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*Birthright spoilers* what was your reaction to...


Alastor15243
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  1. 1. Flora's suicide: your reaction?

    • It was stupid/hilarious
      65
    • I felt nothing
      55
    • I cried
      20


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Flora's death is unfortunately, insignificant in the face of other character deaths.

Total death toll in the making of Fire Emblem Fates:

-Gunter (?)

-Mikoto

-Lilith

-Kaze

-Flora

-Elise

-Xander

-Azura

-Ryoma

-Takumi

-Izana

-Scarlet

-Sumeragi

-Arete

-... and a bunch of other peeps (like retainers, border guards, animals) one could honestly care less about in the story (only bothered to list cutscene deaths)

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I absolutely love Flora, but yeah, it was pretty dumb. I actually felt bad for Felicia more than I did for Flora because Felicia had to watch her sister bbq herself.

Pretty much this.

Flora's suicide just felt forced. Like the game was yelling at me to feel sad about this, when there was no reason for it to happen.

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I felt absolutely nothing about her death. The game hasn't set up any emotional connection between her and the rest of the cast, like mentioning their time together in the Northern Fortress, nor do we as players get any insight on why she should commit suicide other than "I have failed you, lord Corrin!" which is an alien feeling for most of us. And the affected characters shrugs it off so easily as well, despite their supposed grief. I don't want them to wallow in despair but at least there should be an emotional impact rather than "marching and kill Garon because that solves everything".

The deaths in Fates in general are absolutely unmoving, because we as an audience never feel any sadness of the character dying due to lack of good setup. The only time I felt somewhat moved was entering Lilith's shrine as usual only to discover that she is not there.

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I cried mainly because I Married her in conquest and she was one of my favorite characters. and to make it worse Rinkah finished her with a crit and her quote was you'll be cinders. so BlameRinkah

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I initially felt nothing because of how sudden it was.

And now it's grown into dislike since now I know that Flora's actions are basically the same across all 3 routes, making her sudden suicide in Birthright extremely out of place.

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I laughed, and the characters reactions to it by just standing there was hilarious it felt way too forced like much of the deaths in fates.

That being said I do like the idea of scripted deaths in FE games, FE4 did it right but fates doesn't.

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I initially felt nothing because of how sudden it was.

And now it's grown into dislike since now I know that Flora's actions are basically the same across all 3 routes, making her sudden suicide in Birthright extremely out of place.

Actually, no they're not. The circumstances are different in each route and it's actually pretty consistent internally.

Edited by Ryas
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Actually, no they're not. The circumstances are different in each route and it's actually pretty consistent internally.

The circumstances aren't all that different at all. In all 3 battles against her, she fights against Corrin for the sake of the Ice Tribe.

Following all 3 battles, she's regretful in each one for going against Corrin, yet somehow Birthright is the only one where she's suicidal.

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The circumstances aren't all that different at all. In all 3 battles against her, she fights against Corrin for the sake of the Ice Tribe.

Following all 3 battles, she's regretful in each one for going against Corrin, yet somehow Birthright is the only one where she's suicidal.

I'll explain, then.

Like I said, the circumstances are different in each route despite being the same conflict.

[spoiler=In Conquest]Corrin is sent to suppress the rebellion of the Ice tribe led by Kilma, chieftain and father of Flora. Flora fights to defend her village from what she perceives to be Nohrian invaders. When defeated in battle, Flora is defiant and berates Corrin's group for not finishing her off. Corrin responds to her hostilities with kindness and the conflict is settled peacefully without any serious blood spilled. Corrin reconciles with Flora.

[spoiler=In Revelation]Flora is sent along with Camilla and members of her tribe to assault Corrin's army. Garon holds her village hostage, but because he is careless and desperate due to his haste in trying to stop Corrin from reaching Anankos, Flora is given enough wiggle room to suggest to her father that the villagers secretly evacuate the village. Flora fights Corrin's group with an aggressively cold attitude and laments her defeat. Once again, the conflict is settled without serious blood spilled and Flora leaves to assist her father in leading her tribe into hiding.

[spoiler=All routes]Now, in Birthright, right off the bat, Kilma is completely absent from the narrative. Flora is acting as chief of the Ice tribe instead, and is even standing as the boss in the same spot Kilma is in Conquest. In the epilogues of Conquest, Flora eventually succeeds Kilma as chief of the Ice tribe, so her being the acting chief in Birthright can only really mean that Kilma is dead. So right off the bat, someone who Flora clearly deeply respected and wanted acknowledgement from is dead. How? Well, it's implied that Flora escapes the North Citadel not long after Corrin and Gunter heads for the Bottomless Canyon, and as Flora and Felicia are actually political prisoners of Nohr being held as hostages to prevent an insurrection from the Ice tribe, Flora escaping from Nohr and returning to her village is actually the key trigger for the rebellion. But without Corrin around, that means that Garon would have sent someone else to suppress the rebellion. Someone like say, Hans or Camilla, who certainly wouldn't have handled the suppression in the same way Corrin did.

