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Gabriel98

Question for those who have beaten ( one of ) the games: How does Fates compare to Awakening?

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You may want to be a tad more specific so I know how to answer your questions.

Well, which one of the two is the superior one in terms of story, gameplay, character development etc. ( in your opinion of course )

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The gameplay is usually pretty darn fantastic, although some map gimmicks are simply not fun and are only there to artificially make the game more difficult, but that's just my opinion. Still, there's a lot of variety at least, and that's nice.

However, even though they said they'd focus on the story, I'm really not impressed, particularly not by the Nohr route which I consider pretty darn bad and unsatisfying. They're clearly betting everything on the third path, saving most of the mysteries and the best features for that route, so I think the "if" here is a pretty bad title, honestly. Yeah, what "if" you chose the path that's pretty much going to be the correct one? - At least, that's the impression I got from playing Hoshido and Nohr.

I'm not the best to talk about characters, both because of my poor Japanese and the fact that I actually liked a lot of characters from Awakening. Still, there are a few ones I definitely like, and a few I definitely can't stand, unlike in Awakening where the I just didn't mind the worst characters there; here I actively dislike some, but that might change with the English version and it's all so subjective anyway.

Kamui is also a worse character than Robin. He's pretty much just as bland, but while Robin at least had tactics to fall back on which explained why they were in charge of the army, Kamui leads everyone for the lulz. I guess he's got that fancy sword, but it's a thin excuse to say the least, especially once your route's older brother joins the party.

Music and graphics are better though, and like I said I really like the map variety for the most part, so those are definite improvements.

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I assume the story comes down to personal preference

Hows hard and Lunatic mode in compassion? I found Hard mode in Awakening not really that hard but not too easy, and lunatic mode was too hard, do-able without dlc but you have little freedom to train who you want due to very limited number of strategies that are viable. Single miss or bad luck can force you to restart.

Would I expect a similar experience in FE:Fates or have they made Lunatic more balanced?

Edited by Raybrand

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I assume the story comes down to personal preference

Hows hard and Lunatic mode in compassion? I found Hard mode in Awakening not really that hard but not too easy, and lunatic mode was too hard, do-able without dlc but you have little freedom to train who you want due to very limited number of strategies that are viable. Single miss or bad luck can force you to restart.

Would I expect a similar experience in FE:Fates or have they made Lunatic more balanced?

This.I recently played lunatic and I realized that I relied way too much on luck(not the stat btw) and that there was no point to train anyone bit robin and chrom.Do they fix that?

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Couldn't agree more with Thane here. Music and graphics are definitely better, but you can clearly see that they're betting on the Third Path. The ending and the story of Nohr just feels a bit disappointing. I'm currently playing through Hoshido, so I can't say too much about that yet.

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Kamui is also a worse character than Robin. He's pretty much just as bland, but while Robin at least had tactics to fall back on which explained why they were in charge of the army, Kamui leads everyone for the lulz. I guess he's got that fancy sword, but it's a thin excuse to say the least, especially once your route's older brother joins the party.

I don't think Robin is a particularly bland character: the problem is the depth that's there is all subtext due to Robin actively trying to hide his/her major faults because being the tactician means they need to appear confident and in control at all times. But if you really pay attention it is clear that Robin has massive (and I mean massive) lack of self-worth and clearly has way more hangups regarding their lack of identiy due to their amnesia then they let on. But again, the game kinda leaves it all to subtext besides one or two direct mentions.

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Well these Avatar characters are pretty for the most part are almost blank slates for players to self-insert themselves into. True they have backstory and all that but their personalities are completely defined its hard for me to explain............

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Kamui is also a worse character than Robin. He's pretty much just as bland, but while Robin at least had tactics to fall back on which explained why they were in charge of the army, Kamui leads everyone for the lulz. I guess he's got that fancy sword, but it's a thin excuse to say the least, especially once your route's older brother joins the party.

I think being a dragon is a pretty good reason. On Hoshido Kamui also has the advantage of knowing everything about Nohr, making him or her an invaluable information source, which is pretty relevant. I can't say much for the Nohr side, but IIRC

the internal revolution of Nohr essentially comes about because your siblings side with you over Garon, which means you're the literal cornerstone of the revolution,

which is also pretty relevant.

