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On one of my playthroughs I had Rhys as a Saint solo Ashera so... I would say that he can definitely be worth using if you take the time. I've always had a fondness for Rhys since irl we look a bit alike but if you use him well in PoR and port your save over and nurture him he can be an incredible unit. Its worth doing for a playthrough in my opinion

Whoa whoa whoa... I don't see this as possible outside of easy mode since he can't double, and ward wood auras would only be taking 11 damage at most, which gets healed off come enemy phase. There's also this little matter of the spirits healing them even if he could...

EDIT: Ok, so I derped and forgot White Pool. Not that it'd change anything...

Edited by Levant Caprice

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No one here loves the 12 range physic as much as I do, apparently.

I'll admit, I probably would've given it more credit were it not for physic staves being rare - for most of their playtime, you only have the one from 2-E to work with (which will have seen quite a bit of use unless you 1 turned 2-E).

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wait wait, if they do, then why do i keep hearing about how "34 is the magic number to double auras"

or am i retarded and misremembered something?

34+5 from the white pool dog

39 AS=Doubleing auras

Edited by Moishe Oofnik

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34+5 from the white pool dog

39 AS=Doubleing auras

That combined with 34 doubling all the Spirits alone. It's the magic number for all of Endgame (or at least E-4 and E-5), not just Auras.

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Out of the box Rhys is generally superior since his higher chip damage and Physic range outweigh Mist's one extra move, and I don't believe there are any physical enemies with 18 AS (which doubles Rhys but not Mist) at this point (it's been too long since I've played RD and I'm too lazy to check at the moment).

Mist is more worth training than Rhys, but only in the sense that Kyza is more worth training than Lyre; They're both pretty bad at anything besides healing.

The cool thing about Fire Emblem, however (albeit slightly less so in RD), is that you can use either, both or neither and you're not wrong in any way.

Edited by Radiant Dragon

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Out of the box Rhys is generally superior since his higher chip damage and Physic range outweigh Mist's one extra move, and I don't believe there are any physical enemies with 18 AS (which doubles Rhys but not Mist) at this point (it's been too long since I've played RD and I'm too lazy to check at the moment).

Mist is more worth training than Rhys, but only in the sense that Kyza is more worth training than Lyre; They're both pretty bad at anything besides healing.

The cool thing about Fire Emblem, however (albeit slightly less so in RD), is that you can use either, both or neither and you're not wrong in any way.

most physical enemys AS ranges beetween 18-22 in 3-P and in 3-1 it ranges from 19-23(alot of 19 AS doe)

rhys get doubled alot

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Once upon a time, she did.

Yea. And since Rhys/Mist also factored into Mia/Zihark since Rhys supported Mia it got REALLY hairy. That's why the Zihark/Mia debates blew up like they did. They basically touched upon every aspect of the game in determining who was better. Was Muarim worth it considering his late join? How did Laguz transforms factor into it? Did Reyson's chant nullify Mia's edge by allowing people to move again (making Zihark's AVO more valuable) or allow supports to move about with ease (making Rhys's support more valuable)? What was the value of a counter? What is the worth of a skill?

I don't think there was any debate as key to the FE9 tiers as Mia vs. Zihark. I don't know what other key debates that determined the outcomes of entire tier lists there were, but I bet Mia vs. Zihark was up there.

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Which is ironic considering both Zihark and Mia are just bad in FE9.

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most physical enemys AS ranges beetween 18-22 in 3-P and in 3-1 it ranges from 19-23(alot of 19 AS doe)

rhys get doubled alot

My point was about the 18 AS dudes specifically though, the ones that double Rhys but not Mist. Mist is also doubled the majority of those enemies, although it seems that if you can give her a BEXP level after 3-P she has a good chance at not getting doubled by the 19 AS dudes in 3-1. That does give her more options for front-line healing than Rhys in case things go horribly wrong, but I never really cared about the defensive stats of my healers since they never get attacked anyway.

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Which is ironic considering both Zihark and Mia are just bad in FE9.

I get where you're coming from on Zihark, but Mia roflstomps POR on easy mode, and is still amazing on normal mode.

Not sure about hard mode tho due to not yet playing POR on hard.

Back on topic, I doubt Rhys or Mist would be useful in a transferless run, but the beauty of FE is that ANYONE can be useful with enough effort. I don't care for RD due to it's story, but every character is usable somehow(yes, even Meg and Fiona). So it mostly comes down to the players needs, quick results=Rhys; better but not so quick results=Mist.

Either way, I don't use healers, so both remain unused for me.

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I get where you're coming from on Zihark, but Mia roflstomps POR on easy mode, and is still amazing on normal mode.

Not sure about hard mode tho due to not yet playing POR on hard.

