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Ansem

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I-I can't... are you serious? Do you even know anything about the man? Do you really think he hates hispanics? Because he doesn't.

who is doing the raping don?! there's a reason that at some point during that "interview" don just started going "yeah...right, yeah." trump blathers on about stupid shit because he's an old racist man. trump expresses anti-immigration sentiments because so many of them are "rapists" and "killers." what??

I don't hate Hispanics, not in the slightest. Not only do they have the bombest food in the world, not only are they all hardworking and nice, but they're so much fun and they live a great lifestyle focused on family. They have kids, they raise their kids into fine upstanding adults. Americans could stand to learn a thing or two from the Hispanic-Americans.

these are only blanket statements about "hispanic-americans" as a whole, and if were not complementary, would be construed as racist too. not all hispanics are hardworking or nice, not all of them are "so much fun," or "live great lifestyles focused on family." they're people just like whites or asians or blacks. some of them are assholes, some of them are great. that's how things go. this particular comment on hispanics just screams, "i'm not racist, look at how not racist i am!"

honestly, do you listen to yourself?

But see, here's the problem. Liberals just LOVE to say illegal immigrants = THE GOP HATES ALL MEXICANS!! No. That's not true. And if you knew anything about the Latino community, you'd know the majority of them hate illegal immigrants the most. Why do you think these people LEGALLY immigrated to America? Because Mexico is something of a shithole (Slowly improving mind you and it's recently graduated from third o first world, but still kind of a shithole with beheadings and gangs everywhere). and they left that shithole behind. Now imagine that they have to watch as these shitty criminals from their country just waltz past the border and start infecting America, the land of opportunity.

there you go, hurting liberals' feelings again...

@bold: whoa, what? source? hahaha

i don't think anything you say is verifiable. it's just hearsay from one misinformed person to another. the brunt of the issue is that becoming a us citizen takes way too long and is unnecessarily difficult. getting to become a permanent resident in the united states can take years. living in a "shithole" ridden with cartel violence and government corruption doesn't really allow one to spend years just to do that.

You think they like that? They don't. I don't know how many people here have Mexican friends, but I live in Moses Lake, WA. The population here is about 50/50 white/latino. I meet tons of them every day at work and I fucking love these guys. But this community also is home to lots and lots of thieves, and it's common knowledge that it's Mexicans doing the thieving/drugs in the area. This isn't like some xenophobia, just a glance through the local paper's police blotter shows a constant stream of Jose's and Miguel's. And from what I've heard, the Mexicans in town know who is legal and who is not, and they ALL want the illegals gone.

it's actually 61/33 moses lake also has a very high crime rate compared to the rest of the us. don't know why (it's probably a pretty poor area). it's annoyingly difficult to find racial demographics on its crime. if anyone knows how to search for data better and cares enough, feel free to find stuff. until then, i won't accept your personal commentary.

So when I see people bashing Trump who calls ILLEGAL 'immigrants' (Let's call them invaders, please) rapists and murderers, he's not lying. It's not as hard as some make it out to get a visa and move into the USA, thousands do it all the time. It's harder for our soldiers to bring animals from Iraqi regions that they rescued (It's getting easier thanks to nonprofits) than it is for a Mexican to obtain a legal visa and move to the USA. So when Trump says 'I will win the Latino vote" he is NOT lying. I'm not gonna pretend like I love the guy, but many people are getting sick of this PC SJW culture that we live in and he's speaking for those of us sick to death of hearing words manipulated by the mainstream media.

i prefer "undocumented immigrants." he is lying. there's no proof that what he says is true.

you're right about pc stuff--i'd much rather hear the idiots blurt out their stupid racist notions instead of having us decipher things from their words. lets me know who's better to support from the get-go.

What's worse though is deliberate media manipulation and their constant politicking. For example, Fox News continuously puts Jeb Bush in 1st or second place in polls, but I don't know a single person who wants yet another Bush in the White House. Nobody! I have republican friends online, I frequent republican forums, and nobody ever praises the guy. I swear that either he's hiring vote bots for online polls to inflate his numbers, or the powers that own the media are trying to set us up for another Bush VS Clinton election. Just what we need, another member of the oligarchy.

anecdotal experiences aren't evidence. not everyone lives where you live.

