Unit Optimization Thread

[HeoandReo]

I'm actually considering Luna!Matoi for my no-fun optimalish pairings file, mostly because it's where they happened to fall after I sorted out other kids. Thinking of having her marry Siegbert and A+ with Shara, so she gets Spellcaster and Cavalier.

Luna could actually pull off a solid offensive set taking advantage of Competitive with an A+ with Setsuna. Setsuna is the only support she gets that can give her a faire(Bowfaire) and she also gets some good classes to use them with such as Holy Bowman. I'm probably going to use the Logbook to pick up some other things, but it's a niche that she can fit in. The only thing is that Luna will want a partner who can crit a lot to take fuller advantage of her skill. (if only she could support with Charlotte... or maybe she doesn't even need to if a high enough crit rate is reached.)

I did mention Mozume!Matoi a little earlier in this topic. Her growths are solid, mods are pretty good, and she can pick up Extravagance. In Invisible Kingdom she can also A+ with Effie, meaning that she can pass Defensive Formation to Matoi if you're in a low speed class.

Setsuna!Matoi has slightly better mods than Aqua (better defenses overall) but worse growths. Matoi will get to pick up Bowman though.

[astrophys]

I see… how did your planned optimized pairings fall such that Luna!Matoi ended up as the naturally occurring leftover?

You're right that Luna can use Bowfaire from Setsuna both in the Holy Bowman class and also in Luna's inherent Bow Knight and Golden Kite Warrior… Setsuna has the same availability as Hinoka, in any case.

Luna would do well with someone who boosts crit rates, from the standpoint of her personal, or someone who has lots of crit opportunities. Harold would help from the standpoint of his Unlucky Soul making enemies crit prone, but he's also highly crit prone himself. Anyone with Astra access could also do this do to getting five crit chances in an attack (although this only matters if the enemy survives the Astra with a crit, although Luna's crit would then most likely ensure a kill). Subaki does have high skill and Astra, although not in his base class.

Mozume Matoi… would she be able to inherit Aptitude? Weapons Master inheritance is wasted, but yes, she gets Extravagance.

[HeoandReo]

I see… how did your planned optimized pairings fall such that Luna!Matoi ended up as the naturally occurring leftover?

You're right that Luna can use Bowfaire from Setsuna both in the Holy Bowman class and also in Luna's inherent Bow Knight and Golden Kite Warrior… Setsuna has the same availability as Hinoka, in any case.

Luna would do well with someone who boosts crit rates, from the standpoint of her personal, or someone who has lots of crit opportunities. Harold would help from the standpoint of his Unlucky Soul making enemies crit prone, but he's also highly crit prone himself. Anyone with Astra access could also do this do to getting five crit chances in an attack (although this only matters if the enemy survives the Astra with a crit, although Luna's crit would then most likely ensure a kill). Subaki does have high skill and Astra, although not in his base class.

Mozume Matoi… would she be able to inherit Aptitude? Weapons Master inheritance is wasted, but yes, she gets Extravagance.

I'm pretty sure that Aptitude can be inherited. That can help patch up some of the lower growths compared to Azura!Matoi. Mozume could also A+ with Oboro to pick up a Lance Fighter skill, which can work nicely.

Because there is an exact number of first gen mothers to first gen fathers, I'm approaching optimization (assuming all kids) from the standpoint that I can't make every kid awesome this time around. In Awakening, I could pair up kids to useful fathers and end up with something that would reach my satisfaction. (except for Noire, but she is notoriously hard to optimize compared to the other kids) Someone is going to have to stomach being really slow this time arond, so they are going to need the tools to survive with it.

For Matoi, I did make Mozume her mother in an earlier iteration, but I moved Mozume to Velour to take fuller advantage of Flannel's stat spread and class selection. Luna was one of the leftovers who didn't hurt Matoi's stats too much. (I think when I was trying to determine Matoi, it was between either her or Rinkah, and Luna is less harmful statwise) Most of the high speed mothers tended to go to high speed kids with good skill selections (Azura to Kaze, Setsuna to Kinu) and for the most part high speed mothers are from Hoshido. Since Hoshido fathers can only marry a limited number of parents from Nohr, you have to make sure they can actually get married to someone if you're going for all the kids.

