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Mikhail Naumov

Was anyone else absolutely smitten with Conquest?

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I know the newer FE titles get a lot of hate, especially Fates, but I absolutely fell in love with Conquest. I've been with the series since right after FE7 first released in Europe (I was born in Serbia and lived there most of my life) and managed to snag an English PAL copy. Immediately, I was head over heels. Smash didn't get me hyped, and I didn't come into the series late. The second it left Japan, I was on board. On top of this, I've played through and beaten every single FE game AND the spinoff/related titles like the TS games numerous times. So needless to say I'm no series noob, and the older Fire Emblem elements everyone seems to love is what I knew the second I fell in love with the series.

Now, I love Awakening (I love all FE games, except FE2 and FE5 though I still enjoy those titles) a lot, and I even like Birthright a lot as well (it was really ambient and you got access to most of the new classes immediately) and Revelations I feel had a good story, even though it wasn't quite on par with FE9 and FE10. Though I still have this, pit, in my stomach when I play those games because they're missing some of what I came to love so much all those years ago. Conquest, cured this. Now, Conquest is STILL a lot different than the older Fire Emblem titles, the new weapon triangle system is still present, weapons just go on in terms of usage forever, forging exists, the castle shit, etc. I LIKE all those things, I genuinely hope they stay because you're not just calculating how much a weapon weighs anymore. It used to be, any character with high constitution could use whatever weapon and suffer no penalty for it. In Fates, using shit like Silver weapons can cripple your next attack, and Steel weapons can prevent you from doubling outright.

A lot of people bitch and moan about this, but I rather like it. It adds more strategy to the game, as do skills. It's no longer as cut and dry as it used to be, now, provided you're playing on a harder difficulty where you haven't ubergrinded the hell out of your characters (Which Birthright and Awakening let you do RELIGIOUSLY, Conquest doesn't give hardly any grinding options which I love) you're actually going to have to make some REAL calculations when you're playing through the game. Older FE got too easy, even on the hardest of difficulties. The RNG system was extremely predicable and was even easily manipulated, weapon types had no drawbacks other than weight, some characters like Swordmasters and Berserkers could effortlessly become OHKO machines when given killer weapons and how much damage an enemy could do was all easily calculated.

I see a lot of bitch moaning over shit being luck based. People really don't like it, I guess I can see why because it's entirely out of their control. The thing for me is, luck is a REAL factor on REAL battlefields. On a real battlefield, you can't just predict and calculate your way into perfect victory after victory, if so this planet would have one country, The United Empire of Earth. Adding luck based variables like certain skills triggering, a less predictable RNG system and some other things makes the game feel more real, and it's a looming variable that makes you weigh your choices more carefully.

Conquest did what I dreamed of, it kept all the new shit I loved with the newer games and even added some of its own new and good shit, but it also took away a lot of the things that made the newer games laughably easy and brought some of the old school FE traits back. Now, I do not think Conquest is as soul crushingly difficult as a lot of people say it is, though it DOES have difficulty, but there are times on Lunatic (and even on Hard mode early on in the game) where Conquest will absolutely fist you. This is not a bad thing, if you don't get wrecked by the game every once in a while, you start getting careless. Getting wrecked makes you a better player, plain and simple. I also really enjoyed the Fates storylines, because I don't nitpick for tropes and the like when FE is a series that has been littered with troupes and archetypes since its birth.

All in all, the comeback of the older Fire Emblem elements that prevents you from going godmode on the game by grinding your team into oblivion as well as making the map goals a bit more diverse was really, REALLY nice to see, then that combined with the new elements in my opinion makes this the best game in the series.

Though the Dragon Veins are fucking stupid, there's no getting around that.

Anyway, I'm sure not everyone will agree with me, this IS just my opinion. Though I'm just making this because I wonder how many old school FE players really liked Conquest the way I did due to the wonderful combination of old and new.

Edited by Mikhail Naumov

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I feel the same way.

