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Bad/Horrible support conversations!


Michelaar
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Silas's supports that actually stood out as good were Mozu, Beruka, Oboro, Hinoka, and Effie. The rest of his, save the four I mentioned earlier, are kind of average in quality--he's not a jerk in them, but there's nothing particularly interesting about them, either.

Azama actually does have some good supports--Felicia, Effie, Orochi, and Beruka jump to mind. Rinkah's was also good, mostly because of the worldbuilding and interesting tidbits of characterization.

Edited by Abvora
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It got better in the english---the english paints hana as genuinely having an off day, while the JP version really want to suck silas's dick. English version fixed the ooc-ness, but the interaction imo is still pretty awful. Far from either's best.

Out of Silas's female supports the only ones I've enjoyed are Hinoka and Mozu. While I have to give him some credit for creativity and intention I felt his Rinkah support came off condescending. If I want her to run GK I'll give it to her myself. Most of his supports with other women either outright annoyed me or aren't outright awful but just don't do it for me.

I read Silas' support with Rinkah and yeah I agree with you. I know he was trying to be creative, but like he came off as condescending to her and her culture. I'm not a fan of that support. Speaking of Kaze does he have any good supports besides the one with Corrin?

Edited by Frelia
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I read Silas' support with Rinkah and yeah I agree with you. I know he was trying to be creative, but like he came off as condescending to her and her culture. I'm not a fan of that support. Speaking of Kaze does he have any good supports besides the one with Corrin?

Kaze's support with Hana is actually pretty good.

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I read Silas' support with Rinkah and yeah I agree with you. I know he was trying to be creative, but like he came off as condescending to her and her culture. I'm not a fan of that support. Speaking of Kaze does he have any good supports besides the one with Corrin?

kaze's support with felicia is super cute and great

or at least I think it is

oh wait you meant silas didn't you

Edited by maybe
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There are quite a few and I'm leaving out the children as I deliberately ignored them to have some sort of new content once I get the game (had to read the other conversations to plan pairs I like, as I need a decent amount of chemistry to go with it if I like the characters). I can't think of any C-A support that annoys me too much (except Saizo/Felicia and M!Corrin/Scarlet) and mostly rate them with their S-Support in mind.

Talked about in abundance beforehand:

Jakob/Felicia - atrocious, abusive and asinine ("your tea sucks, so I believe we should get married")

M!Corrin/Hana - Why am I even talking to you, Hana? You're obviously stupid/ignorant, annoying, pushy and provocative. Do people like that?

Camilla/Keaton - This is the ONLY support I did for the stats as credible love is basically non-existent in the nonsense that is written here, which only works as a funny moment, nothing more.

M!Corrin/Camilla - I don't feel it, I just see someone feeling guilty, being almost forced to say yes. Wasn't the JP version better? I didn't mind the idea of the sister, loving the "brother" that she'd want more for a long time, but they wrote this terribly.

Camilla/Ryoma - Corrin? Corrin! Let's marry!

Saizo/Hinoka - hard to believe one wouldn't trust Saizo, but that S-conversation came out of nowhere.

Beruka/Xander - I don't see it in the S-support.... I just don't.

Corrin/Rhajat - Really? Another Tharja, even though her JP counterpart is well-written, or at least better than Tharja 2.0? Ugh.... this counts for both pair-ups. It doesn't feel right.

Extras from my part:

Saizo/Felicia - "you taught me a valuable lesson"; there should be a strong sense of trust between master and servant? Wtf? Saizo is one of the most loyal dudes, like Effie, Kagero, Hana, Oboro, etc. to their respective masters, why the hell would he learn that from Felicia? And learning that made him see her true nature and he loves it? So weak imo.

M!Corrin/Scarlet - WTF?!? Have you guys read the awesome support with F!Corrin? The one where you can actually feel a bond building up, with clever foreshadowing and an overall sweet tone? And then look at the freaking garbage when you want to marry her "Don't decorate my stuff too much, it's so girly, oh, but decorate me with your love, coz you did that one little decoration I kinda almost refused." This pisses me off the most (next to the obvious problem with Scarlet in Revelations), as I find Scarlet a very compelling character, even if I'm kinda in the minority with this.

M!Corrin/Effie: They actually managed to take out the only part where Effie gives reasoning for her affection towards Corrin (in the S-Support) making the entire confession even more questionable than it already is with the entirety of her support being about Elise and little to no bonding between the two participants. I know she is devoted to Elise, I don't mind that, but would it hurt to add a bit between those two? She is simple-minded, a little bit more of caring, expression of personal traits etc. would have made so much difference here. I had high hopes for this one, turns out they made it a no-brainer to avoid the s-relationship.

