Any guilty confessions?

[RPGatWill]

My guilty confessions:

I spoiled most of the game for myself on all the paths.

On my first playthrough, most pairings I'll think I've planned wil likely never happen and it'll just kinda be whoever and whatever.

Later on, I will establish my 'cannon' pairings base don how the children act and which mother's would most contribute to that behavior (Same thing I did in awakening).

[Zerosabers]

The only reason I got Hoshido was because Kinu.

[Sunwoo]

Now, I think it's time for some of my confessions:

-I joined here because of the FE14 hype train

-I freely admit to over-reacting when several of the Famitsu issues dropped

-When marriage and kids were confirmed, I was so ticked off that I changed my username (anybody remember "Leon of Nohr"? That guy who made that stupid weapon/spell merging topic? That's me)

-I started liking Leon as soon as I saw the Dark Knight sprite on the bridge in the announcement trailer

-I like Takumi, but I think most of the people who like him like him more out of the way the game treats him than his actual character traits

What exactly does this mean?

[Time the Crestfallen]

Reverse psychology? About how all the characters the game portrays as shining golden paragons aren't especially popular, but the one character who gets treated as 'wrong' and at fault simply for not worshiping the Avatar is the most popular in the game?

[Minischew]

-I like Takumi, but I think most of the people who like him like him more out of the way the game treats him than his actual character traits

Huh, I didn't think of it that way, but that actually seems true. A lot of people say something along the lines of "I appreciate how Takumi doesn't hero worship," but don't actually talk much about his personality.

[Sunwoo]

Eh, I will say this about Takumi. I do like that he doesn't worship the avatar and even suspects them, and I think he gets dealt a shitty hand in Nohr. But I like him for his character as well, his personality and traits. He feels a lot more realistic and complex, and is one of the few characters in Fates who actually feels like they could be a real person. His issues and insecurities are things you see real people have. And I like him for being more "down to earth" and far from perfect.

[The DanMan]

What exactly does this mean?

Basically what Phillius said; Takumi has topped Japanese popularity polls (and is very popular here), but most people seem to be doing it at least partially to say "up yours, IS" for their general bastardization of him in the Nohr route.

I'm not saying there aren't other things to like about him at all; it's just seems that he's popular because of (to quote amielleon's tumblr) his "squishbaby tendencies" and poor plot treatment.

I like him for the same reasons you do; I just really don't see those reasons talked about.

[Alazen]

Takumi is too tainted by what happens to him for me to be so supportive. Especially considering how Shinon did his shtick better.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Alazen

[Verdande]

Basically what Phillius said; Takumi has topped Japanese popularity polls (and is very popular here), but most people seem to be doing it at least partially to say "up yours, IS" for their general bastardization of him in the Nohr route.

I'm not saying there aren't other things to like about him at all; it's just seems that he's popular because of (to quote amielleon's tumblr) his "squishbaby tendencies" and poor plot treatment.

I like him for the same reasons you do; I just really don't see those reasons talked about.

Well, over at archiveofourown there's been a few of discussing what we like about him other than the dislike of the writers slapping him with the "Informed Wrongness" trope, such as his supports. The biggest thing for me as how he made a nice effort to connect with Leon after having a rocky and predictable C-support, which actually ended with him (and not Leon as one might suspect) saying he won't be satisfied with simply having a friendship, but "guiding the world" together. That I thought was pretty damn impressive for a character who started out really insecure about himself and distrustful towards people in general. And at the ending cutscene of Revelations he's happily chatting to Leon about the future like they had been friends for a long time, when really it had just been however long the party's time in Touma was. He might not be fully trusting of Kamui but he still makes an effort to teach them archery. His support with Oboro is just sweet all around. The fact that he supports Crimson as well, even if it went badly he was actively trying to help people from outside Hoshido gain freedom from oppressive rule. He's a good father to Kisaragi and Kanna too. Just some examples of what we've talked about.

The insecurities and doubts he has makes him seem real to me, and contrasts nicely with his Nohrian counterpart Leon but also his older brother, who despite my best efforts I couldn't like as much as the other Hoshidan siblings because Ryoma just feels a bit too talented which makes him hard to relate to. I hope maybe it might be different in the localization, because he's really cool design-wise and as a unit. As someone who suffers from nightmares that's another understandable thing I find relatable about Takumi, and it's not something that can just be waved away with a magic plot-wand either. I feel some people miss that in the Nohr route he also points out a few times he feels as though "something" is messing with his head, causing him pain and seems to be directing him to target Kamui. Which I actually thought was a decent bit of foreshadowing and showed that Takumi was indeed struggling with all these conflicting emotions and thoughts, including despair over the very sudden death of his mother which he didn't even get time to properly mourn over before Nohr starts an all-out invasion. I felt sorry for him, rather than that #blameTakumi crap.

