General US Politics

[Johann]

17 hours ago, eclipse said:

Our local paper seemed to think otherwise.  But then again. . .it's my local paper.

"Fake" is kind of a vague descriptor, it's more accurate to say those groups are astroturfed.

[eclipse]

Just now, Johann said:

"Fake" is kind of a vague descriptor, it's more accurate to say those groups are astroturfed.

Between the cheap airfares and whatnot, I wouldn't be surprised if a few booked a flight down here, violated quarantine, and did this "protest".

[Shoblongoo]

What if it’s not fake and people really are just that dumb.

(Can we talk about how ~30 thinking adults ingested household cleaning product + The Papers had to put out a PSA ‘Why it’s Important to not Drink Bleach’ after Trump’s ad lib press conference on Thursday) 

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

On 4/25/2020 at 5:21 PM, Shoblongoo said:

(Can we talk about how ~30 thinking adults ingested household cleaning product + The Papers had to put out a PSA ‘Why it’s Important to not Drink Bleach’ after Trump’s ad lib press conference on Thursday) 

"Soap on outside of body good...*turns to doctors* maybe soap inside body also good? Me not know."

[Interdimensional Observer]

On 4/25/2020 at 8:21 PM, Shoblongoo said:

What if it’s not fake and people really are just that dumb.

(Can we talk about how ~30 thinking adults ingested household cleaning product + The Papers had to put out a PSA ‘Why it’s Important to not Drink Bleach’ after Trump’s ad lib press conference on Thursday) 

 

When I read the headline on CNN, I, a person who usually abides by that silly swearing off on ever speaking swear words, immediately vocalized a "What the hell?".

The governor of Maryland said some information hotline of the state received a slew of calls about whether to follow Trump's advice. At least those people called first, is the Poison Control Center going to see a spike in activity?

 

My hypothesis behind Trump's bizarre suggestion is quite simple. Some studies about Hydroxiclean (misspelling intentional) came out a few days before his insane remarks, the studies showing the anti-malarial drug did nothing to help treat COVID19 patients, it might have even been more dangerous.

Trump could've just attacked the studies which disproved the product he was betting a lot on, but instead he shifted to a new snake oil. Why is he peddling serpent fat? Because he wants a CREEP- Cure for the RE-Election of the President. He wants some form of treatment for COVID19 to exist so the problem can go away and he can reopen the economy in-full tomorrow, because he isn't confident in his reelection chances without a good economy. Disinfectant or lupus medicine, Trump wants some poultice to remedy his fears.

Edited April 27, 2020 by Interdimensional Observer

[eclipse]

14 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

When I read the headline on CNN, I, a person who usually abides by that silly swearing off on ever speaking swear words, immediately vocalized a "What the hell?".

The governor of Maryland said some information hotline of the state received a slew of calls about whether to follow Trump's advice. At least those people called first, is the Poison Control Center going to see a spike in activity?

I'm proud of the fact that those people had the foresight to ask first.  Instead of just doing it, and putting even more of a burden on hospitals.

[Dr. Tarrasque]

5 hours ago, eclipse said:

I'm proud of the fact that those people had the foresight to ask first.  Instead of just doing it, and putting even more of a burden on hospitals.

And that's sad. 

 

Apparently Biden's lead in key states is less than what Hillary Clinton previously had... beautiful.

[XRay]

3 hours ago, Dr. Tarrasque said:

Apparently Biden's lead in key states is less than what Hillary Clinton previously had... beautiful.

Oof. That does not sound good. Sounds like a tricky situation where Biden needs to pick a centrist VP to better secure the middle while also needing to pick a more left VP to secure the far left of the party.

Maybe it might be better if he talks about installing both centrist and far left people into the cabinet more instead of focusing so much on the VP position.

[Excellen Browning]

On 4/25/2020 at 10:22 PM, eclipse said:

Between the cheap airfares and whatnot, I wouldn't be surprised if a few booked a flight down here, violated quarantine, and did this "protest".

"It was crisis actors"

Stay classy, eclipse

[XRay]

10 minutes ago, Excellen Browning said:

"It was crisis actors"

Stay classy, eclipse

That is actually kind of ironic. The far right was dismissing mass shooting protesters as paid actors, but we could also do the same and dismiss the quarantine protestors as paid actors.

[eclipse]

7 hours ago, Excellen Browning said:

"It was crisis actors"

Stay classy, eclipse

 

6 hours ago, XRay said:

That is actually kind of ironic. The far right was dismissing mass shooting protesters as paid actors, but we could also do the same and dismiss the quarantine protestors as paid actors.

Alright, you two.  I have a little homework assignment for you.

Post Hawaii's racial profile.  Then, post the history of immigration of Hawaii.

After that, I expect an apology.

