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ruadath

HHM Low Turn Count

  

19 members have voted

  1. 1. Who will get the most kills?

    • Hector
      5
    • Marcus
      9
    • Lowen
      1
    • Fiora
      1
    • Heath
      1
    • Florina
      2
  2. 2. Who will enter the most battles?

    • Hector
      5
    • Marcus
      10
    • Lowen
      1
    • Fiora
      2
    • Heath
      0
    • Florina
      1


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I just realized that I can get at least one more Door Key by having Kent trade his sword away to Sain before shopping, and then have Sain give it back to him once he moves. I'm definitely incorporating this into the playthrough.

Also, another thought: before I revisit Chapter 15/16 to see if I can get less EXP for Marcus/buy the extra Door Key, I'm probably going to to try and route Chapter 17 to see if Marcus does get the opportunity for a good level there.

Edited by ruadath

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It may actually still be possible to complete Chapter 17 in 6 turns with only 1 paladin. There are 47 squares from where Hector/Marcus (deployed on closest spot) start to the boss. Here is what needs to be done as a brief outline for Marcus; more details may get fleshed out later.

Turn 1: Marcus moves forward 8 spaces and ends his turn carrying one of the cavs. He is 39 squares away from the throne.

Turn 2: Marcus moves forward another 8 spaces and drops of the cavalier in front of him; let us refer to this cavalier as Cav 1. Another cav or two (and maybe Florina) need to be reasonably close by him. Marcus is 31 spaces away from the throne, Cav 1 is 30 spaces away.

Turn 3: Generic cavs/Florina clear out enemies who may be in the way. A cav (let us refer to him as Cav 2) moves next to Marcus. Marcus rescue him and moves forward only 7 spaces. Cav 1 moves 7 spaces forward as well, takes Cav 2 from Marcus, and drops him forward. Marcus is now 24 spaces away from the throne, Cav 1 is 23, and Cav 2 is 22.

Turn 4: Cav 1 rescues Marcus and moves 7 spaces forward. Cav 2 moves ahead of Cav 1, takes Marcus and drops him forward. Hector is probably lagging a bit behind now, so someone needs to rescue him so that he can get Give-chained to Marcus on the next turn. Cav 1 is 16 spaces away from the throne, Cav 2 is 15 spaces away, and Marcus is 14 spaces away.

Turn 5: Hector somehow gets given to Marcus. Marcus moves forward 8 spaces and drops Hector forward. This puts Hector in seizing range and things should be able to work out from there.

Think this sounds doable? Let me know if you have any thoughts or advice, or if I'm overlooking some detail here. I'm definitely not going to be able to move Matthew up to grab the northen treasure chests (and that valuable Knight Crest), so I'll have to stick with the southern ones. I'm also going to be unable to recruit Lucius, and it is unclear whether or not Raven will get recruited.

Quoting this so people can see this again and so that I can refer to it for reference. A couple things I've discovered while doing a very rough routing of this so far:

Turn 1: breaking through the front enemies isn't particularly difficult. Matthew+Lowen can take care of the myrmidon pretty easily, so that shouldn't be a huge problem to rush Marcus through that area.

Turn 2 EP: Cav 1 (whoever that maybe, possibly Florina) takes a hit from the closest knight, so they have to be ready to survive that (or dodge it)

Turn 3: Marcus and two of my 7 mov units (cav 1 and cav 2) are occupied with moving this turn, and I need to have my other 2 7 mov units (or 3 if one of the cav#'s is priscilla, but I doubt it) take care of an archer and a knight who are standing in the way. I'm going to need 2 crits to do this. Lowen can take care of the knight with a crit+hit (even with a Javelin, which is likely since he's far behind). Florina is the only person who can double the archer (with the Slim Lance), though to ORKO him she needs a critical on one of the hits and a Str proc from previous combat. This also (I think) puts her in range for a nomad to attack her, which I guess means she'll have to dodge.

After that there is a whole cluster of 5 enemies blocking the path, so not sure what is going to happen on turn 4 (depends a lot on who is positioned where). Marcus and the # cavs are again going to be occupied again, so I'll only probably have Lowen and Florina? to clear the way. This is a little concerning, since it means that Priscilla? carrying Hector from the back is going to be taking hits from random enemies on the EP.

Also important to note is that so far Marcus hasn't been involved in any combat so far, so I still don't know if he has the chance to get a good level up. It's likely I won't be able to determine this until turn 5 EP or him attacking the boss.

