Does the amount of fanservice bother you?

[Flarfmuffin]

I mostly just find it hilarious. It's kind of weird having this much fanservice in a Fire Emblem game, but whatever. It won't affect my enjoyment of the game.

[gadaursan]

Well, thankfully this is a video game, which means the less favorable options are what they are: options. Since the other parts of the game hold promise for me, I think i can handle this or I can avoid them pretty easily. Better than watching a television show or movie laden with fanservice where you're forced to see all of it whether you want to or not.

[Taka-kun]

So? That is what I would want as well, but i still don't see the problem of them not doing that, nor do i have a problem with what they did do. The thing is that there will most likely be a sibling bond established regardless, unless you do get the S support. The fact that they can have feelings for you doesn't mean they will, love it or hate it the romance normally doesn't kick in until the S support.

Because it's missed opportunity. Because in an atmosphere of conflicting loyalty, of which family matters the most to you, the end result of the individual conversations between Kamui and his siblings is a marriage proposal, instead of an affirmation of their familial bonds. I could go on and on but I think BrightBow's response in the previous page sums it up pretty well.

Options are fun and I am all in favour of that. But you cannot at one hand try to explore themes about bonds, friendships and love while at the same time allowing the player to do with his "friends" as they please. Those goals are contradictory.

Because that's the thing about friendship, marriage and all those connections between people: Relationships are not just about yourself. It's not just about what others give you. It's also about giving, to put your own desires behind their needs.

If you don't show the proper respect and devotion towards your friends and only ever consider what you want instead of ever considering the wishes of them, then the relationship will suffer for it and eventual it will simply end altogether. So on order to think and in order to learn, the player must be pushed to take the desires of others into account. Because that selfish attitude is not the beginning of relationships, it's their end.

But the characters are never allowed any agency of their own. The most beautiful moment were this was shown was of course the ending of Awakening: Sacrifice yourself and save the world or save yourself and risk and burden another generation. For your friends, this should be a difficult situation. And very person will act differently towards finding a friend in such a position.

A knight like Frederick or a ruler like Virion might believe into devoting yourself for the good of others. A commoner like Donnel might think that in such a large world, the only responsibility you have is towards friends and family. And the children might not want their own descendants to face the same horrors that they experienced themselves.

Yet everyone will tell you not to sacrifice yourself. No one will swallow their grief and accept or even acknowledge the necessity of the act. And despite that conviction, if you do it anyway, everyone will sing your praise. No one will be angry at you for ignoring their feelings or leaving them behind. They all just take turns saying their stupid line involving their little gimmick that they have in place of genuine characterisation.

And if you don't to it, everyone will cheer you up that you did the right thing. Somehow everyone is totally cool with dooming future generations. Even those who experienced the horror firsthand, who lost their friends and family to the world-eating monster that is Grima, will happily expose their children and grandchildren to the same fate.

You are given a choice but you are not given purpose. Loosing Robin means nothing to the player. What matters is how her actions affects the lives of those that live in her world. You care about these characters, so you care how your decisions affect them.

Yet by preventing the characters to have any agency on their own, by forcing them to suck the player's dick no matter what, by shielding the player from any consequence of your actions, it is denying the player's decision an actual meaning, it denies them the option of having the feeling that they are affecting the lives of the people you care about, it denies them to learn from the experience. It turns into what could be an amazing scenario that makes you think about the meaning of your life, your responsibilities and the meaning of your existence in the lives of those close to you into nothing but an empty farce.

And the decision to grope your friends or to marry or not to marry your siblings is empty for the same reason: Because the characters can't say no. You are not allowed to explore these scenarios. You reach S-Rank and you are married. The game told you that would happen before you reached your first support level. You are entitled to that. The game won't allow you to feel the weight of your own decisions by let's say: Giving you the opportunity to push your sister to sleep with you just to find out that she feels absolutely horrible afterwards since she just can't see you as anything but a brother, to give you the opportunity to reflect on your actions, to maybe come to the conclusion that you were acting selfish.

I mean, in theory this situations are interesting as heck. These conflicting emotions and desires. That's the stuff that the series should explore if it really cares about bonds. But you can't do that if the desire of the player is really all that matters and everyone will bend over backwards to tell you how great and noble you are for showing no concern for others.

Granted, we do not know what contains in the support conversations (since all focus is on the S-support) but this is my initial judgement. I am fine with Kamui (do people care about setting spoiler tags anymore?)

not actually being blood-related (makes a nice identity crisis considering they just betrayed the family that raised them up, blood be damned) but the step to becoming spouse is just far-fetched and destroys the family theme

.