A man who can't be bought since he's so wealthy nothing can influence him, and who also is clearly successful in business and maybe understands how to fix an economy based on dozens of years of his own successful business ventures.

there's this thing called "greed." i'd be willing to bet that trump can be bought and sold easily, though this is merely a hunch.

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what's your point? i feel your response won't change depending on my answer.

Well, if he has direct experience with the community, if only a small amount limited to his town, and you don't, I think I'd sooner believe him. My own experience with the Latino community has left me thinking that a sizable chunk of them are decent, if loud and annoyingly party-heavy, people. Most illegals, however, aren't Mexican-Americans or even Mexicans in America but Mexicans in Mexico that just so happens to also be named 'America' which gets really annoying.

Also... That last line... Really? You're going to accuse Trump of potentially being greedy? Why? Are you saying Hilary, or any Dem, can't be bought? I mean, seriously? Come on man. That's just a stupid addition so you can get the last word.

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there's no reason to believe him. he has no evidence of anything he claims (making generalizations requires evidence not personal experience). he's in a very small spot with regards to the entire united states. his views are based off of very little. he needs evidence to back up his claims, which he doesn't have. it would be very silly to simply believe what he says.

i'm from compton, los angeles, which is predominantly black and has many latinos. i've been to east la a number of times, which is almost 100% latino. i interact with latino people on a daily basis when in uni. i've even been to mexico. you don't see me making sweeping statements about latinos because of my experiences.

we can make generalizations against undocumented immigrants all day, but the fact remains you don't have any evidence to believe all this bs that's being thrown out by trump and his followers.

Really? You're going to accuse Trump of potentially being greedy? Why? Are you saying Hilary, or any Dem, can't be bought? I mean, seriously? Come on man. That's just a stupid addition so you can get the last word.

an important skill is comprehending what is written instead of assigning views to people that don't subscribe to them. where in the heck did i say any of that garbage?

Edited by Phoenix Wright
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1. Mexicans are part of a violent country filled with evil people and they're just trying to flee the country and if it happens to be illegally then oh well, whatever, they need to escape no matter what! Despite being from a violent country though, we can trust they're all good people!

2. Mexicans are part of a country of good people which is why they're good people, they just choose to not legally immigrate because... reasons. But trust me, they're definitely great people and we should be glad to have them over here even if illegally and should definitely not deport them.

The cold sweats over which option is correct are keeping me awake at night!

That's the hilarious conundrum liberals place themselves in. The conservative position is "if you can't come over here legally, don't come over here at all" yet for some dumb reason, bleeding heart liberals label it XENOPHOBIA! Big words sound scary! But they like to ignore the fact that 90% of all countries in the world have very strict immigration laws. Suuure, but America tries to close one border and suddenly we're the bad guys. Denmark, Switzerland, all those praised and lauded European countries have strict immigration laws, but it's okay because they aren't American.

Murica. Ended slavery 150 years before everyone else. Practically wide open borders anyone can enter. Constant televised shows focused on minorities. Minority quotas ensuring they have jobs. Anti hate-speech laws. But yes, we're definitely a nation of xenophobes.

Edited by Klokinator
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i really shouldn't respond to something like this, but i'm bored so fuck it i guess

so, first, let me point out that instead of replying to my post directly (cause you can't!), you chose instead to revert to namecalling, non sequitur (seriously what are you even talking about at this point), and a host of other poor argumentative techniques.

1. Mexicans are part of a violent country filled with evil people and they're just trying to flee the country and if it happens to be illegally then oh well, whatever, they need to escape no matter what! Despite being from a violent country though, we can trust they're all good people!

2. Mexicans are part of a country of good people which is why they're good people, they just choose to not legally immigrate because... reasons. But trust me, they're definitely great people and we should be glad to have them over here even if illegally and should definitely not deport them.

The cold sweats over which option is correct are keeping me awake at night!

what are you even talking about. why is it so black and white. who is making these sorts of arguments. how can anyone possibly feel this way.

