My life is officially...

[Percivalé]

i was told not to read this but i did

i actually just found out hours ago one of my friends died of cancer and i've been crying all night about it

it paralyzes me to know this kind of thing happens to people and there's nothing we can really do about it and i'm sorry. we're never prepared for suicide. suicide is a weird thing. i've struggled with the urges. they make you think no one will care even if they DO. and that's fucking terrifying. i got the call saying my childhood friend, like a brother to my sister and me, was in the hospital from an attempted suicide. and even though he turned out okay, i had no fucking idea! i had no idea he was even thinking about it! and now i'm constantly terrified of him attempting again. like, if i haven't heard from him in a while, it just smashes my paranoia button so bad! so bad!!

no one should ever have to experience this. people should never have to feel like they should die and people should never have to experience a loved one's suicide, or attempt. all i can say is i'm sorry. i know it might be hard, it's been hard for me but please talk to people you know you trust. anyone. anyone that is willing to talk with you about it, please talk to them. let it out. it's going to hurt for a while and i'm really sorry, but time will make it hurt less. i have confidence in you and i believe in you. but don't be afraid of counseling or therapy or looking to friends if you need it, please.

i'm no expert and i haven't experienced anything quite like this but i'm always here to vent to. and that goes for EVERYONE. please.

[Avarice Shadow]

I'm so sorry that such a terrible thing has happened to you and your family... I couldn't possibly understand how you are feeling right now. But I would suggest seeking help from a professional so you can speak or vent to. And if you have a close friend that you feel comfortable speaking with, you should vent to them as well.

Another important thing is that I think you should be with your family so you all can support one another. I really hope you and your family will be able to get through this together.

[Water Mage]

First of all, my deepest sympathies, this is something no one should go throught.

But don't ever think your life is over.

I'm sure your brother wouldn't want that.

My grandma once said to me that the best way to honor someone's memory is to simply live.

She said that we should live a long and fuffiling life for the sake of our lost loved ones.

Of course mourning is still important. Things may seem bleak now, but it will get better, trust me on that.

If I said that offends you, I apologize, I just want help you in the same way people helped me when I lost someone important.

Again I'm deeply sorry for your loss.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Water Mage

[Nym]

... *playing ID sorrow*

​I​ don't really think I am well placed to speak because I never had a sibling and quite still young but like the others I offer my condolences to you and I hope you and your family can go through this.

But don't blame yourself, you are not responsible for your brother's choice. You have your own life but if you keep thinking about him without thinking about what he did, he will never really truly die.

I know this very repetitive but if you manage to read my post and all the posts before me, you have surely realize that plenty of members are already here to support you and more will post here after me for supporting you too even more.

[Anacybele]

Sorry for the late reply, my phone died... But wow, thanks for all the support, guys. It really means a lot. I honestly didn't think I'd get much considering some of my history here.

But major thanks, seriously.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Anacybele

[Shrouded In Myth]

I've been a lurker for the longest time, so you don't really know me, but I am familiar with you. I actually do enjoy reading your posts from time to time so since you've given me some joy I want to offer my condolences. I'm not the proper person to talk about this, that would be a professional, but I do want to say one thing; let your emotions out, there is no shame in it. It is time to mourn. Be strong.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Shrouded In Myth

[Original Alear]

I'm so sorry this happened to you. I used to be suicidal, hopefully won't be again, thankfully my family and friends were extremely supportive while I was. I know a lot of other people have said it, but I want to echo the suggestions that you talk about how you're feeling and seek out support.

[Vashiane]

Oh my gosh, Ana... I'm so terribly sorry that this happened. You and your family have all of my condolences, and if you need anything just ask and I'll try to help.

Support is definitely a good idea, and I highly recommend you and your loved ones seek some out as soon as possible.

[Carter]

That's horrible... I'm so sorry, Ana. I wish I could lend you help, but I have no experience in this sort of situation. It's truly heartbreaking just to hear, and I cannot imagine what it was like for you to witness it... if this is bugging you, please seek help! If you want to vent or just need someone to talk to, I'll be there too!

[Azz]

My condolences to you and your family.

I beg of you to go see someone, whether they be a professional or not.Please talk to someone.Not too long ago I had some pretty scary thoughts about stuff like this as I was still trying to get over my sister's death.

Again I am deeply sorry.

[Anacybele]

You guys are all so awesome... Thanks...

I'd make longer responses, but it's harder to type on my phone than my laptop. But thanks...

[Yari]

I'm not that good with this kind of things but I just want to say that it will hurt for a lot of time but one day you'll wake up and it won't hurt at all. Of course there will be days when you'll feel sad about it but as long as you remember the good times you had with your brother, you'll be alright! I know it doesn't feel like it now but you will!