@BrightBow: If you do not mind, I will be saving your quote. Can't phrase it better :)

[Only MU V2]

I've probably gotten so dezentised to common fanservice that it only elicits laughter out of me when it goes all over the top, so it doesn't bother me.

Now on the other hand all these Awakening expy characters are so far my biggest gripe in the game. It's irritating to think that not!Inigo and the rest of them have possibly robbed us of much more interresting characters. That and it just generally feels like a lazy way of bloating the character roster. If you can't come up with more characters then flesh out the ones you have.

Looks like you haven't been keeping up to date with the Awakening kids in this game then.

They're not expies. It's actually them in in disguise. Seriously.

Since both the gameplay and the fanservice have been cranked up to 11 and that's where the series is going, I'm not mad since I accepted it. The lines your male units have for you are more lewd than some of the females anyway, and this is the best I've seen an optional otome style feature implemented and respected.

[BrightBow]

@BrightBow: If you do not mind, I will be saving your quote. Can't phrase it better :)

Sure, go ahead.

[AlphaZero]

So? That is what I would want as well, but i still don't see the problem of them not doing that, nor do i have a problem with what they did do. The thing is that there will most likely be a sibling bond established regardless, unless you do get the S support. The fact that they can have feelings for you doesn't mean they will, love it or hate it the romance normally doesn't kick in until the S support.

Another thing I am confused about is why wait until the S-Support to hear this information. I'm sure the game will explain the shocking reveal by itself, but..

Shouldn't your character being revealed to not be related to the Hoshidan Royals be shown in the A-Support? It seems like pretty integral info to leave out. Besides this would imply that the player thinks that the pairing is incest up until the S-Support, so if you're playing blind, you will think it is incest when activating the S-support. Just sayin', if they really do want you not to be weirded out marrying the Hoshidan royals, why wait until they have activated the support that will inevitably lead to Marriage?

[Awakener_]

No, not at all, in fact I will enjoy it to fullest. Gonna rub Azura while together slaughtering enemies in the battlefield. Gonna take hot spring with her too. Stripping her too. Make baby as well.

[Hempmeister69]

Ahh man BrightBow made such good points I'm seriously starting to feel a little guilty now. I mean the option for skinshipping with everyone implies everyone's okay with it... I guess. But at the end of the day it's still the same deal as everyone of the opposite sex (and tharja) magically falling in love with Robin.

Another thing I am confused about is why wait until the S-Support to hear this information. I'm sure the game will explain the shocking reveal by itself, but..

Shouldn't your character being revealed to not be related to the Hoshidan Royals be shown in the A-Support? It seems like pretty integral info to leave out. Besides this would imply that the player thinks that the pairing is incest up until the S-Support, so if you're playing blind, you will think it is incest when activating the S-support. Just sayin', if they really do want you not to be weirded out marrying the Hoshidan royals, why wait until they have activated the support that will inevitably lead to Marriage?

I think the whole "they're not really your siblings" thing is revealed within the story, regardless of whether you s support with them or not. In Sakura's s support I remember it was just something like her saying her and Kamui don't have the same father.

Edited June 24, 2015 by Hempmeister69

[Roflolxp54]

Yes, but does it try to be anything that it is not? I think everyone knows what they are getting into when they buy that game.

I'm not sure what you're point is, or even if you have one.

Basically, IS could have possibly taken the decision to take the fanservice even further and potentially annoy more fans, partly since Waifu Emblem has just promoted into Wincest Emblem. Senran Kagura Burst looks like an M-rated game but managed to get a T-rating even if the amount of fanservice and some instances of offensive language might have made it M-rated. With how lewd some of the characters may sound, especially in an S-support with Avatar, I wouldn't be surprised if Wincest Emblem would somehow end up promoting into Hentai Emblem. The game is also pretty progressive, too, as it not only allows incestuous marriages, but it also allows homosexual marriages.

Edited June 24, 2015 by Roflolxp54

[Phoenix_Kensai]

Nah.

Fanservice itself doesn't bother me; I love what I've seen of SMT x FE so far, and that game looks to be even heavier on the fanservice, in some ways. I'm more concerned with the overall style of a thing, and while Fates' isn't going in exactly the direction I would have expected or wanted from Fire Emblem, I can live with that.The fanservice is only a part of that, so removing it wouldn't change much, in my mind. The game is looking to be pretty good overall.