That's the hilarious conundrum liberals place themselves in. The conservative position is "if you can't come over here legally, don't come over here at all" yet for some dumb reason, bleeding heart liberals label it XENOPHOBIA! Big words sound scary! But they like to ignore the fact that 90% of all countries in the world have very strict immigration laws. Suuure, but America tries to close one border and suddenly we're the bad guys. Denmark, Switzerland, all those praised and lauded European countries have strict immigration laws, but it's okay because they aren't American.

no it isn't lol.

just my opinion, but perhaps a nation that champions itself on being a 'melting pot' (those countries don't), we sure do love keeping people out. and we only have two borders hahahahaha. seriously what are you talking about.

Murica. Ended slavery 150 years before everyone else. Practically wide open borders anyone can enter. Constant televised shows focused on minorities. Minority quotas ensuring they have jobs. Anti hate-speech laws. But yes, we're definitely a nation of xenophobes.

no...no we did not. i highly suggest going back to the books with that one. i can't help you if you actually believe we ended slavery 150 yrs before everyone else.

uh...an actual add i saw on the green and blue metro lines going to la union was "what would master p think of you if you were...slacker! or successful!" what the actual fuck is that shit. (the green/blue lines run through most of the hood in los angeles and is mostly black people just so you know). focusing on minorities doesn't mean people can't be racist, dude. also, affirmative action is a direct result of racism that still exists today.

we host plenty of xenophobes. that's not even a question.

Edited by Phoenix Wright
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Trump is a bigot and he made a bigoted comment. It's not the librul media spinning it or taking it out of context; it is a factually inaccurate statement he made to appeal to his base, and the consequences are his fault.

I live in Southern California where about 90% of the business signs on my street are either in Spanish, Chinese, or both. I'm dating a hispanic man. This makes me more knowledgeable than Klok about an entire ethnicity/community (of which I'm not apart of - whiter than sour cream here) because I said so. I just love hispanic people. I have asian and hispanic friends UP THE WAZOO. And I say he's wrong.

Something something about bleeding heart liberals and SJWs who may call me out on my stupid comment.

In all seriousness this reeks of the typical "I'm not racist, I have black friends!" excuse. And to be honest I don't think you guys even need to write paragraphs and paragraphs about how misinformed that is: it's kind of obvious.

EDIT: damn it Phoenix already did

Edited by Crysta
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God dammit Klokinator, I wasn't going to intervene, but a little part of my history loving heart died a very painful death when you said that we ended slavery 150 years before everyone else. We were behind only Brazil in ending slavery in the Western World. The fucking Ottoman Empire ended slavery before we did. There's also the part where we did to the Indians exactly what Hitler wanted to do to the Soviet Union: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost

So yeah, I'd say America has one of the most bigoted histories imaginable.

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stuff

lol holy shit. do you write your academic papers like this? just curious

@validating acceptance: who cares how much experience you have with mexicans? if you truly were accepting of mexican americans you would not need to validate your position, youd let your argumentation do it for you.

Well, if he has direct experience with the community, if only a small amount limited to his town, and you don't, I think I'd sooner believe him. My own experience with the Latino community has left me thinking that a sizable chunk of them are decent, if loud and annoyingly party-heavy, people.

your exposure to one particular population of a large group consisting of many populations does not give you authority to make generalizations about the group as a whole.

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there's no reason to believe him. he has no evidence of anything he claims (making generalizations requires evidence not personal experience). he's in a very small spot with regards to the entire united states. his views are based off of very little. he needs evidence to back up his claims, which he doesn't have. it would be very silly to simply believe what he says.

Isn't that a logical fallacy? Demanding he provide evidence to back up his claims without also backing up your own claims?

i'm from compton, los angeles, which is predominantly black and has many latinos. i've been to east la a number of times, which is almost 100% latino. i interact with latino people on a daily basis when in uni. i've even been to mexico. you don't see me making sweeping statements about latinos because of my experiences.