I'll add more here as I figure out more stuff

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I don't think that there is going to be any way to do this reliably (if at all) in 6 turns. The archer and knight on turn 3 need to be killed by Javelin crits, which means that I need to have the two attackers be Sain and Lowen. This in turn means that one of the #cavs has to be either Florina or Priscilla which means they will get mobbed on EP3. I'm not sure whether or not this will result in the path being clogged up on turn 4, but it doesn't help that Lowen (fastest person) can't double the nomads, so I'll have to rely on more crits to deal with them if they get in the way.

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I haven't tested it yet, but I think I have figured out a way to get Marcus slightly less EXP in Chapter 15 while keeping the playthrough mostly the same. The general idea is just to have Hector take one more kill on the last turn.

I think this might end up being important since I would like to give Sain the "good level" in Chapter 16. Then I can use the "good level" at the beginning of Chapter 17 on Florina, with no one else leveling early on, and they will be strong enough to take out the archer and knight. This then means that I can choose Lowen and Kent as the #cavs, which is useful for several different reasons, the most important being that it hopefully aggros the mass of enemies toward Sain and Florina and out of the path of Marcus and co.

EDIT: I should note that by some miracle there are two 2% crits available in the RNG right near the beginning of turn 3, which is exactly what I need to deal with the archer/knight.

Edited by ruadath

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I've updated the first post to include a section that will document all of the minor changes I have made/will make to the videos that are up, just so that they are all collected in one place and easy to refer to.

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I haven't finished optimizing it yet, but I now have a clear of Chapter 16 with Marcus not leveling (left at 99 EXP) and Sain getting an awesome level (everything but Luck and Res). Erk's level has to be modified but it looks like there is a decent sequence where he will get at least Mag and Spd.

The general strategy is the same, but the order of actions is quite different and Lyn's team moves slightly differently, so I'm probably going to make a new video for this.

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The new strategy when optimized has me picking up additional Door Keys (a total of 8, though 9 is possible if I really feel like it) at the cost of purchasing axes. I don't imagine I'll have any problems with Iron Axes since Hector isn't going to be doing a ton of fighting in the next few chapters. A bigger problem is Hand Axes, of which I only have one remaining, with 6 uses. However, I don't foresee it being used at all in Chapter 17 (Marcus doesn't engage in any combat and Hector is being carried most of the time), and I can buy some on Pirate Ship anyway (likely with Priscilla on the first turn or something).

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Just go for a bunch of hand axes, you can easily get away with buying 3 door keys, since you can buy more of them in C18 or C21.

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Nah, if I get the Hand Axes, then Lyn can't reach any enemies of the final turn and misses out on a kill. I also have to burn additional RNs to make up for her not doing anything. I'm sure I'll be fine just picking up the Hand Axes on the Pirate Ship.

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Nah, if I get the Hand Axes, then Lyn [...] misses out on a kill. I also have to burn additional RNs to make up for her not doing anything.

None of these hurts

It might be annoying if you failed to clear a path in chapter 17 because of that, I'd just play it safe.

Edited by Gradivus.

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I now have a 6 turn clear of Chapter 17 ready. However, it will probably be a while before the video gets up since I have to get the new Chapter 16 video up first. In addition, the Chapter 17 strat is going to be a nightmare to record due to the ridiculous amount of trading that goes on; Florina usually needs to attack with strong weapons but wants to end turns with the Slim Lance equipped so she doesn't get doubled, and items like the Heavy Spear, Iron Blade, and Horseslayer need to be shuffled around.

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Can anyone give me an estimate on the total number of Door Keys used during the playthrough?

From what I understand, I need 1 for Dragon's Gate, 2 for Kinship's Bond, and 5 for Light. There are some additional doors to open during Dawn of Destiny and Sands of Time, but many of those can be unlocked with Unlock staves etc. I already know that I pick up 2 door keys from Chapter 17 and Kent gets 5 from Chapter 16, so perhaps if I can get one more from somewhere, there won't be any need to have Lyn buy Door Keys?

Edited by ruadath

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Dawn of Destiny

FE6 chapter 1

I assume battle before dawn though? You can probably open those with thieves since you have tons of time, in fact the enemy thieves will probably open them and you can get the treasure by killing the thieves. In sands of time, fielding a thief is probably enough too, you do have a pretty high number of deployment slots anyway.

