Thracia 776 0% growths ironman low turn count

[sine nomine]

I'm not sure how popular this sort of run is around here, but this Thracia 776 0% growths ironman low turn count run is by far the most fun I've had with any Fire Emblem game. I prefer 0% growths since it removes a large part of the randomness I dislike and also improves the game's balance by reducing player strength to the level of the enemy (the one-man-army tactic becomes questionable, many more units are useful throughout the game, more than brute strength is needed to take down bosses, and levelling is still important for promotions). I almost always play ironman runs (no resetting, game over means the run is over) because I like making reliable tactics that account for poor luck and I get to adapt and salvage a bad situation when it occurs. I've done a couple runs where I find the ideal path to the lowest turncount and reset until it went my way and it wasn't nearly as fun, plus it lacked the tension of an ironman run. And I like aiming for a low turn count since it encourages creative and complex tactics in situations where there would otherwise be little pressure. Even with 0% growths, there are many slow tactics which can trivialize the challenge at certain parts of the game; in a low turn count run I have a reason to employ more impressive tricks instead. Not to mention all the planning that goes into managing deployment orders, staff usage, fatigue, etc. Overall, I think the difficulty in a 0% growths ironman run of FE5 is perfect for people who have played through the game a couple times, and you can make it more or less difficult by aiming for a lower or higher turncount. I highly recommend you guys give this challenge a try if you haven't already.

Anyways, I just finished a playthrough of this challenge and finished with 173 turns which satisfies the SS rank requirements. I'm sure this can be improved quite a bit and I'm interested in seeing what sort of strategies you guys use to blitz through the game this way. By the way, I should add that I played on normal (not elite) and I'd recommend doing that because I wouldn't want to trivialize the early game experience management.

Here are the turncounts from my most recent run:

chapter - turncount

1 - 4
2 - 4
2x - 8
3 - 7
4 - 12
5 - 20 (expect to get ~19, depends on luck and my strategy could be better)
6 - 7
7 - 8
8 - 6
9 - 3 (could easily 2-turn this, but I thought I needed the elite sword)
10 - 15 (would be 14 with just a bit better luck against the boss, but I think a completely fresh strategy could greatly improve on this)
11 - 2
12 - 3 (repair missed, but 3 is reasonable since Fin struggles at capturing)
12x - 6
13 - 7 (I bet there's a way to reduce this with a cool rescue chain)
14 - 10
15 - 2
16a - 7
17a - 4
18 - 4
19 - 2
20 - 15
21 - 1
21x - 4 (wanted to get at least five warp staves)
22 - 2
23 - 2
24 - 4
final - 4

That's what I've managed on my own, not sure where I should go to look at other people's attempts and stuff. I loosely planned out a lot of the run and partially just play it by ear since things change every time. Anyways I look forward to hearing about cooler and better tactics.

Also, at some point I think I'll add a no-warp restriction or all-characters requirement in addition to the conditions included in this challenge. Have either of those been done? Are they fun? I'm leaning towards the no-warp one since I wouldn't want the playthrough to end if a random character happens to die. And I'm open to suggestions for other interesting challenge playthoughs.

[edit: I've figured out ways to save several more turns, I'll give it another attempt someday]

Edited June 30, 2015 by sine nomine

[Psych]

Why would you do some of the Gaidens and not all of them?

[sine nomine]

Why would you do some of the Gaidens and not all of them?

Some of the gaidens lead to a net reduction in turns plus other benefits, some don't.

[Mekkah]

dafuq @ no asvel

[Espinosa]

Wouldn't Asvel have turn-shaving contributions?

[sine nomine]

As far as I know, Asvel never really saves turns in this run. Even in a low turn count ironman run with growths, Homeros can substitute for him as a bosskiller. And with 0% growths he suffers from low stats (e.g. 9 magic when promoted). Despite that, in a slower-paced 0% growths run Asvel is decent and can kill some bosses if you give him a speed ring (which would be better used on Dean; my most common boss-killing strategy features Dean attacking with Eda and Linoan support + king sword charisma).

Where do you guys think Asvel would help? Perhaps I've overlooked something.