[Dwalin2010]

My sincere condolences. I have never been through such a situation, never seen dead people, not even strangers, much less close relatives, but I am so extremely sorry for what happened. Unfortunately I don't know how to help in such a horrible situation, but you have all my sympathy and support.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Dwalin2010

[Sentacotus]

Ana...I can't say how sorry I'am for you having to go through this. Suicide is always something that impacts the people left behind the most and I can't imagine how hard its been on you lately. As someone who has had personal experience with suicide this really hit home. I can offer you a few things that helped me through my situation.

1. Don't for a second think you did anything wrong or that God is punishing you. I won't get too religious or anything on here but just know that God has good things planned for you even if you can't see it now.

2. Seek a psychologist (professional counselor I'd recommend someone who does private practice if its within your means) or even a psychiatrist (Doctor can prescribe medication) something this traumatizing needs professional help.

3. Confiding in family is good and it sounds like your neighbors are there for you which is even better. Try the best you can to stay active. Again I know easier said than done.

4. Don't be afraid to open up about this. As hard as it might be most people even those you don't necessarily get along with wouldn't wish this on anyone. Telling them about it lets them know where you are coming from and holding that kind of stuff inside is almost never a good thing.

If you want to talk about it more and I can even tell you more about what I went through in PMs. Again I can't tell you how sorry I'am Ana.

[Borz]

I am going to be the horrible, evil person who commits forum social suicide by strongly, strongly disagreeing with something someone has said while they were going through a traumatic experience without coating it in heaps of sugar.

This post is directed at everyone who posted so far, however.

"Suicide is never the answer." and other such disgusting, feel-good, thought-terminating cliches are incredibly insulting to the intelligence of actual suicidal people.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrzuKgm1VUg

"Having been there, I've since talked to people who have either been suicidal or in one person who was actively considering suicide and I found that the most...how should I say...the most productive conversations I've ever had with them were the ones where I wasn't the next presumptuous prick trying to impose an interpretation of their feelings. I think that's what made the conversation productive because that's what I was looking for when I was in my moments. I just wanted to meet one person, one other person that could express a level of compassion and understanding that...I guess could only be described as hitting the right frequency. It's communicating in a way that conveyed a genuine desire to understand as opposed to...I guess...just trying to be the next stock concern-face that comes off the factory line. Not trying to be the individual that tries to play the hero without actually listening to you, I guess you could say."

"What makes, I think, suicide such a foreign concept to so many people is that people don't really see it as a rational decision reached by rational people. But that's the scary part-it is, in many ways, rational. It's a horrible decision, but it's a horrible decision reached by a rational train of thought.

That's what makes it terrifying. The decision to not exist anymore has to be by nature one you think through very carefully. And the decision to not exist anymore is also something foreign to other people because a lot of people do have lives they enjoy..."

"It's very much a cost-benefit analysis where you look at the world around you and you say: "I could continue living in an enviroment that I'm not compatible with and deal with the drudgery of life for god knows how many years or I could take this one extra step off the building and none of it has to be my problem anymore."

"Suicide is never the answer!" "Somewhere, someone cares!" "It gets better!" "Talk to your loved ones!" "Seek help from a professional!"

These are all naive, ignorant, thoughtless canned responses. It is better to say nothing than spout this tripe in the presence of a suicidal person.

"Suicide is never the answer!":Would you say that to a person trapped in a Nazi concentration camp? If not, then you draw the line somewhere and the only debate you can have is where to draw it. Ergo, suicide can be the answer. If you would, you're an immoral person who would prefer that they suffer instead of ending their misery. Next.

"Somewhere, someone cares!": Let's assume for a bit that that's true. What then? If they're on the other side of the world, it doesn't matter. They can't do shit unless they care enough to put their life on hold for one person, and even then they might not be able to help you. If this caring person is physically close, then why don't they help this suicidal person who they care so much about? Because they don't know? If they aren't at least aware of the emotional state of the person they care so much about to some degree, then they haven't formed a connection with them and probably can't, otherwise they would have by now. Because they can't? Then their presence is almost irrelevant when it comes to the decision to commit suicide.

Now let's remove the false assumption. It is naive to believe that every person is cared about. It is very, very likely, almost certain that there is a person in the world who could care about them, but if they'll never meet them and form a connection with them then it doesn't matter. I could probably say more and express myself better, but I don't think I need to. Next.

