Class Changing and Inheritance Thread

[AstraSage]

On a side note, Shigure gets Wyvern Rider if Joker is his dad.

I just saw the development at the Unit Optimization thread.

I can't believe I was onto something by just wondering if the first report of Jakob!Shigure in Post #13 could be someone reclassing Shigure out of the Pegasus Warrior Tree with the Marriage Seal first assuming he had the Peg/Rod/Cav set everyone thought before actually stumbling with the Actual Class Set (and the fact there was an Accidental Seal Redundancy with a Wyvern-Rider!Avatar) when reclassing back to Golden-Kite Knight via Parallel Seal...

Not to mention, there's now that question presented over that thread about the possibility of the Case of Kamui's Husband getting a Faction Parallel by using a Marriage Seal with an Overlap could also be translated into Male Kanna actually inheriting said Faction Parallel instead of his Father's Secondary...

Edited July 26, 2015 by AstraSage

[Jayvee94]

Wait correct me if I'm wrong but is there a way for a male avatar to get the Oni Savage line without marrying Rinkah or using it as the chosen class. There's no male character that can give them the line via Buddy seal since Rinkah is the only oni savage. Correct me if I'm not understanding how buddy Seals work

Tsukoyomi has Oni Savage in his class set

[Jayvee94]

So here's the trend:

1. Default class

2. One of Fixed parent's classes

3. One of Variable parent's classes

4. Mother's faction parallel class

[Bovinian]

Tsukoyomi has Oni Savage in his class set

I think it's been confirmed that you can only access someone's secondary class set via Buddy Seal if you share the same primary class set as them. Kamui can't get anyone's secondary class set this way because none of his/her Buddy Seal options will have Dark Prince(ss) as their starting class.

[Chrosion]

With Buddy Seals, the avatar uses one and only needs an A rank. My question is, does this go for other characters with the avatar too? Like if Jakob used a buddy seal while having an A rank with MaMU, do they get access to their secondary class? If so, does this go for FeMU with an A support with Jakob as well?

[Jayvee94]

I think it's been confirmed that you can only access someone's secondary class set via Buddy Seal if you share the same primary class set as them. Kamui can't get anyone's secondary class set this way because none of his/her Buddy Seal options will have Dark Prince(ss) as their starting class.

Now that I thought of it, I think Tsukoyomi can.

Edited July 26, 2015 by Jayvee94

[Bovinian]

With Buddy Seals, the avatar uses one and only needs an A rank. My question is, does this go for other characters with the avatar too? Like if Jakob used a buddy seal while having an A rank with MaMU, do they get access to their secondary class? If so, does this go for FeMU with an A support with Jakob as well?

No, because everyone else that isn't the avatar can only Buddy Seal with units they have an A+ support with. Nobody can A+ with Kamui.

[Lexington]

So here's the trend:

1. Default class

2. One of Fixed parent's classes

3. One of Variable parent's classes

4. Mother's faction parallel class

Actually it looks more like this:

Joker!Shigure

1. Default class (Pegasus)

2. One of Dad's classes (Rod Knight)

3. One of Mom's classes (Pegasus or Rod Knight)

4. Mother's faction parallel class (Wyvern)

Otherwise he should be inheriting Joker's Cavalier.

[Chrosion]

Now that I thought of it, I think Fuuga can.

Fuuga's a Weapon Master, so no Oni Savage line from him :P

Kinda disappointed we only get one Oni Savage, 2 if you count capturable bosses.

Edited July 26, 2015 by Chrosion

[Azz]

Does anyone know what Foleo gets if Nyx is his mother?

[Morgan]

Does anyone know what Foleo gets if Nyx is his mother?

Foleo's base is Rod Knight and he gets Dark Mage from Leo. Therefore I believe Nyx would go to her secondary and pass Thief. So Nyx!Foleo should have Rod Knight, Dark Mage, and Thief

[Morgan]

Regarding Jakob!Shigure, so does this mean the father is always considered before the mom? In that case it changes how I thought M!Kanna inherited his classes as well.

[Jayvee94]

Fuuga's a Weapon Master, so no Oni Savage line from him :P

Kinda disappointed we only get one Oni Savage, 2 if you count capturable bosses.

I made a mistake, I meant the one who already has the class set. Tsukoyomi

[Just call me AL]

Actually it looks more like this:

Joker!Shigure

1. Default class (Pegasus)

2. One of Dad's classes (Rod Knight)

3. One of Mom's classes (Pegasus or Rod Knight)

4. Mother's faction parallel class (Wyvern)

What about Azura!Deeks? Or any of Shigure's variable siblings barring Matoi? Would they get Pegasus Warrior, regardless of base class? Or would that require actually having the Rod Knight class?

[AstraSage]

What about Azura!Deeks? Or any of Shigure's variable siblings barring Matoi? Would they get Pegasus Warrior, regardless of base class? Or would that require actually having the Rod Knight class?

