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The Lunatic Club [Fates]

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Sorry, made another mistake. I don't think Competitive should get modified by Dragonskin. So assuming DS halves DF,

75 = 2*((Atk-26) *0.75) + 0.25Atk - 2

is what we've got?

EDIT: neglecting things like Rose's Thorns, of course

Why -2? Competitive is -1 damage received.

Edit: Nvm, 2 Attacks

Edited by avengerfive

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So I was fairly sure I could ORKO Takumi with a single Dragon Fang proc. Here's my MU after boosts:

WvlL5s2.jpg

Atk: 65 (36(Base Strength, Capped) +3(Wyvern Lord!Gunter Boosts) + 4(Rally Str) + 1(Lasderp's Fancy Feet) + 2(Str Tonic) +3(A-Rank Swords) + 16(Shadow Yato)

I do standard pass/rescue strats and attack Takumi. I'm doing 31 * 2. Great! That means I need to do at least 13 damage with a Dragon Fang proc. Well 65 * 0.25 is 16.25! He's dead!

I attack Takmui and get a Dragon Fang proc! And...!?

WU7UkFy.jpg

I have never been so destroyed in Conquest Lunatic as this. GG Takumi. You win.

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Yeah, unfortunately, the bonus damage is also affected by the Dragonskin damage reduction. Do you have Nohrian Trust? At the amount of Attack you have, getting a Fang and a Luna would be enough and the Luna would have a better chance of showing up (too bad double Luna would be even less useful than one Fang, though). Another option is, if you have a second Pass user or can Entrap an obstructing enemy out of the way, you can try to get another staffer within 7 tiles of Takumi. Drop an Enfeeble on him and all you need is the one Fang.

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So I was fairly sure I could ORKO Takumi with a single Dragon Fang proc. Here's my MU after boosts:

WvlL5s2.jpg

Atk: 65 (36(Base Strength, Capped) +3(Wyvern Lord!Gunter Boosts) + 4(Rally Str) + 1(Lasderp's Fancy Feet) + 2(Str Tonic) +3(A-Rank Swords) + 16(Shadow Yato)

I do standard pass/rescue strats and attack Takumi. I'm doing 31 * 2. Great! That means I need to do at least 13 damage with a Dragon Fang proc. Well 65 * 0.25 is 16.25! He's dead!

I attack Takmui and get a Dragon Fang proc! And...!?

WU7UkFy.jpg

I have never been so destroyed in Conquest Lunatic as this. GG Takumi. You win.

tumblr_o3wa1rLSQ01sdmoigo1_400.jpg

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I was doing this run under the following rules:

  • No children paralogues (Paralogue 1 is fine)/Invasions/Scouts/Challenges
  • Full Recruitment
  • No Path Bonuses
  • No Visiting other people's My Castles/Skill Buying
  • No DLC

Technically, the run is still possible if I get a double Dragon Fang proc. Or if I find a way to get 2 units down to Takumi to attack/enfeeble him. But to save time and brains, I'm going to break one of my rules. I'm going to do an invasion mission to get a B support with MU/Gunter. At B, Gunter gives Str +1, which should result in a dead Takumi (I hope). Again, had I known prior that I needed a B, I could have easily gotten it. Unfortunately, I don't have a save on a previous chapter.

Yeah, unfortunately, the bonus damage is also affected by the Dragonskin damage reduction. Do you have Nohrian Trust? At the amount of Attack you have, getting a Fang and a Luna would be enough and the Luna would have a better chance of showing up (too bad double Luna would be even less useful than one Fang, though). Another option is, if you have a second Pass user or can Entrap an obstructing enemy out of the way, you can try to get another staffer within 7 tiles of Takumi. Drop an Enfeeble on him and all you need is the one Fang.

This makes a lot of sense. 65 * 0.25 * 0.75 = 12.1875. 1 point less then I needed. I don't have Nohrian Trust, I reclassed to Nohr Noble at 20 specifically for the higher strength cap.