Edited June 4, 2015 by sine nomine

[Espinosa]

Reliable bosskilling was what I had in mind, but you're right; the extra turns you take to secure reliability should permit to get others ready for said duties.

[dondon151]

Also, at some point I think I'll add a no-warp restriction or all-characters requirement in addition to the conditions included in this challenge. Have either of those been done?

i've SSS ranked 173 turns, obviously not ironman though

Where do you guys think Asvel would help? Perhaps I've overlooked something.

uh chapter 5 for one

asvel might not result in net turncount reduction if you count the cost of going to chapter 4x, but he definitely kills bosses way faster in a segmented run. i'm not sure how many of those bosses he needs to dodge an OHKO or ORKO, though.

[Chiki]

Ironman LTC is ridiculous. Do something that increases the challenge but doesn't make you rely on luck so much.

[sine nomine]

Reliable bosskilling was what I had in mind, but you're right; the extra turns you take to secure reliability should permit to get others ready for said duties.

Asvel might aid in warpskipping, but his low stats and poor durability make him unreliable in an ironman run. I haven't gone through it chapter-by-chapter but I don't see how Asvel could make back the turns it costs to recruit him, if he even helps at all.

i've SSS ranked 173 turns, obviously not ironman though

uh chapter 5 for one

asvel might not result in net turncount reduction if you count the cost of going to chapter 4x, but he definitely kills bosses way faster in a segmented run. i'm not sure how many of those bosses he needs to dodge an OHKO or ORKO, though.

Do you have more information about your SSS 0% growths run anywhere? I'd like to see if there are any tactics that I could imitate or adapt.

Right now the biggest issue is chapter 10 - I feel like there's some way to rush to the boss, but the ballistae (and the dragon knight, and the bishop with bolting) hold me off, I need to get a stamina drink, and I have to get Safy a bit of exp for her to promote. I don't think I could warpskip this chapter even if she was promoted here since I don't have anyone that can easily kill the boss (even Asvel wouldn't be reliable if I had him).

I'll post more in-depth about specific chapter plans and item distribution later, hopefully we can build off of that.

Ironman LTC is ridiculous. Do something that increases the challenge but doesn't make you rely on luck so much.

Well, the idea is that I aim for turncounts as "low" as possible while still being safe enough to ironman; I'm sure a non-ironman LTC would require much fewer turns. But you're right, even 99% accuracies aren't totally reliable in FE5 and I can't always guarantee even that much (e.g. big shield could trigger several consecutive times, a couple enemies have annoying movement stars, staves have a bad habit of missing, etc). But I'm completely open to suggestions for different ironman challenges.

Edited June 4, 2015 by sine nomine

[Yojinbo]

What do you need the Elite Sword for? I think two turning Ch.9 is better.

[dondon151]

Do you have more information about your SSS 0% growths run anywhere? I'd like to see if there are any tactics that I could imitate or adapt.

just this blooper reel:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGwQ_PdmJcs

i think it's kind of dumb to not do elite mode because warp skipping chapter 10 is so much better than grinding through it. maybe saphy can promote with only the elite scroll, i don't know.

[sine nomine]

What do you need the Elite Sword for? I think two turning Ch.9 is better.

I think you're right. I wanted the Elite Sword so Nanna could survive a ballista hit in chapters 10 and 13, and I thought it might be helpful for Ralph in the final chapter. Also, I wanted Karin mounted at the start of chapter 10. But all those things could probably be worked around.

EDIT: I remember why I thought I needed the elite sword - if the chapter 18 boss was smart and used his master lance against Dean, he would need it to defend himself. Fortunately, the boss is dumb and uses Thoron, letting Dean double with the armorslayer.

just this blooper reel:

[link ommitted since this post is really long]

i think it's kind of dumb to not do elite mode because warp skipping chapter 10 is so much better than grinding through it. maybe saphy can promote with only the elite scroll, i don't know.

I could get Saphy promoted in chapter 8 if I took ~three? more turns or played elite mode (I don't get the elite scroll since I skip 4x). But I don't think I could warpskip chapter 10 either way, I struggle to kill the boss as it is.