Well, with Azura!Deere the process is pretty much:

1. Default class (Rod Knight)

2. One of Dad's classes (Rod Knight or Cavalier)

3. One of Mom's classes (Pegasus)

4. Stops with Three Class Trees in the Set.

Speaking of Variables, I'm proud to say I have compiled a good amount of all the Possible Inheritable Class Sets with all the information gathered so far in a small spreadsheet file inspired by the Big Support Reference Chart:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Xd0pBZ4oQtk7o3fBXUcCGCXc8tQ3BFSx4CcknOkPKTc/edit?usp=sharing

Besides some more polishing, there's still a few questions that needs to be formally answered before it can be actually finished, and all of them are pertaining to Kanna and by extension the Avatar:

• What Actually Happens when the Avatar's Class Set has an Overlap with his/her Spouse's Default Class?
• Is there a difference between the Avatar being the Wife and the Avatar being the Husband on the above answer?
• May the fact Avatar's Spouse is from the First Generation or the Second One affect the above answers?
• Optional: Is there anything interesting about marrying a Kamui-sexual with a Class Overlap?

Edited July 27, 2015 by AstraSage

[Just call me AL]

Well, with Azura!Deere the process is pretty much:

1. Default class (Rod Knight)

2. One of Dad's classes (Rod Knight or Cavalier)

3. One of Mom's classes (Pegasus)

4. Stops with Three Class Trees in the Set.

Speaking of Variables, I'm proud to say I have compiled a good amount of all the Possible Inheritable Class Sets with all the information gathered so far in a small spreadsheet file inspired by the Big Support Reference Chart:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Xd0pBZ4oQtk7o3fBXUcCGCXc8tQ3BFSx4CcknOkPKTc/edit?usp=sharing

That is pretty interesting. However, I'm looking at that table right now, and I'm noticing that Kanna's section is the one that requires one to look into. I would imagine that the next class the other parent has access to would be passed down, in that case. But I guess what we don't know is if there's other factors regarding Kanna's other parent being a child character. Specifically, one that's not Velour or Kinu.

Besides some more polishing, there's still a few questions that needs to be formally answered before it can be actually finished, and all of them are pertaining to Kanna and by extension the Avatar:

• What Actually Happens when the Avatar's Class Set has an Overlap with his/her Spouse's Default Class?

In regards to this, I think I might have way of testing that out that might not involve Corrin. However, such a way involves going on the Nohr or Touma routes and pairng Berka!Sophie with Luna!Siegbert, Felicia!Eponinie or Elise!Eponine with Nyx!Foleo, and Effie!Velour with Ignis. Seeing as I don't have the game, myself, I have no way of sharing any results from this. So I'm wondering if there's anyone that would oblige here. Edited July 27, 2015 by Just call me AL

[Lexington]

Besides some more polishing, there's still a few questions that needs to be formally answered before it can be actually finished, and all of them are pertaining to Kanna and by extension the Avatar:

• What Actually Happens when the Avatar's Class Set has an Overlap with his/her Spouse's Default Class?
• Is there a difference between the Avatar being the Wife and the Avatar being the Husband on the above answer?
• May the fact Avatar's Spouse is from the First Generation or the Second One affect the above answers?
• Optional: Is there anything interesting about marrying a Kamui-sexual with a Class Overlap?

• I've heard one account, where someone with a Spellcaster!Kamui married Orochi and the Marriage Seal gave her access to Dark Mage.
• I doubt that the gender has any influence, since there are no genderlocked non-DLC classes.
• I doubt this as well. If the Second Gen character's primary class is identical with Kamui's secondary class they should get the parallel class. Unless they already have the parallel class via inheritance. I got no clue then.
• I don't see any reason for this, unless there is a Kamui-sexual that already has the parallel class of their primary class.

[lysander]

What does Benoit get from an A+ with Flannel then? Oni Savage?

[AstraSage]

In regards to this, I think I might have way of testing that out that might not involve Corrin. However, such a way involves going on the Nohr or Touma routes and pairng Berka!Sophie with Luna!Siegbert, Felicia!Eponinie or Elise!Eponine with Nyx!Foleo, and Effie!Velour with Ignis. Seeing as I don't have the game, myself, I have no way of sharing any results from this. So I'm wondering if there's anyone that would oblige here.

Well out of your proposed examples the only that shows promise is Berka!Sophie with Luna!Siegbert and even then there's still the possibility the Former would simply get a Wyvern Rider Reclass "Backdoor" along with the Latter's Mercenary...

As for the other cases, Foleo and Eponine don't share Default Class trees so they would just gain another access to Outlaw and Rod Knight respectively even if they already have it, and the same goes to Velour's Fighter with Ignis' Knight.

• I've heard one account, where someone with a Spellcaster!Kamui married Orochi and the Marriage Seal gave her access to Dark Mage.
• I doubt that the gender has any influence, since there are no genderlocked non-DLC classes.
• I doubt this as well. If the Second Gen character's primary class is identical with Kamui's secondary class they should get the parallel class. Unless they already have the parallel class via inheritance. I got no clue then.
• I don't see any reason for this, unless there is a Kamui-sexual that already has the parallel class of their primary class.