"It gets better!": Let's assume this is true. So? If it doesn't get good, then it doesn't matter. Discarding the assumption, it could very well get worse. You're telling them to gamble with their suffering. Next.

"Talk to your loved ones!": Have you absolutely no sense of perspective? Are you just that ignorant? Has it ever crossed your mind that they might be suicidal because they have no loved ones? Maybe you're under the misguided assumption that being related by blood automatically makes someone a loved one? Their family could very well be the problem, but that doesn't cross your mind because you just reached for a canned response. You assume something is wrong with the suicidal person. The world around them is just fine! Something is wrong with them, and that's why they should...

"Seek help from a professional!": "Professionals" often make things horribly worse. They will always assume that something is wrong with you and not the world around you, and even if you explain to them the problem is not with you, they will insist you change yourself. Bothered that you're forced to cover your entire body except your eyes when you go outside? Learn to like it like the other women.

I'm not saying mental health professionals are bad people. I'm just saying they can't do shit when the problem is not with you, as it more often than not isn't when it comes to suicide. When they thoughtlessly try to fix something by attacking the symptoms instead of the cause, they cause harm, sometimes to a great extent.

And finally, the OP's two statements are just horrible. " Suicide only causes others pain. DON'T FUCKING DO IT."

Suicide relieves them of their pain. That's the point. You're telling them they should suffer further just so others don't have to suffer for a while. It's self-centered.

[RidellCrimea]

My condolences, this is truly a terrible experience. I'm sorry I can't offer you any advice since I've never gone through such situation and I've never seen a dead person myself. I also have a younger brother who I love dearly, and hate/pity him due to his certain habits sometimes, but I really couldn't imagine what would become of me if he was to leave like that. All in all, please be strong. I know these kinds of experience are bound to leave a scar and may never truly be healed, but it'll get better as time passes. And if you ever need to speak your mind, the forums are all ears.

Replying to the above post, I agree with some of your points but now is not the time.

Edited August 16, 2015 by RidellCrimea

[Lord Raven]

*snip*

I'm curious if you understand the idea of right place and right time, because you've gotten both horribly wrong.

There's a time and a place for this kind of post. A thread about a woman mourning her brother's suicide is not either. If you wanna be an emotionally detached and callous 14 year old, by all means, just don't do it to kick someone while they're down.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Lord Raven

[Borz]

I'm curious if you understand the idea of right place and right time, because you've gotten both horribly wrong.

There's a time and a place for this kind of post. A thread about a woman mourning her brother's suicide is not either. If you wanna be an emotionally detached and callous 14 year old, by all means, just don't do it to kick someone while they're down.

If you haven't noticed, this is in Serious Discussion.

- Serious Discussion is not your personal soap-box to come to for validation, do not hope nor expect to "preach to the choir". You will be interacting with others, many of whom may not share your viewpoint. If you cannot handle disagreement in a respectful and mature fashion, this is not the place for your post.

- If you want to contribute to an ongoing discussion, please make sure you can provide some logic to back up your case. This isn't the place for groundless claims, no matter how impassioned you can make you pleas appear to be.

The only thing you could argue I did wrong was not striking the middle ground between sugar-coating and hostility.

Emotionally detached? The reason I replied was because this means so much to me. Don't assume my intentions and character.

[Azz]

If you haven't noticed, this is in Serious Discussion.

- Serious Discussion is not your personal soap-box to come to for validation, do not hope nor expect to "preach to the choir". You will be interacting with others, many of whom may not share your viewpoint. If you cannot handle disagreement in a respectful and mature fashion, this is not the place for your post.

- If you want to contribute to an ongoing discussion, please make sure you can provide some logic to back up your case. This isn't the place for groundless claims, no matter how impassioned you can make you pleas appear to be.

The only thing you could argue I did wrong was not striking the middle ground between sugar-coating and hostility.

Emotionally detached? The reason I replied was because this means so much to me. Don't assume my intentions and character.

I don't want to start an argument in a topic such as this, but I feel the need to bring some things up.

Really, yes I do agree with some points in your post.Suicide is what helps people who are suicidal get relief from their pain and yes more often then not, things get worse.However, the way you posted was just such a horrible thing to do.For something that means so much to you, you showed no remorse in you post what so ever.Yes this is serious discussion, yes there will be disagreements, but again, sometimes, if you disagree with something, sometimes it is just better to keep your mouth shut in such as case as this.

Like Lord Raven and RidellCrimea, there is a place and time for everything, this is certainly not the place nor time to be such a heartless dick, excuse my language.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Azz01

[Lord Raven]

Man, this is not in serious discussion because this was meant to be a debate, this is in serious discussion because the situation is serious.