That's really all you needed to add; but I should add in that I also deal with hispanics on a daily basis as all the houses around mine are owned by them as well and I regularly shop at a mexican food market. Sure, it may not be as strong as yours, but I don't see why my experiences with mexicans are suddenly invalid while yours are valid either. Besides, aren't you also making a sweeping generalization by claiming that we're wrong and mexicans aren't like our experiences?

we can make generalizations against undocumented immigrants all day, but the fact remains you don't have any evidence to believe all this bs that's being thrown out by trump and his followers.

Firstly, stop with the 'undocumented immigrants' thing. That implies that they're legal and simply didn't get their paperwork filled out. Not that they snuck into the country and broke the law in doing so. Playing word-games in a situation where they shouldn't even exist doesn't make you look smart or accepting. It just makes you look like a whiny brat trying to utilize a dictionary to make their problems go away.
But, more directly, I have evidence in the form of my own experiences with illegal immigrants, their attitudes, and how they've generally dealt with the world around them. Maybe my own experiences are unique to me, but that's fine. We're not some hive mind. You can't claim that my experiences with hispanics are invalid because they only apply to me then turn around and boast that yours are when they're just personal experiences. Now, MAYBE you have more perception due to things like having been to mexico, but that also doesn't make you right. After all, Trump has also probably been to Mexico as well and are you going to claim he's wrong just because?
an important skill is comprehending what is written instead of assigning views to people that don't subscribe to them. where in the heck did i say any of that garbage?
Because it's the only manner in which your own actually holds a point. If the candidates are both corrupt and greedy pointing out how Trump is greedy and claiming Hilary isn't when she's just as greedy is hypocrisy. It's worse if he's less greedy too. So the only way it's a valid accusation is if Hilary is less greedy. And are you SERIOUSLY going to claim THAT without evidence to back it up then turn around and accuse Trump and people who are in favor of him of believing in him without evidence? Like, seriously, dude. Stop and listen to yourself for a moment.
IMO, I don't care really about Trump or Hilary. I'm actually leaning a BIT more towards the former but that's more because Trump's a newcomer and I haven't cared enough to learn his policies yet (wait till the debates start in-ernest) and I'm actually thinking of voting third party/write-in instead. I just really hate it when people tell me that their beliefs are valid when my own experiences are invalid and call me a bigot on-top of it. I don't care about the hispanic community on the whole. My experiences have defined how I view them but that's just fine. My beef is with the illegal immigrants and the people who act like they are still in Mexico and everyone else is the visitor; not Mexicans or hispanics on the whole. I'd rather be called a bigot than deny my own experiences in favor of what someone over the internet says anyways.
your exposure to one particular population of a large group consisting of many populations does not give you authority to make generalizations about the group as a whole.
That's funny. I recall saying that they were my experiences, not my demanding others to believe and accept my own experiences as the factual law. Besides, does that mean your experiences with a particular population of a large group consisting of many populations is, somehow, valid while mine isn't?
Edited by Snowy_One
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i don't even get how his math can work to "150 years before everyone else" since 150 years after the emancipation proclamation would be...oh, TYOOL 2013.

That's funny. I recall saying that they were my experiences, not my demanding others to believe and accept my own experiences as the factual law. Besides, does that mean your experiences with a particular population of a large group consisting of many populations is, somehow, valid while mine isn't?
no one is saying this, would it kill you to make a single post in an argument without strawmanning your opposition and attributing views that your opposition did not even profess?
Edited by I.M. Gei
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Trump is a bigot and he made a bigoted comment. It's not the librul media spinning it or taking it out of context; it is a factually inaccurate statement he made to appeal to his base, and the consequences are his fault.

I live in Southern California where about 90% of the business signs on my street are either in Spanish, Chinese, or both. I'm dating a hispanic man. This makes me more knowledgeable than Klok about an entire ethnicity/community (of which I'm not apart of - whiter than sour cream here) because I said so. I just love hispanic people. I have asian and hispanic friends UP THE WAZOO. And I say he's wrong.

Something something about bleeding heart liberals and SJWs who may call me out on my stupid comment.

In all seriousness this reeks of the typical "I'm not racist, I have black friends!" excuse. And to be honest I don't think you guys even need to write paragraphs and paragraphs about how misinformed that is: it's kind of obvious.