Azura/Kaden: I've seen people liking it, it's cute, I cannot deny that. As a C-A it's great, but the love-spark in S feels weird to me. Maybe it's just too rushed and I just arbitrarily needed a bit more convincing? Am I the only one? I see that Azura likes him for being nice and making her feel "at home", but soemthing's off and I can't put my finger on it.... I can see this me being weird.

There is more bad/uninteresting stuff, but I kinda don't want to search for them anymore. However, I want to add that I genuinely like some supports that are well-written and where I truly feel something building up (Silas/Mozu, Kaze/Felicia, Ryoma/Kagero, Saizo/Charlotte, Azama/Effie, Jakob/Rinkah (so much better than the japanese version) Hinata/Hana (unbelievable, a Hana support I like), Leo/Sakura, Laslow/Selena, Niles/Nyx, Benny/Beruka; just to name my pairs in Revelations I truly appreciate). Wish they would all be on that level of quality.

Edited by MonkeyCheez3K
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I like Kaze with Mozu; just mainly about their rivaling skills in potato peeling speed which eventually turns into him helping her train to be more useful on the battlefield. Probably boring to most people, but I like how quaint and simple it is. Also reveals how many odd things went into Kaze's ninja training, like cooking and painting fences.

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Well, to be fair, ninja did have to blend in with the common people.

I don't really like any of Rhajat's supports. At all. Must be because she is a Tharja clone. Are there any decent ones?

Selkie's and Mitama's was decent. Overall Rhajat was a downgrade from the JP version and even I will admit that.

I don't really like any of Asugi's supports. I don't like most of Caeldori's aside from her and Shiro.

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Forrest/Rhajat seemed decent to me; pretty quirky friendship without her being too creepy. I haven't read many of her other ones yet to see if she does it often, but if it helps she never mentions Corrin once, which is something I disliked about most of Tharja's supports and Robin. Although she maaaybe mentions Soleil or possibly Nina...??? Wonder if this was a reference since I can't imagine anyone else:

Rhajat: Hey, Forrest. Sorry for being weird the other day. And thank you for the clothes.

Forrest: Oh, you're welcome. I'm relieved to hear you say that. How did the clothes fit?

Rhajat: They fit perfectly. Almost as if you had been spying on me. But I know that you weren't. Because I caught the person who actually WAS spying on me. Heh. Heh. Let's just say...she won't make that mistake again...

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Well, to be fair, ninja did have to blend in with the common people.

I don't really like any of Rhajat's supports. At all. Must be because she is a Tharja clone. Are there any decent ones?

I'd dare to say Rhajat/Hisame is rather decent. You can feel the Tharja flair, but it also is more tame and less obnoxious. I could see them bonding over tea. That's just me, though.

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Rhajat/Hisame was p good yeah

I'm not quite sure how bad Caeldori/Rhajat is (iirc it's now Caeldori wants to be darker or something?) but the japanese version was bad bad bad. I'm very disappointed because I hoped their conversation was going to be about how they subtly recognize each other and feel like they've lived two lives and blah blah blah.

But no, we had to go for the boob joke lmao

EDIT: to make things clearer, I don't like the boob jokes at all, I'm glad it got changed. Sorry if that wasn't clear enough haha

Edited by Shadowess
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It really is a shame that Scarlet, one of my top mvps in Birthright plus mai waifu for me, has a poor build up in her supports with Mamui. Female Kamui's support should have been the male's tbh. The build up was too... platonic and repetitive.

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Rhajat/Hisame was p good yeah

I'm not quite sure how bad Caeldori/Rhajat is (iirc it's now Caeldori wants to be darker or something?) but the japanese version was bad bad bad. I'm very disappointed because I hoped their conversation was going to be about how they subtly recognize each other and feel like they've lived two lives and blah blah blah.

But no, we had to go for the boob joke lmao

What we got was Caeldori wanted not to be seen as such a goodie two shoes. So, she asked Rhajat for pointers. They could have still left the Summer Scramble reference part of the original support with the new subject. But, they couldn't even get that part right.

Oh and Shiro and Rhajat's support also had a boob joke taking out as well. In the B-rank, he said that folks who don't eat meat will get thin and frail, and then added that Rhajat doesn't count. In the Japanese version, he said that girls who don't eat meat in particular won't get bigger breasts, and then added that Rhajat shouldn't worry about that.

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Rhajat/Hisame was p good yeah

I'm not quite sure how bad Caeldori/Rhajat is (iirc it's now Caeldori wants to be darker or something?) but the japanese version was bad bad bad. I'm very disappointed because I hoped their conversation was going to be about how they subtly recognize each other and feel like they've lived two lives and blah blah blah.