My current plan so far is this, for reference. My last plan I attempted to optimize Swallow Strike and attempt to get good stats/classes on top of that. This time I'm attempting to optimize Copycat in addition. I'm also trying to make certain first gens viable as well for their purposes. (Azura, Mozume, Sakura, Arthur, Zero, Pieri among others)

AvatarxSetsuna!Kinu (+Spe/-Lck, Oni Savage) (Kinu A+ Midoriko or Velour. If Extravagance is obtained from Logbook, pick Velour)

Kaze!ShigurexOrochi!Ophelia (Shigure A+ Hisame, Ophelia A+ Midoriko)

Hana!DeerexOboro!Eponine (Deere A+ Gurei, Eponine A+ Velour)

Camilla!ShinonomexAzura!Midoriko (Shinonome A+ Gurei, Midoriko A+ Kanna)

Rinkah!KisaragixHinoka!Sophie (Kisaragi A+ Hisame, Sophie A+ Velour)

Sakura!GureixKinu!Kanna (Gurei A+ Deere or Shinonome, Kanna A+ Midoriko or Velour, similar case to Kinu)

Pieri!HisamexEffie!Mitama (Hisame A+ Gurei, Mitama A+ Shara)

Charlotte!SiegbertxLuna!Matoi (Siegbert A+ Shinonome, Matoi A+ Shara)

Felicia!FoleoxNyx!Shara (Foleo A+ Shigure, Shara A+ Matoi)

Kagerou!LutzxElise!Soleil (Lutz A+ Deere, Soleil A+ Mitama, Elise's high magic growth gives Soleil a growth of 21 following the formula, which isn't bad by any means)

Belka!IgnisxMozume!Velour (Ignis A+ Gurei, Velour A+ Kanna)

Edited July 20, 2015 by HeoandReo

[Wayward Alchemist]

On the topic of Azura!Matoi, we can't forget her brother, Subaki!Shigure. With his Growths and Mods, he would make a fair Trueblade or Weapons Master.

[astrophys]

True, because Azura pairings create two kids…

0/+1/+4/+2/0/+1/0

Subaki!Shigure and Aqua!Matoi:

Pegasus Warrior/Rod Knight/Samurai (both of them)

[Ebony]

Have you considered Aqua!Matoi? She'd be avaiable from the start so you could recruit Matoi much earlier than Hinoka or Luna. Her mods are 0/+1/+4/+2/0/+1/0

She'd almost have a guaranteed +4 Damage when fighting any strength oriented enemies because of [Prodigy] and be able to deal with mages pretty well just by virtue of being a Falcon Knight. This is a possible skillset with the Avatar marrying Matoi with Lancer as a secondary:

[ Voice of Peace | Swallow Strike | Lancefaire | Breaking Sky | Servant's Joy ]

Voice of Peace since its essentially +2 Def/Res for her and everyone around, could be replaced but its fun to have a unique skill. Servant's Joy just to take advantage of her staff use and allow her to heal, could be replaced with anything else. She could also A+ with Sophie for Cavalier skills.

Ohh no... ohhhh no, I really like this idea. I may use this for the third route. Definitely writing down!

(I planned on Oboro x Zero so...)

[Morgan]

I think I finally settled on a mother for Deere and I'm going to go with Kagerou (cute supports in my opinion) Now set wise I was thinking:

Kagerou!Deere @ Butler/Elite Ninja

-Kunaifaire

-Luna

-Breaking Sky (passed from mother)

-Snake Venom

-Servant's Joy/Diamond Strike

Modififiers: +6/-1/+2/0/0/+1

Natural Class trees: Rod Knight, Ninja, Cavalier

That amazing +6 strength with Kunafaire is going to HURT. Not sure if i should swap Luna or Breaking Sky our or leave both in to activate. Snake Venom wears down enemies. Servant's Joy could be nice if I go Butler, but otherwise I'd throw in Diamond Strike or a different filler skill from Streetpass/A+/S ranks.