EDIT: damn it Phoenix already did

Please, PLEASE tell me your second paragraph is sarcasm. A lot of personal experience>personal experience? Even when other people are being called out for using personal experience as evidence. And also, you said "because I said so". I'm not sure how you can think of that as a legit argument.

Way to write a serious counterargument in the third paragraph. And the last one is just fine, that 'America ended slavery 150 years before everyone else' was pretty stupid.

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Please, PLEASE tell me your second paragraph is sarcasm. A lot of personal experience>personal experience? Even when other people are being called out for using personal experience as evidence. And also, you said "because I said so". I'm not sure how you can think of that as a legit argument.

Way to write a serious counterargument in the third paragraph. And the last one is just fine, that 'America ended slavery 150 years before everyone else' was pretty stupid.

uh it's pretty obvious from context that she's being sarcastic and taking the piss out of klok's unironic "i'm not racist, i have mexican friends!" comments? i mean, let us go back and read her post again: "In all seriousness this reeks of the typical "I'm not racist, I have black friends!" excuse. And to be honest I don't think you guys even need to write paragraphs and paragraphs about how misinformed that is: it's kind of obvious."

e: reading again, "Something something about bleeding heart liberals and SJWs who may call me out on my stupid comment" is taking the piss out of another aspect of klok's post and the whiny "abloobloo PC SJW thought police keeping me down and violating my first amendment rights" crowd in general; arguments which have little substance to begin with don't particularly warrant a serious counter argument

Edited by I.M. Gei
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why do we have to make this so difficult? if you would just read what i say, not project what you feel i think, this would be much easier.

Isn't that a logical fallacy? Demanding he provide evidence to back up his claims without also backing up your own claims?

i haven't made any claims! i mean, come on, the claim that klok made about his own town (50/50 whites/hispanics) was incorrect, and i showed that.

if i need to back up "some people are good, some are bad," i'm afraid that's being a little (a lot) biased towards klok's views, not his 'arguments.'

That's really all you needed to add; but I should add in that I also deal with hispanics on a daily basis as all the houses around mine are owned by them as well and I regularly shop at a mexican food market. Sure, it may not be as strong as yours, but I don't see why my experiences with mexicans are suddenly invalid while yours are valid either. Besides, aren't you also making a sweeping generalization by claiming that we're wrong and mexicans aren't like our experiences?

everyone deals with hispanics on a daily basis. your experiences with hispanics aren't invalid, your claims about them are. if you believe a word trump says about undocumented immigrants, then you're wrong. let me paint this in the easiest way possible. i am irish and arabic. obviously, i know all there is to know about arabs and the irish (culturally intertwined and whatnot). the irish are swell people that like to have a drink every now and again--the arabs likewise but all of them cheat on their significant others. do you have any reason to believe these claims?

Firstly, stop with the 'undocumented immigrants' thing. That implies that they're legal and simply didn't get their paperwork filled out.

when it comes down to it, ain't that all it really is?

Not that they snuck into the country and broke the law in doing so. Playing word-games in a situation where they shouldn't even exist doesn't make you look smart or accepting. It just makes you look like a whiny brat trying to utilize a dictionary to make their problems go away.

lmfao what dude. is 'undocumented' really a $10k word? klok wants to call them invaders because that's how he feels about them. i don't feel that way about them. aren't i allowed to express that with words?

edit: i think the funniest part of your claiming i'm trying to sound smart is the fact that i write like a very, very poor man's ernest hemingway haha.

But, more directly, I have evidence in the form of my own experiences with illegal immigrants, their attitudes, and how they've generally dealt with the world around them.

not evidence. there's personal accounts of magic, alien abductions, the afterlife, etc. etc. none of that is evidence. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evidence#Evidence_in_science).

your experiences are all well and good. mine are too. but they're not evidence that's useful in making actual claims. maybe you're hanging with your buds pounding back some shots, and one of you says, "goddamn hippies are communists!" you all laugh in agreement. despite you all actually being wrong, it doesn't really matter--you're not really in the setting to discuss the intricacy of hippies and their beliefs. plus, everyone agrees with you anyway. boom--your experiences are verified and served as your evidence.

now, serious discussion isn't always successful, but its aim is clear: to have more thoughtful, respectful, 'serious,' dialogue. a certain level of quality is expected here. it's impossible to have a thoughtful, respectful conversation with you if it's impossible for you to back up your claims and call me a whiny brat when i expect you to. that's breakin the rules!