It's a pity that the writers at IS are hell-bent on treating anyone who doesn't worship the avatar character as "wrong" and must be "corrected". It's a really shoddy and unrealistic way to write a story, and I feel as though it's only going to get even worse in the next Fire Emblem game, since I can't see IS dropping the avatar character.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Verdande

[Time the Crestfallen]

The problem is that they made the Avatar the main character of the story, as Avatars have to be somewhat flat characters in order for them to truly reflect the 'self-insert' aspect for lack of better wording . If other characters are worshiping another character, than it can be obnoxious but not necessarily noteworthy. But when others are worshiping a player character, it comes across as pandering. It wouldn't fix the story, but I think it would've been better if Kamui was a supporting character/deutertagonist to Xander/Ryoma/Azura/Whoever like Robin was to Chrom.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Phillius

[Sunwoo]

Basically what Phillius said; Takumi has topped Japanese popularity polls (and is very popular here), but most people seem to be doing it at least partially to say "up yours, IS" for their general bastardization of him in the Nohr route.

I'm not saying there aren't other things to like about him at all; it's just seems that he's popular because of (to quote amielleon's tumblr) his "squishbaby tendencies" and poor plot treatment.

I like him for the same reasons you do; I just really don't see those reasons talked about.

Got it. And now that you bring it up, I think you may be right in part. I don't think a lot of people understand the complexity of his character and the complexity of his and Kamui's interactions in Nohr (the complexity comes in that the game wants to portray Kamui as being right, but Takumi's reactions considering the situation are in line with how most people would react). I see that he has a lot of fans (female fans, in particular) and people who say they want to marry him, but sometimes I wonder how much they actually know of his actual personality.

As for the "squishbaby tendencies" … on the one hand it shows that he's not invincible and does run into trouble. On the other hand, when he's getting hit with like 99% of the "squishbaby" moments then you have to wonder if the narrative just has it out for him. I feel bad for him because he's a character I like for all of his faults and complexities and for being so human, and he draws such a short stick in a game that cares only about Kamui.

[Hatsuoki]

If it makes you feel better, I'm at least another person who likes Takumi for his personality. ;u; I hadn't thought about the possibility that he might be liked for just not liking Kamui but I think if people pay a bit of attention to him, his personality really shines through.

To be fair, I think many people here have yet to play the game and can only go off of what everyone else is saying. I can't guess on what the Japanese players think about him though.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Hatsuoki

[sylveonzoroark]

I just like Takumi for his OP bow...

Edited November 18, 2015 by sylveonzoroark

[Minischew]

I just like Takumi for his OP bow...

I like him for giving birth to Kisaragi, because Kisaragi. <3

[CrimeanRoyalKnight]

Takumi is liked for being a squishbaby with complexes while also being pretty. Hence why all the "I want to bully Takumi!".

They all want to gently caress the guy who gets angry and sad at his premature ejaculations and who cries about his bow ability at night, because his childishness mixed with his seriousness and angry behaviour look cute and hopeless. The #blametakumi meme was popular because picking on the arrogant guy with complexes is adorable.

His insecurities, mixed with his pretty looks, make him endearing and attractive, plus getting to marry a guy with a sister complex who is tsundere for you is a fetish around some of his fans, even if some might deny it.

Oh lol please, don't tell me it doesn't excite you, because then not many would write they're "degenerate brocons", "brother-fucking trash", or remind it costantly. Just be honest to yourself and admit the slight incest tickles your fancy. If you do not want to be judged for it, either don't mention it or don't make a big deal about it.

Now, back to track, if Takumi looked like Gatrie, or Gregor, or whathever, not a pretty boy, he wouldn't get half of these kind of fans, at least in the english fandom, because we did not actually read the plot and supports, but summaries and unprofessional fan translations. We barely know how these characters are like, we only know a few traits, yet we want to bang them regardless. We have shallow reasons to like characters, and sometimes, it's alright, we do not have to enjoy all media with a super serious philosophical eye all the time. Some things might be better left unexplored.