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but Kamui seems to be in the position that most main characters of strategy games are in, which is to say, s/he's essentially the general and figurehead, not primarily the tactician. Robin was actually an anomaly in that s/he was explicitly NOT the person in charge but instead the primary adviser, which meant s/he HAD to have that level of competence in order to assist Chrom in the necessary ways. Kamui is the Chrom, not the Robin: s/he has the help of all the other important personages in the army to keep things running and make tactical decisions, and his/her real relevance is "being the person the army is willing to follow into battle." Which, again... freaking dragon. It's no wonder people would follow "the royalty that is also a dragon."

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The gameplay is usually pretty darn fantastic, although some map gimmicks are simply not fun and are only there to artificially make the game more difficult, but that's just my opinion. Still, there's a lot of variety at least, and that's nice.

However, even though they said they'd focus on the story, I'm really not impressed, particularly not by the Nohr route which I consider pretty darn bad and unsatisfying. They're clearly betting everything on the third path, saving most of the mysteries and the best features for that route, so I think the "if" here is a pretty bad title, honestly. Yeah, what "if" you chose the path that's pretty much going to be the correct one? - At least, that's the impression I got from playing Hoshido and Nohr.

I'm not the best to talk about characters, both because of my poor Japanese and the fact that I actually liked a lot of characters from Awakening. Still, there are a few ones I definitely like, and a few I definitely can't stand, unlike in Awakening where the I just didn't mind the worst characters there; here I actively dislike some, but that might change with the English version and it's all so subjective anyway.

Kamui is also a worse character than Robin. He's pretty much just as bland, but while Robin at least had tactics to fall back on which explained why they were in charge of the army, Kamui leads everyone for the lulz. I guess he's got that fancy sword, but it's a thin excuse to say the least, especially once your route's older brother joins the party.

Music and graphics are better though, and like I said I really like the map variety for the most part, so those are definite improvements.

All this. I liked Robin waaaayy better than Kamui, that's for sure. I don't think Robin is bland though. It's hard to compare them since Kamui is super naive b/c of a sheltered royal life while the other is a rational tactician but at least Robin had way more character development IMO.

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I don't know much about the story and characters, although from what I've seen I'm not super impressed so far. I don't think Awakening did too great in that area either, but I'm very confused by their claims of making big improvements to it. The shitty outfits don't help with taking things seriously, either.

Mechanically, though, it's fantastic. Keeps all the smoothness of Awakening but with a lot more substance and meaningful tactical decisions to make. Some maps are rather easy to slip right through but overall it's very solid. I haven't tried Lunatic yet; so far I've gone through Hoshido Hard and now I'm going through Nohr Hard, but there are definitely some challenges already.

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I'm still suffering from both "new game hype" and "disappointment born from failed expectations", so my overview is subject to change.

Positives:

Strategically, I found If/Fates to be much better. The AI was more impressive, and the maps were fun overall; I enjoyed them quite a bit. The new attack/defense stances require more planning and make the pairing system less broken.

Graphically, the portraits were more expressive, while the personalized battle animations were an equally wonderful touch; you could get an understanding of their personality from them. Tattered and dirtied clothing upon defeat were equally nifty. There were pictures in cutscene that allowed the portrayal of certain events to be sharper than the battle models would allow.

Musically, the compositions were gorgeous. A few of the songs stood out to me in particular, namely the title screen. I fell for Renka's voice, but as that'll be altered in English, it probably isn't a deciding factor for most. My personal OST preference is probably If > Awakening >>>> everything else.

Like Awakening, supports are too difficult to judge as a whole, since some were very good, while others left me feeling unsatisfied or disgusted (mostly S supports; rather, especially S supports). Certain topics were addressed more carefully this time, and I found many of them to be more insightful because of how closely related everyone already is with each other. I really, really liked the royal families interacting amongst each other and their retainers, for example. Sibling interactions were cute. (Edit: Actually, I think I might have liked them more than Awakening's for the most part; thus, moved it to positives. Some of them reference other supports, while some reference the actual plot. Those were nice additions.)

Neutral/Debatable:

I loved limitless levels in Awakening -- they granted you a chance to restart a character if you wind up not liking how you built them -- so the new seals (parallel, in particular) require a bit of getting used to. However, for the same reason, you're required to plan your game out more carefully... which, when used efficiently, can be much less time consuming. I'll probably grow to like it once I figure it out. It depends on the player. It'll take me a few more playthroughs to formulate a solid opinion.