[XRay]

8 minutes ago, eclipse said:

Post Hawaii's racial profile.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/states/hawaii-population/

Asian: 37.75%
White: 25.01%
Two or more races: 24.03%
Native Hawaiian or Pacific Islander: 10.08%
Black or African American: 1.85%
Other race: 1.08%
Native American: 0.21%

9 minutes ago, eclipse said:

Then, post the history of immigration of Hawaii.

https://www.hawaiimagazine.com/content/hawaiis-rainbow-cultures-and-how-they-got-islands

Much of the immigration came from Asia, with some also coming from Portugal and Puerto Rico.

10 minutes ago, eclipse said:

After that, I expect an apology.

I do not mind apologizing, but I would like to know what I am apologizing for, since I do not think I have done anything wrong. I also do not see the purpose in researching Hawaii's demographics and immigration history.

@Excellen Browning and I were drawing parallels between the far right accusing the left of using paid actors while we think the far right might actually be the ones to use paid actors because the actions of the quarantine protestors are just so stupid. It is possible some fraction of them are real idiots and think COVID-19 is a joke, but there is also the possibility that some of them are paid to protest.

[eclipse]

Just now, XRay said:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/states/hawaii-population/

Asian: 37.75%
White: 25.01%
Two or more races: 24.03%
Native Hawaiian or Pacific Islander: 10.08%
Black or African American: 1.85%
Other race: 1.08%
Native American: 0.21%

https://www.hawaiimagazine.com/content/hawaiis-rainbow-cultures-and-how-they-got-islands

Much of the immigration came from Asia, with some also coming from Portugal and Puerto Rico.

I do not mind apologizing, but I would like to know what I am apologizing for, since I do not think I have done anything wrong. I also do not see the purpose in researching Hawaii's demographics and immigration history.

@Excellen Browning and I were drawing parallels between the far right accusing the left of using paid actors while we think the far right might actually be the ones to use paid actors because the actions of the quarantine protestors are just so stupid. It is possible some fraction of them are real idiots and think COVID-19 is a joke, but there is also the possibility that some of them are paid to protest.

Redo the history section, because a thorough read into the subject will tell you where you fucked up.

[XRay]

39 minutes ago, eclipse said:

Redo the history section, because a thorough read into the subject will tell you where you fucked up.

I prefer a little more direction than just being told to research the subject. Any links to relevant articles would help.

I have read/skimmed these so far and I still have no clue about the relationship between COVID-19 quarantine protestors and Hawaii's immigration.
https://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/topic/2720-a-brief-immigrant-timeline-for-hawaii/
https://www.hawaii.edu/uhwo/clear/home/HawaiiLaborHistory.html
https://immigrationtounitedstates.org/541-hawaii.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Hawaii
http://www.hawaiihistory.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=ig.page&PageID=316&returntoname=Short
http://www.hawaiihistory.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=ig.page&PageID=299
https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/History_of_Hawaii/Missionaries_Sugar_Immigration

That is most of the relevant links on the first page of Google I found when searching "hawaii immigration history" and "immigration to hawaii timeline."

Edited April 29, 2020 by XRay

[eclipse]

3 minutes ago, XRay said:

I prefer a little more direction than just being told to research the subject. Any links to relevant articles would help.

I have read/skimmed these so far and I still have no clue about the relationship between COVID-19 quarantine protestors and Hawaii's immigration.
https://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/topic/2720-a-brief-immigrant-timeline-for-hawaii/
https://www.hawaii.edu/uhwo/clear/home/HawaiiLaborHistory.html
https://immigrationtounitedstates.org/541-hawaii.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Hawaii
http://www.hawaiihistory.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=ig.page&PageID=316&returntoname=Short
http://www.hawaiihistory.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=ig.page&PageID=299
https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/History_of_Hawaii/Missionaries_Sugar_Immigration

That is most of the relevant links on the first page of Google I found when searching "hawaii immigration history" and "immigration to hawaii timeline."

The first part about the racial profile was for you to get an idea of what kind of people live here.  Notice the emphasis on Asians in general?  Many of the "two or more races" most likely have some sort of Asian in there.

The second part involves the interactions between the races during those years where plantation workers came over.  Those kinds of attitudes don't die overnight.  Or ever, given the nonsense that was "how Hawaii became part of the US" and World War II.

Thus, Hawaii's culture pulls towards Asian, thanks to the ancestry of those whose ancestors were plantation workers.  Racial attitudes take a long time to die.  And we have news stories like this, which shows the marked difference in attitude between those that come in, and those that are here already (face masks were common before they became required in certain places).

Which means whoever bucks the general attitudes in Hawaii stands out like a sore thumb (they tend to be not happy here, and for the life of me, I can't figure out why).  Such as being self-centered and demanding that the state open up, despite the fact that there's a lot of elderly here.

