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Kagehoshi

Faction-locked Classes instead of gender-locked?

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Hi, Kagehoshi here again - you might remember me as the one who ranted on a different topic about the release date gap.

Anywho, I'm not here to rant, I just wish to talk about something I picked up on after having watched the trailers/screenshot a lot, and I want to hear everyone's thoughts. My apologies for the lengthy post. Screenshots I'm mentioning can be found on this site under "Images and Videos."

Something I would like to point out (and I'm most likely not the first to think of it) is that there might not be any gender-locked classes in FE:if, but rather, faction-locked;

Amongst Hoshido's forces (seen in screenshots etc.) we see mymidons and swordmasters,
based on their battle stance (same as Awakening) which fits with how someone would wield a katana.
We also see assassins on the Hoshido side, as they share the same sprites from Awakening again, but
we don't see any cavaliers at all. Ryoma himself looks like a swordmaster, same stance and all.
On the Nohr side, however (screenshots, again) we see that there are no assassins/swordmasters/myrmidons around - only knights and cavaliers. My theory/speculation is that the myrmidons/assassins/swordmasters will be for Hoshido only since they're more reminiscent to samurais and ninjas, which goes with the "feudal Japan" feel on Hoshido, while cavaliers, knights, great knights, and paladins will be exclusive to Nohr as they traditionally look more western/european in appearance, which goes with the western influence of Nohr.
We don't see any of these classes on the opposite sides at all so far - so if certain classes are faction-locked, it could explain why we might see male pegasus knights and female warriors (Rinka, the horned-masked girl seen in trailers, screenshots, and next toRyoma as he tells Kamui about being his brother, appears to be a warrior with a kanabo - the eastern version of an axe - her attack animation is just like warriors/berserkers in Awakening); it would still give your forces more class options despite that some are exlcusive to the opposite faction.
It does makes sense, in the way that a knight, with it's western-inspired armour, would look outlandish on Hoshido's side, while a ninja/assassin (Saizou being an example, appearance wise) would look strange in the Nohr army.
Again, before people bash me, remember that we don't see any of these classes in the opposite faction; all screenshots show these classes fighting the other side, such as knights and cavaliers agains myrmidons/swordmasters, and the only assassin sprites are shown with other Hoshido characters. Hell, maybe even Dark Knights will only be for Nohr as well? We know that Leon is a Dark Knight, and we've seen (appearance wise, at least) Dark Knights being the enemy in screenshot and the first trailer, at least.
Your thoughts?
EDIT: Someone pointed out that perhaps it was just showcased to look like there were faction-locked classes, but in the second trailer (speficially, when both your families beckons you to their side) you can see Hoshido's and Nohr's armies in the background - Nohr has soldiers similar to Awakening with their western style, complese with lances, while Hoshido show katana-wielding myrmidons as their main force, further supporting my theory.

However, there's a possibility that you can recruit units from the opposite faction, as seen on these screenshots:
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/fireemblem/images/7/70/Saizou_sprite.png/revision/latest?cb=20150410071751
http://serenesforest.net/wp-content/gallery/january-2015-nintendo-direct/Jan_006.jpg

Notice how the sprite is the same - first, a Nohrian marked as red, the standard colour of enemies in the series, and in the next, blue - he's with you. It's not a stretch to say that the only way you could get your faction's missing classes is by recruiting them from the opposite side?
Edited by Kagehoshi

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It would be hard to implement this to prevent two seperate ballenceing issues.

1. The equivelent of last game's gaelforce situation, where one class set having access to one or two specific tricks makes it clearly superior.

2. A situation where a route has a ton of characters on the same class set, and few on the other set. (whatch this manage to somehow screw archers over in one rout because none of the potential candidates match up statwise.

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I would prefer this to Gender-locked classes, but we do see a Cavalier on the Hoshido side so I doubt we will get a class entirely locked out of a certain route unless it is a special class.

Hmm, true. That sprite however appears as an enemy as well, so maybe factions can recruit characters from the opposite one? He looks Nohrian to me and it's possible we have already seen him in-game; I have yet to see a Hoshido style cavalier and a Nohrian styled swordmaster.

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I would prefer this to Gender-locked classes, but we do see a Cavalier on the Hoshido side so I doubt we will get a class entirely locked out of a certain route unless it is a special class.

It's been speculated that this is the same cavalier you get on the Nohr side, in which case he's probably a Nohr soldier who defects if you side with Hoshido. It still means cavaliers are a phenomenon that stems from Nohr.

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There is always the chance they just decided to showcase it that way, because as you said, some classes would look ridiculous on one side or the other, so maybe they just didn't show those ones for that reason

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It's been speculated that this is the same cavalier you get on the Nohr side, in which case he's probably a Nohr soldier who defects if you side with Hoshido. It still means cavaliers are a phenomenon that stems from Nohr.

I absolutely agree.