I liked both games' characters, for the most part, so no real comparison here. Some of them pleasantly surprised me, while others weren't worthy of my time. If I tried ranking both of the games' casts, it'd probably be mixed.

Negatives:

The Nohr story was aggravating; there were too many questionable decisions that made me want to scream. It was less generic than Awakening, certainly, but I feel like the older title had significantly better pacing and didn't contain nearly as many filler chapters -- Nohr had far too many of those; at least half of them were pointless in the grand scheme of things. I haven't played Hoshido yet, nor the third path and thus cannot provide a decent opinion. Apparently the latter fills in some gaps which might aid its favour. I don't think you have to buy both Nohr and Hoshido to get a grasp on the complete plot, but you'd probably have to play one of them on top of the third. Basing on text dumps/videos, one of the Hoshido plot twists is... Ugh. Ultimately, I found Awakening to be superior in this regard. For now, at least. Both were "okay" to me, but the pacing... That definitely hindered If. Awakening wins this one.

Kamui was extremely frustrating. I didn't like Chrom either -- or most protagonists, for that matter. Their customisation options were better than Robin, but that's about it.

Edited by sforzur

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It's kinda shocking to hear that the plot is rather poor considering hearing people's reactions it seems to be good, but now I'm just worried :/

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Well here comes the Incest train, choo-choo!

I played the paths and here are my opinions. Hoshido was soooo good. I loved it. Sure, the fact that they let you S-Support with the siblings by having a letter making them your step-siblings was annoying but it didn't bother me as much as other people were bothered. Plus I enjoyed Hinoka's character. The supports with the other siblings were fun and Silas is still Best Bro/Step Bro through Sakura/Awesome Unit.

Nohr.... not what I wanted. Good story, characters, but it wasn't the way I had thought it would be. It was really hyped up about how different it was and... well it was different. Different from what I thought it would be.

Third Path was fun. As good as Hoshido in some aspects. That's all I got to say.

Kamui? He was fun. Some people like Robin more, or don't like the protagonists at all but I gotta say I liked the character and how he acted. Robin was good but Kamui was better. Plus the customization was good too.

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Well here comes the Incest train, choo-choo!

I played the paths and here are my opinions. Hoshido was soooo good. I loved it. Sure, the fact that they let you S-Support with the siblings by having a letter making them your step-siblings was annoying but it didn't bother me as much as other people were bothered. Plus I enjoyed Hinoka's character. The supports with the other siblings were fun and Silas is still Best Bro/Step Bro through Sakura/Awesome Unit.

Nohr.... not what I wanted. Good story, characters, but it wasn't the way I had thought it would be. It was really hyped up about how different it was and... well it was different. Different from what I thought it would be.

Third Path was fun. As good as Hoshido in some aspects. That's all I got to say.

Kamui? He was fun. Some people like Robin more, or don't like the protagonists at all but I gotta say I liked the character and how he acted. Robin was good but Kamui was better. Plus the customization was good too.

I agree with your points here. Hoshido seemed better overall to me. Nohr had a story, and it worked, but just was not as was expected, and so can make it falter. I think overall the stories for both games were better than Awakening as there was nothing strange like time travel involved (yet.

Did you play the third path already? Or is this just based on the info in the text dump and such? Been avoiding most things about it, but in "some aspects" worries me about what it's not as good as in the "other" aspects. xD

I think there were better hairstlyes in this, and the clothing would have been had fem kamui not been pants less : ( In Hoshido though she got a better upgrade design. xD

Robin or Kamui...hmm, well they both have their ups and downs, Robin I guess can put it to amnesia, where as Kamui...can put it to sheltered life or something. In the end I think a shift to the third person may be better, but that's just what I think.

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Did you play the third path already? Or is this just based on the info in the text dump and such? Been avoiding most things about it, but in "some aspects" worries me about what it's not as good as in the "other" aspects. xD

Money has gone to this game and it's been spent. Let that answer it.

Yes I did. XD Trying not to spoil it. Sorry if I'm being "dark and mysterious" again. Don't worry, I'm just biased towards Hoshido because my favorite characters are there, or most of them anyways. Third Path is fun. :3

Edited by DualMix

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Only played Hoshido so far.