Back on topic, I doubt Rhys or Mist would be useful in a transferless run, but the beauty of FE is that ANYONE can be useful with enough effort. I don't care for RD due to it's story, but every character is usable somehow(yes, even Meg and Fiona). So it mostly comes down to the players needs, quick results=Rhys; better but not so quick results=Mist.

Either way, I don't use healers, so both remain unused for me.

Zihark is superior to mia in every way doe her level averages are crap (she doesnt even cap any stat but spd and even than she is just a waste of bexp to get to the level where she caps it)

Mias bases at level10

23 HP 8.6 Str 1.2 mag 11.8 skl 15.4 spd 7.8 lck 7.8 def 3 res

Mias Growths:

50% 40% 30% 45% 60% 45% 20% 45%

Zihark starting stats (lvl10)

25 hp 10 str 1 mag 13 skl 15 speed 6 luck 7 def 0 res

Ziharks growths

55% 45% 15% 50% 60% 40% 30% 20%

She beats him at res def and luck he has more str and better growths (both suck)

Adept vs Vantage=Adept

20/1 Averages:

Zihark:

34.5 HP 15.5 str 4.5 mag 20 skl 22 spd 10 luck 12 def 4 res

Mia:

32 HP 13.6 str 6.2 mag 18.3 skl 22 spd 12.3 luck 11.8 def 7.5 res

Because res and mag are praciticly meaningless (Oliver has 9 mag so threatning)Mia is pretty much a worse zihark with more luck (but he has that earth affinity to laugh at mia)

Edited by Moishe Oofnik

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Except that none of that is really true. Firstly the two do NOT join at the same time at all and have four chapters of difference between them. This means that, not only will Mia have been contributing for four more chapters than Zihark (chapters 7, 8, 9, and 10) but she'll have her first support with Rhys up. So not only is it VERY likely Mia will be 11-12 when Zihark joins but she'll have +1 attack on top of that.

Secondly Vantage kicks Adept's ass both as a skill, especially one for swordmasters, AND as an assist for other skills. The single best complimentary skill for adept is vantage as it allows a SM to strike twice on the EP, a skill which you'll notice Mia has. So for their 'best' loadouts Zihark needs Vantage and Mia needs adept... except adept is only ONE possible combination for Mia. Mia can also pick from Vantage/wrath and vantage/guard (and technically vantage/resolve as well, but that's a bit too late to really consider for any set-up). Adept doesn't work too well with other skills though as if failing to kill in two strikes is somehow a problem for Zihark, well, then the STR advantage is moot in the face of better criticals.

Especially since Earth doesn't really help out Zihark as much as you'd think. Sure, it will help when dealing with pesky mages and thrown weapons but when it comes to actual dodging the two are fairly even before supports with a slight edge to Mia... except it's not. Mia has vantage so, when the two are out of support range, Mia has a chance to critical, adept, or guard foes who attack her in melee range while Zihark does not.

Sure, Muarim can help that out, but if you're seriously going to complain about Mia's STR then there is no justification for Muarim whose STR ends up just as high as Zihark's... except he either has to wait four turns before fighting at all or take the one-of-a-kind band to clock in at a whopping... 37 STR at max level.

A 20/1 Mia with a Rhys A Ilyana B support and a forged Silver clocks in at 37. Except Rhys can heal, pick off the occasional target, and use siege tomes and Ilyana is a capable mage. And Mia has 19 more levels to go while Muarim is capped out. So complaining about Mia's STR then bragging about Zihark's AVO is hypocritical. Especially since Zihark's OTHER supports are Ilyana (who supports Mia as well) and Brom (who is far worse than either Ilyana or Rhys).

Zihark costs more resources (vantage is more valuable and he needs another skill for any other combo while Mia already has vantage and has multiple options for skills including guard which few people can make use of. She costs more EXP, yes, but only four levels-worth and she has four chapters to get it), has a worse support list (Muarim sucks hard once other units start promoting and brings nothing to the table and falls behind even a 20/1 Mia), only clocks in at 1 more STR (Hello +attack supports!) and that's WITH BROM supporting him, and doesn't even really have that much of a defensive lead since vantage lets Mia critical, adept, or guard (depending on your set-up) beforehand while Zihark has to always dodge.

Winner: Mia.

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Secondly Vantage kicks Adept's ass both as a skill,

Vantage is pretty useless for Mia because her attacks are so weak. She can finish off stuff well, but that's it. Adept is much better.

You keep talking about stuff that's irrelevant for a good FE9 playthrough.

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:facepalm:

These again? How often do these spring up? Someone mentions "Mia" or "Zihark" and then someone else has to say one is better. Might as well change the topic name to Mia vs Zihark.

Idc about Mist vs Rhys, they both function the same. Mist is I guess better because of the horse, but she still isn't great. Heavily nerfed from POR.

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Why is there a Mia vs Zihark debate happening in here?

Good thing it's over.

And if you don't catch my drift, that's me saying, "Stop."

Edited by Red Fox of Fire

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