I feeling I may go Elite Ninja for S rank kunais in exchange for 1 point lower defense. Thoughts on improvement? Tbh I'm not the greatest at this stuff XD

[Pokechu]

So, a character can only have one A+ support and it goes one way? For example, if I A+ support Azura to Sakura, Azura can no longer A+ Elise, right? But Sakura could A+ Elise, because it goes one way. After she does she could not A+ support anyone else, right? And is Kamui only able to A+ one unit like the rest? Still haven't fully understood A+ supports and buddy seals :x

Also, what'd be the best secondary class for Kamui if her S support was Nishiki? A few days back I searched for "nishiki" in the thread but I didn't see this question asked. And just to be sure. the best asset and flaw would be Speed/Luck, because Speed/Magic gives -1 to both Speed and Res, and with Speed/Luck the negative luck would usually be -3, but your asset being Speed makes it -1.

reposting this ouo"

don't mean to be rude or anything by reposting, but I feel as if this post was skipped over

[Morgan]

reposting this ouo"

don't mean to be rude or anything by reposting, but I feel as if this post was skipped over

1st para: That is correct. However Kamui does not have any A+ supports. Kamui can however change to whatever class they want using the buddy seal and gets the base class of those they have an A rank with (hence why Kamui is op)

2nd para: If a Kamui marries Nishiki, they get Spellcaster from him. Right there you get access to Breaking Sky which is one of the best skills in the game imo. Depending on what route you're going you get White Blood or Dark Blood (or both). They give some good skills as well such as Hoshido for example. Speed/Luck is in my opinion the best since it gives a great +4 Spd and speed is the most important stat in the game. Your second class should be something that benefits whatever you want your avatar to do. So what is that? Did you want to end on a certain class like White Blood or Dark Blood?

[Minischew]

I have one question in regards to optimized children: Is it better to ship for stats, or for class trees and skills? I remember in Awakening, child optimization depended heavily on maximizing the number of Galeforce units. Are there any skills (e.g. Breaking Sky, Copycat Puppet) that deserve that sort of recognition here?

Of course, I understand that you should try to find the best compromise, but if you had to choose one, which is more valuable in Fates?

Edited July 20, 2015 by Minischew

[Azz]

I have one question in regards to optimized children: Is it better to ship for stats, or for class trees and skills? I remember in Awakening, child optimization depended heavily on maximizing the number of Galeforce units. Are there any skills (e.g. Breaking Sky, Copycat Puppet) that deserve that sort of recognition here?

Of course, I understand that you should try to find the best compromise, but if you had to choose one, which is more valuable in Fates?

If I ever intend on optimizing kids, it will be stats.Since now there is marriage sealing and buddy sealing, you don't need to try get certain characters certain classes to get certain skills.Also, there is My Castle shenanigans where you can just buy skills if you really need to.

[Pokechu]

1st para: That is correct. However Kamui does not have any A+ supports. Kamui can however change to whatever class they want using the buddy seal and gets the base class of those they have an A rank with (hence why Kamui is op)

2nd para: If a Kamui marries Nishiki, they get Spellcaster from him. Right there you get access to Breaking Sky which is one of the best skills in the game imo. Depending on what route you're going you get White Blood or Dark Blood (or both). They give some good skills as well such as Hoshido for example. Speed/Luck is in my opinion the best since it gives a great +4 Spd and speed is the most important stat in the game. Your second class should be something that benefits whatever you want your avatar to do. So what is that? Did you want to end on a certain class like White Blood or Dark Blood?

I'd want them to end on White/Dark Blood, but I was wondering what class would be best for Nishiki to get via the marriage seal. I'm planning on husbandoing Nishiki on the 3rd route, if that helps with anything. Also, how does class inheritance work in this game? Is it both parent's sets combined like in Awakening, or nah?

thanks for the fast reply, though! I would've replied earlier when I typed this post but I was like "lol splatoon time"

[Xeniferos]

If I ever intend on optimizing kids, it will be stats.Since now there is marriage sealing and buddy sealing, you don't need to try get certain characters certain classes to get certain skills.Also, there is My Castle shenanigans where you can just buy skills if you really need to.

