My thoughts on Birthright/Conquest so far

[poptdp]

So I purchased Birthright as my "main" physical copy. I played it on Normal Classic and am now playing Conquest on Hard Classic (downloaded). I have to admit, I am loving Conquest WAY better. The map conditions are awesome and I'm having so much fun with them. I admit the story IS pretty stupid but not as bad as most people made it out to be, I kind of enjoy that it's in the morally grey area.

Here's why I picked Birthright though:

1. I like having post-game content (challenges) which Conquest does not have

2. I actually like the Birthright characters better (though I like Conquest's royals more)

Here's why I enjoyed Conquest more:

1. Maps and conditions are awesome and winning the uphill battles are rewarding. Because of the difficulty, each unit feels more valuable

2. Story isn't as boring like Birthright

My question is this. Did I pick the wrong physical copy? Will I have as much fun with Birthright if I played it on Lunatic or something?

Which version did you personally enjoy more overall?

Edited May 30, 2016 by poptdp

[MCProductions]

Conquest represent.

I got the Special Edition, so I can't say if you bought the wrong physical version or not. Conquest technically has a post game thru DLC and My Castle, but it's more limited than BR's and Revs obviously

[Thane]

So I purchased Birthright as my "main" physical copy. I played it on Normal Classic and am now playing Conquest on Hard Classic (downloaded). I have to admit, I am loving Conquest WAY better. The map conditions are awesome and I'm having so much fun with them. I admit the story IS pretty stupid but not as bad as most people made it out to be, I kind of enjoy that it's in the morally grey area.

When did that happen?

[poptdp]

When did that happen?

When you know what your "father" is but continue to do his bidding?

[Thane]

When you know what your "father" is but continue to do his bidding?

I'm not sure I see what it has to do with morality - I try to never talk about it since it leads to such long debates in which you end up saying very little, but I'm pretty sure that just makes Corrin an idiot, not morally ambiguous.

[NekoKnight]

I got the Birthright hardcopy but it was mostly for the aesthetics (and I was going to play both versions). I like classes and characters from both sides but Conquest has way better level design.

When you know what your "father" is but continue to do his bidding?

He doesn't agree with morally ambiguous principles, he's just deluded himself into thinking he's doing the right thing by doing everything wrong.

[BrightBow]

Oh man, I so facepalmed when Corrin talked some bullshit about the whole war being somehow "gray" early on. Black and white situations don't suddenly become grey just because you personally decide to embrace the dark side. But if nothing else Corrin is always firmly rooted in the centre of his own personal universe, so I guess it's impossible for him to think otherwise.

Edited May 30, 2016 by BrightBow

[Sasori]

I have only played through most of Conquest so far and while I can't say I think the story is good, its still less awfull then I thought. At the least it had something interesting going on with Corrin first trying to reform Nohr from withing by acting like a goody two shoes, getting that hope dashed in Chev and then following Leo's advice about trying to minimise the damage, while pretending to follow Garon's orders. It was also quite entertaining to see him troll Iago. I hadn't expected that since the most I heard about Corrin was him being a total pansy.

It does its best in ruining the good things with stupid stuff like the crystal ball, Garon and his lack of nuance, the deeprealms and I still have to see the stupid Gooron reveal.

Edited May 30, 2016 by Sasori

[Thane]

I have only played through most of Conquest so far and while I can't say I think the story is good, its still less awfull then I thought. At the least it had something interesting going on with Corrin first trying to reform Nohr from withing by acting like a goody two shoes, getting that hope dashed in Chev and then following Leo's advice about trying to minimise the damage, while pretending to follow Garon's orders. It was also quite entertaining to see him troll Iago. I hadn't expected that since the most I heard about Corrin was him being a total pansy.

It does its best in ruining the good things with stupid stuff like the crystal ball, Garon and his lack of nuance, the deeprealms and I still have to see the stupid Gooron reveal.

Don't worry, it gets better.

And by better I mean worse.

[Captain Karnage]

Don't worry, it gets better.

And by better I mean worse.

Thane, why do you keep making it out to be the worst thing ever.

I've been gaming my whole life and have been playing FE for atleast 10 years now and Conquest is no where near some of the garbage games I've been exposed to

I will say that I did enjoy Conquest's story the most out of the trilogy, I certanly forund it to be less of a snooze fest than Shadow Dragon, Awakening, and Birthright

[UNLEASH IT]

Thane, why do you keep making it out to be the worst thing ever.