Edit: That's possibly how it's going to be - some classes aren't available on your faction, but you can recruit one or two from the opposite one, giving you access to all classes but keeping it limited.

Edited by Kagehoshi

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There is the possibility of the soldier class being playable on both sides. In the teaser, some Hoshido looking soldiers who are armed with both katanas and naginatas are present. However , this could just be a npc class or visual effect for the teaser trailer.

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While I do believe certain classes will be native to certain countries (which isn't all that unusual; mymidons/swordmasters, Pegasus Knights and Wyvern Riders all tend to come from specific countries) I don't think this necessarily means they'll be locked to certain factions. There's probably be a few characters who join Kamui regardless of which side they join, a few characters that are just wandering mercenaries, a few characters that desert the countries for moral reasons, etc.

Edited by Mysterique Sign

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Apart from the fact that this theory has indeed been voiced by quite a few people in the past, I don't see why anyone would bash you. Actually, some people went a little bit further and theorized that most exclusive classes were supposed to be the equivalent of another one from the other side.

In any case, archers might be Hoshido exclusive, while Nohr gets bow-using thieves. Upon looking at Sakura's map sprite, we can also see that she looks different from the clerics seen in Nohr, not to mention the TGC revealed that she'd use bows - probably upon promotion - which is unlike anything we've seen before. In general it seems like horses are more of a Nohr thing, so most if not all the classes that ride one would come from there; cavaliers, dark knights, but also troubadours, maybe more. We can see a blond axe user on Nohr, which may or may not be from a different class than Rinka. His sprite doesn't look like anything from Awakening, though obviously Rinca's doesn't either, since female axe users on foot were barely a thing. And then you have a mercenary in Nohr, and Hoshido sure has a lot of myrmidons around. These two classes and their promotion have been opposed several times throughout the series, so mercenaries may very well be tied to Nohr as well.

Then you have the more complicated issue of magic users. Dark magic might be exclusive to Nohr along with dark mages, but even anima was only seen from Nohr at this point, except for that one icy-rat spell from Orochi, which may very well be something completely different.

Finally, the assasins looking guys from Hoshido do have a similar map sprite, but their model is new, as is their very ninja-esque attack animation, and the only weapon we see them use looks like a throwing star. Basically I'm pretty sure they're specifically from a new class called ninja, which is indeed most likely Hoshido exclusive.

But alas, none of this proves that you won't get some of these classes on their opposite version. It's too early to tell. This was more about background than gameplay.

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While I do believe certain classes will be native to certain countries (which isn't all that unusual; mymidons/swordmasters, Pegasus Knights and Wyvern Riders all tend to come from soecific countries) I don't think this necessarily means they'll be locked to certain factions. There's probably be a few characters who join Kamui regardless of which side they join, a few characters that are just wandering mercenaries, a few characters that desert the countries for moral reasons, etc.

Yeah, of course you'll be able to get those classes by the examples you just gave - I meant that, initially, your side won't have certain classes in their ranks (like, we won't see pegasus knights amongst the Nohr army) but certain characters will be recruitable. However, I don't think, for example, that pure Hoshido characters will be able to change cinto Nohr-themes classes, such as knights and cavaliers. It'll be bound to those few that you recruit.

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Apart from the fact that this theory has indeed been voiced by quite a few people in the past, I don't see why anyone would bash you. Actually, some people went a little bit further and theorized that most exclusive classes were supposed to be the equivalent of another one from the other side.

In any case, archers might be Hoshido exclusive, while Nohr gets bow-using thieves. Upon looking at Sakura's map sprite, we can also see that she looks different from the clerics seen in Nohr, not to mention the TGC revealed that she'd use bows - probably upon promotion - which is unlike anything we've seen before. In general it seems like horses are more of a Nohr thing, so most if not all the classes that ride one would come from there; cavaliers, dark knights, but also troubadours, maybe more. We can see a blond axe user on Nohr, which may or may not be from a different class than Rinka. His sprite doesn't look like anything from Awakening, though obviously Rinca's doesn't either, since female axe users on foot were barely a thing. And then you have a mercenary in Nohr, and Hoshido sure has a lot of myrmidons around. These two classes and their promotion have been opposed several times throughout the series, so mercenaries may very well be tied to Nohr as well.

Then you have the more complicated issue of magic users. Dark magic might be exclusive to Nohr along with dark mages, but even anima was only seen from Nohr at this point, except for that one icy-rat spell from Orochi, which may very well be something completely different.

Finally, the assasins looking guys from Hoshido do have a similar map sprite, but their model is new, as is their very ninja-esque attack animation, and the only weapon we see them use looks like a throwing star. Basically I'm pretty sure they're specifically from a new class called ninja, which is indeed most likely Hoshido exclusive.

But alas, none of this proves that you won't get some of these classes on their opposite version. It's too early to tell. This was more about background than gameplay.

You raise some fine points, mate.