I'm guilty of this, too. I guess I am speaking for myself here, lol. I barely know Asama and Zero (only read fan translated supports) but I'm 100% sure I'll marry them. Heck, I'm buying Hoshido for Asama, mostly.

I know, I'm being really mean, but I wanted to get it off my chest... this is a thread about guilty confessions, isn't it?

[Thor Odinson]

I like Takumi for his character, but he's also not my favorite character or particularly attractive to me (too young, I prefer looking at more mature dudes even if the pineapple ponytail is totally my tastes)

I mean ffs my fav is Ryouma I don't think Takumi being taken as the kamui hater has any bearing on me liking him haha

On the other hand though I can read raw japanese at about a 30%-60% understanding depending on the amount of kanji (more the merrier) and can always shoot ammie a message if I feel like I'm interpreting things wrong so???? I guess

On the other hand I wish there is more Ryouma fans who would come analyze him with me. I get that he's got a pretty face and localization isn't even out yet and a lot of y'all want to avoid spoilers and that's fine but it sure as fuck feels lonely here sometimes in the Ryouma meta corner by myself

Edited November 18, 2015 by Thor Odinson

[Duke of Dozel]

On the other hand I wish there is more Ryouma fans who would come analyze him with me. I get that he's got a pretty face and localization isn't even out yet and a lot of y'all want to avoid spoilers and that's fine but it sure as fuck feels lonely here sometimes in the Ryouma meta corner by myself

Mainly because of two things. Ryoma doesn't have a major conflict centered around him unlike Marx and Takumi. He's merely the leader and future king, and while he's far from a bad character IMO, he's just given the Hinoka treatment occasionally, except with more screentime. Kamui is the hero and Hoshido is very black and white; Garon is the big bad, Ryoma wants to end this by defeating him so Hoshido can live in peace. That's about it.

He's a good brother and he's got his goals. But I still think he loses the spotlight a lot.

[Thor Odinson]

Mainly because of two things. Ryoma doesn't have a major conflict centered around him unlike Marx and Takumi. He's merely the leader and future king, and while he's far from a bad character IMO, he's just given the Hinoka treatment occasionally, except with more screentime. Kamui is the hero and Hoshido is very black and white; Garon is the big bad, Ryoma wants to end this by defeating him so Hoshido can live in peace. That's about it.

He's a good brother and he's got his goals. But I still think he loses the spotlight a lot.

He has a bunch of personal shit though, and just because they don't have as much of a major conflict doesn't mean they aren't worth analyzing, when people (not in fates fandom due to lack of english atm, but) can analyze practically every single minor character in the rest of the franchise and have been. There's probably a meta on Dorcas somewhere.

Tbh I think both older brothers are pretty tragic (mostly on each other's route, although nohr route marx writing is a goddamn mess thanks nohr route) and they just really need more happiness in their lives.

with each other. with their dicks.

IDK I just want some company up here okay

Edited November 18, 2015 by Thor Odinson

[Nanima]

Chiming in with my opinion on Takumi here.

I think what CrimeanRoyalKnight said hits the nail on the head pretty well. And I am not going to claim the high ground on this, I do like Takumi for his adorable awkwardness, his tsundere tendencies and 'pretty' (I don't think attractive is the right word for me, since he isn't exactly my usual type. But I still really like it) character design.

But this was not what first drew me to his character. Back when all we knew was his design and attitude towards the avatar (without the reasons behind it) I was much more apathetic towards him. I didn't hate him, just lacked any information that might make me like him, besides his class (which isn't enough by itself for me, I was never all that fond of Shinon).

So only when word got out about his insecurity and desire to improve himself did I take a longer look at him. I find characters who lack self-confidence and have to struggle with this extremely easy to relate to. After that his reasons for distrusting Kamui (and being distrustful in general) became apparent to me, even without it being straight out told. So I began focusing more on him and how he acts in the story.

And I just kept finding more reasons to like him, including the shallow ones listed at the beginning of my post.

I think it's perfectly alright to like characters for shallow reasons, so long as they are not the only reasons.

[Raumata]

I snuck a look at the endings for Hoshido, Nohr, and Revelations. I found that I prefer Nohr and Revelations endings. Plot Wise? They're nuetral.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Raumata

[Ebony]

On the other hand I wish there is more Ryouma fans who would come analyze him with me. I get that he's got a pretty face and localization isn't even out yet and a lot of y'all want to avoid spoilers and that's fine but it sure as fuck feels lonely here sometimes in the Ryouma meta corner by myself

I will gladly join you. It feels like people don't talk much about Hinoka as much as Camilla, but I also have seen a lot of that on Tumblr which I've stopped going on there. So... I don't know.