[XRay]

17 minutes ago, eclipse said:

The first part about the racial profile was for you to get an idea of what kind of people live here.  Notice the emphasis on Asians in general?  Many of the "two or more races" most likely have some sort of Asian in there.

The second part involves the interactions between the races during those years where plantation workers came over.  Those kinds of attitudes don't die overnight.  Or ever, given the nonsense that was "how Hawaii became part of the US" and World War II.

Thus, Hawaii's culture pulls towards Asian, thanks to the ancestry of those whose ancestors were plantation workers.  Racial attitudes take a long time to die.  And we have news stories like this, which shows the marked difference in attitude between those that come in, and those that are here already (face masks were common before they became required in certain places).

Which means whoever bucks the general attitudes in Hawaii stands out like a sore thumb (they tend to be not happy here, and for the life of me, I can't figure out why).  Such as being self-centered and demanding that the state open up, despite the fact that there's a lot of elderly here.

@Excellen Browning and I are not condoning quarantine protesters though? And I am not sure I see how race is involved in quarantine protests. If race factors into anything at all, quarantine protesters I see on television and YouTube are middle-aged/old white people and usually Republican, not Asians.

While the news article you mentioned features an Asian couple, they do not seem to be part of an organized protest where people are gathering around in close proximity to each other in front of government buildings. What the Asian couple did was pretty freaking stupid, but quarantine protestor are like a thousand times worse since they are huddling together in a crowd breathing down each other's necks.

[eclipse]

1 minute ago, XRay said:

@Excellen Browning and I are not condoning quarantine protesters though? And I am not sure I see how race is involved in quarantine protests. If race factors into anything at all, quarantine protesters I see on television and YouTube are middle-aged/old white people and usually Republican, not Asians.

While the news article you mentioned features an Asian couple, they do not seem to be part of an organized protest where people are gathering around in close proximity to each other in front of government buildings. What the Asian couple did was pretty freaking stupid, but quarantine protestor are like a thousand times worse since they are huddling together in a crowd breathing down each other's necks.

Want to take a stab at who got the highlight spot in our paper for the protests?

And what kind of mindset would it take to flagrantly ignore the quarantine orders?  Or protest the quarantine?

[Excellen Browning]

1 hour ago, eclipse said:

 

Alright, you two.  I have a little homework assignment for you.

Post Hawaii's racial profile.  Then, post the history of immigration of Hawaii.

After that, I expect an apology.

Heh. You're taking a mild hearted jab about as seriously as I guess I should have expected you to.

 

But I'll entertain you. If you think there aren't any crazy rightists on Hawaii, you're sorely mistaken. The fact that 80% of the population votes dem means that 20% votes republican.

[XRay]

7 minutes ago, eclipse said:

Want to take a stab at who got the highlight spot in our paper for the protests?

I assume it is an Asian person since you wanted me to look up Hawaii's demographics.

Race is the not the first thing that people think about though when people talk about quarantine protests. But since race does get mentioned right now for whatever reason, I imagine most Americans to be picturing old and middle aged white MAGA people who are doing the protests, not Asian people protesting.

11 minutes ago, eclipse said:

And what kind of mindset would it take to flagrantly ignore the quarantine orders?  Or protest the quarantine?

I honestly have no clue outside of people simply being idiots. The only other theory we are speculating is that while some of the protesters are probably complete dumbasses, there might be a portion of them who are being paid to protest. Not all protesters are complete idiots and many of them do respect the quarantine orders and protest in their cars instead being part of the crowd.

If the protesters in the cars have the brains to actually stay in their cars and know the importance of following quarantine orders, then why the hell are they protesting in the first place other than being paid to do it?

[eclipse]

17 minutes ago, Excellen Browning said:

Heh. You're taking a mild hearted jab about as seriously as I guess I should have expected you to.

 

But I'll entertain you. If you think there aren't any crazy rightists on Hawaii, you're sorely mistaken. The fact that 80% of the population votes dem means that 20% votes republican.

You'll have to learn how to aim better, since it's clear that you have no clue what is acceptable as humor.

And no, it doesn't mean that 20% votes Republican, because there's these things called "third parties".  I'm well aware that there's a nonzero number of Republicans in Hawaii.  I'm also not ignorant enough to automatically assume their political party.  I can somewhat safely assume that there's a nonzero number of white people, since they were nice enough to talk to my local newspaper.

1 minute ago, XRay said:

I assume it is an Asian person since you wanted me to look up Hawaii's demographics.

Race is the not the first thing that people think about though when people talk about quarantine protests. But since race does get mentioned right now for whatever reason, I imagine most Americans to be picturing old and middle aged white MAGA people who are doing the protests, not Asian people protesting.