Too bad you don't have more info about your SSS run, I'd watch the whole thing if you had recorded it.

Anyway here's what I recall about my chapter-by-chapter tactics. I also have a snes9x recording but I spend hours just twiddling my thumbs so I'd rather not watch it.

chapter 1, 2, 2x: Safe and solid rescue tactics but nothing special about this run compared to others.

chapter 3: safy uses the life ring, rescue+drop her so she gets a forest defense boost and gets shot at by one archer on the first turn and two archers every turn thereafter (FE1-style priest levelling!). I bring the kids to three houses, ommitting the shield ring. I send Tanya to her death so I can get Dagda without ch8x. Take the brave axe, hezul scroll, and light sword to chapter 4.

chapter 4: need to get the light sword, brave axe, hezul scroll, and rapier from the chests. I do some rescue and trading chains but it highly depends on the chest positions. Sometimes place unarmed units where they can get captured by Dalshien's crew (a common tactic employed throughout the run).

chapter 5: the big variable is the stats of the chapter boss and his accompanying archers. If none of them can kill Nanna, she can soften them up with her earth sword + holy water. Otherwise I might need to send someone else to lure them and kill them in a safe way. Also, sometimes I have to slow down to deal with any arena fighters Eyvel doesn't finish off. At the end of the chapter, I have Dalshien capture the physic priest and transfer his items to someone before I leave him behind.

chapter 6: pretty simple rush to the exit. I buy door keys while I'm here.

chapter 7: I actually slow down in this chapter to recruit Shiva. Not that he's useful (basically just another unit who gets left behind later), I just can't cut through all the swordfighters in one turn so I let Fin kill a couple, two of them capture Lara and Lifis, one of them attacks Nanna or Fergus, and two of them get killed by Bryton + brave axe + hezul scroll + makua support + Nanna charisma + wrath critical. After that, I free my units and rush to the exit. I grab a couple rapiers along the way. If there's a safe way to blitz through here that might be better.

chapter 8: Fin promotes, safy dodges archers on a forest tile and uses heal as much as possible, lifis steals a knight proof.

chapter 9: Pretty slick rescue chain. Karin ends the chapter mounted and Robert ends the chapter dismounted. Marty, Makua, Halvan, Kein, and Alva get left behind (might switch to a 2-turn next time).

chapter 10: this chapter is a total mess. Turn 1 I have Makua drop Carrion to get captured by the fire sword armor, I capture him turn 2 and try to send Othin/Fergus to kill the northeast ballista, I can't stop the thief if he decides to hurry but I steal/capture him for his stamina drink later, I have Dagda deplete at least the bottom two ballista (ideally all four by standing on a fort, but enemy attack power varies), Karin might drop Shiva+Elite sword+scroll to get the M up staff or visit the rescue staff village herself if possible, several units clear out the central armours, Nanna uses the elite sword so she doesn't die in one hit, Selphina usually kills the dragon knight after he captures someone, Fin takes the north path to kill the ballista there, Karin captures the bolting bishop then rescue drops Fin with the rest of the army, who charges through the centre once the ballistae are neutralized, then I steal the boss' knight proof and attack wih Fergus, Nanna, Leaf, Fin, and anyone else who can attack safely. Safy promotes during this time.

chapter 11: Warp Robert, who shoots at Kempf and scares him away (RIP Robert). Then warp Leaf to seize.

chapter 12: Warp Fin+Leaf, drop Leaf. Karin goes north and uses a torch. Then I try to capture Salem and repair warp. Karin buys a bunch of wind tomes and a couple door keys.

chapter 12x: warp lara, then warp leaf. Carry Safy to Tina. Get the armourslayer (very important), shield ring (nice), fortify staff (not important), and have Tina try to unlock the knight proof.

chapter 13: Mounted units and Lara ride through the chapter, Selphina gets the brave bow. Don't really have a good use for the Lenster knights, perhaps a rescue chain could speed things up (but the armors only attack Glade if they have 21+ attack, so there often is no clear path to the exit).