I can see customers who grew up in a ultra conservative community being offended.. But for me, not at all

I don't know. I grew up in an ultra conservative family that still can't see some chaste kissing or a woman in a tight shirt on TV without complaining about it, and that's probably the reason I can look at something like Camilla's cleavage armor without batting an eye.

...But then, my growing up was spent desperately trying to distance myself from them, so maybe that's not the same thing.

[Peyelle]

I'm not really bothered by the rubbing or hotsprings. Camilla's outfit bothers me a little, but it's the same issue i had with awakening designs-- i really think most people should have pants on, particularly if they're riding a mount of some kind.

I'm wondering if the rubbing will even make it to the US version of the game-- (i want to touch nishiki's fluffy ears)

I just can't imagine it making it with some of the lines, they seem awful lewd, lmao.

[Phoenix Wright]

To be honest though, the people on Reddit are really whiny and immature virgins.

most of the people that browse /r/fireemblem also go on 4chan (specifically /feg/), and many of those people come here as well. it is inescapable. also, why do you 'love' the new sex aspects?

i am bothered by it. it is fanservice for the sake of fanservice. good looks is one thing, but when cartoon characters are made to look "sexy," it pushes me away. fef is so blatant about it i can't help but laugh, but it's still disappointing. i don't mind the incest or whatever, i mean one could make that an interesting thing, but when my fe characters are basically asking to fuck each other through some weird face rubbing thing, it takes away from the experience of what i perceive a fe should give me. not surprisingly, everything surrounding the sex mechanics has been almost completely ignored in the game's coverage--it's because we all know it's fucking weird.

also, the characters are yet again cardboard cutouts, so that's a real shame. they literally stuck 6 characters or whatever from the previous game into this one, splashed different colors on them, and called it a day.

so, the decisions that were made weren't just weird, but also lazy. they appealed to the sex aspect of weeb games and nothing else.

Edited June 24, 2015 by Phoenix Wright

[StoryWeaverKirea]

Not really, I'm actually looking forward to the amie feature. Though I don't at all agree with the incest...

[Blue Sun]

It doesn't bother me.

[Chiki]

most of the people that browse /r/fireemblem also go on 4chan (specifically /feg/), and many of those people come here as well. it is inescapable. also, why do you 'love' the new sex aspects?

So what?

Also, judging from my observations and other people's experiences, I'm pretty sure that bashing Fates is much more common in Reddit than in here. I'd really like to take a poll on Reddit to verify this though.

Because it's funny.

they appealed to the sex aspect of weeb games and nothing else.

If not for that, Fire Emblem games would've been canceled for good after Awakening anyway.

[GigaNerd17]

I'm really split when it comes to the fanservice, maybe even dysphoric. It bothers me that Nintendo of all companies would include this kind of content, but on the other hand, I know I'll immensely enjoy it anyway.

...So I guess I'm hot and bothered.

[Bman]

I am really conflicted by this. I don't mind a little bit of fanservice as long as it doesn't go overboard, sometimes I even enjoy it. It is just really weird that can do all that skinshipping stuff, this is definetly the next level of fanservice and two steps too far for me. I just fear that people will judge this game solely based on these features and ignore all the good stuff that's in it.

[Phoenix Wright]

So what?

whiny virgins here, whiny virgins there, whiny virgins everywhere!

Also, judging from my observations and other people's experiences, I'm pretty sure that bashing Fates is much more common in Reddit than in here. I'd really like to take a poll on Reddit to verify this though.

agreed. the most backlash came yesterday, and it seems things have calmed down. this place does seem more lax about it (if your poll is anything to go by, at least).

Because it's funny.

agreed, i even said as much myself. but when it's not funny anymore, those aspects of the game will still be there, in all of their weird and creepiness.

for americans that are bothered by it, it's not that big a deal though. it's almost guaranteed to be censored in the translation.

If not for that, Fire Emblem games would've been canceled for good after Awakening anyway.

i disagree. fea characters are boring as hell, and it became waifu emblem, but int. syst. didn't need to do what they did in this game. and i want to be crystal clear, it's not even really the facerubbing feature that's weird to me. they're cartoon characters and plenty other 3ds games have similar features. the dialogue in them is what bothers me. it doesn't fit and makes the face rubbing thing 10x weirder.