Emotionally detached? The reason I replied was because this means so much to me. Don't assume my intentions and character.

Coulda fooled me. I've never heard of anyone going into a thread about a tragedy and basically writing an entire essay on why her way of mourning was flawed. (EDIT: Actually, it's the internet, someone's gonna be doing it, but it doesn't make it any less of a bad idea).

At the risk of sounding too presumptuous - which I really honestly don't care about, clearly - I know Anacybele is not someone who stays up late and this thread was posted at 3am from her phone not long after the incident in question happened. If you wanna make another thread about this eviscerating her notions, then fine, but you have chosen the wrong time and wrong place to make this post and frankly you are posting this less than 12 hours after she found out her brother died.

You are also trivializing her emotions to a pretty considerable degree, and you are also stating that you don't care that you are acting as the villain or the bad guy which makes your post seem 10000x worse.

You don't wanna be all sentimental, emotional, and supportive? Fine. But don't go raining down logic all over things the OP said after an actually traumatizing sight. I don't think this was meant for anything but a cry for support. If what you posted is exactly what Serious Discussion is about then I guess this probably doesn't belong in there huh?

Balcerzak's thread may as well be renamed "Debate pointers" because Serious Discussion isn't purely about debates nor are there any additional "rules" posted in there. Serious Discussion is actually about the following:

Serious topics should be discussed here. Be very careful of your actions here, breaking the rules will be taken VERY seriously in here.

Common sense and basic social awareness is all you really need to apply here.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Lord Raven

[Jedi]

. Don't assume my intentions and character.

Ah yes, but you see. We know your character just from your post.

You're a 14 year old who has no heart and thinks he's mentally superior to everyone and doesn't care about stomping on peoples tragedies because he has never experienced anything like this and thinks he has "knowledge" to.

So get the fuck out.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Jedi

[Anacybele]

I'm just going to say this: I don't need bullshit right now, so go the fuck away, Borz. I saw my brother's fucking lifeless body and his blood and brains around his head. I am traumatized for LIFE.

And for the record, I know suicide rids a person of their pain, but you obviously missed the part where I said there are people who care and can help depression heal withOUT anyone dying. Why rid your pain for yourself when it would cause others pain? THAT is what's fucking selfish!

[Tryhard]

I'm really sorry, Ana. I'm not really sure what to say.

I know that you said you didn't have the best relationship with your brother, but unfortunately it can often happen to people who you would never expect it to happen to.

Borz, you should at least develop enough empathy to not spout your self-righteous bullshit after someone has been through the experience before the body has even been buried. You're a piece of shit for doing that, and I hope you learn in future.

[Balcerzak]

Alright folks. Recent posters, let's take a step back and think about what we've done here.

Balcerzak's thread may as well be renamed "Debate pointers" because Serious Discussion isn't purely about debates nor are there any additional "rules" posted in there. Serious Discussion is actually about the following:

This is a fairly solid point.

Gonna take a closer look here at some specific posts. But please no reason for this to get messy.

[Original Alear]

And finally, the OP's two statements are just horrible. " Suicide only causes others pain. DON'T FUCKING DO IT."

Suicide relieves them of their pain. That's the point. You're telling them they should suffer further just so others don't have to suffer for a while. It's self-centered.

I know you mentioned the possibility of someone who has no loved ones or people close to them, but in this case, don't you think that committing suicide regardless of the feelings of those around you can be construed as "self-centered" as well? I'm not necessarily opposed to suicide in every case, but I think it's OK for people to be self-centered to a certain degree. At the same time, it's natural that people have responsibilities for each other. I think the conflict between the individual's responsibility to the family and the family's responsibility to the individual isn't well articulated enough in your post for you to be so committed to your conclusions.

Also, finding rare exceptions to the rule (nazi concentration camp) is not really an effective way to deal with this issue. Ana did say "NEVER" but you seem to be acting like just because you thought of a tough case, you've completely demolished arguments against suicide.

"Seek help from a professional!": "Professionals" often make things horribly worse. They will always assume that something is wrong with you and not the world around you, and even if you explain to them the problem is not with you, they will insist you change yourself. Bothered that you're forced to cover your entire body except your eyes when you go outside? Learn to like it like the other women.

All professionals I've worked with for more a substantial period of time (more than one or 2 sessions of some kind with them) actually did talk about the environment around me, especially how I get along with family, friends, etc. They often encourage people to seek out support, but when I've seen others working with professionals in group settings, the professionals are typically cognizant of the fact that the environment may not be germane for the person they are dealing with, and they try to help change that. Edited August 16, 2015 by Severian