chapter 14: Buy stamina drinks. Put the boss at the bottom left to sleep, warp Dean, have him get lots of nice items. Wall off with unarmed Glade, Fergus, and Fin (plus support partners). Give exp (especially staff exp) to Salem and promote Homeros; rescue chains keep them out of danger on enemy phase.

chapter 15: pretty self-explanatory, just drop Leaf and Lara at the village, reruit Ralph, get the skill ring, buy door keys. Obviously go to Ford Norden since it's way more fun.

chapter 16a: put the first ballista to sleep. Dance Dean holding Pahn so he can drop in Eyrios' range (that was the plan, but looking back I'd be better off just sending Dean since Eyrios could proc movement stars and kill Pahn). Then warp Karin (carrying Leaf) to recruit Eyrios. Depending on Eyrios' position, either go clear the ballista with bolting or dismount and join the main army. Kill Eyrios' troops on enemy phase with Dean + Eda + Linoan + king sword + Nanna + Dragon lance, then finish up on player phase. Steal the boss' master lance with Tina. Get Lara and Eyrios to kill the ballista ASAP, recruit Sleuf, drop Pahn below the river so he can get the knight proof, then send Dean, Leaf, Eda, Linoan, and Karin right past Kempf's setup and kill the boss (Dean can attack the boss, move back, get danced, and then try again).

chapter 17a: Put the dark mage to sleep with Sleuf, position Dean so he can visit houses on turns 2 and 3, position Eda and Karin so they can capture the dark mage and recruit Sara on turn 4, steal the boss' master axe with Tina, warp Eyrios so he can clear the boss area and the boss himself. The reliability could be improved here.

chapter 18: M up on eyrios then warp him+linoan to the bottom right pillar and drop her left. Put Xavier to sleep. Turn two, free her and warp Dean+Leaf (king sword) near the boss. Then position Dean on pillar with armorslayer equipped, hopefully he will crit the boss on enemy phase or the following player phase.

chapter 19: (Lara, Fin, and disposable units at the bottom; Safy, Sleuf, Sara, and one disposable unit at the top) warp sleuf to amalda, rescue him with amalda and move towards Lara. Dance her so she can visit the M Up house and use the rescue staff on her. Rescue chain Lara and Fin towards the other houses. Turn 2, get the items then rescue Fin+Lara; then rescue Sara with the disposable unit and swap her to someone else before exiting.

chapter 20: I used one sleep staff charge on the boss. Perhaps save that charge and spam bolting?

chapter 21: Warp Dean and Eda+Linoan to boss; kill boss and wait right beside. Then swap over Linoan and capture the sleep staff priest. Get the item before seizing.

chapter 21x: M up, thief, dance, repair, etc. Need five warp staves.

chapter 22: Turn 1: Amalda can put Reinhardt to sleep, capture him and rescue whoever captured him, warp dean to get warp staff, warp Eda carrying Nanna two squares left of north ballista.

Turn 2: warp someone to rescue staff house, warp Leaf carrying Linoan, warp Dean to attack boss, warp Lara to dance Dean if the boss' great shield skill procs.

[also worth mentioning: if you're able to promote Tina by now or somehow gave her two magic rings, she can theif away the boss' weapon and let you easily capture him.]

chapter 23: warp Dean to capture dark mage, silence the other (and capture next turn, Eda can take the first from Dean), warp someone to trigger Sety's arrival, warp Leaf and Lara to seize.

chapter 24: Warp a couple guys to capture some bishops, silence the rest. Warp Mareeta to recruit Galzus, warp Pahn to give Reidrick an iron bow, warp Lara to get Sety into position and to help Leaf seize.

Final chapter: This chapter is quite complicated. Here's what I remember.

My deployment for my last run:

0leaf

1fin

2glade

3sleuf

4lara

5dean

6sara

7seram

8dagda

9amalda

10safy

11pahn

12ralph

13selfina

14delmund

15linoan

16sety

17galzus

Turn 1:

- Linoan: M Up on Amalda [if this missed, I'd be in big trouble and have to plan a slower alternative]

- Sleuf: warp Amalda to magic tile

- Amalda: put Elf to sleep

- Safy: rescue Amalda

- Sety: Kill lopt mage

- Lara: dance Amalda

- Amalda: put Zwei's mage to sleep

- Dagda: kill lopt mage

- Galzus: kill lopt mage

- Ralph: kill lopt mage

- Selphina: kill lopt mage

- Fin: rescue Selphina

- Sara: either mend Ralph and swap him the elite sword, fortify, or put someone to sleep. As it happened, none of my units got hit by Hel so I had her put one of Eins' armors to sleep (Ralph could kill the other one with his master axe).