[Constable Reggie]

The fanservice in itself is not the troubling aspect - I can understand it existing in games such as Hyperdimension Neptunia, the problem with its inclusion in Fire Emblem in particular is that it vaporizes any semblance of a consistent tone. Games like HN and Disgaea have consistent tones - lighthearted and jokey, and so the fanservice in those games don't feel out of place (though I still personally struggle to play the HN game I bought on a sale whim despite this). The interviews with the Fates guys indicate that they want to make this game's story meaningful. What a joke. The decision to include so much fanservice (which include the likes of a pandering lesbian Tharja), along the other horrible choices IS have made (in particular, the decision to split the game at the store, rather than at the player's choice) butchers any possibility of this game having a quality story. Wasn't that the initial hope when this game was announced?

Enjoy the fanservice if you want, but there's no denying that until IS just up and make the straight hentai game they seem to really want, its a significant detraction. Focus on either a "heavy, meaningful story" (ex Fe 4, 5, 9. 10, etc), or a non serious "rub everyone's tits and strip them to their underwear anime" (ex HN, Senran Kagura, etc). Trying to combine the two, like Fates is doing, is laughable.

[CrimeanRoyalKnight]

I am really conflicted by this. I don't mind a little bit of fanservice as long as it doesn't go overboard, sometimes I even enjoy it. It is just really weird that can do all that skinshipping stuff, this is definetly the next level of fanservice and two steps too far for me. I just fear that people will judge this game solely based on these features and ignore all the good stuff that's in it.

Lol, just like they did with Awakening. I swear I see that game get called a waifu simulator or a shipping simulator too many times, while it's a (sorta) strategy game mixed with eugenics and maths, maths, maths.

One online friend of mine says the new one is Pokèmon but with waifus, and you need to buy both versions to get all the waifus.

It's humiliating.

[nemissa]

whiny virgins here, whiny virgins there, whiny virgins everywhere!

Actually, people who love fanservice tend to be the ones who are virgins. :P

[The Geek]

I've seen other games mix fanservice and serious story successfully before and I'm confident that Fates can do the same. This level of stuff doesn't elicit anything more than an eyeroll from me at this point anyway.

[Constable Reggie]

I've seen other games mix fanservice and serious story successfully before and I'm confident that Fates can do the same. This level of stuff doesn't elicit anything more than an eyeroll from me at this point anyway.

Examples, please.

edit: let's be clear how stark the tonal shifts in this game are. This is a game that contemplates heavy issues. This game is supposed to be more heavy than say, Luminous Arc 2 "if we work together we can triumph over anything!" level of serious.

Edited June 24, 2015 by Constable Reggie

[Snowstorm]

Marriage and children are fine. I actually like that mechanic, I ship characters all the time.

The hot springs would have been sufficient as fanservice. They just had to take it a step further with skin shipping...

Edited May 21, 2018 by Snowstorm

[goodperson707]

The fanservice in itself is not the troubling aspect - I can understand it existing in games such as Hyperdimension Neptunia, the problem with its inclusion in Fire Emblem in particular is that it vaporizes any semblance of a consistent tone. Games like HN and Disgaea have consistent tones - lighthearted and jokey, and so the fanservice in those games don't feel out of place (though I still personally struggle to play the HN game I bought on a sale whim despite this). The interviews with the Fates guys indicate that they want to make this game's story meaningful. What a joke. The decision to include so much fanservice (which include the likes of a pandering lesbian Tharja), along the other horrible choices IS have made (in particular, the decision to split the game at the store, rather than at the player's choice) butchers any possibility of this game having a quality story. Wasn't that the initial hope when this game was announced?

Enjoy the fanservice if you want, but there's no denying that until IS just up and make the straight hentai game they seem to really want, its a significant detraction. Focus on either a "heavy, meaningful story" (ex Fe 4, 5, 9. 10, etc), or a non serious "rub everyone's tits and strip them to their underwear anime" (ex HN, Senran Kagura, etc). Trying to combine the two, like Fates is doing, is laughable.

^ because every fire emblem game had a consistent tone? The existence of more light hearted moments does not destroy the game. Every fire emblem game i have heard about besides maybe the first 3 has had light hearted moments, sometimes in the middle of of a battle like the funnier lover convos in FE 4, geez it basically mentioned sex in a lovers convo in freakin chapter 5 (you know the chapter) your deep meaningful story right there, if light hearted moments when the story is supposed to be deep are a bad thing, at least Fates had the decency to keep it in my castle. And please don't try to bring marketing into an argument about story it makes about as much sense as saying i don't mind the fan-service but i can't play a game with fan service. (Oh wait a second..what a joke.) And Please having an area with mini-games even in darker games is hardly a new concept but really i just find the fact you can't seem to be able to freaking look past optional features laughable.