On the bright side, I now know that any +Str MU can ORKO Takumi with a single Dragon Fang proc and B support Gunter. Also assuming you have a Rally Str user (C23 MoA OP) and your MU has Capped Strength after the reclass to NN(I reclassed from Master Ninja, and used the Energy Drop from the shop). I don't even have damage boosting skills. Factor those in, and it's not too bad at all. Good for future runs.

Edited by avengerfive

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You could still build the B via your own castle (Quarters and giving accessories event), although it would be pretty random unless you have level 3 Quarters. I don't think anyone would blame you for using the Invasion, though.

Good idea, I forgot about the Private Quarters(I usually remove it because the exclamation mark annoys me). I'll use it. I have enough DV points to upgrade it to 3 too. Thanks!

I'm actually a little skeptical that +1 Str will help tho. It might not add any damage at all. Oh well.

Anyways,

ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ time to rub Gunter-sama's face!!! ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ

Edited by avengerfive

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So it seems like the discrepancy is perhaps because the DF proc doesn't apply to Gunter's personal bonus and triangle, only to disp atk.

So instead of floor((69*1.25-27)*.75) = 44 we get floor((65*1.25+4-27)*.75) = 43. The non-proc damage is still floor(65+4-27)*.75 = 31.

With instead 66 disp atk (then 4 more from Gunter and triangle), it should do 32 no proc, 44 with proc?

66-2 tonic-16 shadow yato-3 a swords-1 lazwald-4 rally-3 wyvern -1 gunter B = 36. That would be either 36 Str from +Str boon or something like 32 Str and 4 from Elbow Room/Defender (proc should still do 44 even if Elbow Room's +3 doesn't get boosted by Dragon Fang) if going +Mag for Levin/Tomes or +Hp/Def for dat C1.

If that's correct, -Luck may actually need Gunter S? I knew there was a reason I married him. Or a +7 Berserker/wolf pair up as that's raw Str (up to 68 disp atk) instead of Gunter's 4 Str from Wyvern and B support + 3 from personal. floor((68*1.25+1-27)*.75) is still 44.

Edited by XeKr

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So it seems like the discrepancy is perhaps because the DF proc doesn't apply to Gunter's personal bonus and triangle, only to disp atk.

So instead of floor((69*1.25-27)*.75) = 44 we get floor((65*1.25+4-27)*.75) = 43. The non-proc damage is still floor(65+4-27)*.75 = 31.

With instead 66 disp atk (then 4 more from Gunter and triangle), it should do 32 no proc, 44 with proc?

66-2 tonic-16 shadow yato-3 a swords-1 lazwald-4 rally-3 wyvern -1 gunter B = 36. That would be either 36 Str from +Str boon or something like 32 Str and 4 from Elbow Room/Defender (proc should still do 44 even if Elbow Room's +3 doesn't get boosted by Dragon Fang) if going +Mag for Levin/Tomes or +Hp/Def for dat C1.

If that's correct, -Luck may actually need Gunter S? I knew there was a reason I married him. Or a +7 Berserker/wolf pair up as that's raw Str (up to 68 disp atk) instead of Gunter's 4 Str from Wyvern and B support + 3 from personal. floor((68*1.25+1-27)*.75) is still 44.

Assuming this is correct(it looks correct), the +1 Str from B support should be enough. My MU(+Str, -Lck) has base 36 Str.

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Finally had a chance to see what all the fuss was about regarding Jakob as a Paladin (all of my runs until now were male). What an absolute joke he makes of the early game. ORKOs right out the gate with a Raider Naginata, basically doesn't die, pairs well with just about anyone, and gets unpromoted experience. What the fuck.

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So I've cleared Conquest Lunatic/Classic with no deaths (no, Xander's tragic death by RNG in Endgame doesn't count)

Thoughts on characters:

Corrin - Even with a def bane, he could tank quite well with a dragonstone. Funniest moment was in Chapter 25, where Ryoma had <10% hit rate on him, and he could double Ryoma with base speed.