Turn 2: Somehow Dagda survived

- Sety: unlock door

- Ralph: unlock door

- Galzus: unlock door

- Dagda (or Glade if he's dead): unlock door

- Linoan: unlock door

- Sleuf: rescue Dean

- Dean: kill lopt mage

- Fin: drop Selphina

- Lara: dance Sety

- Amalda: sleep staff (Zwei)

- Safy: sleep staff (one of Elf's armors)

- Delmund: kill sleeping Elf armor

- Sara: sleep staff (might have been needed for one of Eins' armors, but Ralph killed it so was used on one of Elf's armors instead)

- Sety: put one of Drei's armors to sleep. Then he got a remove and killed Zwolf (if he didn't kill Zwolf, the idiot would just steal an iron blade or something)

Turn 3: Dean was supposed to kill both hammer armors on the enemy phase, but he got killed himself. If that worked, I'd have him kill Zwei then warp him to take Eins' switch.

[note: if Funf didn't die yet, I'd have to put her to sleep then capture with Galzus so Pahn could hit the switch]

- Sleuf: rescue Dagda

- Sety: warp Amalda to Eins' switch

- Amalda: put Drei to sleep

- Lara: dance Sety

- Safy: warp Sety to Zwei

- Dagda: kill armor

- Sety: kill Zwei

- Linoan: hit switch

- Salem: unlocked door

- Selphina: killed Drei

- Fin: hit switch

- Galzus: hit switch

Turn 4:

- Linoan: M up on Sety

- Sleuf: Warp Sety

- Sety: Kill Veld

- Sara: warp Leaf

- Leaf: Seize!

I planned this one out quite extensively since dying in the final chapter of an ironman run is not something I want to happen. Of course, I also had to plan out staff usage, fatigue, stat boosters, etc throughout the run.

Here's some stat booster and knight proof stuff:

ch1 Life ring: Safy

ch2 Speed ring: Dean

ch8 Luck ring: Eyrios

ch12x Shield ring: Eyrios

ch15 Skill ring: Dean

ch17 Magic ring: Tina

ch18 Body ring: Ralph? [no idea who to give it to]

ch19 Speed ring: Ralph [again, no idea]

Knight proofs:

ch7 village - Fin, chapter 8

ch8 village - Safy, chapter 10

ch8 boss (steal) - Fergus, chapter 10

ch9 selphina - Homer, chapter 14

ch10 boss (steal) - Salem, chapter 16?

ch12x chest - missed this one

ch16a village [7] - Selphina, chapter 20

ch20 chest [8] - Sara, chapter 20

Edited June 7, 2015 by sine nomine

[dondon151]

oh! here's a chapter 5 video that i have unlisted on my channel:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSyfjR8Hob0

I still have videos of the entire run, but i'm not happy with how it turned out because the execution is bad, the chapter 4x sound is messed up, and i sort of cheated on chapters 4x and 5 because i wanted to see what the lowest possible turncounts were.

[MartyTheDemonSlayer]

Out of curiosity do you ever see yourself redoing FE5 0% growths, or is it too far down on your list of runs to ever be redone?

[dondon151]

it's actually probably one of the easiest ones for me to re-do because it's one in which i don't really have to change anything lol

i just need to edit movement stars to 0 and fix up the chapter 4x strategy. the chapter 5 strategy isn't that terrible in retrospect, but a long map has a high potential for bad things to happen, so it should be fine if i allowed myself to take a couple of extra turns.

