Anyone else salty that Nintendo missed another opportunity to translate pre FE7 games?

[AzimuthFE]

Treehouse is top tier when it comes to localization so yes.

BAHAHAHAHA!

Seriously, though, I can see it now:

Julia: That day Manfroy brought the book of Loptyr here, you became a demon!

Julius: How dare you! I am a proud and noble Loptyrkin! I am proud of the blood that flows in my veins. You should check your privilege!

Julia: You are correct. I should have realized that I was not treating you with the respect you deserve. Please forgive my microaggression.

THE END

Either that or they replace all the dialog with ellipses and have Seliph and Lewyn kiss.

[epilepsyduck]

I can't wait for the day when people stop being hypersensitive babies about the Fates localization.

On topic, I'd be salty if I ever expected it to happen in the first place. Even if the rumors about Mother 3 being translated after all this time are true, I sort of doubt Nintendo would be getting its money's worth out of translating the older FE games. I expect a lot of veteran fans would just stick to fan translations, newer fans may be turned off due to how different the games are from modern offerings, and people who've never touched the series before would likely ignore it completely. I don't mean any of that as an insult to anyone, it's just kind of how I see it playing out.

[Etrurian emperor]

I don't think a Mother 3 translation can be compared to that of an early Fire emblem one. Mother 3 and its reputation are something of a phenomenon in the Nintendo fanbase, its existence and its lack of a release are well known and well lamented. Smash Bros and subspace emissary also gave everyone a good idea of who Lucas is and why we should care about him.

People know Lucas and want to play his game but I don't think many people not already fan of Fire emblem knows or cares about the older games not being released. Not unless the question of ''Are Marth and Roy in this game'' can't be answered with a yes at least.

Edited April 11, 2016 by Etrurian emperor

[solrocknroll]

Sorry when I said Awakening kiddies, didn't mean to condescend. I meant it more like a trainee from SS(I started with awakening too). And if you like FE13 continue enjoying it :)

all three trainees are horrible units so that analogy became worse

especially since you're implying they aren't as important and are as such just trainees. an expert on awakening is still an expert

BAHAHAHAHA!

Seriously, though, I can see it now:

Julia: That day Manfroy brought the book of Loptyr here, you became a demon!

Julius: How dare you! I am a proud and noble Loptyrkin! I am proud of the blood that flows in my veins. You should check your privilege!

Julia: You are correct. I should have realized that I was not treating you with the respect you deserve. Please forgive my microaggression.

THE END

Either that or they replace all the dialog with ellipses and have Seliph and Lewyn kiss.

woah this is a generalization

not only is nintendo not tumblr, but you seem offended that tumblr even exists if you use terms like check your privledge in a parody. even though that's often pretty legitimate because a lot of people don't realize they have a good life compared to other people

and if seliph and levin did kiss, ignoring the hebephilia involved here, how would this be a problem exactly? are you implying that Niles and Rhajat were bad additions or something? i'm also not seeing the downside to ellipses because suikoden ii had more ellipses than any media you'll ever read and people still love the story

Edited April 17, 2016 by Ms. Bunch

[AzimuthFE]

woah this is a generalization

not only is nintendo not tumblr, but you seem offended that tumblr even exists if you use terms like check your privledge in a parody. even though that's often pretty legitimate because a lot of people don't realize they have a good life compared to other people

My point was that as NoA cram agendas into their localizations, the line between Nintendo and tumblr is becoming increasingly blurred. Personally I don't think "check your privilege" is a valid discussion point. It immediately implies that the other person's views are invalid because they grew up white/straight/rich/whatever. In other words, it's designed to shut discussions down, not start them. Besides, I was just using it as an example of the type of thing NoA has been putting in their games recently.

and if seliph and levin did kiss, ignoring the hebephilia involved here, how would this be a problem exactly? are you implying that Niles and Rhajat were bad additions or something? i'm also not seeing the downside to ellipses because suikoden ii had more ellipses than any media you'll ever read and people still love the story

The fact that neither character is gay in the original? I was poking fun at the way NoA's changes characters to fit their agenda (I didn't make that quip about Julius being proud of his blood idly, when NoA are putting shit like this into their localizations). Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with ellipses, but when they start

that's a problem. Edited April 17, 2016 by AzimuthFE

[solrocknroll]

My point was that as NoA cram agendas into their localizations, the line between Nintendo and tumblr is becoming increasingly blurred. Personally I don't think "check your privilege" is a valid discussion point. It immediately implies that the other person's views are invalid because they grew up white/straight/rich/whatever. In other words, it's designed to shut discussions down, not start them. Besides, I was just using it as an example of the type of thing NoA has been putting in their games recently.

The fact that neither character is gay in the original? I was poking fun at the way NoA's changes characters to fit their agenda (I didn't make that quip about Julius being proud of his blood idly, when NoA are putting shit like this into their localizations). Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with ellipses, but when they start replacing entire conversations with them that's a problem.

agendas? really now? what honestly are you talking about?