Felicia - Useful as a staffbot. Damage potential is null until flame shuriken or reclass into strategist.

Gunter - Jeigan. Benched as usual.

Silas - I liked him, and wanted to use him. But 9 speed at level 14 was the last straw.

Elise - Staffbot + aurabot + glass cannon. Also, mother of my favourite unit.

Arthur - I'd have used him, if not for the fact that he couldn't hit the broad side of a barn. I'll give him a try next playthrough.

Effie - What can I say? She started oneshotting enemies since the archers in Chapter 10. Promoted her to Great Knight, and she capped Str, Luck and speed.

Niles - Best utility unit + shuriken breaker/10

Odin - Eldritch Smackdown! Used him as a swordmaster. Was not disappointed.

Nyx - Benched. At least Elise was a good staffbot.

Azura - Azura/10. Almost gave me a heart attack when I accidentally left her in range of a kitsune in Chapter 19. Luckily she somehow had enough HP to survive the hit.

Camilla - Hit level cap in Chapter 24. That's how good she was <3

Beruka - Benched her because I didn't have enough deployment slots. Still, she seems like she'd be good. Using her in my next playthrough.

Selena - Pretty good once her strength starts to pick up. Her personal skill was totally made for killer weapon attack stance shenanigans.

Kaze - Mage slayer/10

Laslow - Turned out to be Lafast. Equipped him with a killing edge for hilarity. Also, master ninja with Sol is <3

Peri - Once again, benched due to deployment slots. Offense seems good, although she lacks bulk.

Benny - Would make a solid general, but I already have Effie + incoming Xander. Benched.

Charlotte - Pair up fodder/10

Leo - He's probably good, but once again: deployment slots. Should give him a try sometime, preferably reclassed to sorcerer because I don't really like dark knight.

Keaton - I NEED MORE DEPLOYMENT SLOTS! Seriously, stop giving me units that look like they'd be useful when I've already filled up the given slots.

Jakob - I forgot he even existed.

Xander - Totally worth 2 deployment slots. Most problems were solvable by throwing Xander at them. Should probably have reclassed him for Sol just to see how broken that would be.

Shura - Filthy Corrinsexual Actually his stats don't look half bad. But I already have Niles, so to the bench it is.

Children characters were all recruited after Chapter 20.

Elise!Ophelia - Goddess. Nuking everything out of existence since Chapter 21. Next playthrough I'm making a +Mag Diviner female Corrin just to see how much she can break the game.

Selena!Soleil - Laslow x Selena may not have been the best pairing. Had nothing much in terms of skill inheritance. Still, Soleil was pretty decent. Stats were good all around.

Felicia!Nina - Niles x Felicia supports were hilarious. The resultant Nina's combat abilities turned out to be hilariously bad. At least she had decent utility as a pass staffer.

Effie!Midori - Probably not an optimal pairing for Midori, but her strength did turn out to be pretty ridiculous.

Memorable chapters:

Chapter 10 - One of my favourites. I love defense maps.

Chapter 19 - Was annoying until I figured out how the gimmick with the foxes worked.

Chapter 20 - Again, annoying until I figured out the wind gimmick. ​Hayato's hexing rod pissed me off, so I sent Camilla in with the dual club to delete him.

Chapter 21 - Stoneborn with high HP, defense and wary fighter? Meet Ophelia Dusk, goddess of destruction. Also, why is Golembane so useless?

Chapter 23 - And now I have a grudge against Hinata. That avoid is just unfair.

Chapter 25 - To hell with stacking debuffs and 3 range lunge. Time to break out the freeze and entrap staves. Also, I had to make sure Corrin didn't accidentally kill Ryoma when attacking.

Chapter 26 - WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK. I'm just going to avoid that infinite hexing rod and ignore the room with the faceless.