I've been gaming my whole life and have been playing FE for atleast 10 years now and Conquest is no where near some of the garbage games I've been exposed to

I will say that I did enjoy Conquest's story the most out of the trilogy, I certanly forund it to be less of a snooze fest than Shadow Dragon, Awakening, and Birthright

I won't say that I'm speaking for him (yes he can be quite negative about things) but Fates was hyped up as some epic story, so expectations were very high. What we basically ended up with was "GRORIOUS NIPPON" accompanied by numerous inconsistencies, so it makes sense that people are upset with the story.

[poptdp]

I have only played through most of Conquest so far and while I can't say I think the story is good, its still less awfull then I thought. At the least it had something interesting going on with Corrin first trying to reform Nohr from withing by acting like a goody two shoes, getting that hope dashed in Chev and then following Leo's advice about trying to minimise the damage, while pretending to follow Garon's orders. It was also quite entertaining to see him troll Iago. I hadn't expected that since the most I heard about Corrin was him being a total pansy.

It does its best in ruining the good things with stupid stuff like the crystal ball, Garon and his lack of nuance, the deeprealms and I still have to see the stupid Gooron reveal.

This.

In the end, whether or not Conquest's story was good or bad, I find it WAY more interesting than Birthright. Even if Birthright was more well done etc, it was so damn boring apart from 1 or 2 death scenes

[NekoKnight]

I'd call it an even toss up between a story that bores me and a story that makes me angry. I rate Conquest equal to Revelation for this reason.

[Captain Karnage]

I won't say that I'm speaking for him (yes he can be quite negative about things) but Fates was hyped up as some epic story, so expectations were very high. What we basically ended up with was "GRORIOUS NIPPON" accompanied by numerous inconsistencies, so it makes sense that people are upset with the story.

I learned a long time ago not to get on hype trains for games for any reasons, I've been burned 1 to many times

I went into fates with zero expectations and was pleased with what I got.

take it to heart for all games, don't get hyped, you'll enjoy everything better when you have no expectations for it.

and because of Thane my expectations were set even lower,

thanks Thane, I enjoyed the story more because you set expectations low

This.

In the end, whether or not Conquest's story was good or bad, I find it WAY more interesting than Birthright. Even if Birthright was more well done etc, it was so damn boring apart from 1 or 2 death scenes

same

Edited May 31, 2016 by Captain Karnage

[darkestdarkness]

I heard the CQ's story was bad before I started it, but for me that sadly turned out to be true. most of the time I thought I was stuck in some parallel universe where everyone decided they were in dumb and dumber: fire emblem edition, save for ch.26. sad thing is it had the most potential for an intriguing story and admittedly first few chapters were bordering interesting but any hope of CQ's story being at least half decent was shattered by end of ch.15.

that said, CQ has the best gameplay imo. when I replay CQ I just mash start button to skip most story cutscenes.

[Thane]

Thane, why do you keep making it out to be the worst thing ever.

I've been gaming my whole life and have been playing FE for atleast 10 years now and Conquest is no where near some of the garbage games I've been exposed to

I will say that I did enjoy Conquest's story the most out of the trilogy, I certanly forund it to be less of a snooze fest than Shadow Dragon, Awakening, and Birthright

A lot of us have been playing games all our lives, but my decades of playing don't change my opinion about Conquest. Even if I had just started playing video games yesterday it wouldn't invalidate how I feel about it since, at the end of the day, it all comes down to personal preference. Trying to use your experience in gaming in an attempt to invalidate someone else's opinion - especially in a video game forum where many people can say the same thing - is incredibly patronizing and insulting.

I've never had more than minor complaints about Conquest's gameplay, in fact I praise it frequently. For that reason, it's not a garbage game by default.

However, and this goes for Fates as a whole, I've never played a game that treats both itself and its players with such little respect. Its creators tried pleasing everone and having the cake and eating it at the same time, and as such, we've got a watered down version of what could've been, littered with fan service and player worshipping. The plot is so obfuscating and stupid, with characters acting in the most unnatural way possible that I'm surprised they even bothered trying to include a story. That's pretty much why I don't like it. It's not just that it's horrendous and sloppily written, but that it's actively insulting the player's intelligence

If you like this sort of thing, then more power to you. However, I've never understood the argument that lowered expectations somehow makes a fictional work better; you might not end up as disappointed as if you would've had high expectations, but it doesn't magically improve its quality.

[Avestus]

sad thing is it had the most potential for an intriguing story and admittedly first few chapters were bordering interesting but any hope of CQ's story being at least half decent was shattered by end of ch.15.