Waaaaaaaait a minute.

So you mean to tell me that it's possible to get skills from other classes that a character wouldn't normally have access to via My Castle?

For example, if I had two DS'es, and two copies of FE:If... I could recruit any male character, marry them to Mozume, Marriage Seal to Villager, get Aptitude, and then put them in Streetpass so I, and others, could profit without actually HAVING to marry Mozume on the file in which you want Aptitude on? Do the skills get stored once acquired, or do they poof when you remove them from their active Skillset?

Edited July 20, 2015 by Xeniferos

[Wayward Alchemist]

Question: if Kamui A supports Jakob and then A supports Felicia, will he gain access to Rod Knight and Mercenary?

[Xeniferos]

Question: if Kamui A supports Jakob and then A supports Felicia, will he gain access to Rod Knight and Mercenary?

Kamui will get access to Rod Knight from Jakob via Buddy Seal if he is male due to same-sex A support. Rod Knight from Felicia if Kamui is female. Keep in mind this is assuming Kamui's secondary class isn't already Rod Knight. If it is, Kamui will get nothing from either.

Kamui will not get anything from an opposite gendered character at A support, only S.

Edited July 20, 2015 by Xeniferos

[Azz]

Question: if Kamui A supports Jakob and then A supports Felicia, will he gain access to Rod Knight and Mercenary?

Just Rod Knight.

[HeoandReo]

Waaaaaaaait a minute.

So you mean to tell me that it's possible to get skills from other classes that a character wouldn't normally have access to via My Castle?

For example, if I had two DS'es, and two copies of FE:If... I could recruit any male character, marry them to Mozume, Marriage Seal to Villager, get Aptitude, and then put them in Streetpass so I, and others, could profit without actually HAVING to marry Mozume on the file in which you want Aptitude on? Do the skills get stored once acquired, or do they poof when you remove them from their active Skillset?

I'm pretty sure that can be done through the Logbook too. I don't think the Mozume example will work since I don't think Villager can be obtained from a Marriage Seal, but you can do some playthroughs or go to other castles where they have characters with the skills you want.

Personally, I'm just thinking to optimize skills to save a bit of time, but stats + classes should be the main focus.

[Xeniferos]

I'm pretty sure that can be done through the Logbook too. I don't think the Mozume example will work since I don't think Villager can be obtained from a Marriage Seal, but you can do some playthroughs or go to other castles where they have characters with the skills you want.

Personally, I'm just thinking to optimize skills to save a bit of time, but stats + classes should be the main focus.

Boo, I just looked it up and you're right. It looks like Villager also can't be inherited. Thanks for clarifying!

Oh well, there are still all kinds of possibilities. Not to mention it's still possible to get skills like Aptitude and Voice of Peace on children characters this way. This means I can take my favoritism babying to another level. Also, Easy Life and Smithy Skill shenanigans!

Mrehehe...

Edited July 20, 2015 by Xeniferos

[Wayward Alchemist]

So how does this sound for a Hoshido MU that is dead set on using the Dragonstone? This is for a friend. He plans on a tanky play style, as Hoshido lacks bulky classes for the most part.

MU (+Mag/HP -Spd)@White Blood

-Defensive Formation (From Knight secondary, essential since Dragonstone can't double)

-Renewal (HP restoration because no Sol access in Hoshido)

-Diamond Strike/Counter/Magic Counter

-Mirror Strike/Counter/Magic Counter

-Vantage/Counter/Magic Counter

Not really sure what to do.

[HeoandReo]

Boo, I just looked it up and you're right. It looks like Villager also can't be inherited. Thanks for clarifying!

Oh well, there are still all kinds of possibilities. Not to mention it's still possible to get skills like Aptitude and Voice of Peace on children characters this way. This means I can take my favoritism babying to another level. Also, Easy Life and Smithy Skill shenanigans!

Mrehehe...