Endgame - What a bitch. How does anyone not cheese it with rescue staves? It was the only time I regretted choosing +Spd/-Def Swordmaster. Luckily I had reclassed for Life or Death and grabbed Trample from waifu!Camilla. With capped strength from stat boosters + tonics + rallies + S rank sword from arms scroll, I barely hit the benchmark for a reliable ORKO on Takumi. And Corrin went on to activate Dragon Fang for overkill…

EDIT: Forgot Jakob.

Edited by StarSeraphim

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Cavalier Jakob is funny since Cavalier get such an OP as shit starting skill as well as his own Res+2

Its funny how hard IS tried to nerf mounted and flying unit this time around, only to give them some of the best Tier 1 skill(Lunge, Str+2, Elbow Room, Shelter, Darting Blow)

Edited by JSND

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Cavalier Jakob is funny since Cavalier get such an OP as shit starting skill as well as his own Res+2

Its funny how hard IS tried to nerf mounted and flying unit this time around, only to give them some of the best Tier 1 skill(Lunge, Str+2, Elbow Room, Shelter, Darting Blow)

Cav's are still amazing, I dont think IS even tried to nerf them tbh, their promo's just suck a hard one in conquest route.

I'm not feeling the bird nerf at all though, wyverns and pegs are just gr8mazing overall.

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I think Kinshi Knights are much more interesting than Griffon riders from awakening.

although the Amaterasu skill just seems kind of off for being a Kinshi knight skill. feels more like a falco knights instead.

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Alright boys

Its finally fucking happened

Berserker Leo has been done

Armed with a growth rate that makes the straightest man goes gay

Time to get rekt wreck Conquest HM with that unit that specializes with a weapon that is unable to critical on a critical oriented class

Clearly i'm a genius

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Felicia!Nina - Niles x Felicia supports were hilarious. The resultant Nina's combat abilities turned out to be hilariously bad. At least she had decent utility as a pass staffer.

Chapter 25 - To hell with stacking debuffs and 3 range lunge. Time to break out the freeze and entrap staves. Also, I had to make sure Corrin didn't accidentally kill Ryoma when attacking.

Chapter 26 - WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK. I'm just going to avoid that infinite hexing rod and ignore the room with the faceless.

Endgame - What a bitch. How does anyone not cheese it with rescue staves? It was the only time I regretted choosing +Spd/-Def Swordmaster. Luckily I had reclassed for Life or Death and grabbed Trample from waifu!Camilla. With capped strength from stat boosters + tonics + rallies + S rank sword from arms scroll, I barely hit the benchmark for a reliable ORKO on Takumi. And Corrin went on to activate Dragon Fang for overkill…

If you haven't had a chance to try Elise!Nina, give that a shot next time. I ended up her by accident thanks to shipping based on romance and she ended up being monstrous. Very glass cannon-y, but unlike her mother, she could actually take a hit if she really needed to (and then would need two heals to patch up the damage >.>).

Yeah, C25 feels like it's specifically built to go "Bet you wish you had Shurikenbreaker right about now!" to anyone who had the misfortune of ignoring Bow Knight (such as me).

C26 is kinda like C27 in that it looks scarier than it is. Iago has a really weird rotational gimmick going on and there's really no indication of it without just getting continually hit by his staves several turns in a row. I mean, it's still pretty ugly, but it's not programmed to be as vicious as it could be. Doing it under the assumption that it is that vicious is... an interesting experience, though.

As for Endgame without cheese, Shurikenbreaker on several units, all but 2-3 of the team's slots filled with units who can deal significant damage and at least half of the team with significant bulk in order to rotate people out as the stacking Enfeebles start to eat their face. At least, that's how I did it. Oh, and unloading all the status staves upfront to shut that huge wall of debuffing down (although, saving some Freeze uses for the horse rush is a good idea). I'd initially wanted to save a Silence use for the Hexing Rod Great Master, but hilariously enough, in the end, he's so far back that he's almost irrelevant. Also, also, the Faceless are bulky decoys with rather weak Attack. Having one person/pair per side who can do 31+ damage to them on EP, then disengage on PP to let the Faceless harmlessly self-destruct on nothing, is a good way to save crucial damage for pushing through all the scarier enemies.