[sine nomine]

I'd be interested in seeing your SSS run whenever you decide to upload it. Even that I've only seen the blooper reel and chapter 5 it looks really cool; good uses of rescue chains and some creative tactics (Linoan with wrath and resire in chapter 24x? I never would have thought of that). But maybe you could even improve the run before you re-record it. I can't really give much advice without seeing your tactics, but (for example) warping in chapter 8 might save a couple turns, though you'll probably need to rig a repair miss early on to get Safy to A rank staves in chapter 7.

[dondon151]

saphy needs like 3 repair misses to even feasibly hit A rank staves by chapter 8 if she's not promoting.

also the problem is that i'm 99% sure saphy will have to sit out chapter 8 because of fatigue. i don't think she restores her fatigue before rejoining in chapter 7.

[sine nomine]

saphy needs like 3 repair misses to even feasibly hit A rank staves by chapter 8 if she's not promoting.

also the problem is that i'm 99% sure saphy will have to sit out chapter 8 because of fatigue. i don't think she restores her fatigue before rejoining in chapter 7.

In my run, Safy safely dodged eleven arrows and used heal once in a seven-turn clear of chapter 3 (I'm not familiar with the six turn strategy you used). I've never played elite mode but I'm assuming it uses the same exp formulae but just multiplies it by two. In elite mode, you could simply add one missed repair at the start of both chapter 3 and 7 to reach level ten. Or, you could miss just one repair but dodge an extra two arrows in chapter 3 to get to level ten (presumably from the bow armor I used to kill Tanya or the archer at the start; she would die if hit by all three in one turn, but has decent evade and you're not playing ironman). Or you could dodge just one more arrow, miss one repair, and use heal once in chapter 7 before promoting.

I'm positive Safy's fatigue does not carry over, unless there is something wrong with my rom or something. And even if it did, Safy would only be fatigued if you used repair twice and/or did not give her the life ring.

If I were to do a SSS run I wouldn't be opposed to rigging a 16% repair miss since there would be other unreliable strategies anyway. The other approach would be to aim for exactly 179 turns but make the reliability as high as possible.

Edited June 4, 2015 by sine nomine

[sine nomine]

By the way, can someone confirm what happens if Tanya is captured instead of killed in chapter 8x? It would be convenient to get Dagda after chapter 8 then get Tanya back in chapter 21x in a SSS run, but I vaguely remember there being some issue (why do I make sure Tanya dies instead of just letting her be captured). The information on Serenes here http://serenesforest.net/thracia-776/scripts/script-translation/chapter-8-purple-dragon-mountain/seems to suggest that you skip ch8x if Tanya is captured but I don't really trust it.

[dondon151]

how would you skip chapter 8x if tanya is captured in chapter 8x...

[sine nomine]

Sorry, I worded the question poorly. We know chapter 8x can be skipped if either Tanya or Dagda is dead before you finish chapter 3. If one of them is dead, the other one joins after chapter 8 without making you play 8x. I was uncertain what would happen if Tanya (or Dagda) was not dead but captured prior to the Manster arc. Would Dagda join after chapter 8 and Tanya be rescuable in chapter 21x? Or would Tanya be present in chapter 8x despite being captured earlier? If the former is true, a few turns could be saved.

EDIT: various sources suggest that chapter 8x occurs even if Dagda and/or Tanya are captured prior to the end of chapter 3.

Oh and could you clarify something about battle mechanics? If a character has Sol, will the skill proc ensure a hit (thereby increasing overall accuracy) or does the skill only proc if the attack was going to hit anyway?

---

I also have some more questions.

- Should I allow the rewarp staff in a warpless 0% growths ironman run?

- In chapter 11x, Olwen can die from three javelins before Fred reaches her and you can't heal her with physic. Any way to save her more reliably?

- How does the enemy AI choose targets with status staves (or in general, any information about the AI would be useful)? Who will be put to sleep in chapter 12 and who will be berserked in the final chapter?

- How should I deal with the final chapter without warp? Right now I'm thinking I should unlock a door, kill the dark mage, and walk Amalda onto a magic tile and put Elf to sleep (with two magic rings and the fire sword). But if I knew who she would berserk, I might be able to just wait it out.

- Can I block Cyas' spawn point in chapter 17A?