Ah, I didn't know that Villager couldn't be passed down to kids either. (I knew it couldn't be Buddied or Marriage Sealed) That does make Mozume even more special since she's the only one who can take full advantage of its options, though it kind of sucks that now only certain kids can do the whole Extravagance/Line of Death that I was theorycrafting.

Back to the drawing board again, I suppose.

Edited July 20, 2015 by HeoandReo

[Bovinian]

So how does this sound for a Hoshido MU that is dead set on using the Dragonstone? This is for a friend. He plans on a tanky play style, as Hoshido lacks bulky classes for the most part.

MU (+Mag/HP -Spd)@White Blood

-Defensive Formation (From Knight secondary, essential since Dragonstone can't double)

-Renewal (HP restoration because no Sol access in Hoshido)

-Diamond Strike/Counter/Magic Counter

-Mirror Strike/Counter/Magic Counter

-Vantage/Counter/Magic Counter

Not really sure what to do.

Counter won't help you actually tank, and it might even be detrimental if it still makes you not earn any exp if the enemy dies from it. And if this is for ingame then he probably won't be getting the level 15 skills till way late, or even have enough A supports or buddy seals to get that many different classes. Might be useful for closer to endgame though. Or is this not for the main story?

I'd say the Herb Merchant skills are pretty great for early access tanking skills, but if Knight is chosen as the secondary then there probably isn't a good way to get access to it unless you bro it up with Yukimura

[amaicherii]

I'll be marrying Takumi on my Hoshido file (and probably on the 3rd path as well) and Leon on my Nohr file. Based on this, any recommendations for the other pairings in order to have children with great stats? Also, if my Kamui marries Takumi how should I optimize her for Kisaragi and Kanna to have good stats (same with Leon for Foleo and Kanna)?

[HeoandReo]

I'll be marrying Takumi on my Hoshido file (and probably on the 3rd path as well) and Leon on my Nohr file. Based on this, any recommendations for the other pairings in order to have children with great stats? Also, if my Kamui marries Takumi how should I optimize her for Kisaragi and Kanna to have good stats (same with Leon for Foleo and Kanna)?

+Speed is a given for both imo. Both Takumi and Leon give unfortunate -2 speed mods to their kids from the start. A +speed asset combined with a flaw that doesn't reduce it (Luck or Defense) would give Kisaragi/Foleo and Kanna a speed mod of 3, which isn't too bad, all things considered. Assuming a Luck flaw, the stats will look like this:

Takumi: 1/0/6/3/1/1/-1

Leon: -2/2/3/3/0/1/3

Alternatively, if you have a way to get around the low speed (Defensive Formation usually) you could opt to capitalize on each character's better stats. You could so +Str for Takumi and +Mag for Foleo. +Mag is particularly useful since it also cancels Leon's negative modifier. Here's what their stats would look like, this time with -Defense flaw.

Takumi: 6/1/6/-1/1/-2/-2

Leon: -1/7/1/1/0/-2/2

[amaicherii]

+Speed is a given for both imo. Both Takumi and Leon give unfortunate -2 speed mods to their kids from the start. A +speed asset combined with a flaw that doesn't reduce it (Luck or Defense) would give Kisaragi/Foleo and Kanna a speed mod of 3, which isn't too bad, all things considered. Assuming a Luck flaw, the stats will look like this:

Takumi: 1/0/6/3/1/1/-1

Leon: -2/2/3/3/0/1/3

Alternatively, if you have a way to get around the low speed (Defensive Formation usually) you could opt to capitalize on each character's better stats. You could so +Str for Takumi and +Mag for Foleo. +Mag is particularly useful since it also cancels Leon's negative modifier. Here's what their stats would look like, this time with -Defense flaw.

Takumi: 6/1/6/-1/1/-2/-2

Leon: -1/7/1/1/0/-2/2

Thanks!! :)

[Ebony]

Alright so, assume I do a Kamui in Hoshido with Wyvern Rider or Mercenary as secondary class, marrying Takumi, gonna end up a White Blood... +Speed and -Luck?