As for another confession... I guess I feel uncomfortable as Kamui. Mostly for the fact I don't like being overly complimented and put on a pedestal. Which is in a lot of the game. So watching and reading supports where Kamui is kind of complimented constantly is... awkward and very, very uncomfortable for me.

[Radiant head]

And I loathe Kamui, Felicia, and Azura. Kamui because they don't feel like me (even if I admit I like their concept as a dragon prince/princess), Felicia because I hate moe maid stereotypes, and Azura because she's an enigma wrapped in a mystery that never gets explained for the sake of her being mysterious.

Even the dragon prince thing just sounds like something from fanfiction writing 101.

[Thor Odinson]

I will gladly join you. It feels like people don't talk much about Hinoka as much as Camilla, but I also have seen a lot of that on Tumblr which I've stopped going on there. So... I don't know.

At least there is like 2 people I know who really like Hinoka, so there's that.

Poor Hinoka though, she's pretty much ignored by both the plot and most of the fandom. I really like her supports, fwiw, but I wish they'd really given her a bigger role instory and cut out most of that kamuicentric crap.

Which, I mean, the latter needs to apply to the story at large anyway.

[NekoKnight]

Even the dragon prince thing just sounds like something from fanfiction writing 101.

It's less special sounding in the context of the series, though. Almost all the protagonists of the series are princes or other people of noble birth and dragons are another common element in many games. Both parts together, yes it's super special awesome OC donut steel but I'm generally more accepting of the protagonist having unique features provided it doesn't make them overpowered.

[Verdande]

Make that a third person you know of who likes Hinoka then. She is a character I feel was woefully underutilised, and I thought was cool in pretty much all aspects but is sadly shunted to the side because, Idk, lazy writers didn't know what to do with her? I personally find her much more endearing than Camilla (whose character was treated with absolutely no respect or dignity that should have been owed to Nohr's highest ranking and seemingly only female leader and one of the royal siblings). I wanted to hear her opinion on what was going on with various events, rather than the whole show being perfect snowflake Kamui and his "sidekicks" (or one sidekick, usually the brothers while the sisters might as well not even be there) :/ It was kind of hard for me to make a post about her because the writers did so very little with her to my annoyance.

Takumi is liked for being a squishbaby with complexes while also being pretty. Hence why all the "I want to bully Takumi!".

They all want to gently caress the guy who gets angry and sad at his premature ejaculations and who cries about his bow ability at night, because his childishness mixed with his seriousness and angry behaviour look cute and hopeless. The #blametakumi meme was popular because picking on the arrogant guy with complexes is adorable.

His insecurities, mixed with his pretty looks, make him endearing and attractive, plus getting to marry a guy with a sister complex who is tsundere for you is a fetish around some of his fans, even if some might deny it.

Oh lol please, don't tell me it doesn't excite you, because then not many would write they're "degenerate brocons", "brother-fucking trash", or remind it costantly. Just be honest to yourself and admit the slight incest tickles your fancy. If you do not want to be judged for it, either don't mention it or don't make a big deal about it.

Now, back to track, if Takumi looked like Gatrie, or Gregor, or whathever, not a pretty boy, he wouldn't get half of these kind of fans, at least in the english fandom, because we did not actually read the plot and supports, but summaries and unprofessional fan translations. We barely know how these characters are like, we only know a few traits, yet we want to bang them regardless. We have shallow reasons to like characters, and sometimes, it's alright, we do not have to enjoy all media with a super serious philosophical eye all the time. Some things might be better left unexplored.

I'm guilty of this, too. I guess I am speaking for myself here, lol. I barely know Asama and Zero (only read fan translated supports) but I'm 100% sure I'll marry them. Heck, I'm buying Hoshido for Asama, mostly.

I know, I'm being really mean, but I wanted to get it off my chest... this is a thread about guilty confessions, isn't it?

Well I just gave reasons that had nothing to with his looks (and I hate the incest-fetishist pandering with a passion, in general, for wrecking Camilla's character potential, for it's connection to the avatar worshipping and for the damage it did to the Hoshido theme of true family). I haven't come across what you're describing at archiveofourown either, is it a tumblr thing?

Edited December 6, 2015 by Red Fox of Fire