- Is there a good way to recruit Amalda without warp? I think I need to lure her to the left near the houses while most enemies go straight up, but I don't know how exactly the AI will act.

- Is it just me or would Miranda have a minuscule niche in this run since she could spam meteors in chapters 21 and 22? Unfortunately I might suffer from a lack of status stave users, especially Amalda, and I would miss several key items on that route. Oh well, even the mere thought of Miranda being useful is worth mentioning. Maybe I'll try it anyway for the novelty.

Edited June 7, 2015 by sine nomine

[Yojinbo]

- In chapter 11x, Olwen can die from three javelins before Fred reaches her and you can't heal her with physic. Any way to save her more reliably?

- Is it just me or would Miranda have a minuscule niche in this run since she could spam meteors in chapters 21 and 22? Unfortunately I might suffer from a lack of status stave users, especially Amalda, and I would miss several key items on that route. Oh well, even the mere thought of Miranda being useful is worth mentioning. Maybe I'll try it anyway for the novelty.

Eyrios can spam siege tomes and nullifies Olwen's need to stay alive. Skipping Sleuf isn't worth getting Miranda so I'd strongly advice against that.

Recruiting Amalda without Warp usage is hard and luck based. Sleuf can rewarp himself, proc another move, recruit Amalda, then Amalda rescues Sleuf and gets rescue staffed by somebody. It's really dumb though.

[sine nomine]

Eyrios is definitely better, especially given this run's conditions, but I'd still like to know of any way to more reliably recruit Olwen.

By the way, is there a way to reliably recruit Eyrios without warp?

Sleuf is only really useful for silencing a chapter 24 staff user. The reasons the Fort Norden route is still better in this run are Amalda (who can reach >20 magic with stat boosters and the fire sword) and the rescue staff (essential if the ch10 one is missed, and as far as I know there's no way to guarantee that can be obtained). Still a better route but not by as much as in a run with warp. Although the maps are much more fun in my opinion.

I figured out a good way to recruit Amalda without warp (even if her movement star activates), but it might change depending on my deployment pattern and I can't reset to figure out the proper positioning in the actual run.

Edited June 7, 2015 by sine nomine

[sine nomine]

Edit: there's still a few chapters I need to plan out.

Chapter 10: I can easily get either the M Up staff or rescue staff along with the fire sword, but I'd like to know a way to visit both villages. And it's a pretty slow chapter in general, I could use a quick way to clear it. Actually, I don't really care about the fire sword (it's a great weapon but not essential). I can have Karin+Shiva (or Fergus if necessary) visit the M Up village if they have the elite sword and I can send Fin to the Rescue village, but I also need to clear the ballistae so he doesn't get killed. And of course I need to deplete the other ballistae as quickly as possible so I can advance.

Chapter 12: The obvious solution is to fly straight through the middle with Karin. Capturing isn't very reliable since Fergus has iffy accuracy with the killing edge, even with Karin's support, and he needs to connect with capture on two successive turns. Unforunately Mareeta is just one point in hp/magic away from surviving a hit from Salem, or else she could help. Still, the odds of seven-turning are pretty high.

Chapter 12x: Need to figure out how to clear this chapter quickly; there are some thieves that get in the way. The thieves in this chapter are really annoying; Dagda OHKOs them but has awful accuracy; letting them capture someone (Ronan?) helps due to charge, but that slows everything down. Plus they even have movement stars. And I need to keep Dagda's magic boosted or Tina will steal his weapon. Any suggestions on how to approach this would be appreciated.

Chapter 19: A way to reliably recruit Conomore on turn 1 (without too many rescue staff uses or hindering deployment in previous chapters or needing Miranda to be promoted yet) would be great

- I think I can 2-turn this with Conomore if I leave Dagda behind. I'll have to use another rescue charge in ch21x (leaving me with none vs Cyas) and I'll be missing Dagda in ch20. It would be better if I knew a more resource-efficient tactic for recruiting Conomore.

Final chapter: I'll have to figure out a way to position my units so this chapter is doable

Playing on Elite mode, B route, I think <200 turns is reachable.

Edited June 19, 2015 by sine nomine