I do honestly believe that if someone did have a good life, then it's harder for them to comment on someone else's hardships without witnessing them in at least some way. It'd be like if a non-depressed person told a depressed person to just get over it. They legitimately would not understand.

A character's sexuality can change. Jem's Kimber and Stormer are lesbians in recent stories. Korra and Asami likely didn't find out about themselves before each other. Those are two different situations from this, but a character's sexuality isn't set in stone. This particular situation would be pretty nonsensical because there's no insinuation in any form. I agree that this example doesn't make sense, but what about Raven and Lucius if FE7 was remade? If this remake flat out made their subtext into text, would that be change for the sake of furthering an agenda?

As for the ellipses thing, it's probably the only real downside to Fates' localization. Even then, at least it isn't a mistranslation. Besides, I see people ignore all the good translations like Pikmin 3, Xenoblade X, Splatoon, and Paper Mario: Sticker Star just because of an instance of Doge in Tri Force Heroes.

Edited April 17, 2016 by Ms. Bunch

[Gradivus.]

Making Celice and Lewyn kiss each other would just be a needless and forced retcon because it wasn't there in the original and would be plot irrelevant. I don't get what's worth defending about it.

[Alertcircuit]

It's hard for Nintendo to know if there's a demand for these games. I'm not sure how well the Gameboy games sold on the VC, but if they didn't exceed expectations I don't think they'd want to risk spending money on translating and advertising these old games that new players may or may not even respond to.

Also, keep in mind that Awakening and Fates were released on the 3DS, while FE3 and FE4 would be released on the Wii U. FE definitely has a large handheld fanbase, but there's no way of knowing if it translates to sales on console.

My point was that as NoA cram agendas into their localizations. the line between Nintendo and tumblr is becoming increasingly blurred.

Examples? I'm not really seeing it. A pretty solid chunk of the edits in Fates were either to take out stuff that was creepy, or to add humor. They seemed to be doing what they thought would make a better product, not pushing an agenda.

[AzimuthFE]

agendas? really now? what honestly are you talking about?

This is a good example of changing a character to fit an agenda. They deliberately changed a characters straight romantic pairings to "lifelong friendships" to make her appear lesbian or at least bisexual.

I do honestly believe that if someone did have a good life, then it's harder for them to comment on someone else's hardships without witnessing them in at least some way. It'd be like if a non-depressed person told a depressed person to just get over it. They legitimately would not understand.

Fine if that's what you believe, though I stand by my assertion that a person's age/sex/money/etc. is not suitable grounds for judging their life experiences. When you say "check your privilege" to someone you're basically saying, "based on this immediately obvious aspect of your person, I feel suitably equipped to judge that you have never experienced true hardships in your life". It simply isn't a valid point in a discussion.

A character's sexuality can change. Jem's Kimber and Stormer are lesbians in recent stories. Korra and Asami likely didn't find out about themselves before each other. Those are two different situations from this, but a character's sexuality isn't set in stone. This particular situation would be pretty nonsensical because there's no insinuation in any form. I agree that this example doesn't make sense, but what about Raven and Lucius if FE7 was remade? If this remake flat out made their subtext into text, would that be change for the sake of furthering an agenda?

If Raven and Lucius were actively trading saliva in the original JP version then fine. If they decided to make it obvious because "LOOK HOW PROGRESSIVE WE ARE GUYS" then that's an issue. It's unnecessary and disrespectful to the original work.

As for the ellipses thing, it's probably the only real downside to Fates' localization. Even then, at least it isn't a mistranslation. Besides, I see people ignore all the good translations like Pikmin 3, Xenoblade X, Splatoon, and Paper Mario: Sticker Star just because of an instance of Doge in Tri Force Heroes.

I'm glad we can agree on something. The ellipses (and typos) are a major issue. Are people ignoring the other localizations? It isn't really a good counter to criticism of one game to say "but these other games are really good!"

To get back to the OP's topic, AlertCircuit said that NoA take out things they deem "creepy". It is the consensus that incest is considered creepy, and that's the crux of FE4's plot. If you take all the incest, hebephilia and other things NoA considers "inappropriate" out of FE4 then what are you left with? An Advance Wars game, that's what.

Edited April 17, 2016 by AzimuthFE

[Lord Raven]

To get back to the OP's topic, AlertCircuit said that NoA take out things they deem "creepy". It is the consensus that incest is considered creepy, and that's the crux of FE4's plot. If you take all the incest, hebephilia and other things NoA considers "inappropriate" out of FE4 then what are you left with? An Advance Wars game, that's what.

As it turns out, I don't think anything about the incest in FE4 was actually treated as anything but wrong and creepy. From kidnapping Deirdre to having her marry Arvis while being manipulated by the evil Lopt church - however when it's so casual and treated as pretty much not creepy and acceptable (and I don't want to get into a debate about the acceptability of incest here) then it gets weird.