White couple was interviewed and pictured.  Someone with a Japanese last name was also interviewed, but race is a little trickier with women, thanks to traditional last-name conventions.

In a small twist of irony, the Costco customer interviewed also had a last name that's generally associated with someone that's white.  Said person was. . .less than thrilled with the protestors.

3 minutes ago, XRay said:

I honestly have no clue outside of people simply being idiots. The only other theory we are speculating is that while some of the protesters are probably complete dumbasses, there might be a portion of them who are being paid to protest. Not all protesters are complete idiots and many of them do respect the quarantine orders and protest in their cars instead being part of the crowd.

If the protesters in the cars have the brains to actually stay in their cars and know the importance of following quarantine orders, then why the hell are they protesting in the first place other than being paid to do it?

Some really are that unhappy with life.

Anyway, the general mentality you'd need to disobey this kind of law (especially with that one couple that wound up being kicked out) is that your needs are more important than stopping this virus.  Which has a suspicious amount of overlap with the mentality of those who are protesting.  Plane fares to Hawaii are extremely low right now.  I wouldn't be surprised if we had a few knuckleheads of our own that think that way, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone pitched the idea, and "Hawaii vacation with protest" sounded really good.

[Lord Raven]

I don't know how many of them are paid actors, but as far as I'm aware there was a major targeted astroturfing movement on Facebook and other social media that probably did get a lot of locals in on it. Paid actors is not outside of the realm of possibility, but targeting locals is well within the realm of possibility. There's no reason both can't be true.

At least it's not like the bullshit in Michigan that ended the lockdown there. I used to be really sympathetic, but people's refusal to listen to experts and Trump's stoking of anger really made me give less of a shit, especially when some pastors are trying to take people's Trumpbucks. And let's not forget that one dude who is protesting his house arrest by forcing many armed followers to defend him or some shit.

Joe, please save us.

[Rezzy]

Illinois's lockdown was extended to the end of May, and Leo's school got cancelled until the end of the school year. 

@Lord Raven long time no see, how have you been?

[Excellen Browning]

Trump 2020 can't come soon enough.

[Lord Raven]

2 hours ago, Rezzy said:

Illinois's lockdown was extended to the end of May, and Leo's school got cancelled until the end of the school year. 

@Lord Raven long time no see, how have you been?

I'm exhausted and I drove cross country to an internship in Ohio to help me get some stuff before the final year of my PhD. COVID hit and I drove back to Maryland to take care of my dad (the base was closed and my parents house is ridiculously inert, so it was probably the best option), so my last 3-4 weeks have been nothing but that. So, exhausted and stressed, but at least I'm saving money.

49 minutes ago, Excellen Browning said:

Trump 2020 can't come soon enough.

Trump is fucked for 2020, short of some bullshit with the mail-in infrastructure. The Michigan lockdowns all but ensure Michigan goes to Biden and 2016 was an outlier. There's going to be a second wave of COVID because these dumbass governors are opening back up and Trump is going to continue to show why he's a fucking incompetent moron and how his recklessness is gonna cause at least 1000 deaths a day. Fox news having absolute witch cunts like Dr. Oz saying "it's ok only 2-3% of the kids will die when we send them to school" talk at length and the whole injecting bleach bullshit is going to absolutely murder Trump. The reason why it's different now compared to 2016 is because the ever-infallible white male is his opponent and not Hillary "literally Hitler except Raven actually loves her" Clinton.

Polling is also currently making Texas purple and Biden is pulling ahead of Trump in Florida. Either way, fuck that Trump 2020 bullshit, I'm doing everything I can to vote Biden 2020 and I'm genuinely excited for a Joe Biden / Stacey Abrams or Tammy Duckworth ticket (idk those are the two running mates I have in mind). I genuinely currently believe (at the risk of female sexual assault victims coming at me over this) that the sexual assault allegation from T. Reade are targeted well-shitting, and that Reade is either conflating a separate incident with Biden for political expediency or something else entirely. I don't think it'll stick, given their extremely well thought-out response.

Anyway I'm genuinely excited for the Biden ticket because he extended an olive branch to the many candidates on the field and his strong endorsement from Sanders and Warren were really heartwarming amidst everything going on. He absorbed parts of the Sanders campaign and he wants to incorporate Pete/Warren/Klobuchar/etc into his platform policy-wise.

 

(Also since I don't post here anymore much I should point out that Warren was far and away my #1 choice this year) 

Edited May 4, 2020 by Lord Raven

[Excellen Browning]

I'm genuinely not excited for Biden. He's a mewling centrist, a known shill for the health insurance industry, and he needs to stop touching and kissing people inappropriately. I'd still vote for him though.