Gameplay-wise, it's probably my favorite Fire Emblem ever. The new pairup mechanics are very well balanced, and you have to switch between offense and defense. The experience point curve has been rebuilt, so that lower level units catch up much faster, and higher level units can get literally 0 experience: this effectively destroys the "Let me just pick the two best units and have them solo the map" strategy that some used in Awakening.

Units cannot both tank and 1-round enemies anymore. You can't nosterafu-tank your way through the game. Every character is very different from a gameplay perspective due to drastically different growths even if they are the same class.

The AI is also relatively competent. For example, it usually attacks first with its ninjas and maids to debuff your units and it will move its units to always setup attack formation when it can. It won't ever form guard formations though (Every stage has some, but they are pre-setup at stage start and never happens during the stage itself). Stage variety was also fun and there was some neat stuff, even if its on Hoshido.

From a story perspective, my Japanese isn't good enough to understand all the details but I wasn't overly impressed. A lot felt like filler with not that much world building. Still, from a gameplay perspective its very much worth playing (I'm on my 2nd Hoshido playthrough already) and I'll definitively be buying the English version too.

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Money has gone to this game and it's been spent. Let that answer it.

Yes I did. XD Trying not to spoil it. Sorry if I'm being "dark and mysterious" again. Don't worry, I'm just biased towards Hoshido because my favorite characters are there, or most of them anyways. Third Path is fun. :3

Just out of curiosity, feel free to PM it, but how did you manage to get it early?

Only played Hoshido so far.

Gameplay-wise, it's probably my favorite Fire Emblem ever. The new pairup mechanics are very well balanced, and you have to switch between offense and defense. The experience point curve has been rebuilt, so that lower level units catch up much faster, and higher level units can get literally 0 experience: this effectively destroys the "Let me just pick the two best units and have them solo the map" strategy that some used in Awakening.

Units cannot both tank and 1-round enemies anymore. You can't nosterafu-tank your way through the game. Every character is very different from a gameplay perspective due to drastically different growths even if they are the same class.

The AI is also relatively competent. For example, it usually attacks first with its ninjas and maids to debuff your units and it will move its units to always setup attack formation when it can. It won't ever form guard formations though (Every stage has some, but they are pre-setup at stage start and never happens during the stage itself). Stage variety was also fun and there was some neat stuff, even if its on Hoshido.

From a story perspective, my Japanese isn't good enough to understand all the details but I wasn't overly impressed. A lot felt like filler with not that much world building. Still, from a gameplay perspective its very much worth playing (I'm on my 2nd Hoshido playthrough already) and I'll definitively be buying the English version too.

Just a point on the story, they actually do talk a lot about the countries that are caught up in between the war, their positions, their maneuverings, and the other locales too. : ) So there is world building. There is also filler, though, as you surmised, but overall it was pretty good. Understandable as you said your Japanese was not too great though.

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Just out of curiosity, feel free to PM it, but how did you manage to get it early?

I'd be lying if I said it was me, myself, and I. More like it was, friends, friends, and me begging them to let me see take it for myself for a year. Wait, that's not possible. Oh no! I've been caught time traveling- I will definetly ask though, and try to get the info to you as soon as possible! Now to go through years of numbers just to find her.

Wait a minute... I'm not popular... THIS ISN'T MY PH- wait it is.

Looks like someone can't keep the curious train away. Choo-Choo!

Edited by DualMix

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Just beat Hoshido last night, and starting Nohr now. Honestly, I don't think grinding was necessary to add in Hoshido -- I never touched it, and all of my units were at the right level for endgame (~Lvl 15, promoted once base class reached lvl 20). It's definitely harder than Awakening. Dodging is much less frequent than in past games as most enemies always had about a 70-80% of hitting you, and by end game they hit HARD. So if you're playing on classic, you have to really strategize if you don't want your units dying left and right. Funnily enough, the children chapters were harder than the endgame chapters (enemies had higher stats here), but those offered a really nice challenge. Map design was better than I expected, especially near the the endgame, though I am VERY disappointed in Chapter 26 -- it's the one where you face off against Marx, but he's accessible from your starting point, so I beat the chapter in one turn. :P

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