But no, we had to go for the boob joke lmao

The boob jokes from Awakening weren't good and they're still not good in JP Fates. I'm so glad NoA/NoE tactically nuked everything to do with Cordelia/Caeldori's boob angst. Yes, some girls wish they could be bigger. No it's not good for a repeat gag in a game aimed for teenagers/young adults who probably already have body issues. Not in the context they try to present anyway. Speaking of boobs, I know people are praising it with heavy sarcasm as it was actually terrible, but Azama x Kagero was also just... there is no words for that, really. Even if it was made into something boring, it's still a step above sexual harassment. It's a shame Soleil x Ophelia still made it in, but even Soleil is at least apologetic.

http://megidoladying.tumblr.com/post/133858152324/asama-and-kagerou-supports-c-s

Whoever wrote this should honestly work on another game where this might be appropriate.

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The boob jokes from Awakening weren't good and they're still not good in JP Fates. I'm so glad NoA/NoE tactically nuked everything to do with Cordelia/Caeldori's boob angst. Yes, some girls wish they could be bigger. No it's not good for a repeat gag in a game aimed for teenagers/young adults who probably already have body issues. Not in the context they try to present anyway. Speaking of boobs, I know people are praising it with heavy sarcasm as it was actually terrible, but Azama x Kagero was also just... there is no words for that, really. Even if it was made into something boring, it's still a step above sexual harassment. It's a shame Soleil x Ophelia still made it in, but even Soleil is at least apologetic.

http://megidoladying.tumblr.com/post/133858152324/asama-and-kagerou-supports-c-s

Whoever wrote this should honestly work on another game where this might be appropriate.

Words cannot describe how thankful I am that they changed Azama/Kagero. Reading it made me physically uncomfortable. It's still not the best, but it's better than what we could've gotten. Unfortunately Soleil/Ophelia still isn't great, and pretty much outlines what I don't like about Soleil as a character. Even her apologising is unfortunately limited by the current support setup in which she could apologise for harassing Ophelia then go on to harass Forrest in the next few minutes.

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The boob jokes from Awakening weren't good and they're still not good in JP Fates. I'm so glad NoA/NoE tactically nuked everything to do with Cordelia/Caeldori's boob angst. Yes, some girls wish they could be bigger. No it's not good for a repeat gag in a game aimed for teenagers/young adults who probably already have body issues. Not in the context they try to present anyway. Speaking of boobs, I know people are praising it with heavy sarcasm as it was actually terrible, but Azama x Kagero was also just... there is no words for that, really. Even if it was made into something boring, it's still a step above sexual harassment. It's a shame Soleil x Ophelia still made it in, but even Soleil is at least apologetic.

http://megidoladying.tumblr.com/post/133858152324/asama-and-kagerou-supports-c-s

Whoever wrote this should honestly work on another game where this might be appropriate.

? Ohhhh I didn't make myself clear ooops

I'm actually quite glad the support got changed from boob jokes, albeit the topic I was hoping from Caeldori/Rhajat was something about reincarnations. I was just wishing it had nothing to do with boobs, that was all.

I'm sorry I didn't make that clear!

edit: i'm also glad azama/kagero got changed, that was a really bad support in the original oh gosh.

Edited by Shadowess
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? Ohhhh I didn't make myself clear oh god I better clear myself up

I'm actually quite glad the support got changed from boob jokes, albeit the topic I was expecting from Caeldori/Rhajat had nothing to do with breasts. I was just wishing it had nothing to do with boobs, that was all

I'm sorry I didn't make that clear!

No I understood you and agreed with you. I actually didn't like that the original referenced the Summer Scramble because I didn't like the Summer Scramble convo, though it was a beach episode so the "bodies in bikinis" comparison could actually work in that context. But then in Fates it ended up being "How can I have a sexy body like yours?" and it was so cringeworthy. Considering the Scramble DLC was also optional and not free, the reference would probably go over the heads of 90% of Fates players (we don't know how many people bought the Scramble DLC but the adoption rate is surely not 100%). Cordelia's boob anxiety was a front-and-center part of her personality in JP Awakening as well, going so far as to straight up ask M!Avatar to grope her. Absolutely abysmal characterization.

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Laslow x Charlotte --> Dat S Support... I know there are people who might do that, but what the heck. The shocking thing is that with parents like this, hitting on everyone, it would be the one who best explains Soleil's personality. Growing up with these two as role models...

Kana x mother --> I think they overdid the cute thing with Kana.

Fem.Corrin x Gunther --> They marry because they play too much handball together. Ok, I'm being nitpicky here. Gunther cared a lot for Corrin, refusing to beat her from a direct order of King Garon. It's just that Gunther gives the idea of falling for her at a much younger age... Nothing wrong with that, if that didn't imply she was a mere kid by then.

Arthur x Elise --> It's actually not bad. I think like many other supports, the problem with this one is that they have to accept the proposal right away.