Birthright has the more thought out and solid story, but it was boring. Revelations on Lunatic mode is my main file because of post-game (access to all characters, max-grinding, challenge maps, etc). But no game comes anywhere close to Conquest for me. The gameplay is my favourite out of all of them. It was the only version where I was excited to play the next chapter, both to see what happened in the story AND to see what new objective would be for me on the map. Chapter 10 was probably my favourite, because it's an early game chapter where you don't really have many strong units so it takes real strategy to get though and the map design and objective are great. Getting through that chapter gave me one of the best feelings ever. A sense of accomplishment.

They really should use this game as a precedent for all future games. I hated that Birthright was all "rout the enemy" or "kill the boss". And with Revelations and Conquest, "seize" missions count as kill the boss for me, it's the exact same with an extra move required. But PLEASE GIVE US MORE OBJECTIVE BASED MAPS! More defend missions, escape, "kill 5 enemies", etc. missions. Most enjoyable maps ever

Edited by poptdp

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Birthright and Revelations are just, too easy. Especially Birthright, grinding out the ass plus early access to Takumi and the relentlessly overpowered Fujin Yumi he carries along with Ryoma and his OP fucking Katana.

Edited by Mikhail Naumov

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I absolutely agree with the OP. I even like the story of Conquest. It really makes you think about who to use and who to bench, which I greatly enjoy. And the best thing: you can grind supports on any DLC map, except for Boo Camp, without leveling any of your characters, meaning that you can still have all the children without draining any challenge from the game itself.

I'm absolutely in love with Fates as a whole and I would even go as far as to say that it is the best Fire Emblem game I have played to date, both in terms of story and gameplay.

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Depends. Gameplay wise? Yeah Conquest is really fun and probably one of my faves.

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I'm too in love with Fates as a whole, but Conquest has absolutely stolen my heart. Conquest was a breath of fresh air I've been waiting for since FE10, but unlike FE10 which destroyed supports and had a great story that was told very poorly which made it an OKAY story at best, it actually did pretty much everything it went for right. The ONLY thing I don't like in Conquest is the dragon veins, simply because they're a bit gimmicky. There's a few times where they can be of strategic value and save the day, but most of the time they're either just tools to make the map easier or tools to do pointless shit.

Depends. Gameplay wise? Yeah Conquest is really fun and probably one of my faves.


Mainly Gameplay wise, yes. Though I do really enjoy the Fates storylines, but I don't think anyone plays Fire Emblem for its story unless it's the Tellius series. I honestly think the Tellius series is a bit overblown in terms of how good its story is, I think the thing that makes Tellius shine in terms of story is how well it incorporated its world building. The storyline of FE9 was great, while the storyline of FE10 was strange and did very well the first half, then well on its face during the latter half.

Edited by Mikhail Naumov

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I absolutely agree with the OP. I even like the story of Conquest. It really makes you think about who to use and who to bench, which I greatly enjoy. And the best thing: you can grind supports on any DLC map, except for Boo Camp, without leveling any of your characters, meaning that you can still have all the children without draining any challenge from the game itself.

I'm absolutely in love with Fates as a whole and I would even go as far as to say that it is the best Fire Emblem game I have played to date, both in terms of story and gameplay.

While I can't agree with the story sentiment, I definitely agree Fates has the best gameplay I've seen in a FE game. I honestly can't go back to Awakening because Fates is so much better, tho I still really enjoy the pre Awakening games.

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I fell in love with Conquest at first sight. After it came out and the hype died down, I did realize the story had several elements in need of change but I did enjoy it more overall than I did Birthright. Birthright's story is relatively standard and inoffensive and, while there is nothing wrong with that, I found that combined with the lack of challenge even on Lunatic, it was something of a boring route overall.

Conquest had its many questionable and outright stupid moments but I would take its story over being completely bored out of my mind with Birthright's story.

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Mainly Gameplay wise, yes. Though I do really enjoy the Fates storylines, but I don't think anyone plays Fire Emblem for its story unless it's the Tellius series. I honestly think the Tellius series is a bit overblown in terms of how good its story is, I think the thing that makes Tellius shine in terms of story is how well it incorporated its world building. The storyline of FE9 was great, while the storyline of FE10 was strange and did very well the first half, then well on its face during the latter half.