So Kilma and Flora have a failed rebellion on their hands, and they're prepared to die for it. But while Kilma is executed, Flora is brought back to Garon instead, because he has other plans for her. He gives her the choice between letting her tribe be slaughtered, or killing Felicia and Corrin with her own hands. When she hesitates to make the choice, Garon threatens to kill her on the spot if she can't choose, giving her 30 seconds. Under the threat of death, Flora chooses to kill Felicia and Corrin, a choice which must have surely haunted her. Not only that, but she's forced to take orders from Iago, and is sent to infiltrate and deceive Corrin and Felicia, and lure them to her own village in order to ambush them and kill them, all the while continuing to act as though everything was normal and bantering with Corrin and Felicia as usual. The guilt must have eaten her alive, and the difference in her attitude can be seen clearly in her defeat quote where she thanks Corrin's group for stopping her. Her pride has been completely broken and none of her defiance or composure in the other routes can be seen in her. Even in her battle quote against Corrin she loses her cool and lashes out. It's the same for her other dialogue, where it's clear she has a much more defeatist and resigned attitude to everything. All the collective events resulted in a much heavier guilty conscience than in the other routes.

Edited by Ryas
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Responding to the OP:

I laughed when Flora died. It was so ridiculous. "Oh, I'm going to just LIGHT MY SELF ON FIRE NOW, don't mind me."

That was so bat shit crazy. Why didn't she just do a simple knife to the throat? That's what...

[spoiler=Tactics Ogre Spoilers]

...Catiua did when Denam answers her questions poorly in Chapter 4.

Having someone burn themselves alive would warrant a M rating over having that person stab himself, lol. Why would Flora deciding to stab herself be too violent to show ESPECIALLY considering that...

[spoiler=Conquest Spoilers]

Ryoma does EXACTLY THAT in the end of Conquest! LOL.

Also, how the hell does Flora have fire powers when she's a part of the ice tribe!?!?!

This is exactly why I dislike Birthright so much. Though Conquest's plot sucks in some ways, at least it tried to have more dignity when it came to certain sad scenes. Lol, Kaze falls to his death even when Hinoka's around. Lol, let's have Flora light herself on fire. How ironic!

Elise's death was done well, though. Stupid Xander...

Forgive the ranting tone. Birthright's story angers me. I'm so surprised that quality control at IS let that slide.

Edited by Leif
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Jakob and Felicia were right there. If she just stabbed herself, they'd just be able to heal her right back up, just like

[spoiler=Revelation]when Gunter stabs himself through with a sword with the full intent to kill himself, only for Sakura and Elise to save him with their staves.

Flora went that extra mile to make sure they couldn't help her.

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Flora's death was terrible, for reasons already stated. Her lighting on fire makes no sense, her calmly monologuing as the fire conumes her is beyond ridiculous and broke any immersion I might have had with the scene. Even her actions are pretty bizarre, but that pales beyond how the scene itself plays out.

I don't share the view that all the deaths in Fates are poorly done. Those of Elise and Ryoma certainly got to me, for instance. But it does have a lot of bad ones, and this one tops the list, along with Lilith's.

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Oh, you mean when her mixtape dropped?

I prefer Flora over Felicia so I feel they did my girl wrong. I felt bad but only because of how cringey the entire set up was. I sat there thinking, "Is Flora's momma from the Fire Tribe?"

Edited by SaiSymbolic
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Oh, you mean when her mixtape dropped?

I prefer Flora over Felicia but they did my girl wrong. I felt bad but only because of how cringey the entire set up was. I sat there thinking, "Is Flora's momma from the Fire Tribe?"

In all honesty I thought Fire Tribe said Fire Nation so I remembered this one picture I saw

ERj5Kwf.png

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It was definitely over the top, but I did feel bad for Felicia and aside from her chosen method could see why Flora would do that. It probably helped that I'd played most of Conquest and had seen more of Flora and the Ice Tribe.

Nowhere near as ridiculous as

Lilith or Kaze

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Not that I liked the entire scene, but....well I don't thint it's good to see one of your friends (or waifu....yes yes I am an horrible person) die in front of your eyes and you cannot do anything, so...

But as I said, the scene itself sucks

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The only deaths that I thought were handled well were Elise's, Ryoma's, and Xander's to an extent.

Izana's was even dumber than Flora's. "Hey, I'm dying, k thnx bye."

Scarlet's was okay, but didn't work in isolation. You only feel anything for her, if you used her in Birthright. In Revelations, you have her for all of two chapters, and the only chance to get any supports with her at all is if you grind with her the very first chance you get, otherwise you're out of luck. I honestly think no playable units should have dies in Rev, since it's the happy ending. Why is Corrin so distraught over Scarlet's death? She just met her.

Lilith's death was dumb both times. "Hey guys, need any help?" Whack!

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I'm a very emotional person, so I cried at her suicide. It was pretty sad to me, and it was Felicia's reactions after Flora is dead that gets me, with her tearfully saying she'll do better, begging Flora to come back and all...

Yeah, it was dumb, though. There was no reason for my Nohr-wife to die. OTL

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I'm a very emotional person, so I cried at her suicide. It was pretty sad to me, and it was Felicia's reactions after Flora is dead that gets me, with her tearfully saying she'll do better, begging Flora to come back and all...

Yeah, it was dumb, though. There was no reason for my Nohr-wife to die. OTL

The only one that got me teary was Elise, Flora just came out of left field, and unfortunately, I had it spoiled for me. Elise was spoiled for me, too, but even knowing it was coming, it got to me.

The bad thing about having 3 routes was it was hard to avoid spoilers for all 3, and I only really got to play Conquests spoiler free. Ryoma was done well, Takumi I kinda wanted to see die, and Lilith was pointless.

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