able to close the distance to engage at 1 range to blow up in the opponents face. One is not enough, but if you have half a dozen of them, somebody is bound to be killed somehow if the player doesn't completely stop the onslaught at the start of PP1.

My team employs strategy 2 mentioned in #21.

Three units with RFK and Lethality are probably a good point to start at. Their threat will come from attacking only, so there is room for Miracle, which energizes nicely with RFK.

Against dual strikes, Miracle is such a lackluster skill, but we do not really have much choice in terms of survivability.

If I could choose one skill which all units could have for free, it would be lucky7.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let's do a bit of brainstorming.

I believe that the only way counter can be utilized is to put it on units which are able to close the distance to engage at 1 range to blow up in the opponents face. One is not enough, but if you have half a dozen of them, somebody is bound to be killed somehow if the player doesn't completely stop the onslaught at the start of PP1.

My team employs strategy 2 mentioned in #21.

Three units with RFK and Lethality are probably a good point to start at. Their threat will come from attacking only, so there is room for Miracle, which energizes nicely with RFK.

Alright, I suppose this means that a FeMU would be recommended for such an endeavor. Options for flaws include:

Strength: -1 str/ 0 mag/ 3 skll/ 0 spd/ 0 luk / 1 def/ 0 res (hurts skill mildly, but doesn't hinder speed or luck)

A Chrom!Inigo!Morgan would cap Skill at 54 as an Assassin. The extra point of skill from a skill-neutral flaw would make no difference, though Skill +2 from the Archer class would increase it to 56, thereby increasing Lethality's base proc rate from 13% to 14%

Defense: 2 str/ 0 mag/ 4 skll/ 0 spd/ -1 luk / -1 def/ -1 res

The extra point of skill doesn't help matters much, while Luck takes a minor hit. I'd suggest +Skill/-Strength despite sounding counter-intuitive (pun not intended) at first.

Other flaws:

HP: reduces luck by 1

Magic: reduces speed by 1

Defense: reduces luck by 1

Resistance: reduces speed by 1

Against dual strikes, Miracle is such a lackluster skill, but we do not really have much choice in terms of survivability.

If I could choose one skill which all units could have for free, it would be lucky7.

Fathers that provide Thief (for Lucky 7) are as follows: Vaike, Kellam, Lon'qu, Gaius, Henry

Children that inherit Thief through their mothers: Yarne

FeMU will likely be relegated to 'Lethality spam' status, while Lucina, Inigo, and Morgan function as a RK!Lethality 'core'.

The aforementioned fathers can produce five more children with the Thief class, with at least three of them possessing Counter.

Yarne rounds out the set, as he too possesses both Thief and Counter.

Lackluster though it be, children that inherently possess Miracle are as follows:

Owain, Brady, Cynthia, Gerome.

Owain and Gerome in particular naturally possess Counter as well.

Cynthia needs either Henry or Gaius to exist, while also providing Counter+Thief services.

Owain and Gerome just need Thief, making Vaike and Lon'qu more suitable options for them.

Brady can then take whoever isn't used to father Cynthia, either Henry or Gaius for his Counter+Thief set.

If we want Yarne to have Miracle, he'd need Libra as a father to avoid overlap with Kellam's Thief set.

And Laurent could be then fathered by Kellam for a Miracle+Counter+Thief setup of his own.

So the end result seems to be:

+Skill/-Strength FeMU, Olivia!Lucina, Chrom!Inigo, Inigo!Morgan, Kellam!Laurent, Libra!Yarne,

Henry/Gaius!Cynthia, Gaius/Henry!Brady,

Vaike/Lon'qu!Owain, Lon'qu/Vaike!Gerome

Thoughts?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thoughts?

Looks awesome let's go!

+Skill/-Strength FeMU
Lucky7, Quick Burn, Lethality, <filler>, Miracle
Olivia!Lucina
Counter, RFK, Lethality, Aether, <filler>
Chrom!Inigo
Counter, RFK, Lethality, Hit+20, <filler>
Inigo!Morgan
Counter, RFK, Lethality, Lucky7, Miracle
Kellam!Laurent,
Counter, Tomebreaker, Lethality, Lucky7, Miracle
Henry!Cynthia:
Counter, Tomebreaker, Lethality, Lucky7, Miracle
Libra!Yarne,
Counter, Quick Burn, Lethality, Lucky7, Miracle
Gaius!Brady,
Counter, Lucky7, Lethality, <filler>, Miracle,
Vaike!Owain
Counter, HP+5 or Axebreaker, Lethality, Lucky7, Miracle
Lon'qu/Vaike!Gerome
Counter, HP+5 or Swordbreaker or Lancebreaker, Lethality, Lucky7, Miracle
I didn't look at the classes yet. Depending on the class, we'll give the units a superior weapon to hold as long as they do not engage in combat, with weapons with brave effects sitting in every units inventory.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Her stats as a Great Lord are:

45 str/ 31 mag /43 skll/ 44 spd/ 47 luk/ 41 def/ 39 res

Quick note: those are her stats... As a Great Lord(M). GL(F) has different caps.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...