Then yeah, Conquest is awesome gameplay wise, I definitely agree.

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A lot of the boredom of Birthright doesn't actually come from the easiness of it, just the fact that the game loves to send wave after wave of reinforcements at you, not to mention most of the maps were designed around you having to take out large, clumped up balls of units. It encourages a very turtely-type playstyle which is why the game is absolutely broken when you get anything remotely tanky on your team.

From what I've seen, Conquest generally seems to avoid this problem by virtue of enemy placements actually being thought out instead of "Well, let's just put about 5 Sky Knights here, whaddya mean we put a flying bow unit in this chapter?"

So yeah, Conquest is a lot better gameplay-wise.

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Even if I hate Conquest's story, I love the game. I agree with everything you've said, and I even like the Dragonveins. They add so many possibilities to each chapter, and probably the best one was in Chapter 10, where Takumi's DV turns what was a relatively easy defense map into one of the most deliciously frantic chapters in FE history. So yeah, Conquest is awesome, and I'd argue its the best FE game since 4 from a gameplay perspective alone. I do think that there is one major thing it does wrong, but I think that that's something that every FE game sans Shadow Dragon did wrong: checkpoints. Some chapters can take as much as an hour to complete, and starting over from the beginning, especially since in this game in particular the rng is a fuckWilson, sucks. But overall it's a minor complaint that's hardly unique to Conquest.

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The only real problem I have with Conquest's story is that the morally centered rants MU would go on every single chapter, only to end up doing the very things he kept preaching he didn't want to do right after those rants. That's not so much an issue with the story itself, just MU as a character. I think the supports in Fates were rather lacking for some characters (though not all), especially the marriage supports. The pace at which all of it happens is just very odd. It's basically C. Find some vague shared interest between the two of you, B. Talk more about that interest, make plans to pursue that interest together, A. Talk about how the experience went, usually something quirky or whimsical happened and then S. The ring is busted out and babies starting flying out of mommy.

Those things were annoying, but the base plot is something I liked, and the tension between MU picking between families and then having to battle one or the other was something I did enjoy. Revelations had this at the start, as you essentially shoot the bird to both, but then of course everybody makes up. I think Revelations was strongest in terms of plot and story, Birthright was strongest in terms of showcasing all the new things Fates brought along with being the more ambient game in terms of the world and scenarios and Conquest was strongest in terms of gameplay itself which is by far the most important factor.

With Fire Emblem basically as a whole, you have to go into it not only realizing but accepting that it's NOT a game built around amazing plots and storylines. Tellius showed us that FE CAN have a good story, but it's nothing you should bank on just because it was done once. The brainchild behind FE games changes damned near every game, so there's no telling what you'll get in terms of the story. I've found that if you accept that the story is not going to blow you away or suck you in, you can appreciate it more. It's a strategy RPG that is centered around war, and you get MULTIPLE characters instead of just one. So investing becomes broader and by extension more difficult, which I feel makes it harder to construct a good plot when you have to make the player feel invested in the characters. If you walk into it with neutrality, you can usually appreciate parts of it just fine. Just don't dive into every FE thinking it's Path of Radiance or Holy War.

Though I do think Birthright is a valuable tool. I think people, regardless of how good they are at FE or how long they've been with the series, should play it first. I think people should play through all three of the Fates plot lines for starters, but Birthright can be useful in a sense. Birthright introduces you to all the new mechanics added by Fates a LOT better than Conquest does, and sure, this sort of makes Birthright a 26 chapter + endgame long tutorial for the Fates titles, but it really helps when you move onto Conquest because you're familiar with how all the NEW elements work. Because as I said, Conquest brings a lot back from the older FE games and that's why I love it, but it also has a lot of the newer shit going on.

Going into Conquest on Lunatic blind will likely result in an absolutely soul crushing experience because you have no idea what the fuck is going on and the internet will have made you think since you played the GBA series you're as ready for it as possible. Birthright lets you get a long, hard feel for the new weapon triangle and the trade off you make for weapons that each have strengths and weaknesses that will impact your experience on the battlefield along with their unlimited durability. Not to mention the bulk of the new classes introduced in Fates are Hoshido based, so playing and getting a feel for the classes that you will be battling through the whole of Conquest is useful knowledge as well. Knowing how all the skills work is valuable too, but Awakening can give you a feel for this one.