Maybe my own experiences are unique to me, but that's fine. We're not some hive mind. You can't claim that my experiences with hispanics are invalid because they only apply to me then turn around and boast that yours are when they're just personal experiences. Now, MAYBE you have more perception due to things like having been to mexico, but that also doesn't make you right. After all, Trump has also probably been to Mexico as well and are you going to claim he's wrong just because?

i never did. i never claimed it made me right. you wanna know what claim i made? that klok is wrong. i'm not claiming anything about hispanics. klok has yet to back up his claims, and i doubt he ever will.

Because it's the only manner in which your own actually holds a point. If the candidates are both corrupt and greedy pointing out how Trump is greedy and claiming Hilary isn't when she's just as greedy is hypocrisy. It's worse if he's less greedy too. So the only way it's a valid accusation is if Hilary is less greedy. And are you SERIOUSLY going to claim THAT without evidence to back it up then turn around and accuse Trump and people who are in favor of him of believing in him without evidence? Like, seriously, dude. Stop and listen to yourself for a moment.

no it isn't. saying trump might be greedy doesn't need to extend to the rest of the presidential candidates to be meaningful. klok said trump couldn't be bought--i disagreed and said that his greed may allow him to be bought. we're speaking specifically about trumparooney.

IMO, I don't care really about Trump or Hilary. I'm actually leaning a BIT more towards the former but that's more because Trump's a newcomer and I haven't cared enough to learn his policies yet (wait till the debates start in-ernest) and I'm actually thinking of voting third party/write-in instead. I just really hate it when people tell me that their beliefs are valid when my own experiences are invalid and call me a bigot on-top of it. I don't care about the hispanic community on the whole. My experiences have defined how I view them but that's just fine. My beef is with the illegal immigrants and the people who act like they are still in Mexico and everyone else is the visitor; not Mexicans or hispanics on the whole. I'd rather be called a bigot than deny my own experiences in favor of what someone over the internet says anyways.

i never called you a bigot. if you think trump's views on undocumented immigrants is correct i am, but you've never explicitly said you agree with those views.

@bold: that's the actual problem. you don't think you can actually learn from people over the internet. that's sad, really. the internet has some of the coolest, smartest, most interesting people on it. it's also got a lot of misinformed, prejudiced, hateful people on it, too. but that doesn't mean we've got nothing to learn from them, either. and when it comes to discerning between the two groups, i feel it'll be obvious.

Edited by Phoenix Wright
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uh it's pretty obvious from context that she's being sarcastic and taking the piss out of klok's unironic "i'm not racist, i have mexican friends!" comments? i mean, let us go back and read her post again: "In all seriousness this reeks of the typical "I'm not racist, I have black friends!" excuse. And to be honest I don't think you guys even need to write paragraphs and paragraphs about how misinformed that is: it's kind of obvious."

e: reading again, "Something something about bleeding heart liberals and SJWs who may call me out on my stupid comment" is taking the piss out of another aspect of klok's post and the whiny "abloobloo PC SJW thought police keeping me down and violating my first amendment rights" crowd in general; arguments which have little substance to begin with don't particularly warrant a serious counter argument

That's why I was hoping it was sarcasm. If not, it was a post that hardly even warranted a reply, given the circumstances of the rest of the debate taking place. The tone didn't seem sarcastic, but the material HAD to be.

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I was completely sarcastic.

But it's okay; I've had people believe I was serious before when I went on similar facebook tangents. It was kind of sad, but unlike them you had the right confused response.

EDIT: Meaning you at least didn't agree with me.