Edited by Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi

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A friend of mine likes to plan out full team replicate and she could apparently wreck endgame that way. I have not done it that way, though.

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I don't doubt it. That's a toooooon of firepower. It'd probably allow simultaneously pulling the General and Paladin/Malig groups and then just plain overwhelming them the next turn. With that all taken care of, that leaves a lone Master Ninja and the horse pairs to deal with. A group that can wipe a double pull like that would easily overwhelm them too. Stacking Enfeeble is scary, but it's significantly less scary if the enemy's good fighters get insta-gibbed. And if the enemy's good fighters falls that easily, the Faceless ain't got anything on Corrin's death squad.

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Even when I played Endgame straight-up on Hard, the Faceless never got to me. It was just a straight charge down to Takumi, who got blasted ~Turn 4. Fast is like, the only way to play that chapter.

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Beat Conquest Lunatic! The +1 Str from B-support Gunter was just enough to get the ORKO on Takumi with one Dragon Fang proc. Which means XeKr's equation was correct.

The equation is 75 = ((Total Attack - 27) * 0.75) * 2 + (Displayed Attack * 0.75 * 0.25)

Which means you need 69 Displayed Attack to ORKO Takumi with a Dragon Fang Proc (Or 66 with Gunter-Pairup). Also assuming you have a B Sword rank for the +1 damage from WTA.

Thanks to everyone that helped!

Some thoughts:

+Str Ninja MU was really nice. Earlygame was horrible tho. My MU struggled to get many ORKOs. But once level ups, supports and forges kicked in, it was pretty amazing. Around Chapter 23 I hopped in Mechanist for Replicate, which helped a lot on Chapter 25. I was able to nab the Silence Stave, then have my MU finish off the boss.

That said, I still prefer +Str Cav MU. +Str Cav has ridiculous offense throughout the entire game. In fact, it's offense might be a little overkill. Something like +Mag might be better for Levin Sword spamming, but +Str ensures the kill on Takumi and you get like, 3 Spirit Dusts. +Str Cav->Paladin MU with Bow Knight Felicia pairup is probably my favorite MU build so far.

Camilla was the best unit after MU. I reclassed her right away using the Ch.9 Heart Seal to Wyvern Lord, which got her some really nice boosts. I later reclassed her back to Malig just for the two skills. I also gave her Keaton as a pairup bot, who gave crazy boosts (+7 Str, +4 Spd, +2 Def iirc).

Xander was good with Charlotte. I also gave him 3 Speedwings in total (Ch17, C24, and Level 3 Shop).

Kaze was awesome, his Str came up short only about 20% of the time. The Beastkiller Shuriken was amazing on him.

Niles was great. I gave him all my Spirit Dusts, which allowed him to ORKO anything physical with the Shining Bow. And he doubled as a second healer.

Leo was OK. I reclassed him to Sorc later just to try Nostanking, which helped a little on 26. Nothing really bad about Leo, just nothing really amazing.

Azura was Dancer/10.

Elise was Staffbot/10.

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If you haven't had a chance to try Elise!Nina, give that a shot next time. I ended up her by accident thanks to shipping based on romance and she ended up being monstrous. Very glass cannon-y, but unlike her mother, she could actually take a hit if she really needed to (and then would need two heals to patch up the damage >.>).

Yeah, C25 feels like it's specifically built to go "Bet you wish you had Shurikenbreaker right about now!" to anyone who had the misfortune of ignoring Bow Knight (such as me).

C26 is kinda like C27 in that it looks scarier than it is. Iago has a really weird rotational gimmick going on and there's really no indication of it without just getting continually hit by his staves several turns in a row. I mean, it's still pretty ugly, but it's not programmed to be as vicious as it could be. Doing it under the assumption that it is that vicious is... an interesting experience, though.