So even though Birthright is extremely easy, it's an invaluable tutorial if you plan on diving into Conquest balls deep on Lunatic on your first play through. Not to mention it's one side of the story you get to experience and it's still a great game on its own.

Edited by Mikhail Naumov

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Conquest made me wonder why Birthright and Revelation were even necessary; if the map design is so superior, and the vast majority of players enjoy it that much more, wouldn't it be better to just stick to that formula and let new players play on lower difficulties, and maybe add a few extra hints, perks, or whatever to help the people who are really struggling, rather than to make more basic maps?

To make myself clear, I really don't want to exclude new players. I think casual mode and things like that are great since they allow for newcomers to get accostumed to the game and not be punished for their mistakes - or hell, maybe veterans want to play that way, which is totes fine. What I'm saying is that I think Conquest's map design should be the norm in the future, and that there are better ways of having easier options available than to make entire games that are less difficult.

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Conquest is the fun kind of difficulty until endgame. It's challenging but whenever you fail, you knew it's because you played too recklessly. Bringing back checkpoints might be a good idea, however. It's annoying having to reset several times and redo the same "set up" turns over and over again. Maybe there would be an option where you could save exactly once wherever you wanted.

Conquest made me wonder why Birthright and Revelation were even necessary; if the map design is so superior, and the vast majority of players enjoy it that much more, wouldn't it be better to just stick to that formula and let new players play on lower difficulties, and maybe add a few extra hints, perks, or whatever to help the people who are really struggling, rather than to make more basic maps?

To make myself clear, I really don't want to exclude new players. I think casual mode and things like that are great since they allow for newcomers to get accostumed to the game and not be punished for their mistakes - or hell, maybe veterans want to play that way, which is totes fine. What I'm saying is that I think Conquest's map design should be the norm in the future, and that there are better ways of having easier options available than to make entire games that are less difficult.

Agreed. I really bristle when people suggest that new players would be driven away by more chapter objectives and interesting maps. Even if Birthright was overall easier than Conquest, better map design would still earn it my endorsement. That said, Revelation has some of the most tedious maps in the game, so at least they didn't go that route.

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Conquest made me wonder why Birthright and Revelation were even necessary; if the map design is so superior, and the vast majority of players enjoy it that much more, wouldn't it be better to just stick to that formula and let new players play on lower difficulties, and maybe add a few extra hints, perks, or whatever to help the people who are really struggling, rather than to make more basic maps?

To make myself clear, I really don't want to exclude new players. I think casual mode and things like that are great since they allow for newcomers to get accostumed to the game and not be punished for their mistakes - or hell, maybe veterans want to play that way, which is totes fine. What I'm saying is that I think Conquest's map design should be the norm in the future, and that there are better ways of having easier options available than to make entire games that are less difficult.

I don't oppose the three path split at all, because firstly, it's an addition to the story because you get to see how the game will play out through each and every choice. You either side with one family or neither, and that was cool, but the main thing is it essentially made Fates as a whole a LOT longer which I cannot complain about because I can play FE all day and not get bored.

Birthright is a great tutorial if you're planning on going Lunatic mode in Conquest later on, since Fates added SO much new shit to the game, Conquest would absolutely fist you on the higher difficulties starting out if you were blind to all of the many new added elements. Since the bulk of new classes (which is a LOT of classes) are Hoshidian, Birthright lets you personally use and enjoy most of the new classes AND it lets you know how the majority of enemies in Conquest are going to behave since you have used those same classes. Plus Birthright is just a more, ambient game overall. Conquest isn't noob friendly (in terms of this is both your first Fire Emblem AND Strategy RPG game) and I could see it from a business standpoint killing off a large portion of the crowd Awakening brought in (which saved the series) because they lost their face roll easy grind happy play style. Revelation exists because, well, it's canon and it brings together almost all of the characters from Conquest and Birthright.