This.

Thane, why do you keep making it out to be the worst thing ever.

I've been gaming my whole life and have been playing FE for atleast 10 years now and Conquest is no where near some of the garbage games I've been exposed to

I will say that I did enjoy Conquest's story the most out of the trilogy, I certanly forund it to be less of a snooze fest than Shadow Dragon, Awakening, and Birthright

Well, Conquest is not as dull as Shadow Dragon, i agree. But while Shadow Dragon was dull, Conquest (the only version i've played so far) is offensively stupid. I haven't played FEs 1-5 and 12, but among all others Conquest's story is the worst.

Previous fire emblem games gave us world-building, they introduced all that feudal ties in different kindgoms which made every game relatively solid in terms of suspension of disbelief. It was always a medieval story where you always knew how the society functioned and why did all the people have the power, how they took their decisions and so on. The political structure of the world and thus reasoning for wars/alliances/betrayal was always clear. The story itself sometimes was simple, generic or even boring, but it was never THIS stupid.

Actually halfway thorugth the game i made my peace with it. After seeing that nothing about world's structure is ever properly explained or detailed, "Ok", i decided, "i'll think of the game's plot as of that one of tale, having the appropriate laws of tale". Tales can be still good. But ch.15 smashed my hopes. Because for fairy tale it's ok to introduce smth like "only this weapon can smash the big bad evil and to get it you need to pry it from the depth of Hoshido". Something like what was going on with legendary weapons in previous installations.

But here we don't have this tale-ish motivation. No. We have a completely stupid motivation (i try to avoid spoilers here) to conquer Hoshido which would've been impossible if the political structure of the world was depicted any better. It's childish writing. It's offensively stupid. It makes all the future tensions inside Corrin devoid of meaning, since he doesn't have neither his way nor the cause. He himself is a stupid lame plot clutch instead of a character and no one from the cast ever takes him up on that.

Edited May 31, 2016 by Avestus

[Captain Karnage]

Sorry Thane, I was never trying to invalidate your opinion. Maybe I should have rewritten that to say that I've experienced worse stories in games. What I'm meaning to say is that Fates is middle of the road quality for me.

[DragonFlames]

I played through Birthright and got to Conquest chapter 19 and I have to say...

Why exactly didn't Revelations branch off from Conquest chapter 18?

Have Corrin and Azura tell everyone present in Izumo the truth about Garon, convincing everyone, Hoshidans AND Nohrians to work together to uncover Garon's identity and kill the bastard with the combined power of the Fujin Yumi, Raijinto, Siegfried and Brynhildr. I mean, if my father would order me and my siblings (if I had any), to kill my other siblings and their homeland even though them and me didn't want to, I would flip him off, cut his head off and leave. I know its a game with a 'dramatic' story, but this problem's solution is too easy to excuse such a roundabout manner that - admittedly - is utterly stupid. One of the Nohrian royals just had to have the balls to say 'F*** you, Garon', kill the bastard and build a happy future along with Hoshido. But nope! They're all little wussies, killing countless people and potential family members for a stupid roundabout way to the same goal.

Conquest's story just took a deep leap down the Bottomless Valley/Chasm/Pit.

I'm sad.

Well, at least Birthright's story was decent and made sense. I hope Revelations doesn't disappoint me.

[Captain Karnage]

Well, at least Birthright's story was decent and made sense. I hope Revelations doesn't disappoint me.

Thane's not here, but this is what he'd probably say

[Thane]

Thane's not here, but this is what he'd probably say

I feel like I've been a bit TOO negative with my last few posts, so rather than posting something aggressive, I'll just say that this image is about right.

[Seifus]

I have the Conquest hard copy and currently at chapter 8 since it released, ch 15 for Birthright, and ch 18 for revelations. I'll admit the gameplay is fun but I generally play rpgs for the story as well, and the game let me down in that regard. I don't think that I'll be able to finish the games as I like a good story. Birthright's story from what I have experienced just kind of meanders, Revelations so far is just dumb, and after reading what happens in Conquest and people's opinions on it, I honestly want to beat IS over the head with the book "How NOT to Write a Novel." The children are pointless, My Castle could have been like Mother base but it is also forgotten by the plot. This game is actually stirs the same feelings I had for FF13, wondering what the heck was going on and not given motivation to be invested in the characters and plot, and actually FF13 made me give up on the series for five years before being sucked into FF14:HW.

So, I hope that the next one is better, but I'm not too hopeful.

Edited June 1, 2016 by Seifus