Fine if that's what you believe, though I stand by my assertion that a person's age/sex/money/etc. is not suitable grounds for judging their life experiences. When you say "check your privilege" to someone you're basically saying, "based on this immediately obvious aspect of your person, I feel suitably equipped to judge that you have never experienced true hardships in your life". It simply isn't a valid point in a discussion.

That's not how that works though! If someone is using it in this way, then it's pretty easy to negate by saying that they're making both a generalization and pushing an extreme, but that's not how privilege works at all.

EDIT for clarification: The idea is that if a rich person is telling a poorer person that it's easy to be well off, just go out there and get an education and get a job, then the rich person needs to "check his privilege" so to speak. There are certain things - socially and economically - that are easier to do because of things like race/money/connections/etc and there are people who were born in a situation that allows them more success. I'm not sure how old you are to comment on your age but from my experience - with tons of people - some people are just set up to fail from the get go because they don't have the privilege that other people have, and it can often be as shallow as race.

EDIT: correct me if I'm wrong as well but didn't they change just about every single S-support into a close friendship in the localization? I remember hearing about changing Kana's S supports into good friendships as well because Kana is like 7. So is Nintendo pushing an anti-pedophilia stance into their games too?

Edited April 17, 2016 by Lord Raven

[AzimuthFE]

As it turns out, I don't think anything about the incest in FE4 was actually treated as anything but wrong and creepy. From kidnapping Deirdre to having her marry Arvis while being manipulated by the evil Lopt church - however when it's so casual and treated as pretty much not creepy and acceptable (and I don't want to get into a debate about the acceptability of incest here) then it gets weird.

That's not how that works though! If someone is using it in this way, then it's pretty easy to negate by saying that they're making both a generalization and pushing an extreme, but that's not how privilege works at all.

EDIT for clarification: The idea is that if a rich person is telling a poorer person that it's easy to be well off, just go out there and get an education and get a job, then the rich person needs to "check his privilege" so to speak. There are certain things - socially and economically - that are easier to do because of things like race/money/connections/etc and there are people who were born in a situation that allows them more success. I'm not sure how old you are to comment on your age but from my experience - with tons of people - some people are just set up to fail from the get go because they don't have the privilege that other people have, and it can often be as shallow as race.

EDIT: correct me if I'm wrong as well but didn't they change just about every single S-support into a close friendship in the localization? I remember hearing about changing Kana's S supports into good friendships as well because Kana is like 7. So is Nintendo pushing an anti-pedophilia stance into their games too?

I wouldn't say that it's treated as wrong and creepy. Sure Dierdre is kidnapped and brainwashed but there's no stigma attached to other characters who pair up with relatives. In fact, I'm pretty sure that Ares says to Nanna (if paired) "Aren't we cousins?" and her response is basically "lol yeah". NoA would probably remove ALL references to incest in the game and have Julia and Julius born through immaculate conception or something. We are faced with the possibility that NoA will either cut the story to ribbons or not bother with it at all. That was my point.

I'm fully aware of the idea of privilege. I was pointing out that saying "check your privilege" is just a cheap way to attack and discredit the other person. If the poorer person replied "check your privilege" to the rich person, are they going to think "oh shit, that remark has really made me think about my life and circumstances"? I doubt it. Like I said before, it's designed to derail and shut down discussions.

As for the Kana thing, NoA changed that because sex with children is against the law. If they left the dialog in unchanged then people might think that Nintendo are encouraging illegal behavior. Making a character gay isn't in response to any laws. They are only changing that character because either they like gay people and think that this character would be better as a gay person regardless of what the original creator intended, or they are just trying to show how progressive they are, which in disingenuous.

Edited April 17, 2016 by AzimuthFE

[bethany81707]

I'm not really salty about it because I don't expect Nintendo to ever bring those games to the west.

I may not like it but there is a certain logic in the Jugdral games remaining in the past. The continent lacks the smash appeal that Marth and Roy brought to their respective continents and it also doesn't have a western game directly alluding to it like 7 did to 6. How weird the games are in comparison is something I love but its also something that may work against them in this regard.

It being less marketable makes it hard for the game to return the costs it would take to localize the games.

I also suspect Nintento just doesn't like the games.

There's another problem: why on earth are Judgral still limited to two alternate costumes and fragments of medleys? I'd love to hear Light and Dark, see a trophy of Sigurd, anything at all that actually shows Judgral was a good continent? They didn't even have a sticker in Brawl.

[Katie]

Tbh, I think the only way we'll get FE2-6 is if they get remade.

[Tamagon]

who's laughing now dickcheeses

laugh at my boy theo again and you'll get your ass beat

Edited October 22, 2020 by Tamagon

[Ricey]

And for only $6. Not bad.