I get what you're saying, but I dig the idea of the split. If Conquest was the only game, we might not see another FE because part of the reason Fire Emblem was dying is because MOST of the people who pick it up will completely bomb at the game unless it's on a low difficulty. Conquest would turn off at least half if not more of the current FE audience if it was all there was. Revelation is just a bonus that includes the canon story and extends the game further.

Since North Americans and even Europeans on a mass scale are used to their games basically wiping their own ass for them, you essentially have to have an element to cater to them. I think Conquest is fine the way it is, even so much as adding optional grinding and easier difficulties to it would just pollute it in my opinion. Even if you never intended to use them, the fact they were there would bother me because Conquest is so pure in terms of gameplay when it comes to staying true to the STRATEGY element of Fire Emblem which has been lost over the years.

Like I said in my last post, if you're going into Fates with the intention to play all three paths (namely high difficulty Conquest) I think you should start with Birthright. Birthright can function as an entry tutorial to the Fates mechanics and it literally throws all of the new shit (Classes, the new Triangle Weapons which are all Hoshidian, etc) in the game at you from the very beginning. It also makes you appreciate Conquest more if you come to it straight after clearing the laughably easier Birthright first.

Edited by Mikhail Naumov

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I agree with everything the author of the topic saiqd, exvept the Dragon Vein: they are actually done quite well and an example is the Hinoka, ehich I really loved: sure, you cana ctuslly use tje DV to counter the Hinoka's DV, but are you sure you want to leave this bonus to your enemy and also give the enemies on the land a buff on movement?

Or the other one from Sakura's chapter, which gives you the opportunity to open new path for you but to the enemy too.

So, the DV are something that gives you vantages to both you and the enemy, which makes them something that shouldn't be used in a reckless way but instead with great attention, because they can really help you a lot.

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What happened in that first sentence? Lol.

The reason I can't get behind the veins is because how how stupid and gimmicky most of them are. A lot of dragon vein abilities show up in one or two chapters then vanish completely, and the rest of them kind of fuck with the difficulty. Now, when there's royals vs. royals on the battlefield and BOTH sides have access to them, they're not as bad, but when you're the only one with access, it just breaks the difficulty at times. For example, on Paralogue 6 when that Adventurer bitch was running away, I killed her on turn 2 (and this map is really long, winding and full of enemies) because a DV allowed me to burn the forest down and shortcut straight into her with a paired up Kaze and MU.

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I do really like Fates alot they got alot of things right mechanically with it. I'm not even that put off by Conquest's story sure it has its flaws but I don't think its as bad as people say it is. I must say to I love the art style of the Nohr units they really did a good job with those. Especially with the cavs and knights.

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Conquest gameplay is the best in the series IMO.

The story is full of wasted potential though. And I strongly disagree that the series always had writing as bad as the 3DS entries.

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I love Conquest's gameplay; it's amazing really. You can really tell how much love went into the design of maps and enemy formations, and how much they tried to balance out the mechanics. So yeah, I suppose I qualify.

The story's not very good, though I'm one of those people who feels that even at its peak, story wasn't really wonderful in this series (though I certainly think Sacred Stones and Radiant Dawn, at the least, had better plots than Fates did). It has some things going for it, though, at least.

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I adore Conquest. Everything about it. I can hardly stomach playing Revelation and I will never play Birthright again, but Conquest is outstanding.

There are aspects of other FE games I like better--Genealogy of the Holy War has a lot of my favorite ideas, Binding Blade has a lot of my favorite characters, Path of Radiance might have my favorite storyline--but as a total package, I think Conquest might be my overall favorite FE ever.

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In pretty much every game I play, story is a very small part for me. I never really pay too much attention to stories when I play games. However, I do very much look at the gameplay (why wouldn't you?) and character development. That makes me love Fates (and Awakening in terms of characters characters, tbh the chapter design could be a bit meh) a lot more than a good chunk of people, as I honestly have the story on the back-burner while cooking up some delicious gameplay and characters, if that makes sense.