As for Endgame without cheese, Shurikenbreaker on several units, all but 2-3 of the team's slots filled with units who can deal significant damage and at least half of the team with significant bulk in order to rotate people out as the stacking Enfeebles start to eat their face. At least, that's how I did it. Oh, and unloading all the status staves upfront to shut that huge wall of debuffing down (although, saving some Freeze uses for the horse rush is a good idea). I'd initially wanted to save a Silence use for the Hexing Rod Great Master, but hilariously enough, in the end, he's so far back that he's almost irrelevant. Also, also, the Faceless are bulky decoys with rather weak Attack. Having one person/pair per side who can do 31+ damage to them on EP, then disengage on PP to let the Faceless harmlessly self-destruct on nothing, is a good way to save crucial damage for pushing through all the scarier enemies.

Elise!Nina sounds like she'd be destroying stuff with a shining bow. I'll have to give that a try sometime.

C25 mainly sucked because of the 3 range lunge automatons on the left. It forced me to break my hoarding habits and start using those staves. The ninjas weren't much of a threat, as I happened to promote Niles into Bow Knight :D:

As for C26...yeah, I figured out the rotation after a few tries. Just had to be mindful of the hexing rod whenever the turn number was a multiple of 4. The stoneborn in the left room were the ones I couldn't quite deal with. Has anyone managed to properly route the map for C26? I had planned to take on that room after killing Iago, but one look at those reinforcements made me opt to seize instead.

I think I'll try cheese-less endgame after some planning.

Just started up a new run with a +Mag/-Luck Diviner Corrin. Pairing her up with Odin broke C9. With a magic tonic and Lily's Poise, he took out all the archers in one shot. Can't wait to see what Ophelia will be capable of. :XD: In other news, Silas has been making up for his lack of speed in my previous run. And Arthur has been proving himself to be rather competent with some investment.

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Yeah, my Nina pretty much had a Shining Bow glued to her 24/7. She was doing something like 23 x2 to the Endgame Faceless (whose stats are almost all tank) without a pair-up partner.

I had a plan for clearing the map in C26, but I ended up not doing it because it was kind of pointless. The people who could safely fight under that many scary Stoneborn were all already capped at level 20 and said plan was basically only devised to feed my units EXP (and get the chest while I was at it, but that was more of a side effect since I could and did just use Pass Niles to nab it if that's all I was after). I'd laid out the plan in case Corrin and Selena got to A so that I could Eternal Seal and then use the EXP to pick up the Hero skills, but they didn't make it to A until after the map, so I just nixed the idea because it wasn't worth fighting for pretty much no gain. I'm kinda glad I didn't in the end because I needed Shurikenbreaker more than Sol or Axebreaker and I would have been pretty unhappy having to drop another 14k (which would have been all of my reserve funds) onto her.

Of course, having seen what goes on after the lower-left Entrap Maid and her Faceless bodyguard die, my plan would have been out the window, since it involved luring the Stoneborn to the corner of the room and throwing the Kodachi at them through the wall, Sing-Shelter abusing as necessary. The mobs just plain trash the room, though, so I'd probably end up having to run circles around the map (similar to what I do for C3 in Awakening), baiting Stoneborn into wasting their movement by attacking through the walls and then picking off all the Faceless, then slowly isolating each Stoneborn and jumping them.

That's pretty funny about Odin, but I can't say I'm too surprised. +3 Mag and Spd as a pair-up bonus is no joke.

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So i kinda want to try Breaker Stacking Felicia strats for Lunatic, but the investment needed for it is like

(Draco Talent Corrin, Early Heart Seals into Hero until Axebreaker -> Lover Seals into Wyvern Lord for Swordbreaker -> Heart Seal Seals into Bow Knight for Chapter 14 to get Shurikenbreaker -> Heart Seals Tomebreaker Maid -> Ends on Malig Knight with lover seals)

Yeah that seems ridiculous. The end result is also funny(Lunge, Savage Blow, Trample, Shuriken-Tome-Axe-Sword Breaker, Sol with Tomes, Riposte)

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