Edited by Crysta
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nothing i can add that phoenix hasnt already addressed

Besides, does that mean your experiences with a particular population of a large group consisting of many populations is, somehow, valid while mine isn't?

no, if i made a claim like you did, it would fallacious as well

your exposure to one particular population of a large group consisting of many populations does not give you authority to make generalizations about the group as a whole.
where is my claim? unless you're trying to dispute this statement. i didnt think i had to cite this claim, i'd think you'd have the sense to understand that i am trying to say you cannot judge all mexicans based on the few that you have seen. go ahead a judge the ones you've seen, they seem like assholes anyway. but that has no relevance to current topic
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I was completely sarcastic.

But it's okay; I've had people believe I was serious before when I went on similar facebook tangents. It was kind of sad, but unlike them you had the right confused response.

EDIT: Meaning you at least didn't agree with me.

Ok, that's what I figured. You just didn't type it in the same way I would've if I had said something sarcastic. Just a little misunderstanding on my part.

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Given that Hispanics are now the second largest group in the United States, I would agree that pretty much everyone has interacted with Hispanic people unless they're very sheltered. A question on an issue such as 'Do Hispanics/illegal immigrants commit more crime'? is better answered by looking at data that attempting to extrapolate from your own limited personal experience.

I don't know how people can take Trump seriously after that whole birther nonsense- the man clearly disregards evidence to further his rhetoric. http://www.factcheck.org/2011/04/donald-youre-fired/

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Given that Hispanics are now the second largest group in the United States, I would agree that pretty much everyone has interacted with Hispanic people unless they're very sheltered. A question on an issue such as 'Do Hispanics/illegal immigrants commit more crime'? is better answered by looking at data that attempting to extrapolate from your own limited personal experience.

I don't know how people can take Trump seriously after that whole birther nonsense- the man clearly disregards evidence to further his rhetoric. http://www.factcheck.org/2011/04/donald-youre-fired/

Or you're in one of the few states that doesn't have that many of them (mine). And I fully agree on looking at actual data!

I see Hispanics as any other large group of people - some will have qualities that I like, some will not.

The other cool point from this mess?

@bold: that's the actual problem. you don't think you can actually learn from people over the internet. that's sad, really. the internet has some of the coolest, smartest, most interesting people on it. it's also got a lot of misinformed, prejudiced, hateful people on it, too. but that doesn't mean we've got nothing to learn from them, either. and when it comes to discerning between the two groups, i feel it'll be obvious.

Even if it's someone who lives a different life story, sharing their experiences, it's better than not knowing it at all. That's why, despite the fact that this topic is going eight ways of Idunnowhat (I STRONGLY suggest keeping the generalizations down), I haven't locked it yet.

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Given that Hispanics are now the second largest group in the United States, I would agree that pretty much everyone has interacted with Hispanic people unless they're very sheltered. A question on an issue such as 'Do Hispanics/illegal immigrants commit more crime'? is better answered by looking at data that attempting to extrapolate from your own limited personal experience.

I don't know how people can take Trump seriously after that whole birther nonsense- the man clearly disregards evidence to further his rhetoric. http://www.factcheck.org/2011/04/donald-youre-fired/

to be fair, there are still huge rural swaths of the country that are virtually all-white; koochining county, mn, just to name one, has a hispanic population of just 1.3%; blair county, pa, 1.1%; aroostook county, me, 1.1%; grant county, wv, 1.3%.

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Goddamn it! Every time I see someone use liberal unironically, they get absolutely fucking destroyed. Just once, I want to meet a conservative that Isn't made to be a complete a joke... On topic, I want to give the GOP a chance, but everywhere I look just reinforces just how stupidly inadequate the candidates are and how the party is on the road to self destruction. They are pitiful at this point. It a shame really, as hiliary isn't that great herself from what I hear.

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Goddamn it! Every time I see someone use liberal unironically, they get absolutely fucking destroyed.

I think it's bonus points if they aren't actually a liberal. (even if they are more left-wing than that)

I haven't really been paying attention but Bernie Sanders would probably have my vote if I lived there?

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I think it's bonus points if they aren't actually a liberal. (even if they are more left-wing than that)

I haven't really been paying attention but Bernie Sanders would probably have my vote if I lived there?

sanders' platform is the closest analogue to a pre-blair labour or SNP platform if that's what you're asking

Edited by I.M. Gei
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