I think some supports, like the one above and many others would be much better if the S support worked like Izana or Flora recruitment: Building lvl 3 then they come after a map or castle is visited. This S, like others, could have this same effect. She returns and says something like: "You know, we have some differences, age, habits, or whatever, but I couldn't stop thinking about you, or the good times we spent together, or something like that" and then accept a map/castle visit/day later.

Edited by Lanko
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Gunter's S rank is really, really creepy for obvious reasons, but it pisses me off because they actually did manage to successfully show a good surrogate father-daughter relationship, and then they completely ruin it by having them marry. It gets worse when you realize in Revelation that he had a wife and kid beforehand, yet never brings it up in his support.

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Gunter's S rank is really, really creepy for obvious reasons, but it pisses me off because they actually did manage to successfully show a good surrogate father-daughter relationship, and then they completely ruin it by having them marry. It gets worse when you realize in Revelation that he had a wife and kid beforehand, yet never brings it up in his support.

Agreed. I hate that s support so much. What also makes it gross is that Gunter is the one who proposes. Creepy.

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Oboro x Hinata. It's like the Alan x Lance support only with the word "cool" thrown around about a dozen times. A few of the other "let's compete over who can be more awesomely loyal to ____" supports rubbed me the wrong way, too, though at least those weren't filled with worship of a character I dislike.

I've seen Oboro and Hinata's support be brought up here quite a bit and to offer a point of dissent I think it's a pretty good support. Yes they are fawning over Takumi some but they are his retainers. Not only that but it shows how they are as his retainers. Just as Effie and Arthur in their support show their sheer dedication to Elise, Oboro and Hinata show theirs in their support. However because they are two different sets of characters they come off different. Hinata can be pretty immature at times and in this support it also shows some of Oboro's immature side as well. (which actually is really nice to see because she acts a lot more mature in other support convos, it gives her even more depth.) It kinda gives their retainerness it's own characteristic, a sorta friendly take-shots at each other and act sorta immature way. Sure Takumi love may be part of the core of it, but even if you ignore it, it does show quite a bit about the two characters.

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Agreed. I hate that s support so much. What also makes it gross is that Gunter is the one who proposes. Creepy.

To be fair, Fem.Corrin does encourage him to do that. I think there's a line that he says he had an eye for her years ago but I'm not finding it. Not sure if it's My Room convo or I'm confusing it with someone else.

Gunter: Is there anyone in camp that you have particularly strong feelings for?

Avatar: Wh-what? Why would you ask that?

Gunter: Ah, I'm the one who is asking questions.

Avatar: That's fair... There is someone in camp, yes...

Gunter: Really? I see. Then... Tell me, milady, who is this person?

Avatar: You really want to know, Gunter? It's... Well, it's you.

Gunter: It is?! Lady Avatar, I had no idea. I had no idea you felt the same as I do.

Avatar: Gunter, do you mean...?

Gunter: I care very deeply for you. I kept it to myself because you are my liege, though. I thought for sure that I would be taking these feelings to my grave, but... Hearing you say that you cared for me... I couldn't remain silent. Ah, that felt so good to finally say. I'm sorry if it is too much to take in at once.

Avatar: Gunter, you should throw the ball again.

Gunter: Excuse me, milady?

Avatar: If I don't catch it, you'll have to ask something of me again... And I can guess that it will be "Can we be together?"

Gunter: Avatar...

Avatar: It's all or nothing, Gunter! You'd better throw that ball really high!

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Surprised that no one has mentioned any of the the Hoshido siblings S-Support with Corrin.

"Mom wrote a letter before she died saying it's okay for us to bang." Way to go against the theme of the game, IS.

And I know Corrin joins Hoshido because it's the right thing to do. But it just seems stupid when you consider how Fates was advertised.

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Also I don't think Kaze/Rinkah is a bad support but I felt it disappointing in that they're two people with such a major shared life experience and they'd rather waste the support on candy(eng)/pastries(jp). It felt like a letdown. Considering chapter 2 and all I wanted a deeper support from them (plenty of other people to do humor with) I was just really disappointed in it. On a less personal level I wouldn't say it's bad, but personally I am unsatisfied.

I agree on this. I was looking forward to the support chain to see more of their backstory and such but it never really came. It's just a wasted opportunity. There was more to learn about the two of them D:

Oh god, after reading through this thread I'm a little afraid. I've just started Birthright and I was planning on doing Azama/Orochi. I didn't think the C rank was too bad; does it go terribly downhill from there? Are there any non-dickish supports for him?

Don't worry. Azama/Orochi is a pretty good ship in the game. It's great because Orochi trolls Azama back. Since they're both sorta trolls it actually does work between them imo.

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