To be fair, I'm a bit open when it comes to gameplay. I mean, I enjoyed Sticker Star if that gives any context, but overall Fates has some great gameplay. BR, as we know, lacks variety in mission types, and (imo) it doesn't really get "good" until the last 5 or so chapters, but then 27 and Endgame are a bit too... clumped together for me to enjoy. Rev has some VERY interesting and often enjoyable gimmicks, although I think it could have been better. Conquest, which IS the main topic of this thread, is my favorite route, as it is to many other people. The early game is EXTREMELY fun in my opinion, Chapter 10 being probably the best part of that initial rush, and while I feel a certain chapter is a bit absolutely stupid, looking at YOU Chapter 25 Hard/Lunatic, the rest range from good to amazing. The limited resources are welcome, although I feel it honestly could give to be a bit MORE limited with the money, as you end up with a fairly good amount unused by Endgame.

And don't even get me started on the characters. Seriously, I only dislike one character which, to be fair, IS equal to my hated characters FE7, 8 and 13 combined, but I think the good heavily outweighs the bad here. Also it's Azama.

My only complaints are some of the VAs are a bit... meh, Specifically Hana, Setsuna, M!Kana, and Selkie off the top of my head, and the children just... don't work in this game. I love the idea of children units and Awakening did them justice (I have yet to play FE4, although I know they did it there first and the best), but the whole, "Oh here's a place where our children can grow up at like 100x the normal rate (Seriously, they state that the kids grow up in like a week or two)," is just really dumb. I like the characters we got from this, Ophelia being my personal favorite child unit, however that doesn't excuse how horribly shoehorned in it is.

Overall I really enjoy Fates. I've been taking a break from it, as I played it pretty much all day every day for a few months and got burned out, but I'll be back to eventually. Probably after I finish EHM and HHM in FE7. And Ephraim/Difficult in FE8. And Book 2 of FE3... And hopefully buy FE9 and 10... So, yeah eventually.

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I can really only play Conquest now, because I get bored of birthright so fast because most of the objectives is just "Defeat all enemy."

What makes things worst is if you clear most of the map, and then boom! reinforcements appear far away and you have to go kill them.

There's also those stupid ambush reinforcement in Leo's and Final!Camilla's chapter IIRC.

Seriously, I felt like I wasted some money in buying birthright and revelation. Both are horribly balanced and the story is also awful..

I don't get why people defend birthright's story when it's just as bad, seriously! A magical book that'll warp you? How convenient!

Playing conquest after multiple times is still fun, even on lunatic, but birthright and revelation feels like a chore.

Birthright, I find extremely insulting on Lunatic mode the main reason to choose this path is thrown away for fanservice.

Revelation, I hate this path as much as I hate birthright that the next time I play for fun... The Hoshidan royals and retainers are dying on their join chapter. Like I already had glorious Hoshido rubbed in my face for two games and I don't need it for a third. The maps are also WAY too limiting when you have most of the whole cast!

Conquest is mostly well-balanced, in gameplay and characters, and is actually hard. There's no stupid massive stat-inflation(?) or enemy clusters or ambush reinforcements. The story sucks because it focuses too much on how glorious Hoshido is... that it had to tell you about how you picked the wrong choice throughout the game. Revelation also pretty much just adds more to Hoshido's story, so Conquest is kind of unique that it's story doesn't really go much into Valla.

So yeah, I've been smitten with Conquest to the point in which I now REALLY HATE HOSHIDO AND BIRTHRIGHT!

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I love Conquest's gameplay and map design, it's definitely some of if not the best this series has ever had. I can't ever go back to Awakening just because it is such a step down, even compared to Birthright which I feel has the weakest gameplay of all.

Plot-wise, I enjoy the story of all the routes for what they are. Does each have their flaws? Of course. Could they have been better? Of course. Do I wish they had lived up to their hype? Of course. But I accepted a while ago that Fire Emblem's strength is never going to lie in its plot, and that expecting everything to be like Genealogy or PoR/RD is just going to end in disappointment. Fates' plot, while disappointing after all the pre-release hype, has, for me, as many good points as bad ones, and if I focus on those rather than accentuating the negatives, I can enjoy it a fair bit. I like parts of Birthright, I like parts of Conquest, and I like parts of Revelation, and that's enough for me.

Edited by Abvora

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