As for how many staves you'll need, Erk needs to reach D just through heal staves, so I think you need roughly two for him. Mend probably similarly for getting priscilla to promotion and for training Erk further, probably buy 3 or 4. You want a bunch of torch staves for BBD staff grinding, buying three would put you at 40 uses, which is enough to use it ideally twice each turn in BBD to get Erk, and you have like 8 excess uses that priscilla can use for more exp. I'm not sure if you want to buy any physic staves, maybe just decide that spontaneously depending on how much money you have. Buying an extra one is unlikely to hurt though, it'll put you at 30 uses and Priscilla can make good use of it on turns where she can't use torch, as well as Erk to get his staff rank to A, probably in chapter 31.

I think you should just be a bit generous on thunder tomes for priscilla, sooner or later she'll probably use up 5-6 of those minimum if you use them to dump exp into her on enemy phase, partially in defense chapters. You need enough fire tomes to reach D Anima, probably just get two from pirate ship. Just buy 2-3 more than you think you need because flexibility can't hurt when the tomes aren't expensive and defense maps are a pain to make exact predictions for.

Edited by Gradivus.

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FE6 chapter 1

Sorry about that. I always misquote the chapter names when I'm in a hurry and don't look it up on the wiki page.

Thanks for all of the details, as always. I'm trying to use this information to figure out how to best optimize Chapter 16 shopping. Perhaps I should continue on from my clear of Chapter 17 and route Chapter 18 to see which shops I have time to visit before making this decision?

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Here is an (untested) idea: if I can afford to have only one person shop for Door Keys, why not let that be Lyn? Kent can visit the axe/sword shop on the first turn instead, and he'll still have enough mov to make it to the desired spot on turn 2 PP. Then Lyn can trade all her stuff to Wil on PP and buy Door Keys, and Wil can trade it back to her as he takes care of the PKs.

This should allow me to pick up those much needed Hand Axes

None of these hurts

It might be annoying if you failed to clear a path in chapter 17 because of that, I'd just play it safe.

Gradivus was right here; I ended up using the Hand Axe 5 times, leaving me just 1 use left for Chapter 18, so it would be convenient to pick up some in Chapter 16 if possible.

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Alright, here is the new and improved clear of Chapter 16!

As you can see, Marcus starts off with a few less point of EXP and therefore doesn't level after killing Bauker. Other than that, the strategy is pretty much the same, except for the fact that the shopping schedule is changed (for the better, I hope), and Sain kills the PK on the last turn in order to get a level up.

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Hmm, it appears that it is possible to improve this clear and get more EXP for Lowen! There are two possible approaches:

1) By positioning Lowen one space west of where I place him on turn 5, he aggros the archer and gets an extra round of combat in. Everyone's levels end up being the same (I shift Raven killing the archer to after all of the levels are done), I just get a little bit more EXP for Lowen.

2) Alternatively, by positioning Lowen one space SW, he aggros both archers, and crit-kills one of them! This gets him a ton more EXP, but he levels prematurely and gets a slightly worse, though still pretty good level (missed out on Spd and Def). Florina's level changes (-Def, +HP, +Luck), though Sain's remains the same.

Any thoughts on what I should do? For what it's worth, option 1 puts Lowen at 8.19 EXP, while option 2 puts him at 8.46, so it's a 27 EXP difference.

Edited by ruadath

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I'm leaning toward options 2 at the moment, since Lowen doesn't really need a ton of Spd right now; he's already fast enough that he doubles any slow enemies with ease, and he still has a ways to go before he can start doubling mercs and myrmidons. Also, since he isn't getting promoted any time soon, I have plently of time to get his Spd up to (or close to) 20.

I guess which option I take will probably be determined by when it is convenient for him to level in the next chapter (which I will discover once I begin routing it).

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There really isn't much of a point in optimizing Lowen's exp gain from now on. Since you didn't go for the Knight Crest Lowen won't get to promote before you obtain the second one [Eubans drops it] and his stats are looking sufficient enough at this point. He should be able to do his thing with a few level ups and the promotional gains. It's not worth redoing the chapter for it imo.

Your main focus should probably be on maximizing Florina's exp gain so her stats are as high as possible when she promotes. You actually did a really good job at getting her a lot of Exp so far. Wouldn't change anything for now.

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ruadath is probably going for Fiora instead, in which case EXP for Florina becomes less relevant; he already changed the topic poll.

I thought 2 keys were needed for the quickest clear of Dragon's Gate? One for the first door and one for the door leading to the throne?

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