I wasn't referring to gender-specific classes (Staves-dedicated Class Trees aside), but rather to consider the news of the Class inheritance sticking to a "Father First, Then Mother" format even in a case (Azura and Shigure) we previously thought to happen the other way until recent revelations, so there's the possible situation that needs to be either confirmed or disproved where, with a Class Overlap, Female!Kanna might simply get her Mother's Secondary Class even though the Latter would still enjoy having access to a Faction Parallel via Marriage Seal while Male!Kanna might end up getting the Faction Parallel because the Father created a Full Class Set Overlap by not having anything to prevent him from passing his Default Class (As it will never be the same as Nohr Prince) instead of his Secondary if he goes first.

That said, I appreciate you took the time to ponder on each point.

What does Benoit get from an A+ with Flannel then? Oni Savage?

Considering their children, he will still get Fighter out of the deal even if he has it already. His Support is more so Flannel can become a Knight without marrying Effie or a Knight!Avatar.

Now, what would happen if either Arthur were to get an A+ with Flannel instead or Charlotte married Flannel are the more interesting questions...

Edited July 28, 2015 by AstraSage

[Just call me AL]

Well out of your proposed examples the only that shows promise is Berka!Sophie with Luna!Siegbert and even then there's still the possibility the Former would simply get a Wyvern Rider Reclass "Backdoor" along with the Latter's Mercenary...

As for the other cases, Foleo and Eponine don't share Default Class trees so they would just gain another access to Outlaw and Rod Knight respectively even if they already have it, and the same goes to Velour's Fighter with Ignis' Knight.

I'm not seeing how. I mean, following that class overlap on both units involved in parentage results in the child character getting the parallel version of their mother's base class (my cases in point are mentioned in the OP already, but I'll reiterate: Nyx!Eponine ends up getting Spellcaster while Berka!Lutz ends up getting Pegasus Warrior), and that there have been reports of Orochi as male Corrin's wife being able to become a Dark Mage through a Marriage Seal, I'm assuming that what happens in regards to total class overlap in inheritance also happens with Marriage Seal using. For example, if Hinoka!Grey were to marry a Kagerou!Matoi, Grey in this case should be able to get Wyvern Rider via Marriage Seal. Same thing should happen if Orochi!Hisame were to marry Hana!Shara, but replace Wyvern Rider with Dark Mage in this case. And in both of those cases, then Matoi and Shara should be able to get access to the Nohrian counterparts to Ninja and Samurai, respectively. I'll grant you that I have no proof to support this. But I think it's a reasonable assumption all the same. If I happen to be wrong in this, then I'm wrong. Just thought thinking about which child character pairs would have the most class overlap might help save some time in trying to figure out which Hoshidan Classes have which Nohrian counterparts or vice-versa.

Now, what would happen if either Arthur were to get an A+ with Flannel instead or Charlotte married Flannel are the more interesting questions...

The latter would be more viable. Since, at least according to that support topic that's on here, Flannel and Arthur can't get an A+ with one another.

[mimasho]

If I reclassed Leon into a lodestar, would I be able to pass down any class skills onto Foleo or Kanna ?

I feel like I should know the answer to this, but I honestly can't remember ?

you can't, right ? ; A ;

edit: AAND I posted in the wrong thread, my bad !!

Edited July 28, 2015 by mimasho

[AstraSage]

The latter would be more viable. Since, at least according to that support topic that's on here, Flannel and Arthur can't get an A+ with one another.

That's weird, it's been confirmed that both of them do support each other and that any same-gender support that's not a parent-child one or a just sibling one with Shigure/Kanna can be a candidate for the one-way A+...

Also, I apologize but do you understand that Class Inheritance and Buddy/Marriage Seal are two different processes that use different logics?

Edited July 29, 2015 by AstraSage

[Just call me AL]

That's weird, it's been confirmed that both of them do support each other and that any same-gender support that's not a parent-child one or a just sibling one with Shigure/Kanna can be a candidate for the one-way A+...

But the only one who can benefit from Buddy Seals without the need for an A+ support is Corrin, since (s)he can support with everyone in the game. Aside from that, there's only specific pairs and characters that can get A+ supports, none of which are named "Arthur/Harold" or "Flannel".

Also, I apologize but do you understand that Class Inheritance and Buddy/Marriage Seal are two different processes that use different logics?

Again, I was going by stuff like hearsay regarding something like Orochi being purportedly able to reclass into Dark Mage by marrying a Spellcaster class set male Corrin. Edited July 29, 2015 by Just call me AL

[Sunwoo]

Not sure if this is the right place for this, but it appears that Takumi has a unique swordmaster/trueblade outfit? Which really does not make any sense seeing as how it's not even a default option he has, but shrug. I promoted Tsubaki to swordmaster just to be certain it's unique, and I haven't seen it on anyone else yet. So, yeah, I guess Takumi has a unique swordmaster outfit.

[Just call me AL]

Not sure if this is the right place for this, but it appears that Takumi has a unique swordmaster/trueblade outfit? Which really does not make any sense seeing as how it's not even a default option he has, but shrug. I promoted Tsubaki to swordmaster just to be certain it's unique, and I haven't seen it on anyone else yet. So, yeah, I guess Takumi has a unique swordmaster outfit.

Got any screenshots? I'd like to see that.