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I'm pretty sure they will have faction locked classes, which would be interesting.

I'm glad to see stuff getting gender unlocked, female fighters are awesome.

Still, it looks like Nohr is getting the cooler classes. Wyvern riders as opposed to pegasus knights, dark knights, etc.

Hoshido's got.... ninjas?

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I'm pretty sure they will have faction locked classes, which would be interesting.

I'm glad to see stuff getting gender unlocked, female fighters are awesome.

Still, it looks like Nohr is getting the cooler classes. Wyvern riders as opposed to pegasus knights, dark knights, etc.

Hoshido's got.... ninjas?

Ninjas, Swordmasters, Pegasus Knights, and whatever class Orochi is - if her spell is of any indication, I'm guessing she's a new class. I'm probably wrong, though. Sure, Nohr get "more" class choices, but I'm sure there'll be 1 or 2 new classes in Hoshido.

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I think, and mind you, I don't have anything to back this up, but I think that Orochi might be a mage, and it's just that Hoshido mages look different. Like, Nohr mages use traditional western magic, and Hoshido mages use... taoist style?

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I think, and mind you, I don't have anything to back this up, but I think that Orochi might be a mage, and it's just that Hoshido mages look different. Like, Nohr mages use traditional western magic, and Hoshido mages use... taoist style?

Most likely. I'm just optimistic. Still, I don't mind if there's no faction-locked classes (but they better make sure a Hoshido paladin for example looks eastern) but it would be interesting since it not only further shows the differences between the two nations, it'll add new strategies to each side.

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I doubt any class will be completely faction locked. If reclassing is back then its likely you wont get any that are default a class from the other side but instead reclass to that class. But possibly alternate names for the same class based off of the different roots for example samurai could be a name for a swordsmaster on Hoshido side

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I doubt any class will be completely faction locked. If reclassing is back then its likely you wont get any that are default a class from the other side but instead reclass to that class. But possibly alternate names for the same class based off of the different roots for example samurai could be a name for a swordsmaster on Hoshido side

That's a distinct possibility, and if I'm honest, the most likely scenario. Still, I do enjoy the idea that some classes are not available for one faction or the other.

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Faction-specific classes are nothing new in FE; when's the last time you saw a Wyvern Knight from Lycia, or a Pegasus Knight with Thracian origins?

I'm completely expecting you to be able to recruit at least some Hoshidan units on the Nohr route (and vice versa), and it makes sense that they might be the "interesting" ones.

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I'm pretty sure the OP meant that the classes are different culturally, as in that if you get a cavalier in Hoshido, chances are they will have Nohrian origins. They probably won't put a lock on classes, but we'll probably see more wyvern (revenant?) knights, cavaliers, knights, dark mages, and troubadours on the Nohrian side and more pegasus warriors, myrmidons, archers, and priests/priestesses on the Hoshidan side.

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Signs seem to suggest faction-locked classes.

For one, when describing classes, Famitsu explicitly states what faction it's from. Eg. Sorcerers are from Nohr.

Secondly, unless my memory fails me, all Nohrian classes are written in katakana (for a western feel), while Hoshidan classes are a mixture of kanji and hiragana (for a Japanese theme).

Even classes usually written in katakana seem to be purposely Japanese-fied for Hoshido, like the Tenma Musha (Pegasus Warrior) and Kensei (Trueblade).

Funnily enough, Kamui (Nohr) has a western-themed class, while Aqua (Hoshido) has a Japanese one.

Edited by VincentASM

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Funnily enough, Kamui (Nohr) has a western-themed class, while Aqua (Hoshido) has a Japanese one.

This seems to back-up the idea that you may factions are indeeed faction-locked but that you can still get thoe classes despite what route you choose, they'll just have origins in the other side.

I'm honestly wondering how Hoshido is supposed to be the easy path if you've got a bunch of foot soldiers and pegasi facing off against an army of horse-riders and wyverns lol.

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This seems to back-up the idea that you may factions are indeeed faction-locked but that you can still get thoe classes despite what route you choose, they'll just have origins in the other side.

I'm honestly wondering how Hoshido is supposed to be the easy path if you've got a bunch of foot soldiers and pegasi facing off against an army of horse-riders and wyverns lol.

Armorslayers, Wyrmslayers, and Rapiers. Case closed. (lol)

Edit: and Beastkillers xD

Edited by Kagehoshi

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Armorslayers, Wyrmslayers, and Rapiers. Case closed. (lol)

Edit: and Beastkillers xD

True lol, especially w/o weapon durability; either Nohr better hope that those weapons are rare of for some new anti-sword weapons

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Funnily enough, Kamui (Nohr) has a western-themed class, while Aqua (Hoshido) has a Japanese one.

I actually think it makes more sense that way around. As kamui has only been trained in a Nohr class (as he was raised there) and Aqua having been raised in Hoshido

what about their names btw. Is kamui written in hiragana or katakana? and aqua?

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